Road Course Racing. Who Does it with their RS6?

[Justin9212]

I bought my RS6 back in December. This Saturday the 12th I will be attending my first track event with the car. I have done many events over the years with my S4, this will be the first with the RS6 though. It's a pretty tame track, Nelson Ledges Ohio. It's a fun day, not competitive. I have Nitto NT05 tires, New Hawk brake pads, and am doing a full tranny service this week with the fluid Tozo recommended. My car has about 80K on it

My questions for thoses or Race often...
What gets hot?
What can I do to keep temps down?
What are the things to keep an eye out for that most may for get to keep an eye on?

Thanks
-Justin

[ZCD2.7T]

I bought my RS6 back in December. This Saturday the 12th I will be attending my first track event with the car. I have done many events over the years with my S4, this will be the first with the RS6 though. It's a pretty tame track, Nelson Ledges Ohio. It's a fun day, not competitive. I have Nitto NT05 tires, New Hawk brake pads, and am doing a full tranny service this week with the fluid Tozo recommended. My car has about 80K on it

My questions for those who Race often...
What gets hot?
What can I do to keep temps down?
What are the things to keep an eye out for that most may for get to keep an eye on?

Thanks
-Justin

I'm going to answer on behalf of a good friend who used to track his RS 6 quite a bit:
- Everything gets hot, and quickly, especially if the weather is warm. Use the paddles to short-shift at about 4500 rpm to try to stay out of "limp" mode which occurs when things get too hot.
- It's a HEAVY car, so watch your brake pads and tires. Understeer is the order of the day with C5 RS 6s, and managing it is the way to better, smoother, quicker lap times. "Slow in, fast out" works best, using the massive grunt to yank you out of corners and make up what you give up in braking early.
- If you don't have stainless steel brake lines and high-temp fluid (Motul 600 or Super Blue or something similar), seriously consider adding those before your track day. Decent pads are only 1 piece of the braking puzzle....
- Enjoy the straights and tolerate the turns!

My buddy eventually ended up giving up on tracking his RS 6 and went with something lighter - a 993TT, lowered and with hybrid turbos.

Have fun - the car will surprise many with its pace, assuming that you don't cook the brakes or end up in limp mode!

[4everRS]

I've only done one track event, but plan on doing them more and more. It was very addictive.

I did not have heat issues besides the brake fluid. The cooling systems worked as they should. Oil got to 250. Most I've seen it. But really, that's expected. For the record, I do run a methanol injection kit, so maybe that helped keep the heat down. The brake issues were due to a dumb choice to run normal brake fluid. A quick change to motul 600 pitside fixed that.

[hahnmgh63]

As 4everRS said, flush your brake Fluid with a high temp fluid, Motul, Castrol and others make some great fluids. It's too late for this event but the group buy just starting on the list for the Phaeton Brake Duct mod is one of the best improvements you can do to the stock Brake system, it really adds a lot of Airflow, and the Group Buy price right now is a steal. I'm not in it as I already purchased them a couple of years ago. You will eat up your Tires & Brakes but the car for a big Heavy Pig is not bad on the track, when you warm up to it you will shock the hell out of a lot of cars which should be faster, at least their drivers will be shocked.

[kismetcapitan]

for race fluid, I recommend Castrol SRF. It costs a lot and you have to flush it every 18 months at the very least, but it's really good stuff. I used it on my Skyline and on every superbike I've owned - bikes in particular get very sensitive to brake fluid temps and even MotoGP bikes will start to get a mushy brake feel - they have remote brake levers to compensate. SRF resists this the longest in my experience.

[ben916]

CLEARLY we almost forgot to tell you to get the GoPro Hero II....

[4everRS]

CLEARLY we almost forgot to tell you to get the GoPro Hero II....

Haha Ben. Mr. Vicarious.

[4everRS]

CLEARLY we almost forgot to tell you to get the GoPro Hero II....

