A post for all the naysayers

[RXBG]

i want to address many criticisms of the R8 off the bat.

1. reasonable expectations here. the car was hyped up by the media to be a supercar. the car is on the level between a 997 C4S with power pack (100K USD) and a 997 TT. so it seems it is priced just right. that is reality. a beautiful reality. you probably cannot drive anything faster more comfortably on a daily basis than this car. even the 997 with the adaptive dampers is not as comfortable as the RS4 with it's "lowly" DRC. imagine the R8.

2. i happen to know from many sources that the engine benches more than 425 hp. i do not know how much but reports still remain close to 440hp. i stand by that. i for one am anxious to see for myself if audi adjusts the official power output like they did the S6's.

3. the car reaches almost the same top speed as the latest gallardo. while keeping 75k in your bank account. i'll take a $12 martini over the bragging rights about top speed with a gallardo or F430 owner at a cocktail party.

4. by socratic deduction the 4.6 seconds 0-62.5 estimate is very conservative. the RS4's is 4.8 and it can do 4.5 quite easily. that means the R8 can do 4.2 or so. and it has .....read further.

---4.2. do you know how fast that is? that's a gallardo-style number. for 75K less. again.

5. the car. especially at its price point, offers a degree of technical advancement unheard of. when you think about it it puts all cars short of the veyron to shame. it really does.

6. and no one has yet been able to comment on its handling. i can't wait to read the articles. if the porky RS4 has been lavished so. can you imagine this car?

7. finally. the style point. perhaps the least pragmatic of all to discuss because it is a subjective one. you can discuss this one with yourself.

8. and last. the M5. M6 argument. on a good day. based on the numbers that the R8 is "really" capable of (0-60 in 4.0 was quite easy for test drivers while developing the car) the R8 will be just as fast. and this will apply on a nice dry day. on any other forget about it.

a note: my neighbor's CRX, at 12K (USD) with mods, could embarass a stock Z06 in a drag race any day. to me an isolated number (thank you qisha) cannot harness the meaning of an specific machine. catch my drift? (no pun intended)

and finally. ask yourselves this. why would you spend 100K on a car? it is a ridiculous sum to spend for a car by any means. but if you did what would you expect in return? a comfortable, sexy, safe, solid, exclusive car that will be driven everywhere. rain or snow. track. grocery store. movies. dinner. the beach, perhaps? in short, everywhere. and hard. that's what i expect from my money. sounds like the R8 would do. and just about no other car. and it happens to be an audi.

what about you?

[Benman]

Amen to all 8 points.

And as for the "finally" again, amen. If you really want track "bragging rights", then save yourself a ton of $$$ and get a real racecar like I did and smoke anything!

F430s, C4Ss, Lambos are not racecars, they are beautiful driving (read: not racing) machines meant to be driven and the R8 will be King of them All. :king:

Ben

[RXBG]

i'd like to see the CRX take your racecar.....

just kidding. i'd like to see you take the CRX.

ps- be safe out there buddy.

[Mjolnir]

Well said RXBG.

I would also like to add on point #2:

Do you really think Audi spent time and money to
design and manufacture a new intake manifold with
velocity stacks just to make the same power figures
as the RS4 V8 set-up? C'mon.

M

[QuattroFun]

Hmm, does somebody appointed as a moderator (and - as it so happens - with a R8 on order?) actually want to stifle a very reasonable and also very polite/correct debate on a new and hotly anticipated new Audi model among true Audi enthusiasts on a discussion forum and monopolise the discussion to be "the right one" as on all useless back patting/falsely smug BMW forums?

As far as the debate goes, none of us has driven the new car yet so none of us knows either way. Still, when you start to add leather, metallic paint, 19" wheels, magnetic ride, sat nav, carbon fiber here and there and so on, you are looking at closer to 130K in German euros, which less than 15K off a Gallardo and much above a M6. Is this an unreasonable statement? Is it unreasonable to point out that its claimed weight is much above the Gallardo and 911 4S? Is it unreasonable to point out that 420PS is something of a disappointment when the hype over here (not Audi's fault, though) was about much more? Is it unreasonable to point out that the car should by default be in a completely different league in every respect from handling to acceleration to emotional thrills than the RS4 and main target 911 4S and really break the M6's sweat or more when you consider the price tag?

Yes, I for one sure hope and expect that the R8 will be very good and wipe the floor with even heavier M5:s and RS4:s of this world on the track and the twisty bits - but so it really should for the price; that is the default mode and does not as such imply that you got what/more than you paid for. The real test is how much better it is than the main 911 rivals. Unreasonable statement? Go figure.

[MR USER]

Benman... It's so true.... I smoked M3 in the circuit with a mere 130 bhp vw bug....
You said it all... a car is a car and no matter how fast it goes it will never match the cornering and top speed of a racer....

[RXBG]

the only unreasonable thing is that you assume i am unreasonable.

perhaps i should elaborate.

the only unreasonable thing is that you assume that the intention (of the opinions) of my post is to assume the authority to dictate the status quo. shame on you. i am neither a fascist nor a communist. the only reasonable conclusion is that what i posted does not agree with your viewpoints. nonetheless, you should not be irked by that.

further. i assume you meant euros. there are no "german" euros. i do not know the price of a comparatively equippped M6 and R8 in germany specifically. i invite you to produce that comparison. it would allow us to get a better idea of the prices. i am not sure that you proved that point in your post...

from what i hear the R8 will start at just below 100K USD. i am not sure on standard equipment, of course.

and please do not offend me by pointing out the fact that i am moderator and that by posting my opinion i am stifling debate. on the contrary. i want to stimulate it.

[Damienr8]

i want to address many criticisms of the R8 off the bat.

1. reasonable expectations here. the car was hyped up by the media to be a supercar. the car is on the level between a 997 C4S with power pack (100K USD) and a 997 TT. so it seems it is priced just right. that is reality. a beautiful reality. you probably cannot drive anything faster more comfortably on a daily basis than this car. even the 997 with the adaptive dampers is not as comfortable as the RS4 with it's "lowly" DRC. imagine the R8.

2. i happen to know from many sources that the engine benches more than 425 hp. i do not know how much but reports still remain close to 440hp. i stand by that. i for one am anxious to see for myself if audi adjusts the official power output like they did the S6's.

3. the car reaches almost the same top speed as the latest gallardo. while keeping 75k in your bank account. i'll take a $12 martini over the bragging rights about top speed with a gallardo or F430 owner at a cocktail party.

4. by socratic deduction the 4.6 seconds 0-62.5 estimate is very conservative. the RS4's is 4.8 and it can do 4.5 quite easily. that means the R8 can do 4.2 or so. and it has .....read further.

---4.2. do you know how fast that is? that's a gallardo-style number. for 75K less. again.

5. the car. especially at its price point, offers a degree of technical advancement unheard of. when you think about it it puts all cars short of the veyron to shame. it really does.

6. and no one has yet been able to comment on its handling. i can't wait to read the articles. if the porky RS4 has been lavished so. can you imagine this car?

7. finally. the style point. perhaps the least pragmatic of all to discuss because it is a subjective one. you can discuss this one with yourself.

8. and last. the M5. M6 argument. on a good day. based on the numbers that the R8 is "really" capable of (0-60 in 4.0 was quite easy for test drivers while developing the car) the R8 will be just as fast. and this will apply on a nice dry day. on any other forget about it.

a note: my neighbor's CRX, at 12K (USD) with mods, could embarass a stock Z06 in a drag race any day. to me an isolated number (thank you qisha) cannot harness the meaning of an specific machine. catch my drift? (no pun intended)

and finally. ask yourselves this. why would you spend 100K on a car? it is a ridiculous sum to spend for a car by any means. but if you did what would you expect in return? a comfortable, sexy, safe, solid, exclusive car that will be driven everywhere. rain or snow. track. grocery store. movies. dinner. the beach, perhaps? in short, everywhere. and hard. that's what i expect from my money. sounds like the R8 would do. and just about no other car. and it happens to be an audi.

what about you?

RXBG i was going to send something very similar to this in an e-mail to you but you obviously beat me too it. Great Writeup. People should look at this before making crazy comments.

[QuattroFun]

RXBG,

I am sorry that you feel personally offended/not intended - I made a mistake in making a point. The point was this: when a moderator of a forum starts to post very strong and guiding statements & borders on labelling fellow forum users that discuss and do not fully and on all accounts agree with moderator as naysayers it is different from example me stating something. The true naysayers - if there are any - are surely not on this forum but elsewhere. Pitching a fair point of view as a discussor like the rest of us or asserting what one should think and say as a moderator? OK, now I know which hat you had on when posting so fair enough and sorry if you where offended.

As far as the rest goes, well...where facts like prices or weights are involved, they are readily available to all of us all across the web if somebody is interested. And as friendly reminder of an eurozone resident; in the eurozone, the VAT rates and car taxes differ by country so a euro of Audi in Germany differs e.g. from the Netherlands. Hence, reference to "German" euros...

[Leadfoot]

Guys, we are all friends on this forum and as such please don't get embroiled in name calling, RXGB and QuattroFun, you both have valid points.

Firstly the price:

If you compare the price of the M6 to the R8 then maybe it might start to look expensive especially if you add every option on the list, but I personally think after looking at what is standard, the only real options every one would need to add is the 19" alloys, magnetic ride and R-Tonic if you want that sort of thing. With just these few things the R8 is just a cheap as the Beemer and as such it's still over £40K cheaper than the Lambo.

Secondly the weight.

Agreed the R8 is heavier than the Porsche or the Lambo, but remember that this car is an Audi first and supercar second, comfort is very important so there will be extra sound proofing added to make it a better GT/everyday car than either of them. Ask anyone with a 911 and they will tell you on a long journey a Porsche can be tiring. So basically what I am saying is, if the performance is still there we will all welcome the extra comfort.

And lastly the handling/entertainment.

