Road Course Racing. Who Does it with their RS6?

[Justin9212]

I bought my RS6 back in December. This Saturday the 12th I will be attending my first track event with the car. I have done many events over the years with my S4, this will be the first with the RS6 though. It's a pretty tame track, Nelson Ledges Ohio. It's a fun day, not competitive. I have Nitto NT05 tires, New Hawk brake pads, and am doing a full tranny service this week with the fluid Tozo recommended. My car has about 80K on it

My questions for thoses or Race often...
What gets hot?
What can I do to keep temps down?
What are the things to keep an eye out for that most may for get to keep an eye on?

Thanks
-Justin

[ZCD2.7T]

I bought my RS6 back in December. This Saturday the 12th I will be attending my first track event with the car. I have done many events over the years with my S4, this will be the first with the RS6 though. It's a pretty tame track, Nelson Ledges Ohio. It's a fun day, not competitive. I have Nitto NT05 tires, New Hawk brake pads, and am doing a full tranny service this week with the fluid Tozo recommended. My car has about 80K on it

My questions for those who Race often...
What gets hot?
What can I do to keep temps down?
What are the things to keep an eye out for that most may for get to keep an eye on?

Thanks
-Justin

I'm going to answer on behalf of a good friend who used to track his RS 6 quite a bit:
- Everything gets hot, and quickly, especially if the weather is warm. Use the paddles to short-shift at about 4500 rpm to try to stay out of "limp" mode which occurs when things get too hot.
- It's a HEAVY car, so watch your brake pads and tires. Understeer is the order of the day with C5 RS 6s, and managing it is the way to better, smoother, quicker lap times. "Slow in, fast out" works best, using the massive grunt to yank you out of corners and make up what you give up in braking early.
- If you don't have stainless steel brake lines and high-temp fluid (Motul 600 or Super Blue or something similar), seriously consider adding those before your track day. Decent pads are only 1 piece of the braking puzzle....
- Enjoy the straights and tolerate the turns!

My buddy eventually ended up giving up on tracking his RS 6 and went with something lighter - a 993TT, lowered and with hybrid turbos.

Have fun - the car will surprise many with its pace, assuming that you don't cook the brakes or end up in limp mode!

[4everRS]

I've only done one track event, but plan on doing them more and more. It was very addictive.

I did not have heat issues besides the brake fluid. The cooling systems worked as they should. Oil got to 250. Most I've seen it. But really, that's expected. For the record, I do run a methanol injection kit, so maybe that helped keep the heat down. The brake issues were due to a dumb choice to run normal brake fluid. A quick change to motul 600 pitside fixed that.

[hahnmgh63]

As 4everRS said, flush your brake Fluid with a high temp fluid, Motul, Castrol and others make some great fluids. It's too late for this event but the group buy just starting on the list for the Phaeton Brake Duct mod is one of the best improvements you can do to the stock Brake system, it really adds a lot of Airflow, and the Group Buy price right now is a steal. I'm not in it as I already purchased them a couple of years ago. You will eat up your Tires & Brakes but the car for a big Heavy Pig is not bad on the track, when you warm up to it you will shock the hell out of a lot of cars which should be faster, at least their drivers will be shocked.

[kismetcapitan]

for race fluid, I recommend Castrol SRF. It costs a lot and you have to flush it every 18 months at the very least, but it's really good stuff. I used it on my Skyline and on every superbike I've owned - bikes in particular get very sensitive to brake fluid temps and even MotoGP bikes will start to get a mushy brake feel - they have remote brake levers to compensate. SRF resists this the longest in my experience.

[ben916]

CLEARLY we almost forgot to tell you to get the GoPro Hero II....

[4everRS]

CLEARLY we almost forgot to tell you to get the GoPro Hero II....

Haha Ben. Mr. Vicarious.

[4everRS]

CLEARLY we almost forgot to tell you to get the GoPro Hero II....

Haha Ben. Mr. Vicarious. I do agree though on the GoPro. Or find someone's to borrow.

[Benman]

- It's a HEAVY car, so watch your brake pads and tires. Understeer is the order of the day with C5 RS 6s, and managing it is the way to better, smoother, quicker lap times. "Slow in, fast out" works best, using the massive grunt to yank you out of corners and make up what you give up in braking early.
from another who has tracked the Beast, I'd say this quoted portion is the KEY. :cheers: Oh, and GoPro! They didn't have those when I use to track, so I had to use lessor quality means...

[Amulet-S6]

12+ track events in the RS6. The ideas below were borrowed from long-term RS6 trackers.

Brakes: Brake fade is probably the biggest issue. Hi-temp fluid and Phaeton brake ducts will resolve this issue. There's a thread above for a group buy on the ducts thru Unit 20. Upgraded pads will improve performance. I'm a Pagid fan, but there are several good companies. Before the phaeton duct idea, several of us had custom 3-piece rotors made to improve the cooling. Let me know if you want that contact.

