Car handling

[micdee]

Ok well I do not know how to describe my problem or feeling and therefore I can not search the forum about this.

the situation:

I ordered the adjustable upper control arms and lower control arms and a new set of the ARB links from 034 motorsport, because I noticed that the bushings of the upper control were very worn out.
I also had a new set of Goodyear F1 asymmetric 275/30 19 in the garage as the current conti's were almost worn to the minimum.
During MOT they found the rear right tire had a serious crack all around so I had to replace the tires sooner as expected, but almost immediate after this I got a problem with the thermostat.

All this happened about 4 weeks ago and I all that time I did not drive the car.
After I picked it up and have driven it for a while it felt to me that there was some sort of delay for the rear to react when I did some short zigzag turn on the highway.
later-on when I went into a long left curve, with a speed which is above the advised speed, but which was no problem with das Phantom before. This time it also felt like the rear of the beast came in the turn later.
After this kind of freaky situation, I checked the tire pressure and they were 2.4 and 2.5 bar. I set the pressure to 2.7 bar all around and drove the bent again it was a little better, but still not as I would expect a beast to take that turn.

Now I am wondering, what could cause this behavior:
- Is it because I have not driven das Phantom for 4 weeks that I am not accustomed to this behavior and have to get the feeling back (I really cant remember the car felt this way before in the same long left turn, although it is a tricky corner with a bump somewhere in the middle)
- Is it the combination of the new control arms kit with new/fresh bushings on the front, but old/worn suspension on the rear
- is this normal behavior for the GY F1 AS tire?

All your thoughts can be helpful and if there is a thread about similar behavior, please show me the link.

[lswing]

My input won't help too much, but my car has always handled that way I feel. The big weakness being on a big arcing turn with a bump in the middle; the car is already up on the nose it feels, and the bump bounces me off like a springboard. Rebuilt DRC could be my issue. On another note, twisty left/right corners that are not big long turns, the car really settles nice on them, very surprised at how well it pulls through the back country twisties. It's those big freeway on and off ramps that get me...

[speedtrapped]

Hotkis sways, and apikol rear diff mount. Car has notorious understeer, should help tighten front and rear

[4everRS]

If you have the stock DRC system, you may want to check the shocks for signs of leakage. You may soon be in the market for coilovers.

[ben916]

yep, failed DRC or shortly on it's way to be target practice fodder

[micdee]

Ah sorry guys,

I thought I had my signature here aswell, but after a couple of weeks of possessing das Phantom, I already had to decide repair or replace and I replaced the DCR with KW 3v's with the standard settings.

Just to learn more:

I thought understeer is when the car will slide over its front wheels, but ofcourse this has to start somewhere..
I know the RS6 is a understeered car mainly due to its heavy nose, like my R32 I drove before this car.
But in my R32 I never had the feeling the rear reacted later then the front when I went into a turn. The understeer just appeared. When I went in a turn with a good speed and then accelerating the car went in well, without any (tiny) delayed reaction of the rear. When I accelerated "over" the grip of the tires, you could feel it coming and after that the front just would go straight ahead.

In this case the RS6 went through the bent OK, but when going into the turn it felt the rear had to settle a little later then the front. Now I think I maybe should call it the roll of the car.
The first time I did experienced it was on a straight highway when doing some S curves, I felt some motion sickness coming up. The "high" speed turn was later that day, but a little more scary.
Could it be a situation the new (stiffer) bushes of the the front control arms, versus the old/worn bushes in the rear?

[Fraba]

Could be way off here, but if you're running a new set of tires and control arms...your turn-in may be radically improved, giving the feeling that the rear end of the car is a bit delayed in coming around.

[ben916]

Ah sorry guys,

I thought I had my signature here aswell, but after a couple of weeks of possessing das Phantom, I already had to decide repair or replace and I replaced the DCR with KW 3v's with the standard settings.

Just to learn more:

I thought understeer is when the car will slide over its front wheels, but ofcourse this has to start somewhere..
I know the RS6 is a understeered car mainly due to its heavy nose, like my R32 I drove before this car.
But in my R32 I never had the feeling the rear reacted later then the front when I went into a turn. The understeer just appeared. When I went in a turn with a good speed and then accelerating the car went in well, without any (tiny) delayed reaction of the rear. When I accelerated "over" the grip of the tires, you could feel it coming and after that the front just would go straight ahead.

In this case the RS6 went through the bent OK, but when going into the turn it felt the rear had to settle a little later then the front. Now I think I maybe should call it the roll of the car.
The first time I did experienced it was on a straight highway when doing some S curves, I felt some motion sickness coming up. The "high" speed turn was later that day, but a little more scary.
Could it be a situation the new (stiffer) bushes of the the front control arms, versus the old/worn bushes in the rear?

I found your problem:
Das Phantom: RS6, + optic package, Sportec exhaust, KW 3v, Formel brake pads, 034 front adj kit, no speed limit, GoodYear F1 As.
If I read that correctly, you are "getting jiggy with it" in all season tires?!?!?

Also as Fraba allluded to; why did you only change the front control arms and not all of them?

Can someone confirm that an alignment is necessary after changing suspension components?
Control Arms?
Sways?
Bushing?

[JSRS6]

Not all season, asymetrical.

[MaxRS6]

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSunwtdXYlNozQIJfIXqMp-LYGkKiqIIvoJZmDpo99AhyD0k1H1EjlWaSd-

[JSRS6]

They had one of those in Jackass 2, looked painful.

[ben916]

Not all season, asymmetrical.

These?
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Goodyear&tireModel=Eagle+F1+Asymmetric

Or These?
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Goodyear&tireModel=Eagle+F1+A%2FS-C

I WAS thinking these for some reason:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=Pilot+Sport+A%2FS+Plus
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/BigPic.jsp?sidewall=Blackwall&tireMake=Goodyear&tireModel=Eagle+F1+Asymmetric

[JSRS6]

I think the first ones.

[JSRS6]

Especially since the second one is only available in one size.

[JSRS6]

He needs sum them SS'

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=Pilot+Super+Sport

[ben916]

He needs sum them SS'

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=Pilot+Super+Sport

Yeah. PSS is my next set...

[micdee]

@Ben : these are the tires I use at the moment

http://i1229.photobucket.com/albums/ee478/the_micdee/RS6/Eagle_F1.png

http://i1229.photobucket.com/albums/ee478/the_micdee/RS6/tire_tread.png

So I should say yes the first option you showed.

Why only front control arms? well the bushings of the uppers were gone and therefore I needed to replace those and then saw the set at 034 and decided to replace the complete front control arms. (not knowing this would influence the behavior of the car that much)

But since I increased the tire pressure the handling seems to be better, so I guess the tires are also an issue in this matter.
Is it known that the GY F1's have a relativ softer side compared to a conti (sportcontact 3 - I think it was)