Rs4 Vs M3 (autobild) [Archive] - RS6.com

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smerayo

June 14th, 2005, 21:30

Hello, anyone speaks German?

http://www.autobild.de/test/neuwagen/artikel.php?artikel_id=8950&artikel_seite=0

7:53 RS6

June 14th, 2005, 21:49

It should be intresting to have this test in english. Much beccuse if its the M3 in the pictures tested then its the latest M3 called CS or Copetition.

This car have the CSL bakes and rims(not lightwheight rims i herd but same look) and it also have the CSL steering and steering wheel whit m track mode. Even chassi have got some improvment against the reguall M3.

:race:

rks838

June 14th, 2005, 22:05

those free translation sites don't help much - can someone who speaks German translate the key parts of this? Or, if you're really nice and have a spare hour at work, the whole thing :hahahehe:?

Benman

June 14th, 2005, 22:31

Well, can't read German but the pics are great!:p

Ben:addict: :rs4addict

PhilexRS4

June 15th, 2005, 01:51

Great pic

Duma

June 15th, 2005, 20:19

Yes,great pics !:0:

alex_s3

June 15th, 2005, 21:08

We have a clear winner... RS4 :) !! faster, cooler...

JoosyJoos

June 29th, 2005, 22:02

Ok well im straight from the BMW forums checking out audi's cause i like them both. Now i know im biased... but do you really think its fair to compare the brand new RS4 to an aged m3. Of course the RS4 is gonna be better... or you would hope lol. Sure Audi is a good company and is looking great right now cause they are beating ///M for a year but when the new m3 rolls out with a v8 that revs even higher than the audi, produces more hp and torque and carries the prestige of the BMW brand and a comprable price tag if not lower... i think the new M3 will be king. Now thats all my opinion and we wont know if im right until the new one is out... but do you expect BMW to lay down and die? I dont think so... they havent been outgunned by audi in the long run... and i dont think they will be.

Erik

June 29th, 2005, 22:36

How could I have missed this thread?

Great pics! :rs4addict

Vorsprung

June 30th, 2005, 09:09

Originally posted by JoosyJoos
Ok well im straight from the BMW forums checking out audi's cause i like them both. Now i know im biased... but do you really think its fair to compare the brand new RS4 to an aged m3. Of course the RS4 is gonna be better... or you would hope lol. Sure Audi is a good company and is looking great right now cause they are beating ///M for a year but when the new m3 rolls out with a v8 that revs even higher than the audi, produces more hp and torque and carries the prestige of the BMW brand and a comprable price tag if not lower... i think the new M3 will be king. Now thats all my opinion and we wont know if im right until the new one is out... but do you expect BMW to lay down and die? I dont think so... they havent been outgunned by audi in the long run... and i dont think they will be.

JoosyJoos, I also am a fan of BMW's to a certain extent and they must be comended on how well they have done so far and the type of cars they have produced.
Your point though does not hold 100%... Reason being that each brand will have their time of superiority as they come out with their new models. So its fair to compare M3 to RS4 right now, and RS4 is King for the moment, much like E60 M5 is king for the moment in its category versus the also much older RS6 & E55 AMG.
Right now the RS4 is the milestone in its class to beat. Also i very much doubt the new M3 V8 will rev much higher as you say. It will probably have the same max RPM. Secondly, the rumors that have been going around show that the next M3 will have the same bhp as the RS4 and not more. In fact i've read a few articles where they have said it will have 2-3 bhp less than the RS4...
Also i think its very premature to be bringing up the next M3 at this point when its not even a concept model in BMW's books as yet. Its still going to take a while to be officially in production, and i'm sure Audi are very aware of the next M3, and they themselves are probably working on something for then. Remember by the time the next M3 actually does arrive, the RS4 will be well into its lifecycle, and Audi may just up the game further with the release of an RS4 plus (much like they did with the RS6) or something like that?

I think BMW are excellent in what they do, but Audi have really upped the game and taken the challenge. They are really focusing on making RS cars that will give BMW's ///M division headaches, which i think they are doing... Right now, RS4 is king and BMW & Merc need to accept that

Erik

June 30th, 2005, 09:15

Very well put Vorsprung, thank you for that.

kujo

June 30th, 2005, 09:45

The next M3 will have 400 bhp.

That's 20 LESS bhp than the RS4.

It won't be much lighter either, as the new RS4 is only 185 lbs heavier than the currrent M3 Coupe.
(3415 lbs USA Coupe/ 3630 lbs Euro spec car, as no US spec is available to compare)

When the M3 Sedan comes out, then it's a fair comparo.