Tires: Due to the weight anterior to the axel, our front tires take a beating. Chalk the sidewalls to eval tire flexure and adjust psi accordingly. I started out with psi higher than typical and then adjusted +/- as needed after each session. For example, I start my front Pilot sport cups at 45# cold which is quite a bit higher than Michelin recommends.

Tranny: I short shift at ~5200 Never had any issues.

Harnesses: If you track often, then consider harnesses. Anderson Motorsports has some great Schroth harnesses that attach to the OEM attachment points and are clip-in clip-out www.andersonmotorsport.com/ Until then, move your seat waaaay back, pull your seat belt quickly to deploy the arrester, then move your seat forward to snug yourself into the seat. It will take a few tries to get it just right.

Late apexing seems to help on most corners I've encountered.
I like my seat-back upright, so I have to turn the headrests around when wearing a helmet. This may be just me.

**Be warned your face will hurt from grinning! Jim

[hunter]

well jim certainly has more track days in his rs6 than I do but I did just go through the same issue, I bought my beast in february this year and took her out to the track at miller motorsports park for a 2 day nasa event and after scouring this forum in rs246.com below is a list of what I did to prep for my first time at the track:
- RBF 600 brake fluid
- Phaeton brake duct mod
- EBC yellow pads all around
- Hotchkiss anti-sway bars
- checked all fluids and changed as needed.

I'm fortunate to have a euro indie the shop in our area that has worked on my car for the previous owner and also works on 5 other RS6s in our area so they have experience with some of the realities of our particular beast. When I took it into this shop to get some of this work done in preparation I was very pleasantly surprised to have the shop manager tell me he was going to be my nasa instructor the first day at the track. And he was and it was fantastic having someone who both knew the car and new the track especially since I'm certainly no mechanic and I would be certainly taking the car to places I'd never taken a car to before, performance wise, so having the mechanic with me made me feel much more comfortable with some of the potential stresses I was putting on her.

And then the second day my nasa instructor was a certified porsche master mechanic which was fantastic also because that second day he was working with me on maintaining speed through the corners and as I had learned the track now and was able to stay in the proper racingline for much higher percentage of each lap in that second day at about 15 minutes into the 20 minutes track session I did start to see both the coolant temp and the oil temp rising in ways that concerned me and I was glad to have a mechanic next to me. The oil temp pushed passed 250 Half way to the next notch and coolant half way to the notch right of its normal vertical position . The porsche mechanic said it was fine at those points and to be expected and the SOP is to just do a cool down lap which meant we just went about 70 percent and practiced staying in the proper racingline for two laps and watched as the temps came back down and then We hit it again, but the session ended after 1-2 laps . The weather that Sunday was in the low 80s maybe 82-83

As for the brakes which were my chief concern going in, the set up was fantastic. I experienced only one corner on the first day durring my second session that i felt a slight hardness in the brake (pad fade) and imho it was due to the combonation of my getting more comfortable at speed durring the 2nd session while i still didnt know the track and was not hitting the proper racing line and therefore was badly over braking.

I'm taking my beast back to miller motorsports park this weekend the 12th and the 13th for the second nasa event. I can't wait! Now that i feel little bit more comfortable with how I have the car setup and having a little bit experience and having been signed off to HPDE 2 this weekend I'll get the camera setup and take some video this time.

[Amulet-S6]

Max, chime in here, you're a frequent tracker

[hahnmgh63]

Keep in mine Hunter is in Salt Lake city and Miller Motorsports Park is located at 4400' elevation so with the thinner air it isn't going to cool the Oil, Coolant, or Brakes as well as closer to Sealevel, it really does make a difference.

[Justin9212]

We are just about at sea level here, maybe 600ft above at most.

[MaxRS6]

Good advice on all the above...

I would add create yourself a checklist to utilize between sessions. The time between sessions will fly by and it is easy to overlook something that might bite. A simple checklist provides a calm orderly process to check out the car (i.e. the brake pads, tires, fluid levels, temps, tire pressure, torque lug bolts etc). Be sure to keep a close eye on the inside tire for cording. If you have Vag-Com, check the ATF temp periodically. Might consider a spray bottle to wet down the intercoolers with ice water between sessions. I'm not on the Meth at the moment so I utilize the po man spray bottle currently. ;0

Take a spare set of front and rear brake pads. You don't want a simple thing like brake pads to end the day early. If possible, invest in track wheels and tires. If you gonna do it routinely, keep a set of "track" rotors to swap out for track events.


It is certainly a front loaded heavy hog. However; when you get a little brake trail braking action busting out the back end a bit, and blast out of a perfectly hit Apex, ...well....IT IS TOO MUCH FUN. Be ready for the unsuspecting to pounce on you between sessions with the "WTF is in that thang??".

Keep it safe and have a great time! I look forward to hearing about your experience.

[Justin9212]

I do road course often with the S4, not now that I sold it, but I am aware of road course routine. I am not new to the game, just the car. I was really just looking for how long it takes the Oil Temp, Trans Temp, and Coolant Temp to get to an unsafe level. Not in theory, but from actual experience. I have the tires, brakes, and fluids to handle the track.

