HELP****RS6 Control Arms Toast or Not? [Archive] - RS6.com

Razman2008

August 12th, 2015, 16:28

Hi,

Question, so my steering started to shake, I went to a "trusted" alignment shop and they told me all the front end control arms are toast. They gave me a price of over 1000 dollars for material and another 1000 dollars for labor.

My question is can't they just replace the bushings on all the control arms, since that is the main culprit. Or is that not a option on the RS6. Second I found a MEYLE HD control arm kit for 749.95 dollars, is that a better option?

Any input would be appreciated. Just don't feel like spending 2K right now.

DHall1

August 12th, 2015, 16:33

How many miles?

you may not need all of them

A couple of bushing only options are avail

Ecs and europa have parts

SteveKen

August 12th, 2015, 16:37

$2k installed for all the front control arms is not out of the park, especially if they are using the OEM Lemforder parts and replacing all of the arms and components.

The lower aft arms require a slight dropping of the subframe to get the bolts out.

There are different levels of quality with control arms (usually Mfg. based) and the OEM ones can be 2x the aftermarket ones.

You can replace some of the bushings on the inner areas of the control arms, but any of the outer 'booted' joints are not replaceable if they are bad. Replacing the bushings is labor intensive and would be a trade off in price if you weren't DIY'ing it. It's better to just replace them.

Razman2008

August 12th, 2015, 16:51

The car has 120K miles on it, do not know the last time they were replaced. I have been reading a bit on the forum it looks like it may not be the end of the world to do it yourself. For some reason I just figured you would have to have a lift to do it.

Razman2008

August 12th, 2015, 16:54

Pretty good with the wrench, so may take a stab at it. Any good posts that show pictures? If you guys know if not I can look this evening. I may go with the MEYLE HD, their kit seems like it has everything new. Would you recommend replacing the shocks?

Bigglezworth

August 12th, 2015, 17:41

Full OEM kits are available for just under $500USD and include 8 control arms, outer tie rods, end links, and hardware. Aftermarket alternatives that aren't "as good a quality" are available for half that amount or less, but at the cost of bushing quality. They will last longer than 50% the length of the other arms so if you are a DIY, this is a more cost affordable route - even if you need to do it twice during ownership of the car. If you don't wrench, best to go with a better quality kit - again which can be sourced for $500-$600 (certainly not a criminal $1000.00....). Installation for each side for all the aforementioned parts depends on the ability to get the arms disconnected from the upright. IF there are no problems removing bolts, a qualified mechanic should be able to perform this work in a nominal 2 hours per side ($400-$500 labour). Double that if complications separating upright from arms rears it's ugly head (which is likely close to 'book time' and why they are quoting you $1K).

Razman2008

August 12th, 2015, 18:21

Thanks for all the information.

Dmb408

August 12th, 2015, 20:05

Just FYI, just so we are crystal clear, you can absolutely do just the front upper control arm bushings and usually save the ball joint if that looks ok and that is a pretty reasonable cost at a dealership. I have recent receipts for both (1) all FUCA's done new at dealer and (2) just bushings done on one FUCA at dealer

Razman2008

August 12th, 2015, 20:25

I am actually ordering a full KIT from Germany off of their EBAY, it's a HELL-LOT better price than anything here is the USA. Its the MEYLE HD control arm kit. Even with shipping its like 300 less.

DHall1

August 13th, 2015, 02:12

Give us a link dang it

SteveKen

August 13th, 2015, 14:12

Full OEM kits are available for just under $500USD and include 8 control arms, outer tie rods, end links, and hardware. .

Lemforder is OEM and on the highest end of pricing. Usually about $75 - $125 per piece.

Nomenclature on these components are sketchy. "OEM equaivalent" "OEM Quality" , etc. are not OEM.

Please tell me where you can get this pricing for a full kit using Lemforder components.

urs6ville

August 13th, 2015, 15:39

Bigglezworth

August 13th, 2015, 15:57

Lemforder is OEM and on the highest end of pricing. Usually about $75 - $125 per piece.

Nomenclature on these components are sketchy. "OEM equaivalent" "OEM Quality" , etc. are not OEM.

Please tell me where you can get this pricing for a full kit using Lemforder components.Well put Steve. My bad. OEM Quality (i.e. Meyle, TRW, etc.) OEM equivalent are a nominal $175-250 for a full kit. I've spent a number of weeks searching the Internet high and low to find kits and found great disparity in $$ and quality. I have had success purchasing out of Europe and the UK and having things shipped. Being as I pay import charges and currency exchange regardless, it all comes down to math. I'm also going to be swapping out all the bushings on a spare set I have here with polyeurethane units and see how much stiffer things end up getting.

Turbowned

August 13th, 2015, 16:09

urs6ville

August 13th, 2015, 17:22

I just put in a full 034 Motorsport density line kit:

http://store.034motorsport.com/control-arm-kit-density-line-early-b5-c5-audi-s4-rs4-a6-s6-rs6-b5-volkswagen-passat-with-aluminum-uprights.html

My indy tech didn't charge me $1000 in labor, either. The uppers are easy to do yourself; the lowers take a lot more finesse than I was willing to exert, so my tech did those. I think the subframe needs to be lowered and the axles loosened in order to get the lowers removed and installed.

