Audi RS4 vs Porsche Carrera 4S

[Hawk]

http://www.autozeitung.de/index.php?page=2er-vergleichstest&action=detail&id=1429&tb=8&current=2

[Erik]

RS4 or 4S? :D

Thanks for that. The RS4 came quite close on the circuit and acceleration.

Got any other times on the circuit for comparison? M3, M3 CSL?

Seems the RS4 was on Pirelli P Zero Rosso, not Corsa.



http://www.autozeitung.de/images/cars/1429/01_c.jpg

http://www.autozeitung.de/images/cars/1428/01_c.jpg

:rs4addict

[Erik]

Originally posted by Erik
Got any other times on the circuit for comparison? M3, M3 CSL?


Handling (min.)
4S 1:39,8
RS4 1:41,3


This can't be right? :vhmmm: Or?

BMW M3 - Handling (min.) 1:47,0
BMW M3 - Handling (min.) 1:44,5
http://www.autozeitung.de/index.php?page=3er-vergleichstest&action=detail&id=874&tb=8&current=3
No times for the CSL in their tests.

[Hawk]

Originally posted by Erik
Handling (min.)
4S 1:39,8
RS4 1:41,3


This can't be right? :vhmmm: Or?

BMW M3 - Handling (min.) 1:47,0
BMW M3 - Handling (min.) 1:44,5
http://www.autozeitung.de/index.php?page=3er-vergleichstest&action=detail&id=874&tb=8&current=3
No times for the CSL in their tests.
0-120 km/h M3 is more fast than RS4:bigeyes:

997 Carrera S 1:41,3

[Fab]

RS numbers are quiet disapointing. 5s for 0-100km/h...

How can the M3 be faster on 0-120km/h with 80hp less :confused:

What sort of numbers will the avant deliver ? Even worse ?

:vgrumpy:

[buyalemon]

I think RS4 has done well in the tests ..17 sec to 200 is a great time! What I don't understand is the brilliant times for M3:s in the german magz ..here in sweden the 0-200 is done around 19,5-20 sec!

And I'm very sure that Audi doesn't build a new "super Audi" which ends up not being faster than an old M3 ...noooo way!

Call me an idiot ...but I'll wait for the swedish tests where it's stated what type of messuring gear is used, they also uses dynotest ..how many ponies dissapears on the way ...!

//M

[Benman]

Originally posted by buyalemon

And I'm very sure that Audi doesn't build a new "super Audi" which ends up not being faster than an old M3 ...noooo way!

//M
I'd agree, let's wait and see a same day, same place, both cars test before jumping to conclusions.

Ben:addict:

[Julz RS4]

Originally posted by Fab
RS numbers are quiet disapointing. 5s for 0-100km/h...


Yes it's true, but I believe that we can explain this by the fact this RS4 is too new IMO. This car shows only 2804 km, let's see when the car will get more than 20 000 km. :hahahehe:

2804Km
http://img378.imageshack.us/img378/2952/43pz.th.jpg (http://img378.imageshack.us/my.php?image=43pz.jpg)

Thanks Hawk for the link. :rs4addict

[buyalemon]

exactly benm ...M3 RS4 same day ...if M3 is faster, I'll eat my dog (great dane 85 kg)

//M

[clam]

AWD cars are typically slower to accelerate b/c of the inertia of the system.
Also, a 0-x run is a fight between the grip of the tyres and the grip of the clutch. In an AWD, the tyres will win, so you can't just dump it like you would a with a 2WD car. I've heard about 15% of Gallardos have needed a clutch replacement already b/c the owners didn't read that bit in the manual.

All things being equal, AWD will be slower on a straight dry road, but makes up for that in the twisties, or other low-grip conditions.

http://www.autoclips.net/detail.php?parent=60&id=411&id_video=266
This video (ZIP file) illustrates the point.

[Hawk]

Originally posted by buyalemon
I think RS4 has done well in the tests ..17 sec to 200 is a great time! What I don't understand is the brilliant times for M3:s in the german magz ..here in sweden the 0-200 is done around 19,5-20 sec!



//M
In Italy M3 0-200 is done 17.6 sec

[India Whiskey Charlie]

Originally posted by Erik
Seems the RS4 was on Pirelli P Zero Rosso, not Corsa.
Why would you assume it would be riding on Corsa tires? That's an R-compound tire (DOT approved track tire).

