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Thread: Have we seen the best of Audi?

  1. #1
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    Have we seen the best of Audi?

    Global forces at play with fines and costs piling up from diesel gate to both Audi and VW.

    The cost cutting will influence models and designs moving forward. Most likely evident already.

    The new models feel "cheap" in my opinion. Just yesterday I spoke with a new Audi customer with a 2017 lease that she is in the process of returning and paying close to 7000 dollars to get out of the lease. Her reason? It lacks any driving excitement......and she was a long time Audi driver.

    Not a good sign.
    Last edited by DHall1; March 1st, 2017 at 17:26.

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    I think it is too soon to tell, and DieselGate should have not affected in any way a 2017 model. The car was in development was likely signed off before DieselGate was known. Full impact could take a couple of years. Immediate impact would be on "halo" type cars. People will say anything to get off a lease in my opinion. I am not in the market for another Audi at this time, but my nephew's 2017 S4 is darn good looking and nice to drive.

    I think the latest offerings by Mercedes are much worse looking than what Audi provides. I have been impressed by BMW.
    Just lots of options attracting your hard earned cash out there.

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    True, maybe the overall cost cutting was well on schedule. Which means it could ramp up even more.

    S4, SQ5, S5 all feel cheap to me. We have a SQ5....not buying another. Door panels creak and feel plastic. Interior is blah. Nothing like the RS6.

    My 13 E63 feels nice inside. Much the way the RS6 feels.

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    Possibly? But I would like to think not; I was very excited going to my local dealer recently. I can't think of any other carmaker that puts gigantic pictures of its race cars practically everywhere, can you? There's no mistaking where Audi's true passion lies. They're giving quattro GmbH a lot of work to do with the new RS models on the horizon and whatever racing efforts they decide to pursue after FIA WEC, in addition to their customer racing, rallycross and Formula E. So, I'd like to think the best is yet to come, but we'll see, won't we?
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  5. #5
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    Hanging photos of race cars is one thing.

    How your current product offerings perform is another.

    Many segments of the line are getting long on the tooth.

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    I wouldn't come on here and initiate saying it myself, but since somebody else brought it up.... I'm not a fan. Multiple reasons but prime ex. would be, take current S4, its total blah, cheap, all leather-textured plastic everywhere.... and that's the S!! RS models are nowhere near as special as they used to be, by numbers or quality, the performance is there, for now, but still cheaply built 10 yr. engineered life max. All cars are like that now, but still I'd say Audi has fallen off from MB/AMG and even BMW/M which I personally have never been a big fan of, or should I say bottom of the big 3 for me.. I'm pretty sure any segment to segment match up b/w Audi, BMW, MB... Audi is probably going to be at the bottom, with some personal exceptions for me, i.e. I'd probably take a S8 over a top line BMW 7...maybe... but over a AMG S63, I don't think so, not even close. An S4 vs. a M4... I don't like Audi in that one either... at all. European RS6 here in states, maybe we'd have something to compete with AMG E and M5 but the S6/S5?? I don't think so. For me AMG is substantially ahead of S/RS and M by pretty far and all the way around = interior, body design and powertrain.

    Pulling out of WEC/LeMans, for Audi - being what Audi was to LeMans for forever, is pretty much like saying we're not racing anymore. That Formula E series is lackluster at best, at least as of now IMO, and nowhere near the earthshaking storm-surge Audi produced when it brought its TDIs to LMP1. Sigh.... nostalgia of the days of seeing the ALMS P1 diesel Audis in perpetual tooth and nail street fights with the U.S. / Penske debuted P2 Porsche Spyders. Granted, VW group has shifted a lot of those racing assets to Porsche but still. How far we have fallen in road racing since those times that seem so not long ago. Audi is out of even LeMans, NASCAR took over IMSA/ALMS and made it a redneck sideshow... pitiful. The "auto industry" as we know it is doomed.... time to find a new hobby.

