Sizing winter tires.

[April03- GO]

I went for a set of Pirelli Snow Sport 240 for my 18” standard rims. Rather than staying on standard tire size, I downsized to 245/45/18. The “side effect” of this is that the tires will “touch “ the inner fender on a maximum wheel angle.

[Bauer]

I would have thought there would be more clearance but I guess not. I have not put snow tires on the RS6, just have them on the S8 for going to the Sierra's. Dunlop Sport M2's...work very good and are not that noisy on dry pavement.:cheers:

[nene]

I went with Dunlop's Winter Sport M3 at 255/40/18.
Let's see how they hold up!

[gjg]

did anyone use stock 9 spoke rims with 225/45 winter tires and if yes how is the fit ?

tia

[srosie]

Especially noticed on sudden pavement depressions where the sprung chassis sends the wheel north into the wheel well for a brief rub. I am definately calling tirerack about this. I have had their package of the 18" X 7.5" Italia S5 wheels with the 245/45/18 Pirelli Wintersport 240's on there for 2 weeks. Not a huge deal, but they'll want to know this package does not quite fit.

[JP4]

Originally posted by srosie
Especially noticed on sudden pavement depressions where the sprung chassis sends the wheel north into the wheel well for a brief rub. I am definately calling tirerack about this. I have had their package of the 18" X 7.5" Italia S5 wheels with the 245/45/18 Pirelli Wintersport 240's on there for 2 weeks. Not a huge deal, but they'll want to know this package does not quite fit.

What up wit dat! Sounds like they have the offset wrong. I'm quite surprised Tire Rack messed that one up!

[oregonbob]

I've posted this comment before but I'll do it again since the subject keeps coming up. I know conventional wisdom is that narrower tires generally do better in snow, all else being equal. The concept is the narrower footprint also allows for a longer footprint. While this is true, how real is it for everyday driving? In my opinion, this really only applies when snow is deep enough to create a "wedge" in front of the tire as it rolls. Narrower tire creates narrower wedge. But, where I live, snow is minimal and ice is a problem. Anyway, would an RS6 owner really deliberately choose to drive in deep snow??? If so, my opinion is probably not relavent.

For my last several cars, I've purchased a second set of OEM wheels and OEM size winter tires. It's always been my opinion that cheap aftermarket wheels (the ones most people buy for winter) are, well, cheap. They tend to not be as strong as OEM and/or heavier than OEM. That's an opinion; no facts to back it up. But, in my years of OEM wheels and winter tires, I've never bent a wheel, lost a tire, had rubbing of any kind or lost control of my car.

My RS6 has OEM wheels (from the Audi dealer) with 255/40-18 Dunlop WinterSport M3's (from Tire Rack). The dealer even took my A6 4.2 OEM wheels with Dunlop WinterSport M2's in on trade. Handling with the Dunlop's is not a crisp as with the OEM Pirelli P Zero's but I'll bet better than the narrower winter tires Audi offers. There is no wheelspin on launch and the car handles predicitably and better than most any other winter equipped car on the road. I am quite satisfied.

I agree with JP4. If a 245 tire is rubbing, the offset is probably wrong. When I was shopping for replica wheels (before paying the higher price for OEM's), two different vendors told me a 5mm difference in offset would make no difference. Really? Then why would Audi make a unique offset for the RS6? Their answer was to make a profit on the sale of new OEM wheels by having a unique size no one else could offer. Yeah, right!!! Their solution was to offer a 35 offset wheel for a 30 offset car and tell the buyer not to worry about it. One even emailed a photo of his wheel on a A6 4.2 to show that it would fit an RS6 even though the offset is different between those two cars! Sorry. After spending $87K on a car, saving $1K on wheels which were not to Audi spec seemed foolish.

This is one man's opinion. YMMV.

Happy Holidays.

Bob

[srosie]

I park in an alley here in Chicago that after any snow above say 2 or 3 inches becomes quite difficult to traverse. Thus to enter and exit my garage and drive the 100 yards to and from the street requires proper tires. The alleys can sometimes go weeks before they are plowed after a big snow. I can’t tell you how many times I have had to “unstuck” (shovel, push, etc) neighbors cars. Most of these cars are front drivers with all seasons. Even the wife’s allroad slides around a lot more than I like. Suffice it to say, but the 1st and last mile of my journey everyday is the toughest ;-)

Any significant snow (5-6” and higher) makes this drive even harder. Thus the need to get the car up and onto the snow pack is kind of important. This task is complicated because the entrance into the garage is tight and slightly above grade to the alleyway. So either driving forward in or driving backward in (my preferred method) can be quite tricky. I certainly do not want to smash or scrape those purdy fenders. Obviously going out or down is a little easier due to gravity.

I drive the RS6 to work everyday and will continue to do so. I went minus (16” rim) with my 4.2 and a high sidewall snow with excellent results from The Tirerack. The only thing that stopped me were huge drifts in a 2’ snow, and that only stopped me for a few hours. It was the SUV’s and me for about 3 or 4 days!

According to The Tirerack they "stand by their fitment" claims. And clearly these wheels and tires don't quite fit. The overall diameter seems about 1/4" too big. We'll see if "standing by their fitment" actually means replacing this equipment with equipment that fits. In other words, equipment that does not rub the top of the wheel well when driving over road depressions.

[Erik]

All I can say is that there's no feeling like studded tires (or very good friction tires) a powerful engine and quattro when the road conditions are so bad most people are afraid of even walking the streets.

The ESP will help in many cases, especially when accelerating in a turn of if the car becomes upset for some other reason.