[India Whiskey Charlie]

Originally posted by Julz RS4
Yes it's true, but I believe that we can explain this by the fact this RS4 is too new IMO. This car shows only 2804 km, let's see when the car will get more than 20 000 km.
Excuses, excuses. Face it, the RS4 is a pig and the Carrera 4S is a tad bit quicker. Big deal. Why would anyone want to compare these two anyway?

[Erik]

Originally posted by Viken B.
Why would you assume it would be riding on Corsa tires? That's an R-compound tire (DOT approved track tire).

Because you can order it as an option and other tests have been with cars with the Corsas. And I know what the Corsa is. ;)

BUT - not this time. The car was on P Zero Rosso.

[India Whiskey Charlie]

Originally posted by Erik
Because you can order it as an option and other tests have been with cars with the Corsas. And I know what the Corsa is.
Really? That's interesting. What size would they be available in? 255/40-18 or 255/35-19? Also, would it be Direzionale or Asimmetrico tread? Thanks!

http://www.it.pirelli.com/MEDIA/TyreCatalog/12000014_pzerocorsa_direzionale_roll.gif http://www.it.pirelli.com/MEDIA/TyreCatalog/12000006_pzerocorsa_asimmetrico_roll.gif

[Erik]

Originally posted by Viken B.
Really? That's interesting. What size would they be available in? 255/40-18 or 255/35-19? Also, would it be Direzionale or Asimmetrico tread? Thanks!

They would be 255/35/19. Direzionale or Asimmetrico I don't know.

[India Whiskey Charlie]

Originally posted by Erik
They would be 255/35/19. Direzionale or Asimmetrico I don't know.
I just checked the Pirelli web site and that size is available in a Direzionale tread pattern. Thanks. I hope this option will also be available to US buyers too, but something tells me it won't.

[Erik]

Originally posted by Viken B.
I hope this option will also be available to US buyers too, but something tells me it won't.

Well, I've heard you can switch tires on your car once the old ones wear out :D

Check more here about the data on the car. Page 3 I think.
You can count that the RS4 will use Corsas - like the M6 - in the sport auto supertest. Makes no sense to test in on H-ring and N-ring with different tires.
http://www.rs6.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7394

[India Whiskey Charlie]

Originally posted by Erik
Well, I've heard you can switch tires on your car once the old ones wear out
I know, but tires like these are hard to find in the US. The Challenge Stradale and GT3 sizes are often backordered for a very long time. I'm afraid that Pirelli may not import a size if it was not offered as OEM on a certain car in this country.

[Erik]

Originally posted by Viken B.
I know, but tires like these are hard to find in the US.

Hmmm...and my friend is shipping tires in containers from the US to here.
Well, if you like you can order the Corsas from me, at a price :king:

[highrustler]

I am a current RS6 owner and was very excited at the opportunity to move to a RS4 but, my thoughts are changing as I read more here. The current M3 is as fast as or faster than the future 2006 RS4, yet it's a 5 year old design. If Audi is just now equaling the E46, what does that say about their design philosophy? Regardless of whose car you’d rather own, the next M3 is sure to stomp the RS4. Right or wrong?

[Benman]

Originally posted by highrustler
The current M3 is as fast as or faster than the future 2006 RS4, yet it's a 5 year old design.

the next M3 is sure to stomp the RS4. Right or wrong?
The current M3 is not faster (or as fast) as the new RS 4. There has yet to exist a magazine article where the two cars are tested at the same time, same place, and the M3 equal or best the RS 4. More, it ain't gonna happen.

Now is the M3 almost as quick? Sure it is. Is the next M3 going to best the RS 4? Sure it is. Just like the all new M5 bests the RS 6. Just like the next RS 6 will best the current M5... and so on.

Me, I'm plenty happy with my Beast and will be keeping it for quite some time. Something will have to come out that is very special for me to part with it.:0:

Ben:addict:

[Randy M]

That M3 is so high strung that it pops all the time. That's the main reason why I sold mine, I had no faith in it at all.

[buyalemon]

Benman ...I must say ...you are one of very few on this forum that knows what he talkes about concerning this issue! You have driven both cars ..I dig your writing :heart: ..that's it ..period!

