about Audi's RSx series

[roozbeh007]

i was wondering why audi release them so late ?
I mean now I think RS6 is an awesome car but it came out so late. if I had the money, I wouldn't spend it on a car which has a 4 years old body and I know i'll be replaced by next year. why is audi doing this? couldn't they at least use the new body style for rs6 ? now I've heard there wil be a RS8 available around 2007. that's sad.

[nene]

Originally posted by roozbeh007
... if I had the money, ...

I am not trying to be mean or anything, but I think the quote above pretty much sums it all up.
When folks have the money to buy a car such as the RS6, the aging body style is not a big factor.

I just wanted the car badly, and went out and got it. There are lots of inner battles that go on when making a decision to buy any vehicle above $60KUSD. The aging body style would be one, but when you want something, you convince yourself easily. Not having the money to buy it, it's the harder battle. Aging body style, small minute detail.

Just for kicks though, if you did have the money, and you were looking at a nice large family sedan, which is what other RS6 owners were looking at, what would make your list, and finally which car would make it to your garage?

In all honesty though, how can you say 'no' to a face like this!



Peace out

[Erik]

Originally posted by roozbeh007
i was wondering why audi release them so late ?

It's a matter of resources.

And the RS series is the flagship. It boost sales for the rest of the range, so you better have "the range" (=bread & butter) before you boost it as well.

[5000S old skool]

RS8 isnt happening... S8 though with a V10... Also, the next RS4 for the B7 should be coming out later this year.. So it's not exactly what I would call late scince B7 was launched just a few months ago. The body style for the RS2 wasnt too old either, if i remember correctly.

[Audihead]

Originally posted by 5000S old skool
RS8 isnt happening... S8 though with a V10... Also, the next RS4 for the B7 should be coming out later this year.. So it's not exactly what I would call late scince B7 was launched just a few months ago. The body style for the RS2 wasnt too old either, if i remember correctly.

Yes you are right, but here's the thing. The B7 won't be around that long after the RS4 comes out in the States. Maybe a year or two. I guess you could call this a big makeover. It is a new car to be sure, but the B8 will be a completely different monster and the RS4 version of that will be a long time coming.

:s4addict:

[remedy]

Originally posted by 5000S old skool
The body style for the RS2 wasnt too old either, if i remember correctly.

Yes it was, it was launched right at the end of the line for that model, as has traditionally been the case. The reason for this has been marketing; they release the top performance edition right before the introduction of the new model to hype the platform.

[tailpipe]

Originally posted by roozbeh007
i was wondering why audi release them so late ?
I mean now I think RS6 is an awesome car but it came out so late.

Don't worry, I know for a fact that Audi's top marketing people in Germany have been told this directly. Given that producing more sporting cars has become an Audi priority, we should expect future RS models to arrive earlier. But there are two issues:

1. Given that standard cars are the volume sellers, clearly Audi has a duty to priotise less exotic versions

2. High performance versions often differ quite substantially from "bread and butter" versions, so require longer engineering lead times to get right.

Notwithstanding these 2 points, releasing the RS4 just 3 years before the new A4 appears is probably a mistake. Audi has limited the shelf-life of the RS4. Quite a few people on this forum, yours truly included, may consider high performance versions of the new A6 instead of the RS4 for this reason. (The forthcoming S6 is rumoured to have the same engine as the RS4.)

...But, and this is a big but, have you seen a B5 RS4 recently? It may be somewhat dated, but even by today's standards it is still an absolutely outstanding piece of machinery. It goes like stink and the build quality is panzer-like in its excellence.

With new platforms such as the B8 coming on stream with fundamentally better layouts, i.e. engine behind front axle etc., the requirement to substantially re-engineer the chassis for better dynamics should be reduced, so the development times should be shorter. We should therefore see a B8 RS4 a year or so sooner into the new product cycle.

[clam]

The RSx cars are 'halo' cars, that give the outgoing model that extra sales push.
When a model has been around for a couple of years, people tend to forget about it. B/c it's not in any magazine, or doesn't feature in any watercooler conversation. So when people are considering a new car, that aging model doesn't pop up in their recent memory. An outragious RSx car refreshes their memory.

These cars hardly make any profit in real terms. For the company, their only function is boosting the image. Sort of like the Paris Hilton sex tape. It didn't make her any profit, but the publicity did launch a career in entertainment.

So it wouldn't make sense to release them early on in production.
*The model isn't old yet, so people don't need their memories refreshed.
*Demand for the RSx car would run out way before the model is replaced. So by the time its halo-effect is needed, it's already forgotten.
In this case, instead of a sales booster, the RSx would just be a very risky venture.

[nene]

Erik and clam are correct. I doubt Audi will ever bring the RS series out too early. The car is done to keep folks interested in the brand name as well as the model it represents.

[5000S old skool]

Originally posted by remedy
Yes it was, it was launched right at the end of the line for that model, as has traditionally been the case. The reason for this has been marketing; they release the top performance edition right before the introduction of the new model to hype the platform.

Ahh yeah your right... I just checked

[tailpipe]

Originally posted by nene
Erik and clam are correct. I doubt Audi will ever bring the RS series out too early. The car is done to keep folks interested in the brand name as well as the model it represents.

Sorry, but while you guys know a lot about cars, you quickly come unstuck when it comes to marketing.