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    Probably embedded in some other threads but I've mentioned this before. To me, I's been downgrading since after the B5, C5 ans D2 cars. I might throw in a caveat for anything over a 120K price tag on some NLA in US cars like some RS models. The R8 is a big meh, too.

    Just not exciting and there's not much fun in driving them. They get more powerful, but heavier too though. Nothing worthy of scaring me.

    I'd also say it's not just Audi. Pretty much anything new out there is a big snoozefest.
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    Registered User mdegracia's Avatar
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    Having worked on all of these, MB, BMW, Audi -

    I would have to say I am still partial to Audi.

    In my opinion, BMW has declined drastically in both fit and finish, not to mention reliability. We see many N63 and N55 motors with under 30k miles needing turbos; injectors; timing chains; and plenty of bent valve jobs because BMW had the genius idea to NOT key the crankshaft! The new 3-series offering is complete junk with more plastic trim than a KIA. Does BMW even make a true M car - i.e., all individual throttle bodies any more?

    And I would never ever consider a MB. Too much emphasis on gaudy curb appeal for the young generation and always good for an electrical nightmare.

    If I leased cars, I guess my point of view might change.

    Last I saw, the RS7 Performance edition was pretty impressive for its class.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gN6hFTCkEM
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    Yes, we have talked about the content loss over the last 10 years. I get it, cost cutting and inflation pressures keep the constant tug of war between pricing and content.

    I will I'll say my 13 E63 is fun/exciting to drive. It's the last year of rwd and it has LSD. Nice chassis dynamics and feels nimble.

    Now the 13 550 msport I tried before the AMG was a snoozefest 100% spot on.

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveKen View Post
    Probably embedded in some other threads but I've mentioned this before. To me, I's been downgrading since after the B5, C5 ans D2 cars. I might throw in a caveat for anything over a 120K price tag on some NLA in US cars like some RS models. The R8 is a big meh, too.

    Just not exciting and there's not much fun in driving them. They get more powerful, but heavier too though. Nothing worthy of scaring me.

    I'd also say it's not just Audi. Pretty much anything new out there is a big snoozefest.

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    I agree the prev gen N63 had issues but I would have kept my daily driver if it had the chassis dynamics of my 13 E63.

    I don't see the gaudy curb appeal in my 13 E63. It's just a bad fast hot rod with a decent chassis. Nothing too fancy inside just nice leather touches on dash and door panels. It's comfortable and feels like the C5 RS6

    Quote Originally Posted by mdegracia View Post
    Having worked on all of these, MB, BMW, Audi -

    I would have to say I am still partial to Audi.

    In my opinion, BMW has declined drastically in both fit and finish, not to mention reliability. We see many N63 and N55 motors with under 30k miles needing turbos; injectors; timing chains; and plenty of bent valve jobs because BMW had the genius idea to NOT key the crankshaft! The new 3-series offering is complete junk with more plastic trim than a KIA. Does BMW even make a true M car - i.e., all individual throttle bodies any more?

    And I would never ever consider a MB. Too much emphasis on gaudy curb appeal for the young generation and always good for an electrical nightmare.

    If I leased cars, I guess my point of view might change.

    Last I saw, the RS7 Performance edition was pretty impressive for its class.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gN6hFTCkEM

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    Pretty much my observations. I did choose my 13 E63 as my daily driver for many of the reasons noted.

