Any experience with MTM 568 hp package?

[minimad]

Had my MTM 508hp on the beast for helf year. Another MTM RS6 in my town is the 535 hp version (keo's). It seems we both are happy about MTM stuff so far.
Now I am considering to take the stage of 535 hp or one step further to 568 hp version. http://www.mtm-online.de/html_en/preisliste.php4?Modell=RS6&FZID=RS6331Q

Compare to 508 hp, the 535 hp version is not as high C/P value as 508hp version. But for the 568 hp version, MTM will change two bigger turbo charger, also the down pipe are different. what I concern the most are the heat dispension problem and the durability of gear box.

Does any one on the board had or heard MTM 568 hp RS6, please advise.

[Bauer]

Nordschleife had two RS6's at one point...one the 535 hp version...which if I recall correctly had most of the problems...blown transmission and melted exhaust manifolds...which blew the turbos. Nord did have an early year RS6's. The 568hp version, I don't recall seeing him post about any problems.

He did say the car was very fast and with the MTM exhaust that would open up, was loud as could be. I believe that his quote was that under full throttle even at the Ring it turned heads.

Also, I believe that with the 568hp version additional cooler are added to transmission and one is added to rear diff....not positive though.

If you try a search you might find more information.

Good luck!!!:thumb:

[Nordschleife]

Originally posted by Bauer
Nordschleife had two RS6's at one point...one the 535 hp version...which if I recall correctly had most of the problems...blown transmission and melted exhaust manifolds...which blew the turbos. Nord did have an early year RS6's. The 568hp version, I don't recall seeing him post about any problems.

He did say the car was very fast and with the MTM exhaust that would open up, was loud as could be. I believe that his quote was that under full throttle even at the Ring it turned heads.

Also, I believe that with the 568hp version additional cooler are added to transmission and one is added to rear diff....not positive though.



Strangely, the less powerful had the most problems - the factory thought it was a load of bad fuel which caused the exhaust manifold to melt, which damaged the turbos. When replacing the engine, the gearbox would not function. They pulled that 'completely destroyed' according to the factory. Which was really odd, as the gearbox had been perfect before the turbo problem.

Originally, the more powerful one had over 800 NM of torque. This showed up the fundemental flaws in the transmission, beyond what could be cured by reprogramming. So the torque was wound back and reprofiled, so there was less decline as the revs rose, resulting in more bhp overall. This car has a very aggressive exhaust system - at full throttle at Le Mans it turned heads, especially factory heads, and in the tight square tunnels under the track, it would hurt ears, I didn't see any blood, but I wasn't hanging around to look. This car outruns helicopters. However, it pointed out to me the complete foolishness of expecting a car to be all things to all people, and my choice now is horses for courses. i was also surprised how little extra non-exposed usable space there is in the RS6 compared to my S4 limousine with the rear seats folded down.

Unless i was planning on keeping the RS6 for a long time, I would not spend a lot of money going to the next tuning step, it is still crippled off the line by the gearbox. And the maanual option is as expensive as unobtanium, and not exactly 'road legal', if anybody is being picky.

R+C

[keo]

I was starting to get worry after reading Nordschleife's post about the 535bhp upgrade. Yes, minimad I am still enjoy having my rs6 with stage 3 upgrade. I did also think about stage 4 conversion. But just like Nordschleife's saying unless we really don't know where to spend our extra money.

I still don't get it why does less power has more problems??? I get what Nordschleife is trying to say. It just my common sense telling me something else ought to be wrong. Anyway, Minimad as long your beast is smooth and reliable 508bhp, 535bhp and 568bhp is not going to help or be any different for us especially around Taipei traffic condition.

[Chuangs4]

It's so fantastic to hear another RS6 owner herein Taiwan....

but I don't think any of local tuners will have the ability to have this 568hp kit done!

:rs6kiss: :rs6kiss: :rs6kiss:

[Bauer]

- at full throttle at Le Mans it turned heads

Oops...

[minimad]

Originally posted by Chuangs4
It's so fantastic to hear another RS6 owner herein Taiwan....

but I don't think any of local tuners will have the ability to have this 568hp kit done!

:rs6kiss: :rs6kiss: :rs6kiss:

Oh yes, both Keo's and my RS6 were tuned by D-Sport Mr. Fun, he is the authorized tuner for MTM. In fact, he owns one special MTM motorsport RS6 plus sedan (in red)with 594 horses and all amazing modification, you may find articles introducing his monster in many recent local car magazines. Moreover, I believe that more than helf of modified RS6 in Taiwan were done in his shop. FYI, there are more than dozen of RS6 in Taiwan now.