I'm sure the newer M3 Sedan, with V8 will weigh in pretty close to the RS4, which is a sedan.

Factor in AWD launches, same curb weight and 20 more bhp in the RS.
It's a no brainer.....To an Audi fan....

Plus, here in the US, there will be about 1 RS4 to about 7-10 M3's......

I'd pay an extra 5K for some exclusivity.

either way, they'll both be amazing cars.
Fun to drive and power to spare.

If you want RWD, you know what the choice is.

If you want a very well balanced AWD car, the choice is clear.

Never Follow, the Ultimate Driving machine.... :D

kj:incar: :rs4addict

June 30th, 2005, 09:57

hi,

I'll translate the text on autobild for you - will do it in the afternoon / evening when i find time.

rgds
mr

exE46M3

June 30th, 2005, 11:15

Kujo,

I think it's a bit too early to make predictions...

Yes, the next M3 will have a V8. However, that doesn't necessarily mean the engine will weigh more - less moving parts, lighter materials, etc.

Also, I'm pretty positive they'll work real hard to shave pounds off, which is particularly true if a new CSL is slated for production.

I agree the new car is going to be a blast to drive... :thumb:

June 30th, 2005, 22:35

sry - couldn't find time to translate the text - hope I'll find time tomorrow!!!!

sry for now!!!

best rgds
mr

alex_s3

June 30th, 2005, 23:25

JoosyJoos

July 1st, 2005, 05:32

Thats quite possibly the dumbest statement i have ever heard. The M5 may not be too fast in the 0-60 thats because its rwd... you guys have quattro. The M5 would still beat it past 100 and top out higher... Just because 0-60 is better on the audi doesnt mean crap. And to say audi makes faster cars than bmw.... thats ludacris. Ever heard of the z8? beats everything audi has made. 0-60 in 4.6 quarter mile in 13 and its about 5 years old. And if you dont agree with that then you got the m5 (0-60 in 4.6-7), m6(0-60 in 4.4), m3 (estimated low 4's currently at 4.9) to put up with still. An s4 isnt even a comparison with the current m3. If audi wants to make fast cars they should just leave it to there big brother porsche. Dont get me wrong Audis are good... but saying that they are better than BMW is a stretch... if they were better they would have more sales than BMW and would be able to charge more for there product. Fact of the matter is... they dont.

kujo

July 1st, 2005, 06:04

exE46M3,

I'm not making those predictions.
That's just what I've been reading in the various motor forums on the net.
Just some generalizations really.

Personally, I love my S4.
I'm waiting, quite impatiently for the RS4 to hit the States as well.

BUT, if it's price into the upper 70's, I'll drive my S4 for a year and take a real hard look at the new M3 Sedan.
I almost bought the current M3 Comp., but I really need 4 doors.

I LOVE Audi's, but in So Cal, I don't need the quattro.
If the next M3 is up to par, in sedan form, I'd take a long, hard look.

If it's priced the same and perf. is the same as the RS, I'd buy that in a heartbeat.

But, BMW makes great products.
(except the old iDrive system... ;-)

The other thought for me, is a 997 911 and a used Avant for the same price.
Track the P car and use the Avant as the beater...

Either way, there are sooo many cool cars out there now.

Just hope AoA does the right thing with the RS4 here in the States.

kj

Benman

July 7th, 2005, 01:09

Kujo:cheers:

After spending nearly two hours with the new RS 4, I can honestly say, any mag writer who says this thing "compares" to the M3 is smoking crack. There is NO comparison. It's more in league with a CSL but with more power.

Handling is a league above my RS 6 and the capabilities of this new Beast are just amazing considering the platform quattro GmbH had to work with.

Ben:addict::rs4addict (I'm a believer!)

kujo

July 7th, 2005, 01:51

Ben,

Where/when did you get to drive an RS4 ?

Great to hear.

Since, I'm not going to Spain now !! ;(
Starting a show with a new crew the last week of August.
Couldn't take the 2nd week of a show off, with a new DP.
Sucks a$$..... but, such is life.
This show will buy me 2 RS4's.. :D

So, give me details !!!!!

Can't wait for the price of this bad boy to be announced in the US.

kj

Benman

July 7th, 2005, 15:55

Originally posted by kujo
Ben,

Where/when did you get to drive an RS4 ?

Great to hear.

So, give me details !!!!!

kj
Hey Kurt,

That DOES suck that you will not be going as I KNOW you would LOVE to check out the car!