[MaxRS6]

I do road course often with the S4, not now that I sold it, but I am aware of road course routine. I am not new to the game, just the car. I was really just looking for how long it takes the Oil Temp, Trans Temp, and Coolant Temp to get to an unsafe level. Not in theory, but from actual experience. I have the tires, brakes, and fluids to handle the track.

I didn't mean to offend as I was just throwng out a few general comments. Woo hoo- Sounds like you are set for some fun. I've not had any issues even with 3 full days as far as overheating. The only time I've had issues with temps is when I've developed leaks (radiator pin hole, a coolant hose, etc). Thus; a good ol pressure test wouldn't hurt to check for leaks. I have seen the brake light a few times due to wearing the pads down too thin (driver error). However; with good pads and fluid- you should have plenty of stopping power. However; I'm no expert and the better drivers (far more than not) than me are much less heavy on the equipment. As you know, a lot of it depends on how you pilot the car around. Good luck and get some good vids for us..00

[Justin9212]

I didn't mean to offend as I was just throwng out a few general comments. Woo hoo- Sounds like you are set for some fun. I've not had any issues even with 3 full days as far as overheating. The only time I've had issues with temps is when I've developed leaks (radiator pin hole, a coolant hose, etc). Thus; a good ol pressure test wouldn't hurt to check for leaks. I have seen the brake light a few times due to wearing the pads down too thin (driver error). However; with good pads and fluid- you should have plenty of stopping power. However; I'm no expert and the better drivers (far more than not) than me are much less heavy on the equipment. As you know, a lot of it depends on how you pilot the car around. Good luck and get some good vids for us..00


No offense taken. I know the internet often does not convey emotion well. I was not offended, just trying to get this back on topic as to my original question.

[hunter]

I don't know what your experience was like with your s4 but I was pleasantly surprised that I didn't burn any oil. I checked before leaving the track for the drive home each day expecting to need to add some oil, but even after 8 track sessions over 2 days she was good to go. I was pretty impressed with that from a high HP turbo engine that had the oil temps pushed more than I had ever done to a car before.

Having said that, I am however following the recommendation of some of the more experienced guys that run the nasa event and am changing the oil following each track weekend. That sounds to me like relatively cheap preventative measure.

[Benman]

Having said that, I am however following the recommendation of some of the more experienced guys that run the nasa event and am changing the oil following each track weekend. That sounds to me like relatively cheap preventative measure. Sounds pretty reasonable to me! :cheers:

[kismetcapitan]

I do road course often with the S4, not now that I sold it, but I am aware of road course routine. I am not new to the game, just the car. I was really just looking for how long it takes the Oil Temp, Trans Temp, and Coolant Temp to get to an unsafe level. Not in theory, but from actual experience. I have the tires, brakes, and fluids to handle the track.

it's not so clean to do on an Audi as I did with my Skyline - have 13 gauges littered around the dash. But knowing exact oil temp, water temp, and transmission temp would be very, very useful.

[Justin9212]

All went well today, other than finding out my suspension is beat. The car did very well heat wise too, better than I expected. 20min sessions and temps never got too hot. I'll be starting a new thread soon about this suspension though.

[hunter]

Glad it went well Justin ! I found the Hotchkiss anti-sway bars made a huge difference in the handling and would definitely recommend them i think you were probably refering to your DRC but thought id just mention the sway bars cause not only do they flatten out the corners with the stiffer setting this heavy beast will actually oversteer nicely if you brake early and dont shed too much speed and have the resolve to point her into the corner with enough speed. Just remember to be ready to apply a dab of throttle when you feel the tail starr to come around .

I'm back out today for the 2nd day of my weekend at MMP we are running the West track this weekend last month was the EAST track but i cant wait for July when its the full track, man that will be a lot of corners each lap. My brain will be tired!

Tidbits from yesterday. I was curious so i cleared out the onboard liar computer and it said i got 6 mpg all day and over 4 20 min sessions i clocked 92 mi

[Justin9212]

Tidbits from yesterday. I was curious so i cleared out the onboard liar computer and it said i got 6 mpg all day and over 4 20 min sessions i clocked 92 mi
I had done the same and came up with the same results, also noticed that with the instant MPG screen 6mpg was the lowest I saw. I clocked 97mi on track.

[SAFE4NOW]

In late but see below:

What gets hot? Brakes and Heat Soak
What can I do to keep temps down? Brake Duct Upgrade, SS Brake Lines, Hawk Pads, Motul 660 Fluid. Sportec splash shield mod drops temps 40 degrees for me.
What are the things to keep an eye out for that most may for get to keep an eye on?

I'd add a REAR sway bar and keep the front stock.. but I has Stasis coil overs. Add Michlen PS Cups and never look back...

I was a fast in fast out kinda guy AND would go through front brakes in a weekend , but you do have to pay to play, right?