/M

[M&M]

I hope for once I can contribute to the topic without being shot down & attacked personally for merely giving my opinion.

Benman, I am of the opinion that the next RS6 will not be much faster than the car it replaces. But allow me to explain why.

AMG & Audi are on a campaign to turn away from forced induction & go to NA. They are finding that its' hard to replace a turbo/supercharged car with NA & make it faster.

Case in point, C55 vs C32. C55 has more power & torque & yet it isn't really much faster. Some reviews have got it faster, most haven't. Sure its a superior overall car to the C32, but my point is performance wise it isn't a huge step forward.

Next point, RS4 B7 vs RS4 B5. Go back & look at the same mags that tested the new RS4 & check the B5 times. ANd no bullshit excuse about the car being too new. All the cars they test are new.

The new RS4 struggles to beat the old one. Same will happen with the E63 & E55. E63 has 15 odd more hp, but it LOSES torque to the 55. I'm sure it will be slightly heavier as well.

So the nest RS6 we all know will be an NA V10 with around 500hp. I say it will be slightly faster than the old RS6, but not by much. And I don't think it will get anywhere near the E60 M5. But that's just my opinion. Let's wait & see what happens.

[buyalemon]

B5 RS4 was faster than E46 M3 ...B7 RS4 will be faster than E46 M3! E90 M3 will be faster than B7 RS4. RS6 was faster than E39 M5 ...and E60 M5 is faster than RS6 ...do you see a connection?
This is how it works ...don't get your thinking! Audi isn't capable to build a faster car than the new M5?? You think the M5 will be the fastest car in it's segment forever and ever and ever?

[M&M]

Buyalemon, relax dude. This is just a discussion.

To answer your question, no. The M5 won't be the fastest forever. However the law of dimishing returns will start to apply.

E60 M5 is 40kg lighter than the E39. Audi are not on any active weight savings programmes that I'm awate of.

And quotung history isn't going to prove anything. Things have changed. The RS4 is marhinally faster than the M3. Whether that's somethint to shout fromthe rooftops I
m not sure. M3 is 5 years old &out of production. And in fact I'm being kind to the RS4. In fact it has NOT been tested faster than the M3. If you look at the fastest M3 tests & fastest RS4 tests, the M3 is faster.

You can argue till you're blue in the face& it won't change that fact. Complaining about the magazine's numbers (specially well respected mags like Sport Auto, AMS, Auto Bild, etc) won't help your cause. In this same thread we see that the M3 has tested faster to 120 than the RS4. And this is the 3rd magazine to show that.

BUT, in all fairness, I expect the RS4 to be slightly faster. And Audi will find that building an NA RS6 to match the M5 will not be as easy as you think. they have 2 disadvantages: weight & drivetrain loss. In fact those are the self same reason the RS4 struggles to beat an M3 with 60 hp less. How do you expect them to beat a car that has the same power (M5 vs next RS6) on the crank (but 40-50hp more on the wheels) that weighs quite a bit less?

Think about it logically & tell me I'm wrong. An RS car needs about 60hp more on the crank to be competitive with the equivalent M car. SO if the nest RS6 has 550-560hp, then I will concede that it will be about as fast as an M5.

[buyalemon]

Here in Sweden, the fastest M3 test is the CSL doing 0-200 in 18,6 (teknikensvarld nr 20 2003) (normal M3 20,2 by the same mag)...which makes it around 2 sec (4 sec normal M3) slower than RS4! But for a valid test they have to race the same day!

And your drivetrain theory isn't working either! Why? The CSL has 4,06 kg/bhp and the RS4 has pretty much the same ..still 2 sec faster up to 200?? That's one hell of a drivetrain to me!
¤¤¤¤ But once again ...the cars must be tested on the same day for valid nrs ¤¤¤¤

Than you probably think "But the RS6 will get a autogearbox and it will loose all power" well ...let's see ...Audi certainly doesn't rush their RS-models ..soo they should have time to develope a gearbox easaly compared with the SMG ...why not a DSG!

//Magnus

[Erik]

buyalemon, you are forgetting that the time in TV was with very poor tires, almost worn out. The CSL is faster than that! And super-fast on the race track. Why? Low weight!
It's very poor judgement by TV (that's one of many reasons why I ended my subscription) to publish times that are not with a 100% car.

