This all ''intel'' is based on Georg Karcher article in UK CAR mag, which is utter rubbish as always, since this guy has no clue lately about what's going on in VAG, where around 75% of all R&D is currently done by Audi!
Only recently Johan de Nysschen dismissed such claims about Porsche designing future Audi platforms as pure nonsense (interview available on YouTube)!
Best,
D
Actually it is based on Kreso quoting Auto Motor und Sport. That said, Georg Kacher did interview Michael Dick, head of R&D at Audi, in Car.Originally Posted by darkop
Designing chassis for two possibly three niche Audi is not the same as handing over all development work to Porsche, it is logical when there is a sharing of interests that one manufacturer does the developement work for a platform than each brand doing their own thing, especially when it's a niche product like a sportscar or supercar or even a high end executive car, it helps keep cost down to the minimum. But in no way is Porsche developing the chassis for mainstream Audis, Volkswagens, Seats or Skodas, they may well for their expertise in a consulting capacity but that will be as far as it goes.
I personally think it's nosense to believe that Audi will drop their development of large hi-performance engines in favour of Porsche supplying theirs to them and Lamborghini, it ain't going to happen.
Hanging the tail out is Vanity
but choosing AWD is Sanity
Joker, i think you're absolutely right. if anything, Audi has become the most talented engine developer of any global manufacturer. Why would it abandon such a position? The answer is it won't.
My guess, and this is pure speculation, is that opposite is true. Audi's new 4.0 litre V8 engine may be so good that it has instantly trumped anything Porsche has in its own armoury in terms of output, torque, emissions and economy. So the question is how to use this engine within the Porsche empire as well as the upper echelons of the VW group. I mean how many different V8s do you need?
If it has now been decided that Porsche will use the new 4.0 litre unit, along with Bentley, perhaps it will see service in brands that command a higher price premium than Audi before it filters down to Audi's own products? Whatever, i am sure Porsche's entire engine strategy is being reviewed carefully by its new masters.
tailpipe,
New Audi 4.0 V8 is engine that WONT be used in any future Porsche model. Current new generation of Porsche V6/V8 engines used in Panamera is much more advanced design with much better further development potential. Decision is already made at upper level...
A sidenote on Mk. II R8 and Gallardo - both are way into development process, meaning that Porsche has minor if any influence on them.
The big impact of Porsche taking over the VAG sportcar plattform ownership will appear with Mk. III, not any earlier. And of cource with the Audi R4/R5
And because of that - the engine choices for the Mk. R8 / gallardo remain limited as well
I am - besides other things - Audidriven
blog.audidriven.net
So what was he, MD, saying in that interview? Do you have it? Could you post scans? I only saw the one where GK is talking about future of Porsches!
Also, AMuS has no big credibility as of late! They announced so many ridiculous things about Audi that in never came to life...
Darkop,
I'll look for the interview when I get home later. Georg Kacher was interviewing Michael Dick. (I remember him saying that Audi wouldn't commit to the Quattro Concept until they found a suitable platform for it and that they hadn't done so yet, despite using the A5's for the prototype.) All magazines get it wrong from time to time. In my experience, Car and AMuS get it wrong less often than others.
Kreso,
Thanks for that, but that isn't what i'm hearing. My understanding is that VW is having a big rethink on large capacity engines for the group, which is not to say that he's right! ;-) I think there is more going on behind the scenes than anyone wants to reveal or can find out.
Mercedes-Benz latest direct injection V8s are certainly impressive and, if you believe UK magazines, better than those of Porsche. The new CLS has had very positive reviews, especially the CLS63, which outpoints Porsche in a few areas.
I reckon these hi-revving NA engine will remain exclusively the domain of the sports/supercar, they've run their course in the more normal performance saloon category which for the foreseeable future will see only FI engines to start with and possible hybrid there after. I'm looking forward to the future Audis, in fact future cars from all of it's rivals because the continued increasing of weight with each replacement looks to be gone for ever.
Who would have thought that the green party and tree huggers would be the saviour of the car enthusiast and their desire to improve emission would lead to better handling.
Hanging the tail out is Vanity
but choosing AWD is Sanity
That was just in line and to confirm of what I had already said: all Lambos and R8 will stick to the n/a engines. Same as current but made more efficient for next generations. It's hard to say the same for Porsches as there are hundreds of different variations of their models and nobody in the world understands what's going on there!
Last edited by darkop; March 12th, 2011 at 17:38. Reason: link broken
Yeah, the Porsche 911 lineup covers a vast price and performance envelope compared to any other car, there competitors offer different models and even engine configurations to carry the sportscar up to supercar categories Porsche have done it with one car and basically one engine but in many variations.
I wonder how things will change now that Porsche has VW's funding to truly take on the might of Ferrari and McLaren.
Hanging the tail out is Vanity
but choosing AWD is Sanity
here's an article about the future sports car platforms for VAG. The 1st one is MQB(transverse, mid engine) and the 2nd is MSS(longitudinal, mid engine). I know it's dated oct. 24, 2010 but it's still an interesting read...
http://www.fourtitude.com/news/publi...ter_6323.shtml
Next Gallardo will be called Cabrera. Intro early 2013. 5.2 V10(fully updated) NA 570hp. Slightly bigger in exterior dimension and lighter in weight. Performance? Better then 458 Italia.
Next R8? Same engine with 550hp. Also marginally bigger then current R8. Also lighter in weight. For next R8 very sport S tronic for sure.
Wow, I thought V10 was dead after F1 abandoned it. What's your source Kreso?
http://www.insideline.com/lamborghin...-revealed.html
Tailpipe, if you do a search the info has been known for a few weeks now.
Hanging the tail out is Vanity
but choosing AWD is Sanity
sounds reasonable, except for what i have geard about the engine output. 550 hp vs 570 hp is laughable in difference (not referring to your post kreso). but of course the CF intensity will be different between the two models. i have heard more like 600 hp (with a bit less for the r8- but at least as much as the r8 gt currently has- i think something related to the intake manifold in the lambo configuration). but with big weight savings these twins are going to be ring beaters for sure. only the mclaren will be faster vs their peers.
Past- A4, TT, S4
Present- R8 V10
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