S

[stubro]

I have to agree with the comments. I did Chinn Motorsport this weekend going into the weekend I knew the brakes were not 100% but my mechanics and I thought we would be ok. In my fourth session when I was really getting great lap times I noticed that the brake pedal starting to get softer. Of course I mentioned that to the instructor and he kept having me push. As I was about to pass a 911 in turn 16, slow driver, the pedal went very soft and the brake pad warning light came on. Lets just say the sensor doesn't give you much warning the pads were essentially gone. I was able to put enough fluid to bleed the brakes and get home. The rotors were shot anyway so any more damage was no big deal. New tires Michelin Super Sport, new KW3s, not new brakes (fail). The car is hard on brake on the track. I will be upgrading the pads, fluid etc. Sucks I missed the duct buy.

I used Harry laptimer for lap timing but didn't get all the laps. , I will upload GoPro video later. I had a blast and will do it again but i have to say got a ride in my friends 2011 GT3 and that was an experience.

[kismetcapitan]

did you have ESP on or off? ESP does put a lot of extra stress on the brakes.

I know I've said it before, but there is simply no brake fluid as good as Castrol SRF. If it's good enough for Formula 1, it surely will get you through a trackday!

[4everRS]

did you have ESP on or off? ESP does put a lot of extra stress on the brakes.

I know I've said it before, but there is simply no brake fluid as good as Castrol SRF. If it's good enough for Formula 1, it surely will get you through a trackday!

I like to keep the traction control off, however, instructors have told me that if it's on and is engaging, I'm doing something wrong. That I need to get smoother. Slower is faster, ect ect.

As far as brake fluid, kistme is right the SRF is superior brake fluid. It's just so damn expensive. I've had great luck with RBF600. I know Mad Max has used Pro Speed RS683 with good results too.

[stubro]

I had ESP on. I wasn't sure which way to go but I agree that if I drove smoothly it shouldn't matter but next time I will try off. I dropped the car off today to get the brakes done. I am going to do OEM rotors and Hawk HPS pads.

[lswing]

Running the OEM rotors and HPS pads, works good, mild around the city, not much dust, decent bite out on the back road corners. Not sure if you might want more for a track pad though, but they work good, and get better when heated up which is nice! I think the hps+ can squeal some, and have more dust, but more bite for track...

[BLUPSTU]

I've been tracking my beast as well - but still fairly new at it. I've done 8 events and some of those I needed to tow the car home. OUCH! I wish I would have been told about the brake fluid, I boiled mine and barely made it off the track in one piece.....talk about an eye opener. I now run the MOTUL600 and no issues. This is what my Audi club in the NorthWest recommends.

I haven't had any other issues with heating things up. (Knock on wood). The temps go up but cool down nicely with a simple cool down lap.

I do seem to burn through the rotors and brake pads though. I hear there isn't anything better out there than stock rotors. I'm also trying the stoptech brake pads now. I just got them installed so I can let you know how well they work after my next event in July.

I am interested in the brake mod though to cool down the brakes even more.
Also does anyone run the schroth 4point harness with the stock seats?
I was told that our RS6 seats weren't tested and we shouldn't install the Quick fit or quick fit pro. Any recommendations or experience?

Sorry for switching topics a bit.

Thanks

[Amulet-S6]

Blupstu,

There have been a few threads referring to rotors in the past month. Here's are a couple:
www.rs6.com/showthread.php/24469-OEM-rotor-replacements?p=235654&highlight=#post235654
www.rs6.com/showthread.php/24393-Track-Pad-recommendation-for-C5-RS6?p=234807&highlight=#post234807

Strongly recommend the Pheaton backing plate upgrade if you're tracking.

If you want to a larger diameter rotor with our stock caliper, look over this thread from Grizz/Unit20: www.rs6.com/showthread.php/17213-390-x-36-mm-Rotors-what-is-the-requirements/page2
*requires 19" rim minimum

If you want a totally different brake system, ask MaxRS6 (frequent tracker) what he's using. I think it's Stoptech?

There are also several recent threads on track pad and track tire suggestions.

I've used the Schroth "quick connect" harnesses in my S6 Avant and RS6 and really like the system. Bought them through Anderson Motorsports (an Audi shop in MN and big track enthusiasts) They utilize the same anchor points as the factory seat belts. I like that when not needed, the harness connections tuck neatly out of sight. I'm not an engineer, so can't speak to the soundness of our seats. My anecdotal explanation is that since the harnesses synch you into place so firmly, they assist with the strain of my shifting weight and therefore reduce the stress on the seats. Does that sound reasonable? I'm open to hearing/hearing other ideas. Track instructors have mentioned that, in a roll-over, this lack of mobility could increase the chance of head/neck injury; you'll have to weigh the risk-reward here.

Keep Flossing, dr jim

[kismetcapitan]

I think I'm doing the Sportec mod this summer. DIY with a few bucks in parts from Home Depot? Yes! I just worry slightly about hitting things - my car is very low, and I have a traumatic experience from my Skyline (which had an extended oil sump which hung very low) hitting a bump and the oil sump plug coming loose.

I sort of agree about the ESP thing - if you're tripping it, yes, smoother is better, but it depends on how aggressive the ESP is, and it intervenes quite early.

[lswing]

Might give the track a shot with just the upgraded fluid Motul600 and my Hawk HPS pads. I know upgrades would help, but how much? Braided lines? Better pads? Phaeton mod? Which would help the most and how much, as in feels a bit better or keeps your brakes from completely going out.

[ben916]

I've been tracking my beast as well - but still fairly new at it. I've done 8 events and some of those I needed to tow the car home. OUCH! I wish I would have been told about the brake fluid, I boiled mine and barely made it off the track in one piece.....talk about an eye opener. I now run the MOTUL600 and no issues. This is what my Audi club in the NorthWest recommends.

I haven't had any other issues with heating things up. (Knock on wood). The temps go up but cool down nicely with a simple cool down lap.

I do seem to burn through the rotors and brake pads though. I hear there isn't anything better out there than stock rotors. I'm also trying the stoptech brake pads now. I just got them installed so I can let you know how well they work after my next event in July.

I am interested in the brake mod though to cool down the brakes even more.
Also does anyone run the schroth 4point harness with the stock seats?
I was told that our RS6 seats weren't tested and we shouldn't install the Quick fit or quick fit pro. Any recommendations or experience?

Sorry for switching topics a bit.

Thanks

er, have you introduced yourself? To the Seattle peeps? (not trying to be a jerk).
I did the Phaeton brake backing plate, OEM frozen rotors and EBC Reds (not a fan, Hawks are in the future)


Might give the track a shot with just the upgraded fluid Motul600 and my Hawk HPS pads. I know upgrades would help, but how much? Braided lines? Better pads? Phaeton mod? Which would help the most and how much, as in feels a bit better or keeps your brakes from completely going out.

I went to two different indy shops (to be nameless) inquiring about the Motul600 and both stated that I wouldn't need it. I stated that there might be a chance of some tracking, they didn't seem fazed.

It seems the consensus is that if you choose to track her:
1. Motul600 brake fluid - keep the fluid from boiling.
2. Phaeton backing plates - keeps the rotor somewhat cooler
3. Braided Lines - firmer pedal (a forum member had the front left OEM line nearly worn thru and the warranty company refused to replace it - "so you would rather that I crash with no brakes than replace the line?!?!?" - no reply returned...)
4. Expect to burn thru a set of front rotors and front pads and possibly tires.

MaxRS6 needs a blog of his track events along with videos...:hahahehe:

[jimmy94507]

All,
Cheapest handling improvement you can make for the RS6 is Hotchkis H-Sport sway basr.

The stock RS6 rotor is a heat sink? Too heavy and very small cooling vanes and the internally mounted rotor hat blocks cooling air from entering the rotor. Compare to an R8 rotor (same brake caliper as RS6) and you'll see what I mean. We had our own 2-piece rotors fabricated by Coleman racing. RS4 rotor went to 2-piece made by Brembo.

Search the forum for JP4 or jimmy94507 posts. Lots of info on our rotor and post about Phaeton backing plate Mod.
Check the following out for swap in replacement rotor (rotor ring looks like what Coleman provided us and hat looks similar). Link may have changed since last year? I do not know of anyone who has used this rotor. :

JHMotorsports Brake rotors?? Ask them if Coleman makes their rotor ring. Please let me know.
http://jhmotorsports.com/shop/catalog/s4-rs4-c-21_56.html?osCsid=b9b4f1d0e24334edc6afed668afbdcec
Follow link to the B7 RS4.
Diameter and thickness is same as RS6. Don't know about bolt pattern of hat/rotor ring??

Brake Fluid - Motul RBF600, both JP4 and myself (each of us over 40 DE's, including 3 days at Daytona in 2008)
Pagid RS-14 (black) or RS-15 (Grey, most agressive pad), We recommend RS-29 in the rear.

Schroth harness - Started using them on my 2000 A6, 4.2 and very definitely on RS6. JP and I recommend them for anyone tracking RS6. My wife has been using them on her various TT's, now 2008 Dayton Gray TT Coupe.
Contact Jeremy Williams at Matrix Integrated in Portland Oregon (http://www.matrixintegrated.cc/) for info and good all around technical support. Tell him Jimmy & Chris Stoner sent you.

MTM Transmission cooler - I think I am the only RS6 in the US with this cooler installed. Quite effective.
e-mail me if you want more info and pictures of our clean install: jimmys@cableone.net
(Sourcing from MTM turned out to be a big challenge!!!)

Ben916 - Do you have contact info for Headshot and could you send him my e-mail (jimmys@cableone.net)? I would like to know the measurements for cutting the access opening to adjust the KW rear shocks (if he kept his notes.)
Does anyone else have the dimensions for this mod? Thanks,

Miller Motorsports Park - We helped with the first Audi DE held at the track in 2006 (?). We had the benefit of the full track (smile, and no one of had ever been there before, except for Neil McGary. A real challenge for us Instructors!). A great experience for all! For our 2nd trip to MMP the students were split into 2 hour sessions on the West & East tracks, then alternated. Worked very well and then the full track the 2nd day for everyone. Great fun!