On the RS6 side, the previous RS6 was faster than the M5 E39.
Not much faster, but faster. Check the lap times on Nürburgring for once. But we all want more, much more.
There are drawbacks with all designs. quattro has a disadvantage at speed since it looses more power vs. rwd.
But hey, there's got to be a reason why the new M5 comes standard with 400 hp ;)
And I was very disappointed when we could only manage ONE launch with the M6 in launch control during one day. We tried cooling it etc. to no good.
Yes, you will win one fight at the red light, but the next one? Very annoying!

And if I'm correct BMW is developing their own DSG. DSG is superior allround. The SMG is nice on the race track but not the best for comfort. The DSG can be both.

Another thing that comes to mind. We will see what the customers say about the new n/a RS4.
I know Audi is listening and there are several choices for the next RS6 engine. The new twin-charger (supercharger/compressor and turbo) is already avail. from VW but they made no big news about it. Perhaps saving it for Audi?

[M&M]

Buyalemon, you can't use your Swedish test which is the slowest test of an M3 or CSL & then compare that to a different magazine for the RS4. Use the same mag. Sport Auto got 16.6 for the Csl & 16.8 for the M3. They got 17.1 for the RS4. What you gonna chop & change & use whatever test suits you?

[buyalemon]

Yes ..I'm sure a tiptop csl is faster than that, by the way ..how fast? ...but I haven't read one single test where the csl is much faster than a standard M3 up to 100!

The standard did 0-200 20,2 ...bad tires? ..wet conditions?
I think it's of great value that a car deliver all the time ...we don't live in a perfect world, thats why I like Audis better!

I would love to change my Focus RS for any M3 or Csl in the world ..just don't have the money, CSl might be one of the coolest cars ever!

I also think the DSG is the best yet ...I guess the engeneers has some problems since it doesn't exist in the RS4.

[buyalemon]

M&M ...I live in sweden ...what the cars deliver here is whats interesting to me ..not what they have done in a downhill sprint i germany!

[M&M]

Buyalemon, that sounds like a fair comment. However, logic would dictate that you wait for the Swedish magazine to test the RS4 before blabbering on. Who knows what time it will run in Sweden. But comparing a Swedish test to a German test is dumb. I am of the opinion that the delta will be the same all over the world.

[Erik]

Originally posted by buyalemon
M&M ...I live in sweden ...what the cars deliver here is whats interesting to me

Did you not read what I wrote, or what TV wrote? Go check the magazine and you will see that TV used worn tires when they drove the CSL.
For me that test is useless.

Side note: TV is the only magazine in the world that has tested the GT3 faster than the factory. Hmmm...reliable test equipment or just pure luck?

[Benman]

Originally posted by buyalemon
Benman ... You have driven both cars.

/M
Sorry to dissapoint, but I only rode in the RS 4, yes, for almost three hours, but only rode. I have rode in and driven M3s however, and that is what I'm basing my comparisons on. Erik, I imagine, will be one of the few to have driven both.

M&M,

Actually, the curb weight for the E39 is 4024lbs and the E60 is 4050lbs. So the figures you use are about 50kg off. No big deal, but just wanted to say that the new M5 is definately not lighter than the old one. For that matter, NO new car is lighter than the previous model. But for the new M5 to weight only 26 or so lbs more than the old model is a feat in itself!

I still say, let's wait till the mags have a test of the two cars at the same time. That way there'll be no "excuses".

Ben:addict:

[M&M]

Oh, Ok. I was talking about a side by side comparison weighing an E39 & an E60 M5 at the same time. We found the E60 was 40kg lighter. But options & amount of fuel in the tank might have been different.

Please not I'm not saying the new cars won't be a better car than the old one's. Just not much faster. They willbe significantly better cars. Like the C55 vs C32. After driving both one can see that the C55 is far superior. Better sound, more responsive, better handling, wider powerband, better throttle response, less sensitive to heat & fuel, probably more reliable, etc. The new Audi's replacing the turbo models will probably have similar advantages over their predecessors. I'm just saying don't expect them to be much faster. So the argument that the cycle of beating the opposition performance wise with every new model might not necessarily prove true.

But maybe I will be proven wrong & Audi will make a shocker of a V10 with huge power.