Bauer and Nordschleife, thanks for commend. I know it's not practical to spend extra $ on only dragging power. But I really enjoy the process of exploding the potential of the car I loved. My next step of mod is the real break (MoveIt) and real sway bar(probably H-Sport). If the drivability would be improved as much as I expected, then I will consider to go higher power if the Audi stuff can handle. Nord, how do you feel drivability of 568 hp RS6 compares to stock one?

Keo, have not heard you for long time, how's everything going? I heard that you are also interested in the real brake & sway bar, we may talk then when stuff arrive the shop.:revs:

[minimad]

Originally posted by keo
I was starting to get worry after reading Nordschleife's post about the 535bhp upgrade. Yes, minimad I am still enjoy having my rs6 with stage 3 upgrade. I did also think about stage 4 conversion. But just like Nordschleife's saying unless we really don't know where to spend our extra money.

I still don't get it why does less power has more problems??? I get what Nordschleife is trying to say. It just my common sense telling me something else ought to be wrong. Anyway, Minimad as long your beast is smooth and reliable 508bhp, 535bhp and 568bhp is not going to help or be any different for us especially around Taipei traffic condition.

haha , Keo , so you may want to go 568 hp upgrade to prevent that happen:vgrumpy: How about group buy with big discount from D. Sport?:applause:

My personal guess is that 535 hp version squeeeeeeezed all available power from two smaller turbo chargers, the extra heat is the killer to unlucky instance. I hope D. Sport can intall ATF cooler on the transmission (at very little $)before put more tourqe & power on the drivetrain, then provide one year warranty to allure us being the first guys for implementing all series MTM mods experience in his shop. :p :p

[keo]

See u later maybe at the d-sport....drive safely with your beast:rs6kiss:

[Chuangs4]

Originally posted by minimad
Oh yes, both Keo's and my RS6 were tuned by D-Sport Mr. Fun, he is the authorized tuner for MTM. In fact, he owns one special MTM motorsport RS6 plus sedan (in red)with 594 horses and all amazing modification, you may find articles introducing his monster in many recent local car magazines. Moreover, I believe that more than helf of modified RS6 in Taiwan were done in his shop. FYI, there are more than dozen of RS6 in Taiwan now.

Bauer and Nordschleife, thanks for commend. I know it's not practical to spend extra $ on only dragging power. But I really enjoy the process of exploding the potential of the car I loved. My next step of mod is the real break (MoveIt) and real sway bar(probably H-Sport). If the drivability would be improved as much as I expected, then I will consider to go higher power if the Audi stuff can handle. Nord, how do you feel drivability of 568 hp RS6 compares to stock one?

Keo, have not heard you for long time, how's everything going? I heard that you are also interested in the real brake & sway bar, we may talk then when stuff arrive the shop.:revs: Yeah I know John for a long time since I owned my ex-Audi 1.8t. D.sport is the only MTM authorized tuner in TW, and in fact, John is probably the only guy who can contact MTM directly. My advise is not for what person can install which kit on whose car. I think the critical point is the ability to solve problems you may have after kit's installation, especially in such high-tech car like your RS6...

However, if John can promise you about some kind of warranty, that may be fair for you...

If not, I think 535hp kit is the best way to go in Taiwan....

[keo]

I agreed with Chuangs4 suggested. Minimad since you got the 508 package and I had the 535 package and John had the 590 plus package just try it before you make your mind whether to go for 568 or not.....

[minimad]

Keo, yes I did tried his car, it's a damn fast 2 ton steel which still keep excellent balance.:revs: :0:

But I don't think John can proceed such a level of mod in his shop, because MTM replaced/reinforced many stuff in the drivetrain & gearbox.

My question is : is the 568 hp conversion on RS6 = to John's 590 hp conversion on RS6+, If yes, I think the 568hp version should also include those extra stuff, i.e. ATF cooler, Transmission gasket, stronger crank, clutch plate, piston etc., for higher reliability.

I hope that 568hp RS6 can kick the ass of heavy modified E55

:race:

[Chuangs4]

Originally posted by minimad
Keo, yes I did tried his car, it's a damn fast 2 ton steel which still keep excellent balance.:revs: :0:

But I don't think John can proceed such a level of mod in his shop, because MTM replaced/reinforced many stuff in the drivetrain & gearbox.

My question is : is the 568 hp conversion on RS6 = to John's 590 hp conversion on RS6+, If yes, I think the 568hp version should also include those extra stuff, i.e. ATF cooler, Transmission gasket, stronger crank, clutch plate, piston etc., for higher reliability.

I hope that 568hp RS6 can kick the ass of heavy modified E55

:race: John's RS6 is an MTM complete car, which only manufactured by MTM themself...

I don't think 568hp version on RS6 would be equal to 590hp RS6 plus in performance. They are whole different things....