For heaven sake, it's based on a Gallardo so unless Audi have made a real disaster with the rest of the car the thing will be amazing for the price and way better than every BMW or Merc to date. OK, the CSL is bloody good as possibly the best saloon car to date but it not in the same class as a supercar and make no bones about it, that is what the R8 is, a full bodied, red blooded supercar.

I just wish I could afford it.

[sticky]

Agreed on all points. I love the car and everything about it but I was really hoping it would be lighter. Other than the weight, everything is perfect and the car most likely is underated.

[BBGT2]

Well now we can clearly see that RXBG likes the car VERY VERY MUCH.
I wont sit here and post my feelings here as I have already doen that on the other thread. Bottom line is, some like it, some (me) thinks its underpowered bigger TT version. Yes I know it has 420 or 440 ponnies whatever Audi decides to say it has, but I cannot clearly see it as a supercar. As I stated elsewhere I know the 0-100kmh times are nothing more than just numbers and what happens after that mark also is very important.
As someone said "we are all friends here" and we are just basing our reactions on what we feel, doesnt have to agree with everyone else's opinion as then this would be a very boring board. I love the Audi brand to me though they can but wont (for whatever reason) knock one out of the ball park so to speak. I guess we will have to wait until the real world tests and see what happens when they do some tests. German manufacturers always show higher numbers when they present a new car and when real world numbers come in they are lower. Hell I hope the R8 gets tested and it does 4.0 flat to 100kmh that would be awesome as that would surely suprise alot of people, including me.

Bajo

[Leadfoot]

BBGT,

Please don't take this the wrong way but the important of performance figures are a very American thing. In the States, there is lots of cars which can post under 5 seconds the 60mph times, hell even over here there is ever more cars able to do the same and as such anything that doesn't shock with it's times isn't that great, especially when motors like the Z06 can be had for so little money.

Until the introduction of the Ford GT and the Z06, American cars were all speed with no finesse. So the only thing that got you wet, so to speak was these figures. We all have watched the videos of street racing where the good home boy in his Mustang or Vette racing the rich kid in his up-start from Europe and give him a good old hiding down some long straight. But you wouldn't see the video of the same race when a corner approached.

The R8 more than just a car about figures, I believe it will be a turning point for the world's opinion on what Audi as a brand stands for, which up to now has been fast but safe and as such most people class them as boring. After the R8 I reckon we will all see them as all of the above plus entertaining.

This is why I think the R8 has been released ahead of the A5/A4, the R8 showing the future direction of Audi and what to expect from it soon to be released models. The RS4 and TT started the trend and the R8 taking this trend to a different level.

[Qisha]

Dear Friends,

one thing i really like about this board is that everyone is heard and the way each for one thinks about any discussion is accepted-, sharing personal feelings etc. this is unique. You wont find this anywere else.

No matter if you like- or dislike the introduced R8 for what you know about the car, let me bring something to your mind:

There is no other german manufacturer that has a similar car concept in its range yet (to be exact: not anymore -Porsche GT-). The R8 performance figures are understated regarding engine output, 0-62,5 and top speed. During the upcoming year decissions will be made how to proceed with the R8. There are more than good chances for a lightweigt as well as a non NA version. The car is build at the highest Audi quality achievement regulations ever, almost just by hand. The actual daily quote is 15, leading to a total of round about 4.000 Units max. / Year.
Concerning the price: the german list price is quoted for 01.01.2007, this leads to 19% taxes included. So, remember this while comparing.
The option list is not complete, there is more to come. Ceramic Brakes for example or full LED Headlights, all within 2007.

Testdrive the R8 and judge for yourself if the car is worth its sale price.

I prefere a car that beats its stated performance values, more, than a car that hardly achieves them.

[chewym]

The RS4 has been clocked @ 4.3 seconds. Just 2 tenths slower than the Porsce 911 C4s to both 60 and 100 mph.



The R8 will probably be just about as quick at the M6 in straighline acceleration. On the track, no questions asked, the R8 will rip apart the M6. The RS4 is already just as quick around the Ring as the M6.

[sticky]

I don't see the R8 matching the M6 in acceleration. The gallardo can't so why could the r8?

[chewym]

The Gallardo definately does. It has been clocked as quick as 3.8 seconds, the RS4 is only 2 tenths slower in 0-60, but loses more at higher speeds.
M6
http://www.caranddriver.com/roadtest...ecs-page3.html
Gallardo
http://www.caranddriver.com/roadtest...rdo-page5.html
Gallardo in 3.8 seconds.
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....rticle_id=3698

[dsts6]

My only issue with this car is the weight. Why couldn't they ahve just kept the weight down a 100 or 200 lbs, it would have been fine. It would then fit their image of a super car better.
I read in Road and Track that they are considering a light weight version of the car as well as a V10 of course, does anyone know anything about this?
I feel like Audi could of easily blown every other car in its area out of the water just by being a bit lighter, why they had to take the luxury route when what most people look at on paper is performance specs, I dont know.
This is not a GT car or atleast it shouldn't be, who cares about tons of luxury in a car like this, its not an A8