BMW is by quite a margin more successful than Audi, not because its cars are necessarily better but simply because customers believe them to be so. Everyone who buys a standard BMW buys into BMW's promise of driving pleasure. Most of the people who buy a standard model aspire to a high performance one. They just can't afford it. It's called a halo effect.

Fundamentally, top models sell entry level models. Mazda sold a load more 323s after it introduced the MX-5. The same theory works for Ferrari with the effect of the Enzo on 360 sales. The sooner that halo is available, the sooner all other range model sales are lifted. I can show you case study after case study of this marketing truth.

For Audi, many people hesitate to buy its RS models because they want the latest and greatest - especially if you're blowing $75,000 or more on a car: you don't want something that will be obsolete within 2 years of being bought. You should also know that empiracally, people spending more money on a car tend to keep cars longer. Therefore, model shelf-life is all the more important.

Audi has said it wants to produce more sporting cars. It recognises the need to take on BMW directly in order to grab a larger slice of marketshare. Therefore, it needs to be seen as a serious performance car maker. Audi's RS strategy follows BMW instead of leading; let's face it, the RS6 was a response to the M5, albeit a very good one. So, if Audi wants to be seen as a performance marque, its performance models need to be more mainstream, not end of model life limited editions.

Audi's performance offerings presently only boost the flagging sales of existing models; instead, they should lift the entire brand. There is no doubt that Audi's current strategy works, but it is a missed opportunity which other manufacturers take full advantage of.

[absent]

And I am the prime example,always loved Audis,always had one in the garage,waited for the RS seems like forever and when it finally arrived,the only reason I did not take it (bought E55 instead) was the fact that it was that platforms swan song and I did not want to drive an "old" body style.
If MB and BMW can release their performance models early and make good profit and even better publicity,why is Audi not able to do it too?

[roozbeh007]

I am not trying to be mean or anything, but I think the quote above pretty much sums it all up.
When folks have the money to buy a car such as the RS6, the aging body style is not a big factor.

you are missing the point. I'm not even talking about price. let's say everybody out there can afford one.

[roozbeh007]

Originally posted by absent
If MB and BMW can release their performance models early and make good profit and even better publicity,why is Audi not able to do it too?

exactlly

[Erik]

Originally posted by absent
If MB and BMW can release their performance models early and make good profit and even better publicity,why is Audi not able to do it too?

I think we're back to history and resources.
quattro GmbH is still a small place, (S6 Plus, RS2, RS4, RS6, RS6 Plus and so on) but I think they are building up their capacity quite a lot.
Just check the production numbers on those cars mentioned.
RS4 ~ 6.000
RS6 ~8.500 (?)

[QuattroFun]

Erik makes a good point. Quattro has limited resources and RS should really be both special in talent and rare like Alpina. They can always play the S card earlier in the life cycle to match AMG/M, which are volume models. B6 S4 - despite its shortcomings - was the first S car, which was not too far adrift from the champ M3 under most circumstances and actually beat the C32 AMG apart from the straightline in the dry.

[nene]

Sorry 'tailpipe', but as Erik has correctly stated, it's not marketing alone at the base of the issue. So in that regard, we seem to know quite a bit about what we're talking about. It's resources as well. Please remember that Audi is a leader and not a follower. While BMW and Mercedes are trying to have the same mantra, Audi has carved it's own niche. We like it the way it's done. Furthermore, everyone wants the RS models as soon as possible. However, when they come to market, the folks that can really afford it are far and few in between. I don't think that if the RS models came out any earlier, they would sell more, other than for the fact that they would have been in the market longer. However, I like it that the RS models are low volume, thus I'm happy to pay the demanding price, regardless when they come out. But resources and the halo effect as the last push to sell more regular models are really the reason they come out later.


As for you kooz..., you're the one that mentioned money first. If you don't want to buy something that is 4-5 years old, that is fine, but don't base it on whether you have the money to afford it or not.
Furthermore what is the new body going to do for you, when the suspension and the engine will be the same? Aren't those the most important parts of the car, since those are new (DRC suspension and 4.2 bi-turbo)? Granted the 4.2 liter engine is not new, but a trusted one for sure. And adding bi-turbo to a V8 has not been done to any other Audi model either.
You are looking at the car as if its beauty is skin deep. But that is where you are wrong. There are folks out there that would kill to get an RS2 or B5 RS4 if they could get their hands on one here in the US. And those cars are much older.

So, in the end, from Audi's point of view they are going about it right. And from a consumer's point of view, it always about the Benjamins ($$$ for non-US)!!!

[Benman]

Originally posted by nene


As for you kooz..., you're the one that mentioned money first. If you don't want to buy something that is 4-5 years old, that is fine, but don't base it on whether you have the money to afford it or not.

This is a valid point. Take for an example a Dodge SRT-4. It is on the total opposite end of the $$$ spectrum. The Neon had been out for @ 4 years and THEN the SRT-4 came out. Now with a new neon 2 years away (same as with the A6 vs RS 6) people bought them up in FLOCKS! I see them all over. The fact that it's based on a car that is already 4+ years old didn't seem to matter.

The point is, despite the price range ($19,900-$21,000 is a big difference from $85K!) differences the concept is the same, if you want it, you'll buy it despite the "older" body style. Just don't make it a dime a dozen like the E55 or the M5

Ben