    Nascar.....oh boy, that's all we yanks have? What a joke we are

    Quote Originally Posted by CBeau View Post
    I wouldn't come on here and initiate saying it myself, but since somebody else brought it up.... I'm not a fan. Multiple reasons but prime ex. would be, take current S4, its total blah, cheap, all leather-textured plastic everywhere.... and that's the S!! RS models are nowhere near as special as they used to be, by numbers or quality, the performance is there, for now, but still cheaply built 10 yr. engineered life max. All cars are like that now, but still I'd say Audi has fallen off from MB/AMG and even BMW/M which I personally have never been a big fan of, or should I say bottom of the big 3 for me.. I'm pretty sure any segment to segment match up b/w Audi, BMW, MB... Audi is probably going to be at the bottom, with some personal exceptions for me, i.e. I'd probably take a S8 over a top line BMW 7...maybe... but over a AMG S63, I don't think so, not even close. An S4 vs. a M4... I don't like Audi in that one either... at all. European RS6 here in states, maybe we'd have something to compete with AMG E and M5 but the S6/S5?? I don't think so. For me AMG is substantially ahead of S/RS and M by pretty far and all the way around = interior, body design and powertrain.

    Pulling out of WEC/LeMans, for Audi - being what Audi was to LeMans for forever, is pretty much like saying we're not racing anymore. That Formula E series is lackluster at best, at least as of now IMO, and nowhere near the earthshaking storm-surge Audi produced when it brought its TDIs to LMP1. Sigh.... nostalgia of the days of seeing the ALMS P1 diesel Audis in perpetual tooth and nail street fights with the U.S. / Penske debuted P2 Porsche Spyders. Granted, VW group has shifted a lot of those racing assets to Porsche but still. How far we have fallen in road racing since those times that seem so not long ago. Audi is out of even LeMans, NASCAR took over IMSA/ALMS and made it a redneck sideshow... pitiful. The "auto industry" as we know it is doomed.... time to find a new hobby.

  12. #12
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    "The "auto industry" as we know it is doomed.... time to find a new hobby."

    Or just look to older models and keep them alive. I still haven't found that URQ that checks all of my boxes (price being the big one) but...



  13. #13
    Registered User Aronis's Avatar
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    This thread is too depressing.

    No one mentioned the trend toward full Auto Drive and No ability to drive the dam thing anymore! That is really where this is all heading. So performance and chassis dynamics will be a thing of the past and our GrandChildren will look at us and marvel saying "they used to let YOU drive the car?"

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    (prior '94 325is, '97 M3, '00 A6 4.2,'03 RS6,'08 A4 Cab,'13 A8L,'15 Q7,'16 BMW M2,

  14. #14
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    Here's what I see happening in the next 10 years:
    1. Big push towards Uber-like driverless transportation. You won't even need to own a car. Just order a ride on your phone and you can Snapchat your BFFs all the way to your destination. Kids these days don't even want to drive since their whole life is online anyway. (p.s. it's already happening)
    2. Phasing out fossil fuels, more electric. Although, Trump may slow that down a little.
    3. That means that any auto company that wants to remain in business will need to produce low cost self-driving electric fleet vehicles. At some point it won't even make sense to produce manually operated cars any longer.
    4. My main concern is that once the insurance companies (and lawmakers) see how much safer it is to not operate your own vehicle, what will happen to insurance rates? And vehicle taxes? And driving regulations? And roads?

    Oh and then there's this concern: http://jalopnik.com/the-cia-has-look...inc-1793052458

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    Cool, 'coal' burning cars. Nice idea.
    '18 BMW M5, '19 Porsche Boxster GTS
    (prior '94 325is, '97 M3, '00 A6 4.2,'03 RS6,'08 A4 Cab,'13 A8L,'15 Q7,'16 BMW M2,

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    Makes me shudder... Thank goodness I live in a land with snow, ice and a challenging environment for autonomous driving 1/2 the year.

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    You will need to pry my steering wheels out my cold dead hands.

    I can keep my cars running even if I have to use one as a parts car

  18. #18
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    One reason I went with the base Golf R with 6 MT with no DCC or DAP. Just a well setup machine with no settings and adjustments and with great feel and feedback (at least for a modern car). I think one of the few cars left that you feel like you are driving it with some involvement.
    2003 Audi RS6 Daytona/Silver, 2012 Porsche 911 Turbo S, 2016 Golf R 6 MT, 2018 Porsche Macan GTS

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