Wouldn't hurt to spend a few extra bucks and do the inner/outer tie rods before getting an alignment, if they haven't been done in a while.

I love 034:

"Save a ton of money by buying the complete control arm kit over piecing together parts. This kit exceeds the OE arm quality, as we went to an OE supplier for Audi and had them make arms for us to our specifications. Density Line Control Arm Bushings feature slightly sitffer, higher durometer rubber for crisper handling and longer life."

what they want you to read: "We went Lemfroder and had them build us some even BETTER parts and then we sell them to the customer for less than the OEM kit"

what this really says is: "We went to MEYLE (yes, they are an OE supplier for Audi, just not for u/LCA for most Audis), and had them put some better bushings in their standard parts."

heh (sorry, jaded) < /rant><rant></rant>

SteveKen

August 13th, 2015, 17:48

Well put Steve. My bad. OEM Quality (i.e. Meyle, TRW, etc.) OEM equivalent are a nominal $175-250 for a full kit. I've spent a number of weeks searching the Internet high and low to find kits and found great disparity in $$ and quality. I have had success purchasing out of Europe and the UK and having things shipped. Being as I pay import charges and currency exchange regardless, it all comes down to math. I'm also going to be swapping out all the bushings on a spare set I have here with polyeurethane units and see how much stiffer things end up getting.

I cheaped out on the D2 S8 and bought a 12 pc set of OCAP manufactured control arms, tie rods and hardware from Blau Parts. It was still like $500, so I hope I get at least a bit of what I paid for it. It won't be driven that much, so I'm hoping they last me a while. Fingers crossed.

It's funny how reseller x tries to justify whatever they sell. Here's Blau's take on the Ocap brand: http://www.blauparts.com/categories2.asp?cat=1762

DHall1

August 13th, 2015, 19:46

What is your feedback so far?

I just put in a full 034 Motorsport density line kit:

http://store.034motorsport.com/control-arm-kit-density-line-early-b5-c5-audi-s4-rs4-a6-s6-rs6-b5-volkswagen-passat-with-aluminum-uprights.html

My indy tech didn't charge me $1000 in labor, either. The uppers are easy to do yourself; the lowers take a lot more finesse than I was willing to exert, so my tech did those. I think the subframe needs to be lowered and the axles loosened in order to get the lowers removed and installed.

Wouldn't hurt to spend a few extra bucks and do the inner/outer tie rods before getting an alignment, if they haven't been done in a while.

August 15th, 2015, 18:56

Have installed Meyle HD's on a couple customer RS6's and have them myself. And many more on S4's, S6's-- anyone wanting something more sporty and solid. Good prices, good quality (made in Turkey). The cars always feel great. Even on cars with marginally worn arms. If one arm is wornout/loose, I replace in pairs

The lowest end arms used so far was Vaico, on a tired C5-2.8. Pretty nice actually. Not sure if they make a RS6 kit. Wouldn't use it unless someone was on a major budget and had to replace arms.

Bushing Replacement: after checking many a car, haven't found a single car where it was cost effective or made sense in terms of cost (for a retail customer).

BTW, those 'RS6' kits are not truly compatible as shown. The alloy subframe (S6/RS6), uses different arms and hardware, than steel subframe cars. While they may fit "fine", it's a compromise that, depending on the installation method and driving style, may lead to either loose arms, compromised, even a cracked subframe.

Not something I'd risk (and don't). ((not be too negative: it's easier to side-step responsibility selling parts to DIY'ers. Should something go wrong, blame the installer.))

Turbowned

August 15th, 2015, 19:34

What is your feedback so far?

I'll let you know as soon as a get a new alternator in the damn thing :( My tech got it all aligned and out on the road for just a few mins. before the low voltage light came on.

Razman2008

August 18th, 2015, 15:20

Okay so here is the KIT I found in GERMANY, shipping to the USA. http://www.ebay.de/itm/Verstarkter-Meyle-QUERLENKER-SATZ-AUDI-A4-A6-RS4-S4-RS6-S6-VW-Passat-3B3-3B6-/261892517401?hash=item3cfa02ae19&autorefresh=true

Razman2008

August 18th, 2015, 15:26

So is the Meyle HD Kit compatible? See my EBAY link on the KIT I am looking at purchasing.

Have installed Meyle HD's on a couple customer RS6's and have them myself. And many more on S4's, S6's-- anyone wanting something more sporty and solid. Good prices, good quality (made in Turkey). The cars always feel great. Even on cars with marginally worn arms. If one arm is wornout/loose, I replace in pairs

The lowest end arms used so far was Vaico, on a tired C5-2.8. Pretty nice actually. Not sure if they make a RS6 kit. Wouldn't use it unless someone was on a major budget and had to replace arms.

Bushing Replacement: after checking many a car, haven't found a single car where it was cost effective or made sense in terms of cost (for a retail customer).