All you track fanatics from the Southwest, especially S. CA, UT & NV, need to put Spring Mountain Motorsport Ranch, Pahrump, NV on your calendar for April, 2013. (Go to their website and check out the fantastic facility this has become!). So Cal. Chapter of Audi Club hosts a fantastic event there each spring.

Hope some of this info helps. Feel free to contact me.
Regards, Jimmy S.


er, have you introduced yourself? To the Seattle peeps? (not trying to be a jerk).
I did the Phaeton brake backing plate, OEM frozen rotors and EBC Reds (not a fan, Hawks are in the future)



I went to two different indy shops (to be nameless) inquiring about the Motul600 and both stated that I wouldn't need it. I stated that there might be a chance of some tracking, they didn't seem fazed.

It seems the consensus is that if you choose to track her:
1. Motul600 brake fluid - keep the fluid from boiling.
2. Phaeton backing plates - keeps the rotor somewhat cooler
3. Braided Lines - firmer pedal (a forum member had the front left OEM line nearly worn thru and the warranty company refused to replace it - "so you would rather that I crash with no brakes than replace the line?!?!?" - no reply returned...)
4. Expect to burn thru a set of front rotors and front pads and possibly tires.

MaxRS6 needs a blog of his track events along with videos...:hahahehe:

[jimmy94507]

I checked on the front rotors from JHM. They show 2-piece direct replacement here:
http://jhmotorsports.com/shop/catalog/brakes-c-21_66_68_227_253.html?osCsid=b9b4f1d0e24334edc6afe d668afbdcec

Scroll down a little over half way - LWR-FC5RS6 , reduced price of $725 for the front pair.

Or, try this full link to the rotor description page:
http://jhmotorsports.com/shop/catalog/front-rotorspair-jhm-piece-lightweight-for-c5-rs6-p-485.html?osCsid=b9b4f1d0e24334edc6afed668afbdcec
Very reasonable price.





All,
Cheapest handling improvement you can make for the RS6 is Hotchkis H-Sport sway basr.

The stock RS6 rotor is a heat sink? Too heavy and very small cooling vanes and the internally mounted rotor hat blocks cooling air from entering the rotor. Compare to an R8 rotor (same brake caliper as RS6) and you'll see what I mean. We had our own 2-piece rotors fabricated by Coleman racing. RS4 rotor went to 2-piece made by Brembo.

Search the forum for JP4 or jimmy94507 posts. Lots of info on our rotor and post about Phaeton backing plate Mod.
Check the following out for swap in replacement rotor (rotor ring looks like what Coleman provided us and hat looks similar). Link may have changed since last year? I do not know of anyone who has used this rotor. :

JHMotorsports Brake rotors?? Ask them if Coleman makes their rotor ring. Please let me know.
http://jhmotorsports.com/shop/catalog/s4-rs4-c-21_56.html?osCsid=b9b4f1d0e24334edc6afed668afbdcec
Follow link to the B7 RS4.
Diameter and thickness is same as RS6. Don't know about bolt pattern of hat/rotor ring??

Brake Fluid - Motul RBF600, both JP4 and myself (each of us over 40 DE's, including 3 days at Daytona in 2008)
Pagid RS-14 (black) or RS-15 (Grey, most agressive pad), We recommend RS-29 in the rear.

Schroth harness - Started using them on my 2000 A6, 4.2 and very definitely on RS6. JP and I recommend them for anyone tracking RS6. My wife has been using them on her various TT's, now 2008 Dayton Gray TT Coupe.
Contact Jeremy Williams at Matrix Integrated in Portland Oregon (http://www.matrixintegrated.cc/) for info and good all around technical support. Tell him Jimmy & Chris Stoner sent you.

MTM Transmission cooler - I think I am the only RS6 in the US with this cooler installed. Quite effective.
e-mail me if you want more info and pictures of our clean install: jimmys@cableone.net
(Sourcing from MTM turned out to be a big challenge!!!)

Ben916 - Do you have contact info for Headshot and could you send him my e-mail (jimmys@cableone.net)? I would like to know the measurements for cutting the access opening to adjust the KW rear shocks (if he kept his notes.)
Does anyone else have the dimensions for this mod? Thanks,

Miller Motorsports Park - We helped with the first Audi DE held at the track in 2006 (?). We had the benefit of the full track (smile, and no one of had ever been there before, except for Neil McGary. A real challenge for us Instructors!). A great experience for all! For our 2nd trip to MMP the students were split into 2 hour sessions on the West & East tracks, then alternated. Worked very well and then the full track the 2nd day for everyone. Great fun!

