R8 competition heats up.

[Leadfoot]

This is correct, there is a big difference between Roush and Rosche.

Roush did not have anything to do with the BMW motor.

sticky,

How sure are you that you're right?

BMW, Porsche, Ferrari all of them use outside help when designing things, they all use gearboxes made by outside sources, the electrics are sourced, the suspension systems are sourced, why does it sound so outrageous for BMW to use an outside source to help develop an engine, Audi used Cosworth with the RS4 Mk1 engine prior to acquiring them.

I know you think very highly of BMW engineering and I agree it's up there with the best, but why are you so sure that Tazsura isn't correct.

Surely there is someone on the forum that can shed a little light on this debate.

[sticky]

sticky,

How sure are you that you're right?

BMW, Porsche, Ferrari all of them use outside help when designing things, they all use gearboxes made by outside sources, the electrics are sourced, the suspension systems are sourced, why does it sound so outrageous for BMW to use an outside source to help develop an engine, Audi used Cosworth with the RS4 Mk1 engine prior to acquiring them.

I know you think very highly of BMW engineering and I agree it's up there with the best, but why are you so sure that Tazsura isn't correct.

Surely there is someone on the forum that can shed a little light on this debate.

Rosche designed the E30 M3 motor and headed the engine development of the motorsport division. When Murray came to BMW asking for help with designing a motor for the McLaren F1, they set to work. The motor was a fully internal BMW design which was set to meet a certain weight and torque goal, which it exceeded. I have never heard of any external collaboration on the design of the motor. Roush does all kinds of work all over the world with many companies, but I have never heard their name in connection with BMW and the McLaren F1.

[Leadfoot]

Rosche designed the E30 M3 motor and headed the engine development of the motorsport division. When Murray came to BMW asking for help with designing a motor for the McLaren F1, they set to work. The motor was a fully internal BMW design which was set to meet a certain weight and torque goal, which it exceeded. I have never heard of any external collaboration on the design of the motor. Roush does all kinds of work all over the world with many companies, but I have never heard their name in connection with BMW and the McLaren F1.

All I was saying is one can't rule it out. The fact that they work with such famous name and in the F1 circles there is a likely hood that what Tazsura is saying maybe right. It won't make BMW work or the engine itself any less an achievement for BMW, I just find it amazing you dismiss it out of hand just because you haven't heard the name associated with BMW or McLaren, hell there is lots that both companies keep quiet from the general public, but just because we don't know about it doesn't mean it didn't happen.

I say keep an open mind until there is proof otherwise.

[sticky]

All I was saying is one can't rule it out. The fact that they work with such famous name and in the F1 circles there is a likely hood that what Tazsura is saying maybe right. It won't make BMW work or the engine itself any less an achievement for BMW, I just find it amazing you dismiss it out of hand just because you haven't heard the name associated with BMW or McLaren, hell there is lots that both companies keep quiet from the general public, but just because we don't know about it doesn't mean it didn't happen.

I say keep an open mind until there is proof otherwise.

Umm, I can't find anything anywhere of Roush working with BMW on the McLaren F1 motor. There are videos out there on McLaren, tons of fan pages, and pages from BMW motorsport themselves.

Keeping an open mind is always the right thing to do but everyone knows BMW motorsport designed that motor, it is common knowledge. There is nothing out there connecting Roush in any form, how is that for proof? The only time Roush has been mentioned with BMW and development of the F1 motor has been in this thread. I don't know what proof to find as there is nothing out there to say, "Roush did not work on this motor," because there is no association and it has never been brought up. BMW motorsport created this V12, basing it on their existing V12 block from the 850csi. Of this, I am 100% certain.

I am not dismissing it because I haven't heard the name associated, I am dismissing it because I have read many things on the McLaren F1 and the official McLaren book along with everything ever written on the motor doesn't mention Roush, only BMW Motorsport. That is why I dicount it, I don't know what else to say.

Unless there is some secret agreement we all don't know about I suppose there is a chance. There is also a chance ferrari worked on the motor, ford, and chevrolet as well, we can't rule them out just in case.

[Lateknight]

I think there is a confusion here between Rosche and Roush (obviously)

I'm with 'sticky' on this - Roush have nothing to do with the 6.1 ltr BMW designed engine used in the F1.
Roush do modify Chrysler 6.1ltr Hemi engines, though.

At best, it maybe the right thing to agree to disagree on this one.