Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst ... 234
Results 55 to 64 of 64

Thread: Auto Zeitung comparison-BMW M3 vs. Audi R8 vs. C06

  1. #55
    Registered User Leadfoot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    7,791
    Quote Originally Posted by Mmm View Post
    There is no way understeer is faster than oversteer. You obviously can't drive RWD. If you giving loads of lock, then yeah. But if you catching a whiff of oversteer & are keeping the throttle & momentum going forward you will gave good exit speed. With understeer you have no option but to lift to get the nose in & then re-apply throttle. With oversteer you can keep the throttle buried & steer with it while getting the nose to the apex & powering out.

    But I agree the R8 is the best handler out there at the moment. The videos I have seen have it oversteering while nicely, especially when Tiff drove it. I hear it can send up to 95% to the rear which is probably why it handles so well.
    Use to rally the Mk2 Escort so probably you are correct, I know nothing.
    Search and you will find the truth.

  2. #56
    Registered User Mori's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Poland
    Posts
    433
    Lets face the fact that most people don't track their cars, and there are many better ring toys than RS4s or M3s.

    Second of all, some people drive their car in extreme conditions all year, and get to where they are going faster and safer with Quattro than ESP+RWD.

    My weekend fun-car will always be RWD, but my daily driver/family car will always have Quattro.

    Oh and since I am out of a weekend fun-car atm, then I guess I just have to slide around in my RS4. Made my g/f scream a bit last night in the rain when we went around some twisties sideways. And guess what - no understeer if you know what you're doing.


    Hmm and since this thread is about the R8 vs. M3s and whatnot - I guess I'd better get back on topic and just state that I'd still prefer a GT3 or GT3RS over the R8, which is a beautiful car and suprisingly good, but the 911 simply has my heart.
    2007 RS4 Avant | Misano | Black Optics | SS+
    2001 S3 | Ebony

  3. #57
    Registered User Leadfoot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    7,791
    Mori,

    You naughty boy, 1000 lines saying I must never place another car ahead of an Audi.
    Search and you will find the truth.

  4. #58
    Registered User Mori's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Poland
    Posts
    433
    I'd actually considered cut and pasting that 1000 times, but then I figured I'd get banned for spam.

    But seriously - I'm young without a family and if I didn't need an Avant for work, I'd definately go for a 911.
    2007 RS4 Avant | Misano | Black Optics | SS+
    2001 S3 | Ebony

  5. #59
    Registered User Leadfoot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    7,791
    Quote Originally Posted by Mori View Post
    I'd actually considered cut and pasting that 1000 times, but then I figured I'd get banned for spam.

    But seriously - I'm young without a family and if I didn't need an Avant for work, I'd definately go for a 911.
    After driving both the Cayman and 997S seriously on the track I would never consider the 997. The Cayman is a much better driving car with much better balance and front-end grip, but as for the one to go and pose in, well that's a different story, the 997 would win every time.
    Search and you will find the truth.

  6. #60
    Registered User Mori's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Poland
    Posts
    433
    Well the 9974S with the powerkit is the first car which could go faster in the twisties than I have the guts to try. Even with the RS4, while having fantastic grip, has reached its grip threshold on more than one occasion - of course I liftoff then to get some oversteer and continue on happily. A great car - I really love it, but I want something more hardcore, less comfy, louder, and basically a sports car.

    Test drove a 2007 M5 today - very very fast, actually quite decent to drive in town with P500S on, but way too big for me.

    Now - the RS5 if it comes out is one mean machine that could grab hold of me as well.

    Love my RS4 - best touring car you can buy IMO - just for the record.
    2007 RS4 Avant | Misano | Black Optics | SS+
    2001 S3 | Ebony

  7. #61
    Registered User Leadfoot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    7,791
    Quote Originally Posted by Mori View Post
    Well the 9974S with the powerkit is the first car which could go faster in the twisties than I have the guts to try. Even with the RS4, while having fantastic grip, has reached its grip threshold on more than one occasion - of course I liftoff then to get some oversteer and continue on happily. A great car - I really love it, but I want something more hardcore, less comfy, louder, and basically a sports car.

    Test drove a 2007 M5 today - very very fast, actually quite decent to drive in town with P500S on, but way too big for me.

    Now - the RS5 if it comes out is one mean machine that could grab hold of me as well.

    Love my RS4 - best touring car you can buy IMO - just for the record.
    I didn't get to sample the Carrera4S on the track so can't comment on what it's differences are compared to the rwd version. No doubt the 4S will be better balanced and have better on the limit manners. As for the normal Carrera S, it was a car that each time you entered the same corner the car reacted differently, this wasn't true of course it was just even small entry speed differences made the car react differently, either oversteering or understeering. Again I didn't feel the confidence that I felt with the Cayman or Boxster, with them the only thing that a different entry speed did was alter the arch of the corner, not the car's behaviour.

    Funny you found the M5 only big, I found it way to quick for it's own good. Not a car I felt comfortable driving quickly, the nose felt even more nose heavy than the Audi. I don't know the weight balance but it felt very light at the rear to me.
    Search and you will find the truth.

  8. #62
    Registered User Mori's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Poland
    Posts
    433
    Quote Originally Posted by Leadfoot View Post
    I didn't get to sample the Carrera4S on the track so can't comment on what it's differences are compared to the rwd version. No doubt the 4S will be better balanced and have better on the limit manners. As for the normal Carrera S, it was a car that each time you entered the same corner the car reacted differently, this wasn't true of course it was just even small entry speed differences made the car react differently, either oversteering or understeering. Again I didn't feel the confidence that I felt with the Cayman or Boxster, with them the only thing that a different entry speed did was alter the arch of the corner, not the car's behaviour.

    Funny you found the M5 only big, I found it way to quick for it's own good. Not a car I felt comfortable driving quickly, the nose felt even more nose heavy than the Audi. I don't know the weight balance but it felt very light at the rear to me.
    Hmm I drove the S on the track as well and quite frankly it was really stable. It actually felt more composed and better sorted than the 996 TT I drove later that day.

    I absolutely agree about the Cayman/Boxster - great handling regarding over/understeer. Easy to correct if you try to do something stupid. But the 911 I drove did feel faster in the twisties.


    I didn't feel the lightness in the rear - but the 500HP certainly. I could get it to spin in 4th gear (ok the tires were a little worn ) and it certainly doesn't feel as surefooted as the RS4, but its easy to drive, is well balanced in corners and probably extremely easy to drift in (the M6 is at least ).

    Here's the vid from the BMW M6 event (Launch control at about 00:38-40 into the movie): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBuBGmUf-O4

    I didn't film it - I just drove the car.
    2007 RS4 Avant | Misano | Black Optics | SS+
    2001 S3 | Ebony

  9. #63
    Registered User Leadfoot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    7,791
    Quote Originally Posted by Mori View Post
    Hmm I drove the S on the track as well and quite frankly it was really stable. It actually felt more composed and better sorted than the 996 TT I drove later that day.

    I absolutely agree about the Cayman/Boxster - great handling regarding over/understeer. Easy to correct if you try to do something stupid. But the 911 I drove did feel faster in the twisties.
    Don't get me wrong, the 997 is a great handling car, I think my problem was that I sampled the Cayman S first on a track which though dry had not be used for some days prior to the event and it's surface was a little greasy. The Cayman just took everything in it's stride and never put a foot wrong and it's balance is so lovely. The 997 was either understeering or oversteering and heaven forbid you lifted a little mid corner when the nose run wide as you had to be quick with the steering to catch the tail. I found the only way to get a good time was to be a little slower in to and through the corner than the Cayman and wait until just before the corner had finished before giving it the beans.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mori View Post
    I didn't feel the lightness in the rear - but the 500HP certainly. I could get it to spin in 4th gear (ok the tires were a little worn ) and it certainly doesn't feel as surefooted as the RS4, but its easy to drive, is well balanced in corners and probably extremely easy to drift in (the M6 is at least ).
    There is no doubt this is a machine designed before going sideways. It interesting to hear you didn't find it light at the rear end, maybe the roads you were on were a lot smoother than the ones I sampled it on because I thought I was sat not in an M5 but a E55, the DSG light was blinking away with every poke of the throttle. Something you seldom see with a Quattro. It may well have been well balance in the corners but at the time, finding it's better behaved side was not on my agenda.
    Search and you will find the truth.

  10. #64
    Registered User Mori's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Poland
    Posts
    433
    Quote Originally Posted by Leadfoot View Post
    Don't get me wrong, the 997 is a great handling car, I think my problem was that I sampled the Cayman S first on a track which though dry had not be used for some days prior to the event and it's surface was a little greasy. The Cayman just took everything in it's stride and never put a foot wrong and it's balance is so lovely. The 997 was either understeering or oversteering and heaven forbid you lifted a little mid corner when the nose run wide as you had to be quick with the steering to catch the tail. I found the only way to get a good time was to be a little slower in to and through the corner than the Cayman and wait until just before the corner had finished before giving it the beans.



    There is no doubt this is a machine designed before going sideways. It interesting to hear you didn't find it light at the rear end, maybe the roads you were on were a lot smoother than the ones I sampled it on because I thought I was sat not in an M5 but a E55, the DSG light was blinking away with every poke of the throttle. Something you seldom see with a Quattro. It may well have been well balance in the corners but at the time, finding it's better behaved side was not on my agenda.
    997/Cayman: yeah I can imagine that the Cayman felt much more neutral and balanced. I had fun with Caymans in the rain on a track - it was soooo easy to control.


    Dude - I'm based in Poland where roads are not smooth by definition! True - I easily broke traction when accelerating, but with M Dynamic Mode the DSC intervention was very soft, and when I switched it off, the car drove in a straight line anyway. I guess its really easy to over do it with DSC off in corners, but hey - you need to know how to drive if you buy a car like that right?

    Hmm - just to clarify: I wouldn't buy an M5/6 personally. Would prefer a P-car (GT3 or Turbo please).
    2007 RS4 Avant | Misano | Black Optics | SS+
    2001 S3 | Ebony

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •