Torque Converter

[paperchase]

Hey all,

I've got the dreaded torque converter stuck in the on/off position code and reset it with a cheap handheld scanner. It came back in a few weeks and I couldn't reset it because it was throwing the code from the transmission so I got a shop to do it. It has now come back a week later so I know there's an issue. I have no tranny slippage whatsoever. I do occasionally, and ever so slightly, feel the downshift from 2-1 when coming to a hard stop but I'm told that's normal.

I'm contemplating the Level 10 upgraded torque converter and have a good tranny shop that will do the labor inexpensively. I used them to do a tranny in my S8 and they specialize in Audi's and do enough that the rates a very reasonable. Is there any reason I should hold off, other procedures I should try or any concerns I'm overlooking before pulling the trigger? I'm a bit annoyed because the last owner said they had no CELs ever and I got the purge valve and torque converter valves during the first week of ownership. I fixed the purge valve easily, but this one will cost a bit more. Thoughts?

[BradP]

This one is a mystery to me too. Torque converter lockout is for fuel economy (for the most part). It's also electronically controlled. So, if the TCU knows the seal is bad, throws a code, and stops trying to lock it out; how is it the tranny supposedly fries shortly after? I know I don't care if the lockout works or not. The only way the tranny should fry is if too much pressure is lost trying to lock it out.

I threw the code for 8 months after I got my car and changed the fluid. I was told by the experts I was going to loose my tranny. I told the service guy at the shop my opinions on that, and he really had no reply. Then, the code went away on its own never to return. Tranny is fine, and I certainly don't baby the car.

I'll be doing the fluid again sometime soon, and expect the code to return...whateva'.

[lswing]

TC acting this way will heat up fluid and finish off your trans. Might as well replace both. Tozo is a great option, $4k for both fully rebuilt. Drive easy and you'll last longer. Whoever sold you that car probably knew. There is a list of info in the Maintenance tab in my site, other things to take care of.

[paperchase]

Well I have a few other toys so I'm not driving it right now. I can get a Level 10 converter for $600 and get it installed for $750 which combined is a lot less expensive than a trans. lswing, are you saying changing the converter won't save the trans? I know changing the fluid may erase the code, but that seems like a short-term repair as opposed to a solution.

[lswing]

Typically its $2-3k to get it installed, you have good friends. The trans will last, depends on if you are tuned and driving habits. New trans is the same price as labor to replace, might as well do it now.

[DHall1]

Please post details on the car

Mileage

Vin

History

How long owned

[paperchase]

lswing, how much is the trans? I'm referring to part cost. I'm not tuned yet and I've been mellow with the driving so far...for the most part. Considering an 034 ECU/TCU upgrade, however.

DHall, I have about 75,000 miles, I submitted the VIN to another member to log, 2 owners prior to me and I've had the car just a few months now. Enough time to feel it out replace front brakes and rotors, troubleshoot the purge valve code and research the torque converter issue. I have a code for one engine mount and the exhaust temp -- neither of which throw off a CEL. I have the upgraded RNS-E headunit...otherwise the car is stock.

[lswing]

$3,500 for Tozo trans, $1k core deposit or ship him yours, $500 TC. Trans will have extra clutch pack, know weak points fixed such as reverse pin I think, upgraded VB pressure to keep shifting tight. He's done many so it's a solid bet. I think Level 10 and maybe another vendor cost around $5,500, but they may hold more power with upgraded clutch packs, although I've heard mixed reviews on shift quality. The more an auto can hold generally the rougher it shifts.

I replaced my TC for $2k, very friendly labor rate, then a year later the trans failed so another $2k for the same labor, was at 89k. But I was tuned and driving hard at times. Reason to almost just do it all now if you plan on being tuned.

Your labor quote is very cheap, be careful as sometimes more problems occur if not in the right hands. It's easier to just pull the whole trans/engine than to try and get the TC out, consensus from many who have done both.

[DHall1]

Its a crap shoot. Comes down to how long it was driven with the bad tc

750 to pull the engine? I doubt it

They dont know what they are getting into

Your going to flash it? Replace the whole thing

[paperchase]

Its a crap shoot. Comes down to how long it was driven with the bad tc

750 to pull the engine? I doubt it

They dont know what they are getting into

Your going to flash it? Replace the whole thing

No disrespect, but they know what they're doing. They did a trans and torque converter on my 2001 S8 for $3,400 cash (2 yrs/24K warranty) and it shifted like new upon completion. They do more Audi than any other make. Located in an industrial park in MD surrounded by machine shops and various tuners. If anyone needs a referral message me.

What's the expected/average life expectancy of a new trans from Tozo? Also, is Tozo's torque converter upgraded from the factory unit?

Shifting gears, perhaps I should start another thread, has anyone had success with aftermarket warranties on the RS6? The policies are inclusion based (not exclusionary) so they only cover stated parts and with respect to the trans they cover failure of internally lubricated parts. I'm wondering what the argument is to deny coverage when a claim for a new transmission is filed.

[Bigglezworth]

No disrespect, but they know what they're doing.Clearly they don't.... Base rate from Authorized Audi service tech is 16-18 hours for R&R of powerplant and unless your shop is pimping themself out at less than $50/hr, the amount you're being quoted is unfeasible. Unlike your S8, you are highly recommended against trying to remove the tranny while the engine remains in the chassis. A few people have successfully done it, but in doing so there was no savings on time. I've swapped 2 tranny's and had the powerplant out of each of my three beasts at least once and three times on my daily so I can cry foul on said claim.

As for the query on whether or not replacing a TC after you have the faiilure increases the lifespan of the transmission, it's a crap shoot. There are so many variables that can affect that. One of my three cars had 235K on the factory transmission. It had the TQ swapped out at 100K. One of my other cars had the TC error code for 5 years and 65K prior to the tranny finally crapping the bed.

Best of success with whatever you elect to do.

[lswing]

What's the expected/average life expectancy of a new trans from Tozo? Also, is Tozo's torque converter upgraded from the factory unit?


Trans for Tozo is more than rebuild from Audi I would say due to his extra precautions. Life expectancy is anywhere from 2k-200k miles, depends on how you drive, and if tuned.:incar:

TC is the same from most everyone these days, Tozo, ACE/EDGE, Audi...it was only a bad seal in the first batch of original issues that caused a problem.

Edit; Everything that Bigglez said above, true. After 3-4 engine pulls my mechanic had it down to 15 hours from 20, but the first time he tried to replace just the TC was miserable, lots of other crap in the way, much tighter work space than other Audi's.

[CBeau]

No disrespect, but they know what they're doing. They did a trans and torque converter on my 2001 S8 for $3,400 cash (2 yrs/24K warranty) and it shifted like new upon completion. They do more Audi than any other make. Located in an industrial park in MD surrounded by machine shops and various tuners. If anyone needs a referral message me.


Whats the name of shop? I'm in MD and getting ready to tackle installing a Tozo built trans and ACE TC myself that I've had for a bit. I have a fully fit out shop of my own to use and a very capable tech helper but after much research I'm still not really looking forward to it and def. plan to pull engine and do the laundry list of around 100k mi. should dos on the engine, cam tensioner pads, valve cover gastekts, vac. lines etc. etc. etc. and pray for another 100K of use. I'm at 92k-ish I think and trans (?TC too) gave up the ghost all in short order after trans fluid change .... did my research on that too incl. with Mr. Tozo and consensus is if trans fluid been changed regularly then ok keep changing, if not and trans is working leave it alone!! My research.... including speaking with Mr. Tozo = want the car / trans to remain drivable, don't tune / up HP/TQ!! Crappy trans is more than maxed out with car straight outta the box as is. If you really need that extra for your vintage sedan do a manual swap and sell car shortly thereafter as seems to be the manual swap trend for whatever reason.