Haha Ben. Mr. Vicarious. I do agree though on the GoPro. Or find someone's to borrow.

[Benman]

- It's a HEAVY car, so watch your brake pads and tires. Understeer is the order of the day with C5 RS 6s, and managing it is the way to better, smoother, quicker lap times. "Slow in, fast out" works best, using the massive grunt to yank you out of corners and make up what you give up in braking early.

from another who has tracked the Beast, I'd say this quoted portion is the KEY. Oh, and GoPro! They didn't have those when I use to track, so I had to use lessor quality means...

[Amulet-S6]

12+ track events in the RS6. The ideas below were borrowed from long-term RS6 trackers.

Brakes: Brake fade is probably the biggest issue. Hi-temp fluid and Phaeton brake ducts will resolve this issue. There's a thread above for a group buy on the ducts thru Unit 20. Upgraded pads will improve performance. I'm a Pagid fan, but there are several good companies. Before the phaeton duct idea, several of us had custom 3-piece rotors made to improve the cooling. Let me know if you want that contact.

Tires: Due to the weight anterior to the axel, our front tires take a beating. Chalk the sidewalls to eval tire flexure and adjust psi accordingly. I started out with psi higher than typical and then adjusted +/- as needed after each session. For example, I start my front Pilot sport cups at 45# cold which is quite a bit higher than Michelin recommends.

Tranny: I short shift at ~5200 Never had any issues.

Harnesses: If you track often, then consider harnesses. Anderson Motorsports has some great Schroth harnesses that attach to the OEM attachment points and are clip-in clip-out www.andersonmotorsport.com/ Until then, move your seat waaaay back, pull your seat belt quickly to deploy the arrester, then move your seat forward to snug yourself into the seat. It will take a few tries to get it just right.

Late apexing seems to help on most corners I've encountered.
I like my seat-back upright, so I have to turn the headrests around when wearing a helmet. This may be just me.

**Be warned your face will hurt from grinning! Jim

[hunter]

well jim certainly has more track days in his rs6 than I do but I did just go through the same issue, I bought my beast in february this year and took her out to the track at miller motorsports park for a 2 day nasa event and after scouring this forum in rs246.com below is a list of what I did to prep for my first time at the track:
- RBF 600 brake fluid
- Phaeton brake duct mod
- EBC yellow pads all around
- Hotchkiss anti-sway bars
- checked all fluids and changed as needed.

I'm fortunate to have a euro indie the shop in our area that has worked on my car for the previous owner and also works on 5 other RS6s in our area so they have experience with some of the realities of our particular beast. When I took it into this shop to get some of this work done in preparation I was very pleasantly surprised to have the shop manager tell me he was going to be my nasa instructor the first day at the track. And he was and it was fantastic having someone who both knew the car and new the track especially since I'm certainly no mechanic and I would be certainly taking the car to places I'd never taken a car to before, performance wise, so having the mechanic with me made me feel much more comfortable with some of the potential stresses I was putting on her.

And then the second day my nasa instructor was a certified porsche master mechanic which was fantastic also because that second day he was working with me on maintaining speed through the corners and as I had learned the track now and was able to stay in the proper racingline for much higher percentage of each lap in that second day at about 15 minutes into the 20 minutes track session I did start to see both the coolant temp and the oil temp rising in ways that concerned me and I was glad to have a mechanic next to me. The oil temp pushed passed 250 Half way to the next notch and coolant half way to the notch right of its normal vertical position . The porsche mechanic said it was fine at those points and to be expected and the SOP is to just do a cool down lap which meant we just went about 70 percent and practiced staying in the proper racingline for two laps and watched as the temps came back down and then We hit it again, but the session ended after 1-2 laps . The weather that Sunday was in the low 80s maybe 82-83

As for the brakes which were my chief concern going in, the set up was fantastic. I experienced only one corner on the first day durring my second session that i felt a slight hardness in the brake (pad fade) and imho it was due to the combonation of my getting more comfortable at speed durring the 2nd session while i still didnt know the track and was not hitting the proper racing line and therefore was badly over braking.