All you track fanatics from the Southwest, especially S. CA, UT & NV, need to put Spring Mountain Motorsport Ranch, Pahrump, NV on your calendar for April, 2013. (Go to their website and check out the fantastic facility this has become!). So Cal. Chapter of Audi Club hosts a fantastic event there each spring.

Hope some of this info helps. Feel free to contact me.
Regards, Jimmy S.

[HT MOtorsport]

Hi All,

I figured I would share a little inspiration for those headed to the track.

2 videos below were shot at NMP with NEQ last month. The first is my RS6 'Judas' on its first test outing on 275 R888's with Hawk DTC70 pads on stock rotors, Pheaton ducts and Hotchkiss sway bars. UNfortunately I had a motor problem with oil pushing past the LS1 rear main seal.

The second video is me driving a new friends MTM RS6 on the other track. Lots of fun all round :) MTM was on street tires, stock suspension and brakes with DTC70's. First few laps were ESP on, last few were ESP off.

1) 'Judas' LS1 RS6 at NJMP Thunderbolt

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwJXT_FLqvI

2) MTM RS6 at NJMP Lightening

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etDvDlv0mIU

Overall both cars felt surprisingly good for such a heavy pig.

[jimmy94507]

Hi,
What size wheels and offset were you using to mount the 275's and have sufficient clearance?

Thanks, Jimmy


Hi All,

I figured I would share a little inspiration for those headed to the track.

2 videos below were shot at NMP with NEQ last month. The first is my RS6 'Judas' on its first test outing on 275 R888's with Hawk DTC70 pads on stock rotors, Pheaton ducts and Hotchkiss sway bars. UNfortunately I had a motor problem with oil pushing past the LS1 rear main seal.

The second video is me driving a new friends MTM RS6 on the other track. Lots of fun all round :) MTM was on street tires, stock suspension and brakes with DTC70's. First few laps were ESP on, last few were ESP off.

1) 'Judas' LS1 RS6 at NJMP Thunderbolt

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwJXT_FLqvI

2) MTM RS6 at NJMP Lightening

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etDvDlv0mIU

Overall both cars felt surprisingly good for such a heavy pig.

[HT MOtorsport]

Hi,
What size wheels and offset were you using to mount the 275's and have sufficient clearance?

Thanks, Jimmy

Hey Jimmy,

Wheels are TSW Nurburgring rotary forged 18x9.5 ET40 with a 10mm ECS spacer. The R888's are 275/45/18 and they run wide as they are a dot-R tire and to be honest they are a bit big for the car. They dont rub with the car at stock ride height but they would if it was lowered a lot. Next time I will likekly drop to a 265/40/18, but I will enjoy wearing these out first.

H

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-VoLfG5pE9ho/T-OE2V4JzcI/AAAAAAAAUcw/Rzvf6qoxCFQ/s912/IMG_00169.jpg

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-H3XcxTWI9b0/T_Jb5bxn24I/AAAAAAAAUlU/WMGGFalu-Yo/s912/IMG_0005.JPG

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-xSnQ1Tjmnp0/T_Jb6J3lyvI/AAAAAAAAUlc/Rwd0vLuIaAc/s912/IMG_0006.JPG

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-q3Rrt6i9Uq0/T9PfURMslnI/AAAAAAAAUTo/pODkZIZR8m0/s912/IMG_00117.jpg

[Bigglezworth]

Overall both cars felt surprisingly good for such a heavy pig.I hesitate to guess you weren't really pushing either car to their full limit. Impossible to tell from the video I know, but for your friends MTM tuned ride, I find it difficult to believe an S5 would go by an RS6 running full out on a straight away, much less with that much speed.

Other than that, I see the brakes held up fine. What were your max speeds on the straigh sections prior to threshold braking into the corner? Our track here prior to closing down had a 1/2 mile front straight which would enable a nicely tuned RS6 to hit 250-260km/h prior to threshold braking to taking corner #1 at 120-130 (tight corners). I found the brakes took a shit kicking after a half dozen hot laps from those speeds and even though I was using DOT4 boiled them on one occassion. Never boiled them again after draining and filling with DOT5.

[HT MOtorsport]

I hesitate to guess you weren't really pushing either car to their full limit. Impossible to tell from the video I know, but for your friends MTM tuned ride, I find it difficult to believe an S5 would go by an RS6 running full out on a straight away, much less with that much speed.

Other than that, I see the brakes held up fine. What were your max speeds on the straigh sections prior to threshold braking into the corner? Our track here prior to closing down had a 1/2 mile front straight which would enable a nicely tuned RS6 to hit 250-260km/h prior to threshold braking to taking corner #1 at 120-130 (tight corners). I found the brakes took a shit kicking after a half dozen hot laps from those speeds and even though I was using DOT4 boiled them on one occassion. Never boiled them again after draining and filling with DOT5.

You are correct, neither car is a race car so I was treating them both with some respect. This was also an Audi club HPDE and I was instructing so despite running in the instructor group I was being generous with point by's.