My FULL (and I mean FULL) report on my trip to Germany (and Pics) is at: http://www.rs6.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6996

For those less patient, I have a thread JUST on the day a quattro (still LONG) at: http://www.rs6.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7003

Hope you enjoy and sorry for no pics of that day, but I explain.

Ben:addict: :rs4addict

Toto89

August 2nd, 2005, 21:00

Hi all!
Sorry my English is quit poor.
I also think that it is unfair to compare
the old BMW M3 and the new RS4.
It will be fair if we will have the new M3 sedan but it will have only 400 hp and for me (I'm an AUDI fan:hihi: ) it is no question that the AUDI is much better.
But the RS4 (and other RS AUDIs as well) not only faster (if they faster)than BMW M's but more exclusive and have a much COOLER look:0: :D :rs4kiss:

alex_s3

August 3rd, 2005, 22:38

yeah! :) nice car kujo!

Toto89

August 9th, 2005, 14:12

I think in the moment the best comparable cars in the category are the S4 V8 and the BMW M3.I know that M3 is much faster in the track but what is on the road?
I don't know exactly what is faster the M3 or the V8 S4?For example which is able to higher top speed etc.
Can anybody knows exact details here?
I ask this because the I know that the difference between the their performance is only 1 hp(S4 V8:344hp,M3:343hp):vhmmm:

Speedou

August 9th, 2005, 15:47

M3 is faster if you watch acceleration numbers. Both one's top speed is limited to 250km/h but as you can read from the rs6.com article the S4 was little bit faster on limiter. But I don't know which one is really faster without limitters.

Severino

August 16th, 2005, 19:56

Hi i’m new! But I’m only a new writer:) !
I’m reader since a few years. I tried my best in translating the test but can’t promise anything :D!
Perhaps “mr” from Austria is able to correct the massive faults in the next days?! For my apology I have to say the school is over since a long time and since then I only had to talk daily english without any proverbs and technology contents. So I hope you can enjoy the test with the faults! First I thought to mark the passages I’m not sure with “:)” but then you’ll get a text with such a lot of “:)”! I promise my german is better ;)!

Audi RS4 vs. BMW M3

Audi takes a new way : with the highrpm concept and the power which is more on the rear, the new rs 4 wants to offer paroli (don’t if this word really exists in english…it means to be an serious opponent). A comparison.

Sometimes more power is not enough. With 344ps the s4 is little bit stronger than the m3 but the difference only exists on the paper. On the racetrack and with the handling till today the car from munich was faster – direct translation means that the m3 till today has had the nose in front of the s4! German proverb...don’t know if it exists in english :)!
The heavy V8 in the front and the 4wd which puts more power to the frontwheels produces allot of understeering. Surely, but not what the ambitious driver likes very much.

With the rs 4 Audi takes a new direction in two ways: First to take the highrpm-concept which till today is publicised by the m-gmbh in the combination with the direct fuel input :) - like you know Audi call it FSI. Second there are modifications on the torsendifferential which is handling the power between the front- and rearaxle.

The key is the new powerdistribution with 40:60. With optimal grip now only 40% of the strong 420 ps power is led to the frontwheels, the reartires have to handle the rest of 60%.
That’s the theory but how is the rs4 really against the m3?

If 343 bavarian ps meet 420 “schwaben” ps, one thing is guaranteed : A lot of fun. Although the m3 must live with 77 ps less strength, the screaming of the engine while doing highrpm is a pleasure. Particularly if you hit the Sportbutton the accelerator pedal converts it mercilessly.
Or you directly order the competition-package for 5300 €, that contains the brakes and the steering of the csl as well as sportier chassis tuning and a alcantara-steeringwheel, in addition the M-Track-Mode-button. This button takes the DSC to sleep :) and allows little swivel on the rear but the DSC is not completely deactivated.

Also the rs4 has a “funbutton” on the steeringwheel. It changes the accelerotor pedal characteristic and at the same time it changes the characteristic of the seats. After pushing this button the seats are really like racingwheels.

The rs 4 gets started with a startbutton near the handbrakehandle J it sounds impressive.
The FSI starts with a dull/musty sound which makes desire on more :). Also the FSI hangs unbelievably on the gas and winds up evenly with an impressive v8 sound till it reaches the limiter at 8250 rpm.
The road performances are closer than it seams to be. The rs 4 reaches 100 km/h in 4,8 seconds the m3 takes 0,4 more. Both are limited at 250 km/h. If you do not care that the m3 is not able to break the magic-five-second-mark for sedans both offer a perfomance on the border to a raceJ. Both have an impressive sound.

Driving in the frontier on a racetrack the philosophies offer their differences. Because of the 40:60 powerdistribution you can take the rs 4 to curves with less understeering than the s4 but you are not able to take the rs4 to oversteering. The handling is very simple and easy. You only have to put down the accelerotor pedal and also on wet tracks the cars has a lot of grip.

The m3 wants to be handled sensitively. Using the heavy sportmode it allows every driftangle. That looks spectacularly but don’t make fast times. You have to handle the power with care on normal roads.

Result of Ralf Kund the testeditor.
Both are impressive “drivemachines” the price difference of 10.000 € is not small. The rs4 offers a brilliant engine and an easy handling but it is only able to beat the m3 on the perfomance side.

In my opinion he is not sure what he wants. The performance is the reason why to buy a sportscar like the rs4 or also the m3. So which chapters he is searching for on this comparison? The rs4 is faster and that’s it:D !

:bye:

rks838

August 23rd, 2005, 05:46

Sounds pretty accurate to me. Have you driven the RS4? Can you give us your thoughts on it?

alex_s3

August 23rd, 2005, 21:31

yeah.. But inn TopGear they tested the M3 (343hp) vs S4 (344hp).. and the strange thing was that the S4 was 1+sec faster around the track on dry! imagene on wet! on the drag the M3 won a little.. maybe beacuse it is 160 kgs lighter than the S4 with 1 hp more.. Sow if I compare the RS4 vs M3 its not really a competition.. but maybe the new M3 wil be fast..

Erik

October 4th, 2005, 19:47

Nice pics!

http://media.autobild.de/bild/5/210ac247b6ea733c2a1eb1380fcc86f5_1.jpg

http://media.autobild.de/bild/F/66c77959729d829c991e5e2c77638c4f_1.jpg

http://media.autobild.de/bild/8/9d59b6ce1c367fb45d57d82bf0173278_1.jpg

http://media.autobild.de/bild/1/e7ee0f37d415161a3cfabc6fb16d8a71_1.jpg

http://media.autobild.de/bild/C/9a8cad09f261d8ddafc9d6503201b22c_1.jpg

BBGT2

October 6th, 2005, 02:37

Originally posted by JoosyJoos
Thats quite possibly the dumbest statement i have ever heard. The M5 may not be too fast in the 0-60 thats because its rwd... you guys have quattro. The M5 would still beat it past 100 and top out higher... Just because 0-60 is better on the audi doesnt mean crap. And to say audi makes faster cars than bmw.... thats ludacris. Ever heard of the z8? beats everything audi has made. 0-60 in 4.6 quarter mile in 13 and its about 5 years old. And if you dont agree with that then you got the m5 (0-60 in 4.6-7), m6(0-60 in 4.4), m3 (estimated low 4's currently at 4.9) to put up with still. An s4 isnt even a comparison with the current m3. If audi wants to make fast cars they should just leave it to there big brother porsche. Dont get me wrong Audis are good... but saying that they are better than BMW is a stretch... if they were better they would have more sales than BMW and would be able to charge more for there product. Fact of the matter is... they dont.

That is funny, a bimmer fan surfing Audi sites and "defending" his choice of vehicle. That is just plain ridiculous to me. Why bother coming over here telling us your piece of mind about a product we OBVIOUSLY like and then try to knock it. You get some kind of pleasure from it? If so too bad for you, I guess its good that not all cars are bmw's as this would surely be a sorry ass planet. And dont even mention "build quality".
This thing of ours is an Audi thing a bimmer fan just does not get it.

Bajo:addict:

Benman

October 6th, 2005, 18:39

Originally posted by Bajors6
That is funny, a bimmer fan surfing Audi sites and "defending" his choice of vehicle. That is just plain ridiculous to me. Why bother coming over here telling us your piece of mind about a product we OBVIOUSLY like and then try to knock it. You get some kind of pleasure from it?

This thing of ours is an Audi thing a bimmer fan just does not get it.

Bajo:addict:
Agreed. You know, I don't think even ONE member from ANY BMW forum on the entire internet can say that of me! I never go to their forums to "stir the pot". I'm sure that some Audi guys do, but personally, I'm an Audi guy. I don't NEED to go to THEIR forums and then proceed to preach to them about how much I love my car and dislike theirs.

Sad. Really sad.

Ben:addict: