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Thread: Transmission Behavior Question

  1. #1
    Registered User PixieVC's Avatar
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    Transmission Behavior Question

    All of you with RS6s... answer me this...

    Under light acceleration (slow - gain of 5mph per 10 seconds), at what RPMs/Speed does your car shift from 2nd to 3rd, and 3rd to 4th?

    The reason I ask - I've noticed that my car simply will not shift from 2nd to 3rd at any less than 25 MPH, under any circumstances unless I override the computer with the upshift paddle...

    The exact same thing happens from 3rd to 4th, which it won't shift to at less than 40 MPH.

    I'm just curious of it's normal... there are a lot of 25 MPH and 35 MPH speed limits around, and driving 38 mph at 2,900 RPM is going to be a whole lot more inefficient than 39 mph at 1,900 RPM. I'm regularly overriding the computer to force a shift.

    I suppose my question is... is this NORMAL behavior for an RS6 trans? If it is not normal, what might be causing this behavior? And before anyone asks - shifts are always fairly smooth, very consistent, and predictable. Shift behavior under harder acceleration and wide open throttle is as expected - it will hold the gears longer, in the case of WOT, to redline and shift smoothly to the next gear.

    Kickdowns and upshifts are also smooth. Torque converter works fine - very fast to lock, and I did the 'test' that some forum memeber suggested - 5th gear, 50 MPH, floor it... and the RPMs went up by about 50 (yes, fifty), and then back down to where they should have been in the span of about 1 second... so I'm guessing it's working as designed..

    Any pointers? Am I just being a car hypochondriac? Thanks...
    Daily Drivers: 2002 Mercedes E55 AMG, Brilliant Silver, Autoadapt Menox control, hard-wired Valentine 1 | Ki Tsunami Titanium w/ Spinergy SPOX, Jay J2 Seatback, Jay J3 cushion, 2.5 degree camber

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    just Vag your transmission. if there is an issue it will show up.

  3. #3
    Registered User PixieVC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by peiserg View Post
    just Vag your transmission. if there is an issue it will show up.
    I'd love to. Let me just conjure up the equipment and software and read the codes. Or maybe there's money in me developing a telepathic code reader for cars in general? A mind to computer interface for OBD-II... Or I know, I will let the mechanic I keep in my trunk do that for me and have him issue a full report. This would be an excellent use for an old middle east oil lamp.. Rub it and get 3 wishes...

    point is: not all of us are so equipped. To get it scanned I need to go to a mechanic and shell out dollars - neither activity I enjoy much (who am I kidding? I LOVE spending money!!)...
    Daily Drivers: 2002 Mercedes E55 AMG, Brilliant Silver, Autoadapt Menox control, hard-wired Valentine 1 | Ki Tsunami Titanium w/ Spinergy SPOX, Jay J2 Seatback, Jay J3 cushion, 2.5 degree camber

  4. #4
    Registered User JSRS6's Avatar
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    Those are the normal speed shift points.
    Avus RS 6, RNS-E/BT/RVC, Eurocharged/MTM, SuperSports, PSS9/Hotchkis, SS Lines/EBC Reds, FMU/BMC, Sportec vents, 007's, 9500ci, Black Optics/Headlights/Trim/Rims, CC; coming soon: stage 3 snow meth

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    Registered User mik15's Avatar
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    mine changes below what Pixie is describing here, it's shifting around 2200-2400rpm if i let her do its job and do not interfere, i am not sure if this matters, mine has an ABT tune but as i understood from them they didn't reprogram the TCU...

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    Registered User MaxRS6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PixieVC View Post
    I'd love to. Let me just conjure up the equipment and software and read the codes. Or maybe there's money in me developing a telepathic code reader for cars in general? A mind to computer interface for OBD-II... Or I know, I will let the mechanic I keep in my trunk do that for me and have him issue a full report. This would be an excellent use for an old middle east oil lamp.. Rub it and get 3 wishes...

    point is: not all of us are so equipped. To get it scanned I need to go to a mechanic and shell out dollars - neither activity I enjoy much (who am I kidding? I LOVE spending money!!)...
    Invest in the Ross-Tech cable. It is a "must-have" for any RS6 owner IMHO. For a few hundred dollars you can scan your own codes and it can provide a wealth of information. By pulling a "base" log of information, you will be able to view changes when performance issues arise or the dreaded CEL decides to rear its' ugly head. The information can also be very helpful when dealing with techs.

    http://www.ross-tech.com/vag-com/index.html

    If you don't yet have the MTM TCU chip- Get it.
    210K miles rolled

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    Registered User mik15's Avatar
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    Max - which one would you say is the best one to buy? i am interested in one! Is the KII-USB ok?

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    Registered User aussie rs6's Avatar
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    +1 - get it from hoppen for ~$125. The minimum "must do" upgrade for any C5 RS6.

  9. #9
    Registered User kday's Avatar
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    I bought the HEX-CAN when I bought my RS6. It's more future-proof and I think there may be some upgrades (bluetooth?) that require the CAN part.

    I agree it's a critical investment for an RS6 owner. I keep it and an old laptop in my trunk at all times.

  10. #10
    Registered User vitalian's Avatar
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    Pixie, although those shift points are just a tiny bit higher than on my car, they look pretty normal to me.
    2003 RS6, Mugello Blue/Ebony - SOLD :-(
    2015 S5 Coupe, Mythos Black w/Black Optics package and an attitude

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    Sorry for assuming things here.. but if as you stated when you got here, your goal is to beat the shit out of the car until it's basically only good for parts, one might assume you would have a $125 part that would save you the inevitable trips to pay someone to figure out whats going on. And as an aside, once you've done the whole beat the hell out of the car till it's only good for parts thing, can you save me some of your switches if they are still cosmetically and mechanically sound? The dealership wants a lot O' cash for the switches I need.


    Quote Originally Posted by PixieVC View Post
    I'd love to. Let me just conjure up the equipment and software and read the codes. Or maybe there's money in me developing a telepathic code reader for cars in general? A mind to computer interface for OBD-II... Or I know, I will let the mechanic I keep in my trunk do that for me and have him issue a full report. This would be an excellent use for an old middle east oil lamp.. Rub it and get 3 wishes...

    point is: not all of us are so equipped. To get it scanned I need to go to a mechanic and shell out dollars - neither activity I enjoy much (who am I kidding? I LOVE spending money!!)...

  12. #12
    Registered User PixieVC's Avatar
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    Oh boy. I knew taking certain liberties would come back to bite me. The car will be serviceable at the time I decide to let it go. I made a huge investment in the car, above the price of purchase, to ensure that it'll be working well for me for at least a few years. Per your comments, I've gone ahead and decided to dump the several hundreds of dollars on a computer interface for the car so I can... look at a stream of numbers and try to determine if there's a problem. Fortunately pattern recognition happens to be my personal piece de resistance as an engineer and analyst, so I should be able to have this figured out in no time.

    MTM TCU, huh? I really don't want to rip up the carpet for that... anyone know of a shop or a man I can pay here in the SF Bay Area to handle these sorts of things for me? Doing the computer upgrades, for example...
    Daily Drivers: 2002 Mercedes E55 AMG, Brilliant Silver, Autoadapt Menox control, hard-wired Valentine 1 | Ki Tsunami Titanium w/ Spinergy SPOX, Jay J2 Seatback, Jay J3 cushion, 2.5 degree camber

  13. #13
    Registered User lswing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PixieVC View Post
    Oh boy. I knew taking certain liberties would come back to bite me. The car will be serviceable at the time I decide to let it go. I made a huge investment in the car, above the price of purchase, to ensure that it'll be working well for me for at least a few years. Per your comments, I've gone ahead and decided to dump the several hundreds of dollars on a computer interface for the car so I can... look at a stream of numbers and try to determine if there's a problem. Fortunately pattern recognition happens to be my personal piece de resistance as an engineer and analyst, so I should be able to have this figured out in no time.

    MTM TCU, huh? I really don't want to rip up the carpet for that... anyone know of a shop or a man I can pay here in the SF Bay Area to handle these sorts of things for me? Doing the computer upgrades, for example...
    The codes read out really easy, interface is great, used it a few times to diagnose simple issues on my own, no trip too the shop. Also the TCU is pretty easy to get to, side board snaps off, carpet lifts up, 5 mins or less, plug and play if you send it to Hoppen, although they have a backlog I'm guessing. The shift points with my MTM go higher the further my foot is in the gas. Easy on the pedal and it shifts around 2,500-2,800, hard on the gas and it doesn't shift until 6,500 And driving in Trip is ultra smooth if you shift right on, downshifts are amazingly smooth at a stop sign.

    $250 for the RT cable is nothing, I'm looking at a $2k steering rack sometime this year...
    Ace/Edge TC - Tozo Trans - MTM TCU - REVO/ME7 tune - Wagner IC's w/ Venair Hoses - Aux Radiator delete - Hotchkis Sways - Hawk HPS Pads - Koni Sport Struts - Scroll KO4 Turbos - Devil's Own WM - 421whp/452wtq on Mustang Dyno - http://www.audirssix.com

  14. #14
    Registered User PixieVC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lswing View Post
    The shift points with my MTM go higher the further my foot is in the gas. Easy on the pedal and it shifts around 2,500-2,800, hard on the gas and it doesn't shift until 6,500
    Mine does this...

    Perhaps I already have a TCU and don't know? And perhaps a chip. Given how badly I murdered my friend's E39 M5 the other day... there might be some merit to it.
    Daily Drivers: 2002 Mercedes E55 AMG, Brilliant Silver, Autoadapt Menox control, hard-wired Valentine 1 | Ki Tsunami Titanium w/ Spinergy SPOX, Jay J2 Seatback, Jay J3 cushion, 2.5 degree camber

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    Registered User Hy Octane's Avatar
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    With the adaptive TCU shift points will change according to conditions. If I do a short trip on the freeway in D the tranny adapts to higher shift rpm.. when I return to traffic in the city.. at first it continues this pattern,.. over a period of a few minutes of being in slow n go traffic, the shift points come down until it will go into 5th gear at 35 mph.. so for me its a constant change deal.. I do wish there was a way to isolate the shift program that one prefers and have it as a default.. in other words, a way to switch off the adaptive brain when you have found the ideal program that suits your style..

  16. #16
    Registered User PixieVC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hy Octane View Post
    With the adaptive TCU shift points will change according to conditions. If I do a short trip on the freeway in D the tranny adapts to higher shift rpm.. when I return to traffic in the city.. at first it continues this pattern,.. over a period of a few minutes of being in slow n go traffic, the shift points come down until it will go into 5th gear at 35 mph.. so for me its a constant change deal.. I do wish there was a way to isolate the shift program that one prefers and have it as a default.. in other words, a way to switch off the adaptive brain when you have found the ideal program that suits your style..
    Are you modified in any way? Stock?

    Mine is anything but adaptive. It's the same pattern regardless of driving conditions or circumstances... feels like an old analogue non-electronic gearbox. My trans will only adapt to higher, not lower shift points under harder acceleration.

    My computer won't let me select 5th at less than 40 mph, and less than 35 mph will downshift into 3rd.
    Daily Drivers: 2002 Mercedes E55 AMG, Brilliant Silver, Autoadapt Menox control, hard-wired Valentine 1 | Ki Tsunami Titanium w/ Spinergy SPOX, Jay J2 Seatback, Jay J3 cushion, 2.5 degree camber

  17. #17
    Registered User Hy Octane's Avatar
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    Mine is stock.. you might try resetting the ECU/TCU.. not by Vag com but by physically removing one battery cable for a few minutes and then reconnecting it. You might have to reprogram a few things like radio and window codes, but it willreboot the computers on board and reset everything to default.
    Like any computers, they get a bit confused sometimes and need a reboot..

  18. #18
    Registered User kday's Avatar
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    Disconnecting the battery won't reset everything like it did in the past. The ECU stores some things in a non-volatile EEPROM. I don't know about the TCU.

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