[buyalemon]

This is ofcourse of nonimportance (cars must be tested on the same day once again) ...but Erik ..if you want to I can run after bilsports testsresults on the car (where thay blaimed on chilly weather)...not very impressive numbers either! And admit that it's a bit strange that a testcar from BMW (wich by the way was delivered with 2 sets of tires) had problems with the traction only in the swedish tests. Also the guy who ran his CSL at "a day on the strip" must have got the bad tires with a time above 14 sec!

A small calculation of the csl-test::deal:
0-100: 5,7 sec (wheelspin)
0-200: 18,6 sec (wheelspin)

The factory said the car would do 0-100 in 4,9
If we sub 0,8 from 18,6 we get 17,8!
Or maybe the car lost grip over 100 km/h?

The german magz said that the stock M3 would do it in 16,8
:vhmmm: ...zero fuel? ...good windconditions perhaps!

The same mag wrote "the new RS4 is 2 sec faster than old one up to 200" when I looked at the results from the mag they both did it in 17 sec ...thats also a reason why I don't buy there results.

We all believe in the results we want to believe in, this is a storm in a glas as we say here ...someone lucky will most certainly post a video of a race between theese cars. And Erik ...you own a csl right? if so ...I don't get this argument ..post your results ..I promise that I'll take your word for them!

//Magnus

[7:53 RS6]

Originally posted by M&M
Buyalemon, you can't use your Swedish test which is the slowest test of an M3 or CSL & then compare that to a different magazine for the RS4. Use the same mag. Sport Auto got 16.6 for the Csl & 16.8 for the M3. They got 17.1 for the RS4. What you gonna chop & change & use whatever test suits you?

:thumb:
Sport auto knows what they are doing. TV in sweden do not have a clu of what they are doing. Im not sure but somthings tell me i can launch a CSL faster whit out the launch control.
I wounder how TV did do their launch. as well as other mags did do it, did they try both things?

[7:53 RS6]

To my knowledge a new car of today is allredy broken in from factory.
If they would leave that to the custumers it would be to many cars broken down i guess.

We all think diferent and thats how it always is going to be, and its no wrong in that.

Me i couldent care less if a car is a bit slower to 100km/h or 200km/h than mags is saying, or faster. This small diffrenses is nothing i will feel any way. If you blind test me am sure im not going to tell the change of 0-100 in 4,9 or 5.7 or 0-200 in 16.6 or 17.4! Even 2 car side by side its hard to se the faster one. Its so much moore to a car than these numbers.

To me its how a car feels and how everything in a car comunicating to gether, as engin gearbox, chassi and the lot.

And most importent how the car is comunicating to me.
And whats get me going is the round times on track as well as that info is not so fun to the next guy, its all dfifrent what we enjoy of course
Just my to cents

[M&M]

Godd points 8:05, I agree. How a car feels is vey important. ANd all the magzines so far are saying the RS4 isn't as good a driver's car as the old E46 M3, let alone the CSL. I recall 3 different magazines saying the same thing.

[buyalemon]

Let me sum up some things that has been said here lately, very funny ..this wil be my last post in this matter.

"Next RS6 can't be faster than E60 M5"
Comment: We saw what happened the last time.

"TV in sweden do not have a clu of what they are doing"
Comment: Another swedish mag Bilsport tested the car with an old WRC driver and they used VBOXII=same figueres that TV came up with.

"Sport Auto knows what they are doing"
Comment: They sure do ...no swede has ever been driving M3.s as fast as they do

"TV:s testcar had worn tires, the test is useless"
Comment: Since the other swedish tests shows pretty much same numbers=all tests are useless

""M3 is faster not using the launchcontrol"
Comment: That's why they stink in the F1 launches!

Sleep tight// Magnus

[M&M]

OK Buyalemon, you win. But let me recap by askig you this. There have been 3 magaziens that have doen instrumented tests on the new RS4. According to those 2 magazines (who have alsoe tested the old B5 RS4), is the new RS4 any faster than the old one?

But don't take my word for it. More tests will be out soon & will prove the samething. In fact, Audi themsleves claim the same 0-200 times for both cars.