I'm taking my beast back to miller motorsports park this weekend the 12th and the 13th for the second nasa event. I can't wait! Now that i feel little bit more comfortable with how I have the car setup and having a little bit experience and having been signed off to HPDE 2 this weekend I'll get the camera setup and take some video this time.

[Amulet-S6]

Max, chime in here, you're a frequent tracker

[hahnmgh63]

Keep in mine Hunter is in Salt Lake city and Miller Motorsports Park is located at 4400' elevation so with the thinner air it isn't going to cool the Oil, Coolant, or Brakes as well as closer to Sealevel, it really does make a difference.

[Justin9212]

We are just about at sea level here, maybe 600ft above at most.

[MaxRS6]

Good advice on all the above...

I would add create yourself a checklist to utilize between sessions. The time between sessions will fly by and it is easy to overlook something that might bite. A simple checklist provides a calm orderly process to check out the car (i.e. the brake pads, tires, fluid levels, temps, tire pressure, torque lug bolts etc). Be sure to keep a close eye on the inside tire for cording. If you have Vag-Com, check the ATF temp periodically. Might consider a spray bottle to wet down the intercoolers with ice water between sessions. I'm not on the Meth at the moment so I utilize the po man spray bottle currently. ;0

Take a spare set of front and rear brake pads. You don't want a simple thing like brake pads to end the day early. If possible, invest in track wheels and tires. If you gonna do it routinely, keep a set of "track" rotors to swap out for track events.


It is certainly a front loaded heavy hog. However; when you get a little brake trail braking action busting out the back end a bit, and blast out of a perfectly hit Apex, ...well....IT IS TOO MUCH FUN. Be ready for the unsuspecting to pounce on you between sessions with the "WTF is in that thang??".

Keep it safe and have a great time! I look forward to hearing about your experience.

[Justin9212]

I do road course often with the S4, not now that I sold it, but I am aware of road course routine. I am not new to the game, just the car. I was really just looking for how long it takes the Oil Temp, Trans Temp, and Coolant Temp to get to an unsafe level. Not in theory, but from actual experience. I have the tires, brakes, and fluids to handle the track.

[MaxRS6]

I do road course often with the S4, not now that I sold it, but I am aware of road course routine. I am not new to the game, just the car. I was really just looking for how long it takes the Oil Temp, Trans Temp, and Coolant Temp to get to an unsafe level. Not in theory, but from actual experience. I have the tires, brakes, and fluids to handle the track.

I didn't mean to offend as I was just throwng out a few general comments. Woo hoo- Sounds like you are set for some fun. I've not had any issues even with 3 full days as far as overheating. The only time I've had issues with temps is when I've developed leaks (radiator pin hole, a coolant hose, etc). Thus; a good ol pressure test wouldn't hurt to check for leaks. I have seen the brake light a few times due to wearing the pads down too thin (driver error). However; with good pads and fluid- you should have plenty of stopping power. However; I'm no expert and the better drivers (far more than not) than me are much less heavy on the equipment. As you know, a lot of it depends on how you pilot the car around. Good luck and get some good vids for us..00

[Justin9212]

I didn't mean to offend as I was just throwng out a few general comments. Woo hoo- Sounds like you are set for some fun. I've not had any issues even with 3 full days as far as overheating. The only time I've had issues with temps is when I've developed leaks (radiator pin hole, a coolant hose, etc). Thus; a good ol pressure test wouldn't hurt to check for leaks. I have seen the brake light a few times due to wearing the pads down too thin (driver error). However; with good pads and fluid- you should have plenty of stopping power. However; I'm no expert and the better drivers (far more than not) than me are much less heavy on the equipment. As you know, a lot of it depends on how you pilot the car around. Good luck and get some good vids for us..00

No offense taken. I know the internet often does not convey emotion well. I was not offended, just trying to get this back on topic as to my original question.