My car was being tested and as such I was just feeling it out for grip and braking levels. Unfortunately about 8 laps in I could smell oil and came in to find a waterfall of oil coming out of the bellhousing so that was it for my car.

The MTM had some mechanical issues with boiled brake fluid so I jumped in and helped the owner resolve the problem, and he very generously allowed me to take it out with him as a passenger in the last instructor session of the even. Clearly I did not want to damage his car, although I did wind it up pretty hard to see how it behaved compared to mine, as well as to give the owner who was a student a bit more understanding of what the car was capable of. We did manage to get some pretty good slip angles in a few of the 'safer' corners.

As for speeds on the straights, the 2 videos are on two separate tracks at the same facility in New Jersey http://www.njmp.com/facility/track-maps.html. Both straights have about the same terminal velocity and I was seeing between 135 and 140mph in both cars. I was braking super early i.e. about the 500' mark, so about 100' before the first braking board. These cars are heavy and take a lot of slowing down so I decided to play it safe and not kill the rotors too badly.

The S5 passing I gave a point by and a big lift.

H

[ben916]

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-VoLfG5pE9ho/T-OE2V4JzcI/AAAAAAAAUcw/Rzvf6qoxCFQ/s912/IMG_00169.jpg



Jaque de Threadage....

The RED halos?
Is that the mod from 8520 on Audizine?

Please do shead some "light" on this mod...

[kevin]

what are your opinions on using 255/40ZR18 Hoosier R6's on stock wheels for track events?

[JP4]

Good advice on all the above...

I would add create yourself a checklist to utilize between sessions. The time between sessions will fly by and it is easy to overlook something that might bite. A simple checklist provides a calm orderly process to check out the car (i.e. the brake pads, tires, fluid levels, temps, tire pressure, torque lug bolts etc). Be sure to keep a close eye on the inside tire for cording. If you have Vag-Com, check the ATF temp periodically. Might consider a spray bottle to wet down the intercoolers with ice water between sessions. I'm not on the Meth at the moment so I utilize the po man spray bottle currently. ;0

Take a spare set of front and rear brake pads. You don't want a simple thing like brake pads to end the day early. If possible, invest in track wheels and tires. If you gonna do it routinely, keep a set of "track" rotors to swap out for track events.


It is certainly a front loaded heavy hog. However; when you get a little brake trail braking action busting out the back end a bit, and blast out of a perfectly hit Apex, ...well....IT IS TOO MUCH FUN. Be ready for the unsuspecting to pounce on you between sessions with the "WTF is in that thang??".

Keep it safe and have a great time! I look forward to hearing about your experience.

:race: Hey MaxRS6.... I think I recognize the occupants of that car in you picture!! :applause:

[Amulet-S6]

JP4, Haven't seen you post in a while. Hope all is well in St L . Doing any track events?

[JP4]

JP4, Haven't seen you post in a while. Hope all is well in St L . Doing any track events?

Heading to Mid-O on Thursday, :incar::revs::race::applause:

[JP4]

what are your opinions on using 255/40ZR18 Hoosier R6's on stock wheels for track events?

The Hoosiers are not designed for such a heavy car. The load rating is worse than most track tires of that size. I would not recommend it.

[MaxRS6]

:race: Hey MaxRS6.... I think I recognize the occupants of that car in you picture!! :applause:

That pic remains hanging on my office wall. It was my great honor to have you as my first instructor. You gave me a lot of great habits that carry on, and I believe have helped me over the past years have a lot of fun in a safe manner. Not to mention the numerous phone calls that go something like "Hello John- How u doin- What do you think of this (tires, brakes, lines, braking methods, etc, etc)?"...Then John responds something like "Max- Are you out of your mind??- Remember- you won't be setting any track records- LOL "

Daytona was 3 days of too much fun, and as I heard someone say "The most fun you can have with your clothes on!"- LOL

Have fun at Mid-Ohio and I wish I was there with you..;(

[MaxRS6]

The Hoosiers are not designed for such a heavy car. The load rating is worse than most track tires of that size. I would not recommend it.

Agreed- This was one of my calls with my mentor (JP4). I tried the Hoosiers at Barber and went through a set over two days. They did work but they were gone veddy quickly.

I'm a convert to the Michelin Sport Cups for track use. I used them for 3 days at TWS and they wore much better for this kid. Amulet hooked me up with another set he had in storage. Thanks again Jim! I'm stocked up for the next opportunity...;0

[RS8]

Hi
I'm building a racing car of an manual 6 speed S8-97 with Rs6 engine that has upgraded turbo's and MTM ecu.

I wondering what type of engine oil is the best for RS6 ?

I always used Castrol RS 10w-60 in other cars but is that too thick for RS6 engine ?

[RS8]

I have spoken to Castrol now and they say that a thick oil will generate more heat so they recommend a thin oil like 0w-30 or 5w-30
So i think i will go for Castrol EDGE FST 5w-30

But i want to hear first from you guys which oil you recommend for racing.

[RS8]

Is anyone using Carbotech XP10 / XP8
or Performance friction brake pads ?