[buyalemon]

M&M I've also seen the numbers ...but if Audi say the car will do it in 16,6 and the tests shows 17,1 I don't see it as a problem. (Audi first said that it would be a bit lighter) ...Audi wanted the car be this fast, I guess to keep as much equipment as they like. If it was as stripped as a Csl it would go alot faster ..but that hasn't been Audis strategy!

Why it's not faster then the last one? (in a straight line) ..I have noo Idee, but the last one was also damned fast, I guess they have prioriteded handling and cornerabilities than straight line racing which I think is great.

I guess we can connect this to the M3 and the csl ...the csl isn't any faster in the straights (difference should be bigger with 17 hp and 110 kg) ..but it's asskicking quick on a track!

//Magnus

[Erik]

Let's hope for the RS4 Plus ;)

Na, I'll save my comments until I drive the thing. :revs: :rs4addict

[7:53 RS6]

Originally posted by M&M
Godd points 8:05, I agree. How a car feels is vey important. ANd all the magzines so far are saying the RS4 isn't as good a driver's car as the old E46 M3, let alone the CSL. I recall 3 different magazines saying the same thing.

The RS4 is not not a drivers car like the CSL, even that im sure buying one some day.

Audi is now getting better the are trying to building cars as BMW are doing it in some ways, but still of course have the Audi in them. Audi go wery far to change their cars to drivers cars, to cut of the 50/50 quattro is a sign that they are aming for it.( the 50/50 was a big marketing thing for them and you dont leave that if its not for the better)

The cut off the turbo in favor of a na high reving engine is another sign that Audi know they was of the track so to speak, but now are aiming hard to get there, and soon they maight be the drivers car no 1, but they are not now.
This is my personally wiew, so undersand im not saying this to upset some, so before you put on the big flame, accept that not all is the same in weiw even in a Audi forum.

Love to hang so please dont throw me out Erik, he,he

:thumb: The most of you guys know im in to the best as well:addict:

[7:53 RS6]

Originally posted by buyalemon
Let me sum up some things that has been said here lately, very funny ..this wil be my last post in this matter.

"Next RS6 can't be faster than E60 M5"
Comment: We saw what happened the last time.

"TV in sweden do not have a clu of what they are doing"
Comment: Another swedish mag Bilsport tested the car with an old WRC driver and they used VBOXII=same figueres that TV came up with.

"Sport Auto knows what they are doing"
Comment: They sure do ...no swede has ever been driving M3.s as fast as they do

"TV:s testcar had worn tires, the test is useless"
Comment: Since the other swedish tests shows pretty much same numbers=all tests are useless

""M3 is faster not using the launchcontrol"
Comment: That's why they stink in the F1 launches!

Sleep tight// Magnus

If you mean WRC Thomas Rådström i accualy did drive 4 seconds faster than him on gotaland ring. He drove a RS6+Avant stock and i drove my stock RS6 Avant:thumb:



To answer the other, its not all about numbers. Its difrent mag testing, god or bad tiers or what ever, 2 exatly identical M3 can differ in speed, used ones can differ even moore, the guys testing them differ even moore in skills, as well as tarmac grip can differ and so on and so on! Thats why you should not look so on numbers in mags, its a refrens but its not moore.

[buyalemon]

No ..I meant Thomas "Gullabo" Jansson! And the guy who did the TV test was Edward Sandström ..STCC driver!

And why I mentioned them is because someone said that "maybe they don't know how to launch an M3" ..let me assure you ..they bloody should know!

Let's skip this stupid discussion ...I hope Erik can post a video and a review of the RS4 next monday!? He has driven M3:s, Csl:s and many other nice rides ..I'm leaving my faith to him ...don't think he'll lie!

//Magnus

[Erik]

Never drove the CSL. Not yet anyway.

And I'm 'out of office' (Nürburgring that is ;) ) most of next week so the RS4 report might have to wait. :incar:

[7:53 RS6]

Originally posted by Erik
Never drove the CSL. Not yet anyway.

And I'm 'out of office' (Nürburgring that is ;) ) most of next week so the RS4 report might have to wait. :incar:

Erik its time you drive my CSL. If you going to let the guys wait on the report, please post my picks from nurburgring whit the RS4,its 6 of them, so we have somthing for now, untill the report comes

[buyalemon]

8:05 I can testdrive your Csl if you want to :hahahehe: ...I'll even buy you dinner if I like the car :thumb:

[7:53 RS6]

Originally posted by buyalemon
No ..I meant Thomas "Gullabo" Jansson! And the guy who did the TV test was Edward Sandström ..STCC driver!