BTW, those 'RS6' kits are not truly compatible as shown. The alloy subframe (S6/RS6), uses different arms and hardware, than steel subframe cars. While they may fit "fine", it's a compromise that, depending on the installation method and driving style, may lead to either loose arms, compromised, even a cracked subframe.

Not something I'd risk (and don't). ((not be too negative: it's easier to side-step responsibility selling parts to DIY'ers. Should something go wrong, blame the installer.))

Other_Erik

August 18th, 2015, 17:27

Was looking at the 034 kit, good stuff, then I ran across this gem:

http://store.034motorsport.com/hella-flush-stance-lowering-kit.html

Can't say they don't have a sense of humor!

O_E

Razman2008

August 18th, 2015, 17:42

I just peed my pants watching that video................OMG LMAO

Was looking at the 034 kit, good stuff, then I ran across this gem:

http://store.034motorsport.com/hella-flush-stance-lowering-kit.html

Can't say they don't have a sense of humor!

O_E

Other_Erik

August 18th, 2015, 17:54

I just peed my pants watching that video................OMG LMAO
http://store.034motorsport.com/turbo-blow-off-simulator-for-posers.html

End of item description:
NOTE - IF YOU ARE STUPID ENOUGH TO BUY THIS, WE WILL CHARGE YOUR CREDIT CARD AND NEVER SHIP YOUR ORDER AS WE WOULDN'T BE CAUGHT DEAD STOCKING SUCH A RIDICULOUS PRODUCT AT OUR FACILITY

Turbowned

August 18th, 2015, 18:12

This one is still my favorite: shifter delete kit

http://store.034motorsport.com/shifter-delete-kit-b5-a4-s4-rs4.html

"Do you see a shifter? No!That's right, F1 drivers don't have time to waste on shifting. When they are on the track, they're busy driving, checking out F1 babes, and reading the newspaper.
DON'T LIE TO YOURSELF: YOU WANT TO BE JUST LIKE AN F1 DRIVER. THANKS TO 034MOTORSPORT, YOU CAN!"

August 18th, 2015, 19:02

So is the Meyle HD Kit compatible? See my EBAY link on the KIT I am looking at purchasing.

While it may/will fit, it's NOT the exact arm kit. Look at your lower front arms. There is a large flat plate on the bushing where it mounts to the subframe.

I get good prices on the kits, but also the correct front lower arms. Which match OEM design.

Bigglezworth

August 18th, 2015, 19:27

While it may/will fit, it's NOT the exact arm kit. Look at your lower front arms. There is a large flat plate on the bushing where it mounts to the subframe.

I get good prices on the kits, but also the correct front lower arms. Which match OEM design.I'd like to hear your thoughts on why a bushing with flat plates on the end performs different than the one without. I've run both on my cars and can attest to the fact that neither improved or worsened drive performance. Also, neither lasted longer or shorter than the other with them both wearing out equally over the same amount of mileage. There might in fact be some design logic behind it, but given that all the other three control arms don't have the flat plates and use similar mounting surface to frame areas, I am at a loss on what exactly that would be

CornersWell

August 20th, 2015, 12:28

So, just curious since I'm probably going to be needing to replace my control arms (again...3rd or 4th time, now) due to the "thunking" at low speed in the driveway: what's the current best option? Obviously, the stock parts wear out far too fast (68K mileage and on my 3rd or 4th set?). Upgrading to the poly bushings sounds good, but ride quality will be harsher (and I'm already on 20" rims...maybe that's why they're wearing out so fast?). In the DC Metro region, road conditions are awful, so that has to accelerate the deterioration. Anyway, I'm starting to think about my pile of parts for my next "big" service. So, everyone's wisdom on this is appreciated.

Thanks,

CW

Turbowned

August 20th, 2015, 15:51

I'd like to hear your thoughts on why a bushing with flat plates on the end performs different than the one without. I've run both on my cars and can attest to the fact that neither improved or worsened drive performance. Also, neither lasted longer or shorter than the other with them both wearing out equally over the same amount of mileage. There might in fact be some design logic behind it, but given that all the other three control arms don't have the flat plates and use similar mounting surface to frame areas, I am at a loss on what exactly that would be

This was the one thing my tech and I were concerned about; the arms coming out had the flat plates while the 034 Motorsport arms did not. If you say they work and seem to last for the same amount of time that's a big relief.

Bigglezworth

August 20th, 2015, 18:42

This was the one thing my tech and I were concerned about; the arms coming out had the flat plates while the 034 Motorsport arms did not. If you say they work and seem to last for the same amount of time that's a big relief.That is my own experience yes. What that equates to from an "engineered/designed" perspective is anyones guess. Again, the other three arms don't have the flat plates so your guess is as good as mine. If you work on a lot of different cars, and watch shows on how cars are manufactured on the assembly line, you come across a whole bunch of oddities that are used as part of mainstream initial production assembly and not required as part of ongoing maintenance moving forward. Anyway, just my observation. Each owner has to be comfortable with what they choose.