New Guy, New RS4, Big brake problem at high speed

[aspenburghound]

Have searched the forum but have not found a thread relating to this issue.
Have any of you guys experienced erratic behaviour of the car at strong braking at higher speeds i.e 120-160MPH. My car pulls to the left like crazy and is a real hazard. Furthermore, during testing, when braking in a turn the car will strongly pull in the direction of the tuen, enough to shift lanes.

Please Help as I don't loke the feel.

Alain

[welbo]

I personally did not experience what u have describe in ur post. I have did top speed run with hard braking till about 50km/h and the car stay striaght and true. U may wish to send ur car for a check with ur aftersales service centre.

[MR USER]

The alignment of your wheels is not correct.
Normally this can happen when you hit a hole or an object at speed. Send your car in!

[7:53 RS6]

Its been reported from some tests that the RS4 is a bit nervous under braking. As of my self i dont konw about it as i never driven it. As well im for one never take what i read for the fact.

I recall Erik mentioned this issue on the launch of RS4 test in sweden as well.


No to what i do know, this issu is nothing
that shold be on a car at all.

Why dont make a poll on the forum and i guess we are all inlighten if this is a common thing or not. There are as mentioned other reasons for it to accur, still what make me react is its been reported in test from varius cars?

But sure cars have came from factory whit wrong settings wheels before, so thats nothing new as well, and it could as well just be the reason to.

[Leadfoot]

It might be something as simple as the type of tyres the car is using or tyres pressure. My S4 was a little bit nervous under braking with the Pirellis, but with the contis it's fine.

[Erik]

Originally posted by 7:53 RS6
I recall Erik mentioned this issue on the launch of RS4 test in sweden as well.

The issue I reported was that when you come from acceleration / high speed and go into a hairpin, during the breaking the car feels very light in the rear.

I am exaggerating (a lot), but it feels like the car behaves like a snake / eel. However it wasn't really a problem, just felt a bit uncertain with a new car. On the other hand we were given new RS4s and hopped in and out and were expected to floor it from the beginning, under time pressure...not exactly the best way to get to know a car.

The Audi S4 has the same problem. If you go very fast and break very hard, you get the feeling that the rear wheels are in the air (which they are not, but it's no Porsche 911)

This is due to the fact that the cars have a heavy engine in the front, and DRC does magic but it can't help everything.

However, the problem aspenburghound is reporting seems of a different nature. Doesn't have to be the brakes, but some other setup in the car.

If you drive straight, don't touch the sterring wheel and brake does the car go left or right? It should go straight unless the road is uneven.

[MR USER]

I had the unfortunate experience of having to do emergency braking from 270 Kph (counter) to about 60 kph as a truck pulled over without signaling.
The braking on this car is marvellous. The car was waving as most of the cars do when braking really hard at really high speeds.
There was no specific behaviour to underline apart from the excellent responce and the short distance required to decrease so dramatically the speed!

O I almost forgot I had to drive with the windows open for quite some time to get rid of the smell :MTM:

[Leadfoot]

Originally posted by MR USER
I had the unfortunate experience of having to do emergency braking from 270 Kph (counter) to about 60 kph as a truck pulled over without signaling.
The braking on this car is marvellous. The car was waving as most of the cars do when braking really hard at really high speeds.
There was no specific behaviour to underline apart from the excellent responce and the short distance required to decrease so dramatically the speed!

O I almost forgot I had to drive with the windows open for quite some time to get rid of the smell :MTM:

Yeah right, and your not talking about brakes smell either.:vgrumpy:

[7:53 RS6]

Originally posted by MR USER
I had the unfortunate experience of having to do emergency braking from 270 Kph (counter) to about 60 kph as a truck pulled over without signaling.
The braking on this car is marvellous. The car was waving as most of the cars do when braking really hard at really high speeds.
There was no specific behaviour to underline apart from the excellent responce and the short distance required to decrease so dramatically the speed!

O I almost forgot I had to drive with the windows open for quite some time to get rid of the smell :MTM:

What do you mean whit waving? It kind of reminds me of what Erik mentioned as well and what i read some times before?

I often brake down my cars from about 300km/h on speedo to very low speed, and them cars are rock solid, just planted on the road, the CSL as well RS6.

Regarding the RS6/4 brakes are good, you bet they are i argee. Even on RS6 avant the do a very, very good jobb on that porker. So whit less pork on RS4/gallardo they work even better.

[MR USER]

On uneven surfaces (italian motorway) the car tends to move a bit left and right under havy braking... I had this with racing cars as well.

[ct940pp]

guys

generally i have been very impressed with the brakes of the car. at high speeds ( over 220 kmh) the car feels very solid in braking even though the braking system was not as communicative as the m5.

in my humble opinion the brake pedal feels a little numb compared to the m5. it would be interesting to hear the opinion on anyone on the forum with the ceramic brake option. ihave them on my stradale and though they take a while to heat up the stopping power in inxoticating.

btw. i encountere a silver rs4 owner in the south of france with a geneva license plate and informed him of the forum

[7:53 RS6]

Originally posted by MR USER
On uneven surfaces (italian motorway) the car tends to move a bit left and right under havy braking... I had this with racing cars as well.

Had this on racing cars as well?

where do you drive race:D Most tracks i seen is quite even

:D

[MR USER]

Monza, Mugello, Imola, Adria, Misano, Magione, Varano etc... Not a single one had even surface in braking points when yo are really braking....

[7:53 RS6]

Originally posted by MR USER
Monza, Mugello, Imola, Adria, Misano, Magione, Varano etc... Not a single one had even surface in braking points when yo are really braking....


Very strange, some of these tracks is as i know them not like a B road in the city, that do make cars to pull and wave as there are signs of heavy wear and the tarmac is deformed by all tiers driving there. It kind of sounds like the tracks you mention are in this conditions hearing your cars waving all over the place?

I say somthing is not as it should if you drive a new RS4 or race car and its waving here and there under hevy braking at tracks.

I say GT track in Poland Poznan, i say it was diffrent than any other track i been to when it came down to surface, its nowdays new tarmac. Still on the old tarmac no waving in my car, and its not known to be the baby ass smothe surface if you know what i mean. Monza is better as well all others i been to, even the ring was better surface back in 1993 compered to Poznan GT 2005, now days its smoth as baby ass.

Well mabee the race car was in richtbenk and not pulled out propperly and it might be the reason it waving all over?
Well i cant be fun driving a race car like that anyway.

[aspenburghound]

Thanks for all the responses. It sounds like it must be my car. It is going into service on 14/9 so hopefully they will find out. Interestingly, I got a call from Audi USA telling me that unfortunately, the dealer will not be able to test the car over the speed limit of 65 MPH to determine the problem. What a joke.... The car only does it at higher speeds. I hope to get good news because the problem is real. It pulls hard enough to the left to shift lanes, so letting go of the steering wheel is not an option.

[tsunami racer]

just so you know you're not crazy, here are a couple articles by two american magazines that DIRECTLY point out this problem. i also experienced it once on a freeway offramp while braking. it feels like the electronic brake distribution just wigs out and starts applying more pressure to one side than the other. then tries to overcorrect itself and applies more pressure to the other side.

i've had another problem with my RS4 (suspension knocking/rattling) that appears to be a problem with the fluid regulator that controls the diagonal shocks. and to your point, aspen, audi of america has been almost worthless. i don't know how audi is in other parts of the world but their customer service in the USA has been very very disappointing.

http://www.automobilemag.com/multimedia/video/0609_2007_audi_rs4/

http://www.caranddriver.com/roadtests/11333/2007-audi-rs-4-quattro.html

[KK265]

Yesterday while panic braking from 220 km/h the car went suddenly 1 lane right!Very dangerous!!

[aspenburghound]

Brought the car to shop today and took a test drive with the Service Manager to demonstrate the problem. It was extremely obvious to him even at lower speeds i.e 80 mph. It is amazing that when going into a turn while driving on the highway and breaking , the car will jump over 1 lane in the direction of the turn. It is beyond dangerous and I sincerely hope that my car is an isolated case. If not, AUDI might have themselves a serious problem on their hands.

Please keep me informed of any similar cases

[aspenburghound]

And by the way, the alignment is correct. Nothing wrong there

[tsunami racer]

you should print out the car and driver article and take it into the dealer.

trust me, if it's on the first paragraph of a car and driver story, SOMEONE at audi of america IS WELL AWARE of this problem.

but based on my experience so far with this company, they'll do nothing about it.

[dxben]

Originally posted by tsunami racer
you should print out the car and driver article and take it into the dealer.

trust me, if it's on the first paragraph of a car and driver story, SOMEONE at audi of america IS WELL AWARE of this problem.

but based on my experience so far with this company, they'll do nothing about it.

There is no way that the issue outlined by C&D and Automobile is the same as the one the OP is experiencing, at least I highly doubt it. The thing is I have done panick stops at 90mph and my car didn't float an inch in either direction, so there is something wrong with his car.

The issue discussed by C&D when braking didn't sound as serious as the one he's encountering, so let's not let this thread turn into FUD without a really good basis for it.

Best of luck and keep us informed on what happens.

[KK265]

The thing is I have done panick stops at 90mph and my car didn't float an inch in either direction, so there is something wrong with his car.


Try the same please at 240- 250 km/h.....Because at 130 km/h everything it is ok with my car also..

[aspenburghound]

Audi is taking an interest in this case. I get daily telephone calls from Audi N.A. I should know more on monday. The dealer has not found anything wrong with the car but did a complete realignment on the car. Monday am they plan on doing a test drive. My problem is a lot more severe than what was shown in the CD video. The car will literally shift from 1 lane to another in heavy braking. I still find it hard to believe that the dealer or Audi N.A would deliver a car in this condition to a client. I would not want to imagine what could happen to my wife if she were driving and needed to stop radically. It would not be pretty with a 3 year old in the back.
This screams liability ....... !!!!!!

[dxben]

Originally posted by aspenburghound
Audi is taking an interest in this case. I get daily telephone calls from Audi N.A. I should know more on monday. The dealer has not found anything wrong with the car but did a complete realignment on the car. Monday am they plan on doing a test drive. My problem is a lot more severe than what was shown in the CD video. The car will literally shift from 1 lane to another in heavy braking. I still find it hard to believe that the dealer or Audi N.A would deliver a car in this condition to a client. I would not want to imagine what could happen to my wife if she were driving and needed to stop radically. It would not be pretty with a 3 year old in the back.
This screams liability ....... !!!!!!

I don't understand, do you routinely drive over 120mph with your wife and 3 year old in the back?

I am not saying you don't have a case here, but just as an aside, if I take this car over 100 I make sure I am not anywhere near my wife or anyone else.

But good to hear that Audi is responding to the issue in the car. Keep us updated and best of luck!!

[dxben]

Well allow me to *eat my hat* because I just had the experience tonight in my RS4.

And ironically after stating that it couldn't be a model-wide issue, and who knows if it is, however tonight this is what happened:

I was driving in the middle lane of a 3 lane highway at roughly 80mph. I had to suddenly brake and did a 3/4th panick stop, say from 80 down to 65mph, not that much but in a very short time.

The outcome was that the car jumped into the right lane, about halfway. Probably would have gone more had I not let off the brakes.

I will say the road was not perfectly even, it was undulating up and down and it was a very slight arc/curve.

I don't know what to say, it was very frightening. I never had this happen on my S4 and I am now worried about driving fast. I mean anyone might need to make a panick brake in traffic, had a car been to my right, it would have been smacked hard in the side by my RS4.

I don't want to believe this is a problem believe me, anyone with more physics knowledge can shed light on this? Is this normal for AWD panick stops on an imperfect road at 80mph?

I just know I've made panick stops at this speed before in this car without this happening.

[AndyBG]

This is something that makes you think...

Somebody official should say something...

[7:53 RS6]

Well as i said, my RS6 was rock solid under relly hard braking. Even from close to 290km/h on speedo braking hard.

My humbel impresion are that hevy awd cars as RS6 avant are even more solid planted to the tarmac under heavy braking, even on roads that are not good. I feel CSL also rock solid but on the roads whit much tier wear in the driving area, it feels RS6 awd are not so sensitive to this, CSL are more sensitive to it, even its solid.

I cant remember any of the bord members driving RS6 complaining about this issu that are mentioned on new RS4.

[Leadfoot]

I would have thought the DRC suspension system, would have helped the braking, not what do I know.

My S4 is perfect on the motorway when braking hard from speed, but I haven't had to do this on bumpy back roads, thank god, so can't say what it's like in these conditions.

[IulianUM]

In my case breaking the car is absolute stability . I was testing the "limits" for the first time after the "running in" of the car and suddenly the radar warning starts to beep , I was well over 200 Km/h (Hope the police doesn´t read here , if they do , this is a joke ...:rotflmao: ) and had to brake hard , in one word perfect (fortunately it was a false alarm).
Also tested other Rs4s on track days and there were no problem at all , and there we were breaking hard and on turns .

Awaiting more info .:confused:

[dxben]

In my case breaking the car is absolute stability . I was testing the "limits" for the first time after the "running in" of the car and suddenly the radar warning starts to beep , I was well over 200 Km/h (Hope the police doesn´t read here , if they do , this is a joke ...:rotflmao: ) and had to brake hard , in one word perfect (fortunately it was a false alarm).
Also tested other Rs4s on track days and there were no problem at all , and there we were breaking hard and on turns .

Awaiting more info .:confused:

Ok I wanted to update folks after I too chimed in with a concern. I have a feeling that this is not a braking issue, at least not in my case, but an issue with roads that have a lot of imperfections.

For instance, I took the same roads today and had a lot of float and pull to the left and right without braking, just from driving over 80. The fact is the roads that this happened on are pretty bad and I think the steering response and tight suspension of the RS4 allow the front wheels to really comply with undulations. This means that you have to have a firm grip on the steering wheel to tell it who's boss.

It may be exaccerbated by the AWD since the front wheels want to apply power as well as move.

It could be that braking on such roads simply multiplies this effect by a lot. I think it might be preventable by really applying a hold on the wheel.

The truth is that the other day i took an offramp (curved) at 80mph, very tight windy turn that went around and around.

I realized I was going too fast, even for the great handling RS4. So I took the foot off the throttle. That wasn't enough and I felt the back end starting to come a bit undone (thanks to that 60/40 dynamic rear split?) and I hit the brakes pretty firmly. Not a panic, since that would have caused badness. But an even pressure.

The car was composed and eventually came to a stop.

The difference was that road. It was perfectly paved.

Could this be the magic ingredient?

I plan on taking a Carrerra 4S out for a test drive this weekend. I don't know if I can get the dealer to let me take it on a highway, but I will try to see if I can induce anything similar.

[AndyBG]

...I plan on taking a Carrerra 4S out for a test drive this weekend. ..


That colud be interesting, do it if you can...

[lcrcr]

If there is a braking issue, it does not affect all cars. I just attended a high speed driving event at Road America, a race track here in the US. There were numerous opportunities to brake from 130+ MPH to less than 50 MPH. My car, at least, showed no trace of veering and was always highly stable. This took place with gusty winds, too.

Larry

[PetrolDave]

I noticed on Friday that when braking the RS4 is much more sensitive to white markings painted on the road than my S4 used to be - is this just because there is so much more braking force? Anyway, I reckon it's just another example of the RS4 being a car that demands more driver skill than the S4.

[KK265]

I noticed on Friday that when braking the RS4 is much more sensitive to white markings painted on the road than my S4 used to be

Does anybody has detail info on aligment settings of RS4 ,offset,angles etc?I think that if we had this information perhaps could explain better some things...