But one has to be very careful because the car will stop no better than any other car, regardless of quattro.

http://www.rs6.com/pics/RS6/Scanned/RS6-AMS-Extreme-1.jpg

[srosie]

Studded tires are illegal in Illinois. Chew up the road or so the story goes.

[oregonbob]

Studded tires are legal in Oregon and they absolutely do damage the road. We live with ruts in our highways year round just so a small percentage pf people can drive with the somewhat false security of studs. In most poor weather conditions - but admittedly not all condiitons - a proper winter tire is as good as a studded tire. But, studded tires are very poor in the wet and dry as the studs impede rubber contact the road. Seems like a poor trade off to me.

Then again, I don't live near Erik. :-)

Bob

[srosie]

Wrong size wheel. 18 x 7.5 cause the tire to crown too much after mounting. 18 x 8.5 will keep the tire un-bunched. Will be swaped out on Friday.

Like Oregonbob mentioned I will lose "some" snow performance, but a proper fit is more important.

And I have nothing but good things to say about The Tirerack. They are PROS!

[April03- GO]

Originally posted by JP4
What up wit dat! Sounds like they have the offset wrong. I'm quite surprised Tire Rack messed that one up!

I have the same set of tires as srosie, pirelli 245/45/18, snowsport 240, but on the standard 18" wheel that came with the car with the same "rubbing" problem.
This tells me that its a question of height of profile 45 vs. 40 that creates the problem, rather than offset, at least at my car.
Greetings from Sweden!!

[Headroom42]

I set up Dunlop Winter Sport M3 in 245/35/19. Why 19"? Because of the 380mm braking discs.

The Dunlop ist perfect and brings lots of fun. You can go speedy up to 240km/h and you have a lot of fun in snow. Very good grip

Headroom

[Alex K]

Hi Headroom42,

I also have the Dunlop M3 on my 19" optional OEM wheels, but these are 255/35/19.
I don´t think Dunlop makes a 245/35/19 and even if they did, this would not be legal in Germany as you will not get an ok from Audi.
I tried to get an ok for 255/40/19 as the Dunlops were not available for some time in fall of this year, but Audi denied.
As far as I know, the only two tire sizes possible (better: legal in Germany) on OEM rims are 225/45/18 and 255/35/19.
For aftermarket wheels, this could be different of course.

[Headroom42]

Sorry, my fault. It is 255/40/19 Dunlop M3 and the are on the OEM Rims. It depends more on the TÜV, not Audi.

Headroom

[srosie]

My wheels were swapped out last night, and sure enough no rubbing with the extra inch of width. For all those concerned the 18 x 8.5 (stock) width is the correct wheel size for this winter wheel/tire project.

[Johfra]

I had the "rubbing" problem with the set of wheels from Tire Rack. I contacted them and apologized for their mistake. They didn't realize there was a problem when they recommended the wheels. They are taking them back Monday, and I just opted for the Winter wheels from Audi. They're fine in snow, but somewhat disappointing on dry ground.

We've already had two snow storms, and the car did fine. Tire Rack said they did not have anything that would work on the RS6, and I needed something for my "commuter" car.

[srosie]

They have a few choices, but not many. The tires they sold you with the first package should work just fine. Just have them swapped onto the 18 x 8.5 wheel of your choice. What size tire did you get with the first package?

[Johfra]

Tire Rack configured 255/40VR-18 Pirelli Winter 240 SnowSport with 18x7.5 5-112 et20 cb57 ati s5 rims. This setup definately will not work and Grant at Tire Rack said they had nothing else that they would guarantee to work on the RS6.

When my dealer stacked the SP9000 wheels (stock RS6 tires) next to the Winter set from Tire Rack (4 high and on their side), the Tire Rack set measured over 3.5 inches taller which caused the rubbing, especially when in a turn and you hit a dip in the road.

My dealer then checked the Tire Rack rims and found that the offset was not correct for the RS6. When looking at it on paper from the specs, they should fit fine, but they did not.

[srosie]

My story was similar except the explanation that the narrower wheel would cause the tire to crown at mounting more so than when mounted on a 8.5 inch rim. However, 3.5 inches seems a lot more than what I experienced. Seemed more like a 1/4 inch. Bottom line 18 x 8.5 is the correct wheel size.

[JP4]

Originally posted by srosie
My story was similar except the explanation that the narrower wheel would cause the tire to crown at mounting more so than when mounted on a 8.5 inch rim. However, 3.5 inches seems a lot more than what I experienced. Seemed more like a 1/4 inch. Bottom line 18 x 8.5 is the correct wheel size.

If I'm reading Johfra's post correctly he's talking about 3.5 inches wider with 4 tires stacked up on their sides. You're talking about 1/4 inch taller per tire. See what I mean? :hmm:

[srosie]

I had no fender rubbing. Just at the top of the wheel well over road depressions. Tirerack is happy this debate has been solved, I bet.:error:

[Johfra]

I must say that even though the return of the tires was a little disorganized, I feel that Tire Rack did a great job with their customer service. They acknowledged their mistake and took care of all expenses regarding their mistake.

[JP4]

Originally posted by srosie
I had no fender rubbing. Just at the top of the wheel well over road depressions. Tirerack is happy this debate has been solved, I bet.:error:

You know that's right for sure!

[JP4]

Originally posted by Johfra
I must say that even though the return of the tires was a little disorganized, I feel that Tire Rack did a great job with their customer service. They acknowledged their mistake and took care of all expenses regarding their mistake.

Glad to hear they did good by you too Johfra!