R8 Ring time achived by Sport auto is...

[Leadfoot]

KresoF1,

Since you are the man in the know with regards to all things Sport Auto related have you heard anything about the new M3 only being able to lap the ring in 8:12.

The more I think about it the less I believe this report, even it they give the old M3 a power hike to 420hp and fitted the same size of tyres it would more than likely be able to lap it in around 8:12 or something close.

[KresoF1]

Leadie,
Actually I belive that 8.12min is pretty legit for new M3. Why? It is official time with Michelin street tires...
Old M3 achieved 8.22min in Sport Auto Supertest so, 10s more faster seems OK for me.

Regarding R8... It could even in von Saurma's hands go around 8.00-7.58min with some adjustments... Magnetic Ride and Pirelli P Zero The Hero are key elements IMHO.

BTW, new S5 Ring time is around 8.25min...

[Leadfoot]

Leadie,
Actually I belive that 8.12min is pretty legit for new M3. Why? It is official time with Michelin street tires...
Old M3 achieved 8.22min in Sport Auto Supertest so, 10s more faster seems OK for me.

Regarding R8... It could even in von Saurma's hands go around 8.00-7.58min with some adjustments... Magnetic Ride and Pirelli P Zero The Hero are key elements IMHO.

BTW, new S5 Ring time is around 8.25min...

The S5 time is that official, was this do by Sport Auto because unofficially I was told in testing it went around in something close to 8:17.

The S5's time is a little disappointing based on what has been said about the grip from the new chassis, to quote AUTOCAR's test against the 335Ci

'But on the tight, Alpine passes north of Verona, the S5 comprehensively blitzes the 335i on A-to-B pace. We’re talking of a difference that would equate to several seconds a stage mile here.'

Now do that sound like the kind of car that would post an identical time to a BMW335i and Alpine passes sound just like the sort of roads that would possibly make up the ring.

[KresoF1]

S5 time is what my friend(who is regional Director of Sales for Audi) told me.
I heard news about Gallardo facelift as well and some other Audi news...

[Leadfoot]

Then in my opinion the new chassis has not move the game forward for Audi one little bit, think about it, the old S4 Avant did it in 8:29 and we can allow a couple of seconds off this for the saloon. Too improve this again by only a couple of seconds based on the fact that it have an improved chassis, better weight balance, more power and torque, one would have to say that disappointed would be an understatement don't you think.

[KresoF1]

I agree with you.
Personally(do not kill me!) I would rather go for 335i Coupe then for S5. All A5/S5 looks pretty strange to me. It is also pretty big car, I saw it side by side with 335i Coupe and could not belive how much bigger Audi is!

BUT, let get back OT.

[Leadfoot]

Well I will be seeing it for the first this weekend and getting to drive as well, after having a S4 for over two years I will possibly be one of a handful of people on this site to give a valid opinion on whether the new S5 is indeed an improvement.

So will keep you all posted.

[3x5PSI]

BMW tend to be conservative with the claims. The official claim for the CSL was 8:00 & it did 7:50. The Z4 M Roaster did 8:15 as tested by Sport Auto, & it's not much lighter than an M3. Autocar also got 8:15 for an E46 M3 SMG.

[Leadfoot]

BMW tend to be conservative with the claims. The official claim for the CSL was 8:00 & it did 7:50. The Z4 M Roaster did 8:15 as tested by Sport Auto, & it's not much lighter than an M3. Autocar also got 8:15 for an E46 M3 SMG.

I don't agree with what you are saying, I know of report that the M5 was lapping the ring in 7:5? but it's official time is 8:12, word always leaks out what times all these car are doing during testing. I know that in a higher state of tune the TT/S have lapped the ring in 8:14 (how much higher I will keep to myself ) but it's not that far from the up-grade's amount, like-wise the S5 has done something like 8:17, we know the RS4 do it in 7:58 and I have heard what the RS6 has allegedly lapped the ring in.

But back to the CSL, if it done the ring in 7:50 then what did it not do during testing.:bigeyes:

P.S. KresoF1, when was the S5 lap time carried out, was this very recent and if so when will the results be put in to print?

[3x5PSI]

LEadie 8:15 was the Z4 M Roadster as tested by Sport Auto officially. The roadster is not very rigid & doesn't have as precise handling as a coupe. And its quite heavy as well. I think it weighs 1480kg as tested by Sport Auto. Surely an E92 M3 will blow away Sport Auto's time for the Z4?

[Erik]

Maybe we can have some more information soon.

My "friend with the CSL" is down at Nordschleife Hardcore with Sport Auto and was in the R8 with Frank Stipler and is now going with Horst von Saurma in the GT3 RS.

I asked him for the inside information stuff

[Leadfoot]

Erik,

Are you meaning the times for the R8 and possibly the new M3.

P.S.

I hope he can get the times of the S5 as well.

[Leadfoot]

LEadie 8:15 was the Z4 M Roadster as tested by Sport Auto officially. The roadster is not very rigid & doesn't have as precise handling as a coupe. And its quite heavy as well. I think it weighs 1480kg as tested by Sport Auto. Surely an E92 M3 will blow away Sport Auto's time for the Z4?

I know the roadster isn't as good as the Coupe, but the MCoupe is that great a drive on the road regardless of what time it would achieve on the track. The brother-in-law owns one and it a scary thing to hustle down a bump/twisty road I will tell you.

I totally agree with you, I can believe the M3 will only be able to post a time of 8:12 in much the same way as I reckon the S5's time of 8:25 a plain silly as well.

[KresoF1]

Guys, you may find this interesting... My discussion about R8 Ring time on other forum...
Comment to my post form other member:
"Sportauto conducts this test with ESP off, AMS tests with ESP on (HvS actually mentions this in the Supertest article). It is mentioned that R8 is faster to drive with ESP "on" due to a nervous rear at the limit which only can be mastered by very fast counter-steering (which may be fun, but doesn't make you fast of course).

As for your assumption that the Sportauto R8 may have suffered from a lack of horses: do the accelaration tests / topspeed tests (Sportauto vs. AMS) vary significantly ? (I don't have the AMS test at hand).

As per my understanding (after reading the Supertest) the somewhat unexpected NoS-Laptime is due to aerodynamics and damping. "

My resonse:
"The difference of 17.4km/h in speed between ESP on and off(BTW, there is so called ESP sport mode but, von Saurma did not mentioned it...?) is IMHO way tooo big!

Other thing-aerodynamics... Yes, the Cw is 0.35 for R8 and 0.31 for RS4 but, in windchannel aerodynamic balance of R8 is far, far better then of RS4(just look at test results).
So, IMHO aerodynamics is not responsible for not so good Ring time.
What I can not except is that von Saurma is implying that RS4 is actually faster in 0-250km/h then R8(again, according to von Saurma aerodynamics is responsible for bad Doettinger Hoehe top speed. I expected more from him since I talked with one Ring freak and in his opinion engine power is the key element here...)!

Let me explain this:
-Hockenheim time R8 1.12,7min
-Hockenheim Zielgerade top speed R8 191km/h
-Hockenheim time RS4 1.15,4min
-Hockenheim Zielgerade top speed RS4 187km/h

So, since we know that R8 acceleration in 0-200km/h is 16.2s and RS4 16.9s these Hockenheim results are expected...

-Ring time R8 8.04min
-Ring Doettinger Hoehe top speed R8 254km/h
-Ring Schwedenkreuz top speed R8 238km/h
-Ring time RS4 8.09min
-Ring Doettinger Hoehe top speed RS4 262km/h
-Ring Schwedenkreuz top speed RS4 240km/h

This results clearly show you that R8 example that was used by Sport Auto is slower above 200km/h then RS4.Since I do not think that difference in ambiente temperature played major role here(R8-20 degree C, RS4-13 degree C) not so good engine power of that R8 example must be a case here...

BUT, according to Auto Bild Sportscars, EVO and one Swedish magazine R8 is actually faster then RS4 in 0-250km/h!

Let me give you just one example:
-R8 0-250km/h: 29.3s
-RS4 0-250km/h: 31.9s


Last thing that also puts benefite of the doubt on your ESP on/off discussion is the fact that EVO's amazing R8 Bedford time was also achived with ESP off. "

Comments?

[Leadfoot]

KresoF1,

Like I said before, the majority of tests have shown the R8 to be very quick indeed on the track, check the times on the VIR track compared to the GT3RS and the Z06. There is no way that this 'Supertest' conducted by Sport Auto is a reflection of the rest of the tests, it's at odds with the others.

I will not believe any result conducted on the ring that doesn't produce a time less than 8:00.

[7:53 RS6]

Its all about the driver. Ok guys dont go thru the roof now, Frank Stippler drove the R8 full lap in about 7.50min. Let me tell you that even the CSL will go faster than Horst 7.50 whit the right driver.
Heck even me drive my CSL at more or less the same time as Horst do, i gained some speed these days. Lets say im 6-10 seconds slower.

Remember that on all Sport auto laps one must add about 4-6 seconds to get a compleate FULL lap(depending on car) due to they dont drive section T13, wich is around 200m.

Stippler did the compleate full lap
Still whats intressting is what Horst drive, as he drive all cars, just a pointer.

[Kram]

ok, we are ready. Tell us what he drives


At least it is great to know for sure that the car is capable of much more than the test showed. Do you have any news from the other cars that Erik said?

A bit OT, but 7:53RS6, what tire was you using on the ring to do those great lap times in your own car?

[OfftheHeZie]

What was the mileage of the Sport Autos R8 in comparison to the RS4. It is not a myth that the RS4/R8 engine produces more power after mileage - max around 10k miles. And we have all seen the dyno test results of the R8 engine vs the RS4, they are different in torque curve, but I cannot remember exactly how it looks or if this answers any questions about speed differences at a certain km/h.

~Mason