No matter how far could a RS6 be moded, it will still get a small chance to kick heavy moded E55 ass. The automatic transmission is the issue where the bottle neck is....

Stay tuned!



:revs: :0: :0:

[minimad]

Chuangs4, yes, I know the diff of John's RS6+ from the 568 hp package. I think his car can easily beat heavy moded E55 in any circumstance except top speed.


:MTM:

I just try to have an experimental mind to possible mods. But most probably will return to the reality:p

[keo]

Minimad, I am sort of agreed with chuangs4's point of view. Both E55 and RS6 is a beast alright and both have that unique character. I had the chance to drive the e55 for weeks and knowing the most unforgetable is it instant torque feeling. It is totally different driving experience compare with rs6. That strong pulling of e55 is pretty much the only thing I can remember this car. The rest of the beauty is it just another mercede. Honestly tell you e55 was my first pick before going to rs6. But after a test drive of rs6 I just got hook up not it's performance wise but that unique characteristic. Just love it.

Trying to beat the e55 in stock form is no where close. I have constantly competing with my friend's e55 start from when it is stock than upgrade till stage 3. I know the urge of wanting more and more power. It just like never enough. But at stage 3, for myself it is already too much than I can cope with (trying to drive safely). At stage 3, it all depend on the driver. Who ever is on the accelerator first. I know one thing we can win over e55 is it handling. You just have to appreciate that 4 wheel drive. My friend e55 almost end up kissing the wall several time when we are in the twisted road. But something else I am aware of is not the power anymore. It is the brake. Too many time I and e55 are just that close of kissing others. So I've decided to upgrade my brake next week at John's place.

[audirs6sport]

Originally posted by Bauer
Nordschleife had two RS6's at one point...one the 535 hp version...which if I recall correctly had most of the problems...blown transmission and melted exhaust manifolds...which blew the turbos. Nord did have an early year RS6's. The 568hp version, I don't recall seeing him post about any problems.

He did say the car was very fast and with the MTM exhaust that would open up, was loud as could be. I believe that his quote was that under full throttle even at the Ring it turned heads.

Also, I believe that with the 568hp version additional cooler are added to transmission and one is added to rear diff....not positive though.

If you try a search you might find more information.

Good luck!!!:thumb:


How much tq? hp is just numbers in reality, tq is what gets your car moving =)

[minimad]

Originally posted by keo
Minimad, I am sort of agreed with chuangs4's point of view. Both E55 and RS6 is a beast alright and both have that unique character. I had the chance to drive the e55 for weeks and knowing the most unforgetable is it instant torque feeling. It is totally different driving experience compare with rs6. That strong pulling of e55 is pretty much the only thing I can remember this car. The rest of the beauty is it just another mercede. Honestly tell you e55 was my first pick before going to rs6. But after a test drive of rs6 I just got hook up not it's performance wise but that unique characteristic. Just love it.

Trying to beat the e55 in stock form is no where close. I have constantly competing with my friend's e55 start from when it is stock than upgrade till stage 3. I know the urge of wanting more and more power. It just like never enough. But at stage 3, for myself it is already too much than I can cope with (trying to drive safely). At stage 3, it all depend on the driver. Who ever is on the accelerator first. I know one thing we can win over e55 is it handling. You just have to appreciate that 4 wheel drive. My friend e55 almost end up kissing the wall several time when we are in the twisted road. But something else I am aware of is not the power anymore. It is the brake. Too many time I and e55 are just that close of kissing others. So I've decided to upgrade my brake next week at John's place.

Keo, I thought that you already have MTM 380mm rotor on the front, if yes, what kind of brake upgrade you will proceed next week?
Frankly speaking, I have the MTM 380mm disk on mine, I don't feel very obvious improvment over the stock. That's why I am thinking to put Moveit rear brake before I go either 535hp or 568hp conversion....

[audirs6sport]

Originally posted by keo
Minimad, I am sort of agreed with chuangs4's point of view. Both E55 and RS6 is a beast alright and both have that unique character. I had the chance to drive the e55 for weeks and knowing the most unforgetable is it instant torque feeling. It is totally different driving experience compare with rs6. That strong pulling of e55 is pretty much the only thing I can remember this car. The rest of the beauty is it just another mercede. Honestly tell you e55 was my first pick before going to rs6. But after a test drive of rs6 I just got hook up not it's performance wise but that unique characteristic. Just love it.

Trying to beat the e55 in stock form is no where close. I have constantly competing with my friend's e55 start from when it is stock than upgrade till stage 3. I know the urge of wanting more and more power. It just like never enough. But at stage 3, for myself it is already too much than I can cope with (trying to drive safely). At stage 3, it all depend on the driver. Who ever is on the accelerator first. I know one thing we can win over e55 is it handling. You just have to appreciate that 4 wheel drive. My friend e55 almost end up kissing the wall several time when we are in the twisted road. But something else I am aware of is not the power anymore. It is the brake. Too many time I and e55 are just that close of kissing others. So I've decided to upgrade my brake next week at John's place.

Of course E55 is faster on straight line in both stock form. RS6 was released earlier than w211 E55 was, and merc was already aware of this fact. Obviously, there's no reason why merc wouldn't release a car that's quicker than it's competitors, especially knowing the opponent's specs.
You're talkign about a s/c vs turbo charged cars. s/c has a more linear powerband response which behaves like an n/a motor, thanks to the lack of lag; unlike turbo charged applications. However, the problem with rs6 in stock form is that the way the throttle behavior has been programed on to it's ECM's eprom. I have mine set so that it gives partial throttle when I step on partially, and full throttle when I want full throttle. This has tremendously improved the lack of so called "instant response." You can also have the boost changed in low & mid range as well, unlike most softwares out there that have higher crank on mainly high end range. This was also another factor that helped my car feel gain alot more instant feedback. Believe me, I've blown plenty of E55's on straight line, I got three buddies with modded E55's (w211 chassis). I will be posting a video as soon as I have some spare time on my hands as well as my benzino buddies.
What also helps is that you can do a mister setup for your side dual IC and water injection into your intake to drop the intake air temp as well as cool down the turbo from heatsoaking. I've seen some use alcohol mixed with water, or methanol. This is a very cost effective, inexpensive peripheral aid upgrage. I believe you can purchase the SCCA RS6's water IC mister setup from Champion Motorsports. Here's a link to a site where it shows the products I've mentioned. http://www.autospeed.com/shop/category_705/browse.html
P.S. Just to let you know, alot of the tuners out there who claims all the power their upgrade makes, has failed to prove themselves. APR's upgrade when loaded on dyno test has actually lost 10 hp on B5 S4 last time I've checked. I would be more serious upon the details of upgrades and specifically what it is doing to your car, rather than just looking up the brand names and $ tag.

[audirs6sport]

Originally posted by minimad
Had my MTM 508hp on the beast for helf year. Another MTM RS6 in my town is the 535 hp version (keo's). It seems we both are happy about MTM stuff so far.
Now I am considering to take the stage of 535 hp or one step further to 568 hp version. http://www.mtm-online.de/html_en/preisliste.php4?Modell=RS6&FZID=RS6331Q

Compare to 508 hp, the 535 hp version is not as high C/P value as 508hp version. But for the 568 hp version, MTM will change two bigger turbo charger, also the down pipe are different. what I concern the most are the heat dispension problem and the durability of gear box.

Does any one on the board had or heard MTM 568 hp RS6, please advise.

Do you have any details upon the "larger turbos" that they are referring to? Just curious.

[audirs6sport]

Originally posted by Chuangs4

No matter how far could a RS6 be moded, it will still get a small chance to kick heavy moded E55 ass. The automatic transmission is the issue where the bottle neck is....

:revs: :0: :0:

And E55's only weakness is the motor... Even E55's transmission is not all that reliable when you begin to load more power. One of my buddy had his E55 tranny swapped when it was STOCK. :( When making additional power, it is ALWAYS highly recommended to upgrade all your peripherals for higher reliability. That goes to ANY cars that a human being has ever made.

[TaTaPiRaTa]

I wonder how many 535HP packages MTM sold, any info on that ?

[mi021le]

whos used meth? id love to see what mth would do on one of these cars. ive seen a turbo trans am on a stock moter put down 792 on 15 psi using meth. blew the old record on the unforged motor away. but just didnt know people were using it on rs6s. any links to these things or who in the world has worked with meth or alcohol?

ive seen these guys advertise but no idea on the turbo changes.


http://www.auto-amd.com/rs6.asp

jay

[minimad]

Originally posted by audirs6sport
Do you have any details upon the "larger turbos" that they are referring to? Just curious.

chked w/ D. Sport, MTM stage 4 uses KKK K16 turbo

[audirs6sport]

Originally posted by minimad
chked w/ D. Sport, MTM stage 4 uses KKK K16 turbo

Just a std k16 or k16/k24 hybrid? K16 vs RS6 K04 is not a huge difference. If it's a std k16, you might as well do yourself a favor and save yourself from wasting money on a bs upgrade.

[minimad]

Originally posted by audirs6sport
Just a std k16 or k16/k24 hybrid? K16 vs RS6 K04 is not a huge difference. If it's a std k16, you might as well do yourself a favor and save yourself from wasting money on a bs upgrade.

Not even a std K16, is a hybrid of K03 and K16.
A hybrid of K16/K24 would be too big to fit in engine bay. That is what I heard from D. Sport:doh: