Auto Zeitung comparison-BMW M3 vs. Audi R8 vs. C06

[RussianM3_dude]

I don't see what's so special about the RS4 engine. Ok I whole-heartedly commend Audi for growing some danglies and actually meeting BMW head on with a NA engine (witness how they chickened out with the RS6). However it's not a very good engine unless you look at the spec. When I read the brochure, I was like "Wow, off the hizzle fo' shizzle!!!" but in real life it's just not that special except for the fact that it revs like no Audi before it.

The main problem is that it is very linear and one-dimensional. I see no difference in sound or delivery between 5 and 8250 rpm which means that I often shift too early or bounce of the limiter. The engine just doesn't push you to squeeze out every rev like the E46 M3 or a I4 sport bike. Also, there is not that much throttle response, not even close to something like the Ferrari 4.3 or the BMW 3.2 . Also, the direct injection whine just totally ruins the sound. It is weird, on some days I almost don't hear it and only the engine sound, other days their is so much whine, the engine sounds like a blender, complete crock.

It's not an engine with a lot of character. Very competent, but it leaves me cold. I heard the old Arese Alfa GTA V6... now THAT is how an engine should sound and feel. I can only imagine if Alfa had the cash to push it to 100hp/liter.

As for the R8... Audi definetly benefits from lowered expectations and the fact that it's cars are much easier to squeeze performance out of. I think from next year, once Porsche updates their engines... Game over, 911 will be back on top.

[Ruergard]

Ok I whole-heartedly commend Audi for growing some danglies and actually meeting BMW head on with a NA engine (witness how they chickened out with the RS6).

Chickened out? You havn't noticed that there are some plusses with a turbocharged engine that a NA engine can't achieve?

Things like 650nm of torque between 1500 and 6250 rpm?

[Mmm]

Chickened out? You havn't noticed that there are some plusses with a turbocharged engine that a NA engine can't achieve?

Things like 650nm of torque between 1500 and 6250 rpm?

Yeah & that translates to 0-200 in 14.9. With 580hp.

[Ruergard]

Yeah & that translates to 0-200 in 14.9. With 580hp.

I havn't talked anything about performancefigures, but if you wan't to take it to that. Take an M5 and a RS6 out on a road that isnt dead straight, not completely dry.. or why not at wintertime?

[Leadfoot]

I have never before see the influx of BMW disruptors as there has been, since finally Audi have stepped out of the shadow of BMW and putting them in to the shade. Since the RS4 was introduced small voices started to appear which have grown steadily with the R8 and now RS6.

Clearly they don't like their beloved BMW not being top dog.

[Mmm]

I havn't talked anything about performancefigures, but if you wan't to take it to that. Take an M5 and a RS6 out on a road that isnt dead straight, not completely dry.. or why not at wintertime?

Who races in imperfect conditions, really? Is it worth it? And if you win what do you prove? That your car is the imperfect weather champion? Anything can happen in imperfect conditions in any car.

[Leadfoot]

Who races in imperfect conditions, really? Is it worth it? And if you win what do you prove? That your car is the imperfect weather champion? Anything can happen in imperfect conditions in any car.

Who races in imperfect conditions?

Lets see now, there F1 racing drivers, formula 2/3/4 in fact every form of single seater cars have from time to time race in imperfect conditions. Then there is rally drivers, the really skilled drivers which almost always race in these conditions, I wonder what type of system their cars use.

Karting, touring cars, in fact the list goes on and on.

Sadly this is the sort of reply one expects from a person who prefers to drive a rwd car. The last time I looked the weather wasn't always perfect but clearly it's the only time you must be capable of racing so best only race during sunny spells and a bone dry track.

But sure anything can happen in imperfect conditions but it seems to always happen to rwd cars so why should we be concerned with that.

P.S.
With the exception of rallying, all of the other forms of motorsport use only rwd and awd is banned. Quite possibly for the very reason that it rains when one least expects it or wants it and an awd set-up would have a very unfair advantage.

With regarding to the recent tests of the M3 vs the R8 and also the S5 vs the 335i even if both could only match the times of their respective rivals in the dry, the very fact that is anything other than perfect conditions they are able to hold a huge advantage makes then the superior set-up for an everyday car required to be driven 365 days of the year.

[Ruergard]

Who races in imperfect conditions, really? Is it worth it? And if you win what do you prove? That your car is the imperfect weather champion? Anything can happen in imperfect conditions in any car.

Well, I like to drive my cars every day of the year. No matter of the weather, it both rains and snows a lot up here. But with Quattro that's not really a big problem...

"Imperfect weather champion"
No that the car I've choosed will perform very, very good in both good and bad conditions!

Clearly they don't like their beloved BMW not being top dog.

Agree, there's a lot of talk going on nowtimes!



Maybe we're going a bit to much offtopic now btw.

[tazsura]

I don't see what's so special about the RS4 engine. Ok I whole-heartedly commend Audi for growing some danglies and actually meeting BMW head on with a NA engine (witness how they chickened out with the RS6). However it's not a very good engine unless you look at the spec. When I read the brochure, I was like "Wow, off the hizzle fo' shizzle!!!" but in real life it's just not that special except for the fact that it revs like no Audi before it.

The main problem is that it is very linear and one-dimensional. I see no difference in sound or delivery between 5 and 8250 rpm which means that I often shift too early or bounce of the limiter. The engine just doesn't push you to squeeze out every rev like the E46 M3 or a I4 sport bike. Also, there is not that much throttle response, not even close to something like the Ferrari 4.3 or the BMW 3.2 . Also, the direct injection whine just totally ruins the sound. It is weird, on some days I almost don't hear it and only the engine sound, other days their is so much whine, the engine sounds like a blender, complete crock.

It's not an engine with a lot of character. Very competent, but it leaves me cold. I heard the old Arese Alfa GTA V6... now THAT is how an engine should sound and feel. I can only imagine if Alfa had the cash to push it to 100hp/liter.

As for the R8... Audi definetly benefits from lowered expectations and the fact that it's cars are much easier to squeeze performance out of. I think from next year, once Porsche updates their engines... Game over, 911 will be back on top.

http://www.worldcarfans.com/9070910....ototypes-spied

Wow, that's HAS to hurt!

Your beloved BMW...having to twin turbo the M5...what happened dude?!

Taz

[RussianM3_dude]

http://www.worldcarfans.com/9070910....ototypes-spied

Wow, that's HAS to hurt!

Your beloved BMW...having to twin turbo the M5...what happened dude?!

Taz

It's all Audi's fault. Because of their inferiority syndrome, they have to compensate with massive on paper power. Unfortunately most people fall for that. However let's see if it will have turboes after all. I am thinking ///M would rather lose some weight. There has been speculation of a ///M6 CSL and maybe an ///M5 CSL. Loose 200 kilos and it will be as fast as an RS6 as well as way more fun to drive.

[tazsura]

It's all Audi's fault. Because of their inferiority syndrome, they have to compensate with massive on paper power. Unfortunately most people fall for that. However let's see if it will have turboes after all. I am thinking ///M would rather lose some weight. There has been speculation of a ///M6 CSL and maybe an ///M5 CSL. Loose 200 kilos and it will be as fast as an RS6 as well as way more fun to drive.

LOL..inferiority? You crease me up. So Audi now with their massive power have surely turned "inferiority" into Superiority, no?

And why can't the genius's at BMW just wave their wond and produce an extra 80hhp from the NA V10? Must be easy surely?

I would love to see a CSL M6. I doubt they could do it in the M5 though, as this is supposed to be a luxury saloon as well as being a sporty beast. To drop 200kg without dropping such items as air con etc...would be very hard...and completely alienate a huge chunk of clientel.

Taz