interesting comparison RS4 B5 vs B7

[Fab]

I Just found an interesting review on another Audi web site (RS246.com) that some of you may know as well. This review will obviously open an interesting debate between RS4 B5 and RS4 B7. Here it is :



This is my first message here. I only found this site last week.

I thought you may like to hear about the week I have just spent in Germany with a friend who has a new B7 RS4. He has never had an RS4 before. I currently have a B5 RS4.

We spent the week comparing both cars on autobahns and country roads. Here is our joint verdict.

Parked side by side, we both agreed that the B5 looked awesome even though its 5 years old. The B7 looks just like any other sporty A4. The B5 looks like something special with its wide arches. The B7 looks like it has added on aftermarket bits.

The B7 interior is far superior. He has race cloth seats which are outstanding. My B5 has Hitec seats. The B5 interior looks like a standard A4. The B7 makes you feel special.

The B7 has more interior room although the front seats are not as comfortable as a B5. In fact we both agreed that the B5 seats are far more comfortable. The B7 seats look the business but after two hours in the car they are very uncomfortable. The stupid 'sport' button makes them even more uncomfortable because the sides close in.

The B5 starts with a key. The B7 starts with a button and a key. Why? we both asked.

The B7 gearbox is fantastic. It's far better than the B5

The B7 brakes were very good. Stopping at 130mph on the autobahn was excellent. As anyone who has a B5 knows, stopping at 130mph with standard brakes is a joke. So I like many have special brakes

The B7 suspension and road feel was much better than B5. I have quattro gmbh suspension on my B5 but it is not as good as the standard B7 suspension. The B7 really felt good and stable on country roads

The B7 engine is awful. It's noisey, rough and nowhere near as smooth and lively and responsive as the B7. We did back to back runs and both agreed the B5 is quicker, sounds better and is much smoother. As he said, when the B5 accelerates, its sounds like a jet taking off. The B7 sounds like a bumble bee. After an hour on the autobahn you just want to scream because the noise is so irritating. I think this surprised him the most. He couldn't believe how much better the B5 felt and sounded. In fact for me, it was a good reason never to own one. The engine that Audi has talked about so much is the worst part of the car. You have to rev it (and then put up with the noise) to appreciate it. You can't just squeeze the accelerator like and instantly speed up like you can in a B5. You have to gear down and rev it.

As I said, we did lots of driving of both cars, swapping from one to another and making our individual notes. It's amzaing how much we agreed on even though he owns a B7 and I own a B5

We noticed that people always turned to look at the B5 but only once did someone turn to look at the B7!!

The B7 road manners, handling, brakes and interior are better than B5
The B5 looks, comfort and engine are better than the B7

Our verdict: An existing B5 owner will not be impressed enough to trade-in his car. When you walk up to a B5 there is a wow factor that the B7 does not have. In fact it looks like many other new A4's on the road. But someone who has never owned an RS4 will be delighted with a B7.

My firiend said that if he could get a new B5, we would buy it instead of the B7 !!!

My verdict: I shall be keeping my B5 until Audi wake up and stop trying to chase BMW. The B7 is a great disappointment.

Finally, those that disagree, don't shoot the messenger! I need to replace my car, so I wanted the B7 to be good, but it didn't come close as a replacement.

[AndyBG]

That kind of verdict is to be expected from B5 RS4 owner, but you can see from a plain that AUDI is taking competly diferent course with its new RS4, so in my opinion comparations between these cars shold not take place.

I love the B5, but its qualities are in oder house wehn it comes to B7, after all, thing that is maybe bigest improvement on new AUDI and this guy sad nothing about it is driving and behaving of this car trough corners, i maen, come on, everybody nows that old B5 RS4 likes to get its nose ''litle'' out of corner, while new 40/60 weight distribution takes B7 RS4 in totaly new league for AUDI.

Wehn it comes to engine, i don;t now what they expected from N/A engine, it has to build its speed gradualy, there could not be that explosion that you get from turbo engines.

To say again, i love B5 RS4, but i am sure that B7 RS4 isn't that bad.

ANDY

[alex_s3]

I like the B5 better than the B7.. I like V6 Biturbi better than a V8 because you got less tuning potensial than the V6.. And the B5 has better looks (unless wheels)

[Payne]

Originally posted by AndyBG
That kind of verdict is to be expected from B5 RS4 owner, but you can see from a plain that AUDI is taking competly diferent course with its new RS4, so in my opinion comparations between these cars shold not take place.

I love the B5, but its qualities are in oder house wehn it comes to B7, after all, thing that is maybe bigest improvement on new AUDI and this guy sad nothing about it is driving and behaving of this car trough corners, i maen, come on, everybody nows that old B5 RS4 likes to get its nose ''litle'' out of corner, while new 40/60 weight distribution takes B7 RS4 in totaly new league for AUDI.