And why I mentioned them is because someone said that "maybe they don't know how to launch an M3" ..let me assure you ..they bloody should know!

Let's skip this stupid discussion ...I hope Erik can post a video and a review of the RS4 next monday!? He has driven M3:s, Csl:s and many other nice rides ..I'm leaving my faith to him ...don't think he'll lie!

//Magnus

Leave your fath to your selv, its always better to get a personal wiew of things, rather than just listen to others or belive all we read. A combination is good i guss.

Just beeing a STCC driver dont mean they dont make things wrong. I drove Porsch carrera CUP race cars on track a few days ago. And one STCC driver managed to spinn the car twice in one lap, and it was no fast lap eighter, even these guys make mistakes. We are all peopel.

TV is a mag that always seems to get all cars tested on slower times than other mags, pesonally this dont mean much to me, the 0-100 and 0-200 times is not my main intrest
But the thing is that the CSLs strong bits may not be 0-100 or 0-200 times. But whit 360hp and 1520kg(tjänstevikt) its darn good any way i think.

There are many moore faster cars out there for this. CSL is strong in round times.

[7:53 RS6]

Originally posted by 8:05 RS6
Leave your fath to your selv, its always better to get a personal wiew of things, rather than just listen to others or belive all we read. A combination is good i guss.

Just beeing a STCC driver dont mean they dont make things wrong. I drove Porsch carrera CUP race cars on track a few days ago. And one STCC driver managed to spinn the car twice in one lap, and it was no fast lap eighter, even these guys make mistakes. We are all peopel.

TV is a mag that always seems to get all cars tested on slower times than other mags, pesonally this dont mean much to me, the 0-100 and 0-200 times is not my main intrest
But the thing is that the CSLs strong bits may not be 0-100 or 0-200 times. But whit 360hp and 1520kg(tjänstevikt) its darn good any way i think.

There are many moore faster cars out there for this. CSL is strong in round times.

Opps did right my post, dident se yours. Sure you can try some day:thumb:

[buyalemon]

Let's end this :race: ..if I drove your Csl I just might send protest letters to TV and the other swedish mags ..and maybe I would join a BMW forum instead :MTM:

:incar: //Magnus

[7:53 RS6]

RS6 an rejsa is the olny forum i read and wisit and wright.
Not befor Erik throw me out from here im gone:p :cheers:

[rks838]

I know I'm sort of butting into the conversation, but isn't it interesting that this started as an "RS4 vs. Carrera 4S" thread?

[M5 RUS]

I disagree...

RS6 is only faster then M5 to 0-100km, then M5 gains and passes...after 200km mark, there is no competition, even chipped 500Hp RS6 with Sportex chip, with ABT chip cant beat M5, after you pass 200km mark...

NO RS6's has beat ME or My friends E39 M5 in 1/4 mile races...and we only have sport exhaust and cats removed...420 HP on a dyno...

4x4 and Automatic transmission its main disadvantages for racing...Old RS4 is faster then RS6...

Although...I must admit, if you hesitate on M5 and miss launch a a bit (some tyres spining) then its difficult to catch RS6, you catch up closely to 200 or later....

The point that I want to make...Is that if New RS6 will have only 500 HP, with quattro and automatic gearbox...It will NOT beat E60 M5 for sure...

I was looking to get NEW RS4 but I got disapointed with it performance...I was expecting NEW RS4 to be closer to New M5's performance like (0-100 in 4.5-4.6 and 0-200 in 15 secs)...

And the price for new RS4 is rediculos starting at 120K US and UP...

I like the handling of RS6 more over M5... M5 is more fun, RS6 more stable and secure...

I wish Audi would consider our opinions and made NEW RS6 with 600 HP...
:wo:

[Benman]

Originally posted by M5 RUS
I disagree...

RS6 is only faster then M5 to 0-100km, then M5 gains and passes...after 200km mark, there is no competition, even chipped 500Hp RS6 with Sportex chip, with ABT chip cant beat M5, after you pass 200km mark...
I think you just made rks838's point.:D

Ben:addict: