TT-S Revealed - Official Thread

[The Pretender]

I don't like the front bumper and the side skirt at all.
I like the rear valance but on a 3.2 quattro.
The question is will the TTS grill fit into the S-Line front bumper and the exhaust valance in the rear S-Line bumper.
In that case you can put on the TTS a normal S-Line carbon bodykit and put in the "S" grill.
And you can put the TTS rear valance on a 3.2 Quattro S-line bumper.

Jarod.

[Leadfoot]

There's more than just one world between a 4.2l V8 and a 2l I4. In your example you change your style but keep the level, but here you're close to loosing everything. You're getting back from the premium segment to a standard engine that's with slight modifications also beating in e.g. a seat leon or the rabbit. I'd see this as equal to dropping the excitement and exclusiveness factor all together and getting back on a chipped GTI stage.

I have never classed the achievements of any car solely on what engine it happens to use, but you are correct in saying that perception from others may view the size of an engine to the ability of the car as the norm is bigger is better. Porsche has had to fight this for years with it's inferior 6cylinder small capacity engines against the like of Ferrari, Lamborghini and others with their 12cylinder large capacity engines.

But which one is profitable and which have been bought over time and again. I personally put this down to Porsche producing the results in term of performance while offering a well balanced package with regards to handling, braking and economy.

I believe the same will apply to the TT/S. Ignore the engine note and this car will deliver on every other fronts and deliver in buckets, to disregard this car because of it's engine you will have to do the same when the TT/RS arrives because it too will have a smaller engine than the rest of the competition.

Imo it's made for people who like to impress those that don't know the technical details of this car and assume a powerful engine in an quad-piped S-model.

Wrong, this car is made for people who aren't concerned with engine size but by the abilities of the machine, the people that will consider this are the type that buy the Cayman instead of a 997 regardless of cost because it is the better balanced car in term of overall performance. The number of exhaust mean precious little.

Maybe those who don't like it don't even register in forums like this just to rant about it. In the german forums it seems to be more balanced though, I didn't see unanimous excitement there. So maybe it's once more a matter of road types and general speed limits, that lead to totally different perceptions of the same concept.

This is something I do agree with, no small capacity engine will run with the big boys for long when it comes to topspeed, but then again this is a TT after all and that is hardly it's point.

But I agree that it will sell well, the 2l engine keeps it cheap for an S-model, so it should be an instant success. Even though that wasn't the initial idea behind S-models in the past...

You can't be stuck in the past, the breed has had to change and this is because BMW has moved it's M models into direct competition with the RS. I reckon in the future a return to smaller forced induction-ed engines will be the way forward for the S models at least.

[SigmaS6]

Porsche has had to fight this for years with it's inferior 6cylinder small capacity engines against the like of Ferrari, Lamborghini and others with their 12cylinder large capacity engines.

They use a 3.4l in the Cayman S, so it seems they are not downsizing in any way close to Audi. And why Audi believes that the performance models should be the first to be downsized is absolutely beyond me.

Imo it's a nice effort if VW does that with the 1.4l TFSI rabbit, but why should Audi chose the TTS for such an experiment? Are there really the environmentally aware customers?

Also I'm not sure if we can really call it downsizing in the TTS, imo Audi was just too cheap to develop an engine for the TTS, so they put in what they still had lying around.

to disregard this car because of it's engine you will have to do the same when the TT/RS arrives because it too will have a smaller engine than the rest of the competition.

If it has the 2.5l I5 it will have an exclusive and powerful engine of just the right size. An engine no rabbit will have and with a sound that is RS worthy.

the people that will consider this are the type that buy the Cayman instead of a 997 regardless of cost because it is the better balanced car in term of overall performance.

Wasn't the 911 turbo made for those who strive for better balance and performance than the std 911?

You can't be stuck in the past, the breed has had to change and this is because BMW has moved it's M models into direct competition with the RS.

BMW offers a 3l engine with 306hp in the 135i, their engine lineup seems perfectly ok to me, totally free of downsizing experiments. The same goes for the M models.

[Mockenrue]

imo Audi was just too cheap to develop an engine for the TTS, so they put in what they still had lying around.

From Fourtitude:

Compared to the engine it was derived from, the two-liter power unit has undergone extensive reengineering and strengthening to ready it for operation in the TTS – overhauled areas include the engine block, the cylinder head, the pistons, the connecting rods and the turbocharger, which can build up as much as 1.2 bar of relative air pressure. The intake and exhaust systems have undergone elaborate honing to allow the refined four-cylinder engine to both breathe freely and generate a powerful, resonant soundtrack. An optimized and highly efficient intercooler lowers the temperature of the compressed air, producing a crucial increase in the quantity of air supplied for combustion.

[Qisha]

Dear Friends,

actually the TTS does not sound "that bad" like some are assuming. The base engine has won the "Engine of the year" Award if you remember. Nearly every engine (and around it) part has been re-engineered for use in the TTS.

Give that little bullit a chance.

Qisha

[SigmaS6]

From Fourtitude:

Compared to the engine it was derived from

Please read carefully, the engine it was derived from is the 2l engine from the TT and GTI, not the S3 engine. The mentioned changes are those that lead to the S3 engine, the TTS-engine is 1:1 the S3 engine, without any modifications.

[Leadfoot]

SigmaS6,

I might be wrong on this so don't take it as gospel, but I was under the impression that the TT/S was using a new version of the 2.0TFSi engine what will first see service in a VW with the Tiguan.

How much of a difference there is I am uncertain but there are differences.

But clearly what ever anyone says about this car and as engine you have already made your position clear and look likely to stick with it.

[SigmaS6]

I might be wrong on this so don't take it as gospel, but I was under the impression that the TT/S was using a new version of the 2.0TFSi engine what will first see service in a VW with the Tiguan.

Not sure when the first GTI RaVe will be delivered, but it should be the same 2l 270hp engine, so I guess this one will have it first

If they really had changed anything for this engine I'd be very surprised, because what would you change to get 2 percent more power? The revised 2l will have 211 hp, so 11 more. I don't think those changes done to the S3 engine add up to just 7.

[Leadfoot]

I think we had this discussion quite a while ago, only that time it was the case that you felt the TT/S would be useless compared to the Z350, again because of engine size.

Same record, different tune.

[SigmaS6]

I think we had this discussion quite a while ago, only that time it was the case that you felt the TT/S would be useless compared to the Z350, again because of engine size.

I doubt that. Yes, i think the 350Z should be the dominating factor to find the right output for any new model in this segment, but I'm no big fan of the 350Z because I don't feel that it offers much more than power (I don't even think it makes good use of it).

Btw, given that Audi would have made the TTS with say 330hp (which is around the maximum you can achieve with chipping) and two turbos to get rid of the lag I wouldn't have had many problems even with the 2l engine choice. I'd still have missed at least one cylinder, but my overall attitude would be rather positive.

Currently I think I'm pretty much in line with car and driver:

Although the announcement of the TT-S isn’t a huge shock—we’ve been expecting it for a while now—it is rather surprising that its output isn't a huge improvement on the TT 3.2’s 250 horsepower and 236 pound-feet. We’re hopeful but not optimistic that the TT-S will represent a more notable jump in performance than that offered by the 3.2 over the 2.0T—and in some instances the 2.0T is actually quicker than the 3.2. We’re afraid we don’t see much of a point.

Indeed, with much of its equipment, like the magnetic shocks, available as options on the 3.2, the TT-S begins to feel like more of a trim package—probably an expensive one—with a bonus power bump. We will, however, wait to reserve final judgment until we slide behind the TT-S’s flat-bottomed steering wheel once it goes on sale this November.

I think we agreed in the past that this engine in the TT might well be a good idea, but doesn't imply an S-badge. Maybe we can settle for this

[Leadfoot]

Btw, given that Audi would have made the TTS with say 330hp (which is around the maximum you can achieve with chipping) and two turbos to get rid of the lag I wouldn't have had many problems even with the 2l engine choice. I'd still have missed at least one cylinder, but my overall attitude would be rather positive.

If Audi had of given you what you wanted then there would never have been a need for a TT/RS and also the price wouldn't have been £34K but more like £40K and I am sorry but not S model in TT form could have commanded a price like that.

I think we agreed in the past that this engine in the TT might well be a good idea, but doesn't imply an S-badge. Maybe we can settle for this

I don't see the point in discussing the rights or the wrongs with the engine choice until the car is here and has been tested. Don't you agree.

I have got a guts feeling that this car will really deliver but until it's tested by others (motoring press) I can not prove it. Time will prove me right.

[The Pretender]

Good test results is not everything, you still have a 4 cylinder engine for your money.
Even a 272 ps 5 cylinder engine would be the better option IMHO.

Jarod.

[chewym]

How would the 5 cylinder version of the exact same engine be any better. The fuel economy on the TTS is very, very good. And it's a very light engine as well. Adding an extra cylinder would kill both fuel economy and add a lot more weight.

[Leadfoot]

How would the 5 cylinder version of the exact same engine be any better. The fuel economy on the TTS is very, very good. And it's a very light engine as well. Adding an extra cylinder would kill both fuel economy and add a lot more weight.

chewym,

I think we are beating a dead horse with this one.

To some people engine size is more important than handling finesse and decent economy.

[The Pretender]

The same power output from a engine with one cylinder more not mean more fuel use.
The 2.0 is a high state tuned engine with a big turbo to get the power output and it have turbo lag.
A 5 cylinder would produce the same power with a smaller turbo and less turbo lag and probably the same fuel use.
Therefore IMHO the better option, i don't like a kick in the back small typ of engine.
Only the little more weight is a minus factor for a 5 cylinder, every thing else is a big pro factor.

Jarod.

[tvrfan]

HOPE ITS NO RE PoST !

NICE engine Sound

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pshe3_RyIKY

[The Pretender]

Yes nice one, two cars together in the mountains.
They still sound like coffee grider's to me.
Imagine a 300 hp 3.6 VR6 FSI TTS on that road in te mountains, that would sound like haven, and they only needed one of it.

Jarod.

[Leadfoot]

Yes nice one, two cars together in the mountains.
They still sound like coffee grider's to me.
Imagine a 300 hp 3.6 VR6 FSI TTS on that road in te mountains, that would sound like haven, and they only needed one of it.

Jarod.

Agreed but the video would have to run a little longer as it wouldn't have the same handling finesse.

But that would be OK to you and sigmaS6 as it's noise which is most important after all.