Wehn it comes to engine, i don;t now what they expected from N/A engine, it has to build its speed gradualy, there could not be that explosion that you get from turbo engines.

To say again, i love B5 RS4, but i am sure that B7 RS4 isn't that bad.

ANDY

Just have to totally agree with you!
Just to correct: it is 40/60 torque distribution, no offence;)

and to add: B7 Rs4 looks much better then the B5

Just my .2 cents;)

[KK265]

The answer from Neckarsulm is that a chipped b5 (420 PS)needs every 15.000km of hard driving (no circuit) engine rebuild.The b7 after 150.000- 200.000km.

[AndyBG]

Originally posted by Payne

Just to correct: it is 40/60 torque distribution, no offence;)



That is what i originaly tought, wrong typing.

Thank you for correcting me. ;)

[Benman]

Originally posted by AndyBG
That kind of verdict is to be expected from B5 RS4 owner...

To say again, i love B5 RS4, but i am sure that B7 RS4 isn't that bad.

ANDY

Yeah, kinda expected a B5 owner to say that. It's a classic case of, "My car is so much better than the new one. I'm so dissapointed they didn't make it better than my car." Give me a break.:rolleyes:

The B5 RS 4 is sweet for sure, also, it is the MkI so will always be something special. But saying the RS 4 MkII isn't better? That is just stupid.

First: He admits his stock brakes are a joke (hence why he changed his).

Second: He states his handling isn't as good (even with the optional quattro suspension) compared to the stock set up his friend has on his B7...

Third (and now it gets silly): The engine is the worse part os the car?!?!?!?:confused: I don't think so!

Fourth: The looks. "It looks like any other "sporty" A4? Is he crazy? The looks of the B7 smoke the B5. Sorry.

People comparing "tuning" potential to stock of course are going to say their tuned B5 cars are superior. Heck, sink enough $$$ into it, it will be faster, better handling, better braking, better overall dynamics, etc... But the point is, compare stock to stock and the B7 is a revelation.

It is the car that someone put $15,000.00 worth of suspension and brake mods into their B5 would become! It already is that car! Now, is it as fast as a tuned RS 4 in a straight line. No. But again, compare stock to stock and I really don't see what the complaining is about.

I guess it might be the same story with me when the new RS 6 comes out. I might also turn into one of those people who complain, "The car isn't TT. The car is too heavy. It's not as "Special" as MY car..." Time will tell...

Ben:addict:

[AndyBG]

Originally posted by Benman


...People comparing "tuning" potential......

Ben:addict:

I am not into that ''tunning'' stuff, don't get me wrong, its nice to improve a cart but buying car just becouse of its tunning potential...

[Rstr]

Originally posted by Fab
The B7 sounds like a bumble bee. After an hour on the autobahn you just want to scream because the noise is so irritating.


"Bumble Bee"?! that's a good one. I say this guy is full of sh*t (along with his story) and never took a ride. :p

[Payne]

Originally posted by Benman

I guess it might be the same story with me when the new RS 6 comes out. I might also turn into one of those people who complain, "The car isn't TT. The car is too heavy. It's not as "Special" as MY car..." Time will tell...

Ben:addict:

Ben,
I hardly doubt it! I'm sure you'll be one of the first ones to say that the new Rs6 is:bow: if it will be:p

[Audihead]

Originally posted by Rstr
"Bumble Bee"?! that's a good one. I say this guy is full of sh*t (along with his story) and never took a ride. :p

I feel the same as you and Ben. http://dtwaudi.com/images/smiles/51999294poopbanana-thumb.gif

[Bauer]

I have not driven the B7 RS4 nor a B5 RS4 so I cannot comment with great accuracy. I can say I love the tunability of my B5 S4 and would love to drive the new B7 RS4 to see how it stacks up. Yes I know my car is tuned and the B7 is stock... but I would still like to see the difference. I do know the chassis is far superior to the B5. Love the looks of the B7 as well.

Oh and Ben... dont know which thread it was on where you said my car was as expensive as a B7 RS4... it is not by about 15k to 20k depending on options. I am about 60k into mine, maybe a little more.

[Benman]

Originally posted by Bauer
I have not driven the B7 RS4 nor a B5 RS4 so I cannot comment with great accuracy. I can say I love the tunability of my B5 S4 and would love to drive the new B7 RS4 to see how it stacks up.

Oh and Ben... dont know which thread it was on where you said my car was as expensive as a B7 RS4... it is not by about 15k to 20k depending on options. I am about 60k into mine, maybe a little more.

Really? Sorry, I thought it was more. My bad. I thought with car and all the custom stuff Stassis had done it was more. Don't know where I got that impression from.:confused:

Now I want to go for a ride even more.:D

But as you mention, stock to stock (apples to apples), the B5 had no chance...:cheers:

BTW, I replied to your thread: http://rs6.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7623 (darn you Bauer!!!:D )

And the thread I posted the price: http://rs6.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=8474&perpage=18&pagenumber=3

Sorry for the inaccurate $$$ post. I kindly retract it.:cheers:

Ben:addict:

[RSA4]

Why didn´t he buy the Recaro seat instead of the RS-seat. Doesn´t cost any extra.

Real racing cars have a startbutton that´s why RS4 has it.

[Erik]

Originally posted by Fab
The B7 engine is awful. It's noisey, rough and nowhere near as smooth and lively and responsive as the B7 .



Uh? :confused:

Guess he means the B5?

The V6 TT is wonderful, especially tuned.

But the V8 is better IMO.

[Spada]

Just to let any of you prospective owners know, the B7 rs4 is the best car I've ever owned and I've had many great, fast cars. I've had mine for a week or so now and I have no complaints. Although I'm not a b5 owner, I've driven all the way across France in one and I would say to take this review with a pinch of salt.

If you actually re-read the review, the only part where the b7 isn't "much better" (apart from looks and the starter button) is the engine, and most people say this is one of the greatest engines ever made. I happen to think so too. I don't understand his take on the engine at all? :vhmmm:.

The starter button might be technically pointless, but the "why?" Is a pointless question. Why not? I actually really like it now I've got used to it. It's just a bit of fun!

And I don't see what right-minded owner of a brand new RS4 could look at the old one and think it looks better! And the thing about people noticing the old one more? I've been finding 95% of people don't notice the B7, but those who do, will swivel their head all the way round and gawp for as long as they can. This is the exact impression an RS Audi should make imho: I don't want everyone looking at me when I go to the shops! The occasional head-turn from enthusiasts is enough. It looks beastly, but it's refined enough to blend in. I always thought stealth and subtlety were key to RS's looks?

[gnomik007]

Originally posted by Spada
And I don't see what right-minded owner of a brand new RS4 could look at the old one and think it looks better! And the thing about people noticing the old one more? I've been finding 95% of people don't notice the B7, but those who do, will swivel their head all the way round and gawp for as long as they can. This is the exact impression an RS Audi should make imho: I don't want everyone looking at me when I go to the shops! The occasional head-turn from enthusiasts is enough. It looks beastly, but it's refined enough to blend in. I always thought stealth and subtlety were key to RS's looks?


Thats exactly what I think.All RS cars althought calm on the outside, BEASTlike on the inside :love2:

[Spada]

Yea 007, and to anyone who knows anything about cars, it's plain to see see the b7 rs4 IS a beast, I assure you. It has a wide track, huge, dished 19 inch wheels with wheel-arches that actually accomodate them, massive brakes and gaping holes in the nose.

If you look at the face of a nice sporty but polite new golf GTi, you'll see a very similar appearance. But where the golf's nostrils are covered with moulded black plastic, you look through the RS4's and you see the brake ducts. The body is beatiful and refined, but barely concealing the monster beneath!

[firewired]

Spada,

What is your take on the whole engine noise thing he mentions as well?

I like a hearty exhaust note when driving enthusiastically, but is it overly intrusive when just cruising? (I am trying to imagine the occasions when my wife is in the car.)

[DaytonaGreyRS4]

Personally, I don't like the B5 RS4 Wagon.

I'd like to see both the B5 and B7 RS4's stock / stock... 1/4 mile...

http://media.putfile.com/B7-RS4-on-the-streets-in-Germany

A vid from another thread I posted.

[Spada]

firewired, there is infact very litte noise at all when cruising at speeds under 100mph. The lack of "cabin noise" is actually something I noticed on my first drive. There is a noticeable improvement over the b6 s4. Perhaps his complaint is concerned with cruising well beyond 100mph?

[Spada]

oh and the thing about having to downshift and rev it doesn't make any sense to me either. There's power available from 2000 revs.

[gazzab]

OK guys this thread has had enough air time, may be some one is stirring.

Gazzab

[Fab]

You guys have to read the RS4 test drive made by Autocar on their March issue :0: :bow: Once again one of the best engine, great brakes, handling, etc... You have to read it.

some numbers :

0-60 4.5s
1/4 mile 13.1s
1km 23.5s

same dry track time than Porsche Cayman (twisty track)
new wet track record :king: "devastatingly effective on the wet"

"This is one of the great modern road car engine"

"One of the best engine we can think of"

"the new V8 M3 engine will need to be very good indeed to take the game on from this"

Now my question : How can a someone say this engine is crap :confused: (despite the fact he is a B5 owner :D ) and say the B5 stock is faster. 23.5s standing km is just 1 second faster than the B5 :bow:

[AndyBG]

Hey, Fab, relaxe, you are going to now first hand and tell us about that sweet high reving V8!

:D ;)

[Benman]

Originally posted by AndyBG
Hey, Fab, relaxe, you are going to now first hand and tell us about that sweet high reving V8!

:D ;)
Yep, we all know the new RS 4 is sweet! Just make sure to give us some reviews.:thumb:

Ben:addict: