R8 V10 info...

[KresoF1]

Just got back today from Geneva. Show was actually pretty good. Gallardo LP560-4 is awsome machine indeed.
Honestly, not that impressed with Brilliant Red R8 V12 TDi Le Mans. It look little bit too overdone if you understand me.

Any way I had a chance to speak with some Lambo and Audi guys and I learned few things(facts?) about forthcoming R8 V10... Intro will be(as we already know) in Paris but, sales will start at the end of 2008. I also got very direct answer from one Lambo guy that new R8 V10 will NOT use the same engine as LP560-4. I ask: "You mean lower power unit will be in R8 V10?" He said: "NO. It will use 5.0L V10 derivated from new RS6, NA high reving unit with same intake system as current 4.2L V8 in R8." I said:"Wow...."

Then I talk with one Audi guy and while we were at local bar he said:"This info could be true. But, I can not say anthying more..."

Later, I learned that R8 V10 indeed could feature 5.0L(4991ccm) V10 with 500-510hp/7800rpm and 520Nm/4500rpm! Why? Because there is NO point for Audi to offer R8 V10 with SAME engine as in Gallardo LP560-4. New R8 V10 needs to be pointed at lower position then new LP560-4 according to my Audi source.

What's that mean performance wise?

0-100km/h: 4.2s
0-200km/h:13.6s
Max: 310km/h
Weight: 1600kg(just 40kg more then current manual R8)

Price wise new R8 V10 will be about €25K more in Germany then current R8.

Also about gearbox option-only manual and R-Tronic for R8 V10 as well. NO 7speed so called(potentionally) RS-Tronic DSG style gearbox in any R8 version!
If Getrag build beefed up version of 7speed DSG we could experienced it at earliest in R8 V12 TDI in late 2010... BTW, faith of R8 V12 TDI is still in stars...

New Gallardo LP560-4 and R8 share many parts. For example brakes(standard and optional ceramics) are identical. As are many other parts. Gallardo LP560-4 is better car thanks to development of R8. No doubt about it.

[Rage]

Just got back today from Geneva. Show was actually pretty good. Gallardo LP560-4 is awsome machine indeed.
Honestly, not that impressed with Brilliant Red R8 V12 TDi Le Mans. It look little bit too overdone if you understand me.

Any way I had a chance to speak with some Lambo and Audi guys and I learned few things(facts?) about forthcoming R8 V10... Intro will be(as we already know) in Paris but, sales will start at the end of 2008. I also got very direct answer from one Lambo guy that new R8 V10 will NOT use the same engine as LP560-4. I ask: "You mean lower power unit will be in R8 V10?" He said: "NO. It will use 5.0L V10 derivated from new RS6, NA high reving unit with same intake system as current 4.2L V8 in R8." I said:"Wow...."

Then I talk with one Audi guy and while we were at local bar he said:"This info could be true. But, I can not say anthying more..."

Later, I learned that R8 V10 indeed could feature 5.0L(4991ccm) V10 with 500-510hp/7800rpm and 520Nm/4500rpm! Why? Because there is NO point for Audi to offer R8 V10 with SAME engine as in Gallardo LP560-4. New R8 V10 needs to be pointed at lower position then new LP560-4 according to my Audi source.

What's that mean performance wise?

0-100km/h: 4.2s
0-200km/h:13.6s
Max: 310km/h
Weight: 1600kg(just 40kg more then current manual R8)

Price wise new R8 V10 will be about €25K more in Germany then current R8.

Also about gearbox option-only manual and R-Tronic for R8 V10 as well. NO 7speed so called(potentionally) RS-Tronic DSG style gearbox in any R8 version!
If Getrag build beefed up version of 7speed DSG we could experienced it at earliest in R8 V12 TDI in late 2010... BTW, faith of R8 V12 TDI is still in stars...

New Gallardo LP560-4 and R8 share many parts. For example brakes(standard and optional ceramics) are identical. As are many other parts. Gallardo LP560-4 is better car thanks to development of R8. No doubt about it.

Thanks for the info.

No doubt the R8V10 will be awesome. Interesting about the gearbox....no 7sp DSG is a shame.

That leads me to think that the RS5 will NOT have the V10 engine as the R8V10 or it may (potentially downtuned) but NO DSG.

[AndyBG]

Great write up!

After this, R8 V10 story is starting to take shape...

It will be interesting to see how ''regular'' R8 will survive on the market when ''bigger brother'' arrives...

[Leadfoot]

KersoF1,

Thanks for that, it proves once again the info I proved and was told was indeed correct, that the engine was 5.0L and used the same block/bottom end as the RS6. The info on the DSG (RS-Tronic) is something that has been discussed here for a while, I still believe that it will make an appearance either an the end of this year or early in the next.

P.S.
If the info I received was correct about the R8 engine I wonder is it possible that the info on this engine providing the drive for the RS5 is also correct.

[RXBG]

no way the V10 will go into the RS5. i keep saying it. a V10 is the kind of engine you see in classes like the S6, S8.... if they put a V10 into the RS5 what would you put in the next S8? i guess a V12. but i still think 10 cyl is pushing it in the A5 line. my guess remains a HO TT V8. which could easily go into the A6 line to replace the current 4.2 NA offering 9albeit in lower output form). the A6 4.2 is now outclassed by the 550i and it will soon be the 555i TT V8.

[The Pretender]

The next gen S8 will get a tune down 5.0 Bi-TFSI RS6 engine IMHO.

Jarod.

[Leadfoot]

no way the V10 will go into the RS5. i keep saying it. a V10 is the kind of engine you see in classes like the S6, S8.... if they put a V10 into the RS5 what would you put in the next S8? i guess a V12. but i still think 10 cyl is pushing it in the A5 line. my guess remains a HO TT V8. which could easily go into the A6 line to replace the current 4.2 NA offering 9albeit in lower output form). the A6 4.2 is now outclassed by the 550i and it will soon be the 555i TT V8.

I'm not denying that I too am finding it hard to believe but the fact is that I was told that QuattroGmbH are looking to keep the high revving N/A engine policy for the RS5 but are also looking to have this engine producing in excess of 500Nm of torque, explain how a 4.2Lv8 is capable of that much torque without the requirement of forced induction.

Not all the info I get maybe 100% accurate but most is pretty close and I wonder will my supercharged v6 for the S4 also prove to be correct as will the Bi-turbo v6 diesel.

[Damienr8]

no way the V10 will go into the RS5. i keep saying it. a V10 is the kind of engine you see in classes like the S6, S8.... if they put a V10 into the RS5 what would you put in the next S8? i guess a V12. but i still think 10 cyl is pushing it in the A5 line. my guess remains a HO TT V8. which could easily go into the A6 line to replace the current 4.2 NA offering 9albeit in lower output form). the A6 4.2 is now outclassed by the 550i and it will soon be the 555i TT V8.

Strongly agree with you RXBG. There is no way and reason for a V10 to go into the RS5. It does not fit within that model segment. I think it's going to be a TFSI or TT V8. I personally have no problem with Audi placing the Rs4/R8's Hi Revving V8 in the RS5.

[+44 Dave]

Is there an Audi release at Geneva this year ? I thought the Q5 was coming ? Todays the first public day right ?
What are we expecting to see ?

On topic, What i cant understand is why people see "NO POINT" in putting the new Gallardo engine in the R8 V10 ? There differently manufactured cars, they wont be driving the same just because they have the same engines, there is much more to it than that.

[Leadfoot]

I too was lead to believe that the Q5 would be shown here. I actually like the idea that Audi have chosen a different engine to the new Gallardo, it make both car more individual. Also with this power the new R8v10 should be able to give the GTR a run for it's money both in acceleration and around the track.

I wonder have Audi's additions to the bodywork altered the aerodynamics in anyway, hopefully improving it's top end acceleration and in turn improving it's possible ring time in the process.

[PeterJohn]

The lack of DSG is not b/c of strength. A DSG is actually stronger b/c it eliminates the human factor, and spreads the workload over two clutches. The Veyron has a DSG, and HPG runs 640hp engines through DSG boxes with uprated clutches.

The reason is b/c, aside from the handbuilt Veyron box, the currently produced DSG is only suited for tranverse engines.

[Damienr8]

I too was lead to believe that the Q5 would be shown here. I actually like the idea that Audi have chosen a different engine to the new Gallardo, it make both car more individual. Also with this power the new R8v10 should be able to give the GTR a run for it's money both in acceleration and around the track.

I wonder have Audi's additions to the bodywork altered the aerodynamics in anyway, hopefully improving it's top end acceleration and in turn improving it's possible ring time in the process.

Ideally, I would like the V10 to weigh the same as the V8 model. Maybe through the use of more aluminum, magnesium and carbon fiber components, this could be possible. I would hope that the "new" 5.0L V10 (that from what Kreso said, is derived from the 5.2 in the RS6) would be a light V10.

My ideal vision. A 5.0L 9000rpm V10, 508hp. 390lb/ft torque. Same weight as V8 R8

[KresoF1]

The lack of DSG is not b/c of strength. A DSG is actually stronger b/c it eliminates the human factor, and spreads the workload over two clutches. The Veyron has a DSG, and HPG runs 640hp engines through DSG boxes with uprated clutches.

The reason is b/c, aside from the handbuilt Veyron box, the currently produced DSG is only suited for tranverse engines.

You did not read a discussion about future RS-Tronic(DSG for R8 mid engine platform) between Leadfoot, me and some other members few months ago?

Here is a link for Getrag 7speed DCT for mid engine layout:
http://www.getrag.de/en/253

Problem with that gearbox is the weight and Audi and Getrag are currently working on lower weight version.

[KresoF1]

I too was lead to believe that the Q5 would be shown here. I actually like the idea that Audi have chosen a different engine to the new Gallardo, it make both car more individual. Also with this power the new R8v10 should be able to give the GTR a run for it's money both in acceleration and around the track.

I wonder have Audi's additions to the bodywork altered the aerodynamics in anyway, hopefully improving it's top end acceleration and in turn improving it's possible ring time in the process.

Regarding track times... Gallardo LP560-4 is 3s faster on the Ring then old Gallardo SL. Lambo guys told me that R8 V10 is around 8s slower then LP560-4. That would put R8 V10 in low 7.5Xmin time.

BTW, did you read comparison in Car magazine with R8, M3, 997 Turbo and GT-R? Fair article IMHO. GT-R is fast as hell but, it is not nearly as involving to drive as R8.

[The Pretender]

The new LP560-4 5.2 FSI engine is exactly the same as the Audi 5.2 V10 FSI engine used in the S6 and S8, only it's the high Rev version of it.
Like the RS4 engine is the high Rev version of the S5 engine.
I see no why Audi would start using old 5.0 V10 engine from Lamborghini.
The official info i have see in the past say 480 hp 5.2 V10 FSI.
But now with the LP560-4 having 560 hp the new R8 V10 power output is placed on 520 hp 100hp/litre like the RS4 have.

btw: 3.2 V6 FSI, 4.2 V8 FSI and 5.2 V10 FSI are the N/A engines, the forged induction engines will have 3.0, 4.0 and 5.0 litre volume.

Only the old Lambo V10 is N/A with 5.0 litre.

Jarod.

[The Pretender]

GT-R is fast as hell but, it is not nearly as involving to drive as R8.

60 hp make a difference, drove the R8 and the new 997 Turbo man that is a quick car, but i prefer the R8.

Jarod.

[KresoF1]

The new LP560-4 5.2 FSI engine is exactly the same as the Audi 5.2 V10 FSI engine used in the S6 and S8, only it's the high Rev version of it.
Like the RS4 engine is the high Rev version of the S5 engine.
I see no why Audi would start using old 5.0 V10 engine from Lamborghini.
The official info i have see in the past say 480 hp 5.2 V10 FSI.
But now with the LP560-4 having 560 hp the new R8 V10 power output is placed on 520 hp 100hp/litre like the RS4 have.

btw: 3.2 V6 FSI, 4.2 V8 FSI and 5.2 V10 FSI are the N/A engines, the forged induction engines will have 3.0, 4.0 and 5.0 litre volume.

Only the old Lambo V10 is N/A with 5.0 litre.

Jarod.

I wonder how you missed some very important facts...

Old Gallardo engine is 5.0L 4961ccm V10 engine. New RS6 and forthcoming R8 V10 5.0L V10 is 4991ccm engine. BTW, new 4991ccm engine do not use any part from old Gallardo engine. R8 V10 will use 4991ccm engine with high reving concept, basically it will use same intake system is current R8 4.2L engine.

New Gallardo use 5204ccm V10 but, according to Lambo guys it use only 10% of the parts from current S6/S8 engine...

[The Pretender]

New Gallardo use 5204ccm V10 but, according to Lambo guys it use only 10% of the parts from current S6/S8 engine...

Off cause they can not tell there is a Audi engine under the Lambo bonnet.

Jarod.