Need Help With Claim Denial

[Ben74]

So the warranty company is denying my claim for the repair that needs to have the engine pulled. Audi service is saying the problem is the oil cooler. Warranty company claims oil cooler is not listed as a covered part in the contract. Audi service says the oil cooler is the same part as the oil filter adapter/housing that is listed in the contract, Audi just calls it an oil cooler instead of an oil filter adapter/housing. Does anyone have any knowledge or experience with that part?

Ben

[JSRS6]

Have you had the warranty company AND audi service on a conference call? Let them talk details.

[V8weight]

Your service writer is correct, the oil cooler is the filter adapter/ housing assembly.

[marklar182]

Which warranty company?

Get ready to fight! It is their goal to make profit, and the way they do it is by service denials!

[Ben74]

Company is called United Auto Care. I believe it is owned by Penske. So what is the best way to prove that the part is exactly the same, just named differently? Do I try to go up the chain at Audi itself? I found an Audi RS6 Self Study Guide pdf created by Audi. In that document, it looks like Audi combined the oil cooler with the filter adapter/housing? From the guide:
The coolant/oil heat exchanger, an oil cooler without a separate housing, is bolted to the oil filter module to form a unit.

Ben

[Ben74]

It looks like a lot of times the oil cooler and the filter adapter/housing are separate parts in other cars. Is that correct? Is the RS6 just different because they have it as one combined part?

Ben

[marklar182]

We have both, a water oil cooler in the housing assy. and a air to oil cooler in front of the radiator and a/c condenser.

[SteveKen]

I'm guessing that your coolant pipe is broken and requires the removal of the oil cooler assembly that houses the oil filter, etc.

This does not require an engine pull but it is a bit of work. Maybe the service guy can explain that this is not an external oil cooler, or something of that nature.

[MaxRS6]

Brings back fond memories...I was in a loaner for an extended period of time

http://www.rs6.com/showthread.php/20998-10-part-results-in-5K-Warranty-Work-Yahooo!/page2?highlight=tube

[Ben74]

Audi service now says that they are two separate parts. The oil cooler can be ordered separately from the oil filter adapter. This is not looking good. Thanks to everyone for all the help! Please post if anyone has any other ideas.

Ben

[DHall1]

Will the dealer work with you on naming the failed component? Can they be sure the filter adaper gasket is not leaking? Hint

As for insurance companies. Legalized mafia. How else do you explain how Farmers Insurance wants to pay 700 million dollars to name the new NFL stadium in LA. Without even a team yet. Glad we don't have Farmers Insurance. Geez

[marklar182]

Good luck on your fight.

If it is the plastic coolant pipe that is leaking, email this guy for a $25 metal version

jamesbufkin@bufkinengineering.com

http://forums.audiworld.com/showthread.php?t=2616795

http://forums.audiworld.com/album.php?albumid=38899&pictureid=158220

[Ben74]

I kind of tried that already. I asked him if he was sure that it was the oil cooler that was the problem. He said it is very obvious that it is the oil cooler and not something else. The warranty company has already sent someone to verify the problem. It would probably be too obvious at this point to try and claim some other part is the problem. Good idea, though.

Ben

[marklar182]

Make sure your read your agreement to the letter. Is it a powertrain only warranty or full vehicle?

[Ben74]

Here's the section of the contract the applies:

Parts not listed are not covered. Parts covered:
Gasoline Engine - Cylinder block and all internal lubricated parts including: crankshaft, rod and main bearings, cam bearings, expansion (freeze) plugs, connecting rods, wrist pins, pistons, piston rings, camshaft, cam tower, lifters, cylinder head, valves and guides, valve springs, rocker arms (cam followers), pushrods, timing chaing housing (cover), timing belt and pulleys, timing belt tensioner, intake and exhaust manifolds, flywheel, balance shafts, harmonic balancer and retainer bolt, crankshaft pulley, valve covers, oil pan, oil pump and pressure relief valve, oil filter adapter/housing, engine oil sending unit, engine mounts, water pump, temperature sending unit, thermostat and housing, fuel supply pump, vacuum pump, dipstick and tube and fasteners for the components listed above.

[marklar182]

Sounds like a crappy contract. How long have you had it? Have they paid a claim yet?

[Ben74]

I've had it about 2 years. They have paid approximately $1,200 so far. The section I posted is just the engine section. There are multiple other sections that I didn't bother to copy and post.

Ben

[DHall1]

Do you have the hi tech plan that covers seals and gaskets?

[vodeftones]

I will tell you one thing the tech won't be pulling the motor for this but he would like to get paid for it though. :)

[Ben74]

Do you have the hi tech plan that covers seals and gaskets?

I do have the hi tech plan, but I don't see anything in there mentioning seals and gaskets. Under the engine section I posted earlier, it does say: All seals and gaskets listed on the assemblies above.

What are you thinking? Thanks again to you and everyone else here being so willing to help! It is truly appreciated!!

Ben

[Ben74]

I will tell you one thing the tech won't be pulling the motor for this but he would like to get paid for it though. :)

Are you absolutely certain the engine will not be pulled to replace the oil cooler? If you, or anyone else here, can confirm that, then I can pressure the service advisor on that. I don't want to get confrontational with them unless I have to since they are the ones working on the car. Thanks again!

Ben

[MaxRS6]

^^ Look at the thread I had posted and put here again for convenience. Tozo says it does not have to be pulled.

http://www.rs6.com/showthread.php/20998-10-part-results-in-5K-Warranty-Work-Yahooo!/page2?highlight=tube

They pulled my engine (saw with own eyes and pics). I had a lot of other items done at the same time.

Doh- I wish I had known about the metal option as I had the plastic OEM put back in.

[MaxRS6]

I do have the hi tech plan, but I don't see anything in there mentioning seals and gaskets. Under the engine section I posted earlier, it does say: All seals and gaskets listed on the assemblies above.

What are you thinking? Thanks again to you and everyone else here being so willing to help! It is truly appreciated!!

Ben


I know with my hi road tech+ plan I had a specific gasket and seals option that was part of the plan. Under that specific sectiion it stated the gasket and seals option was part of the tech+ plan I was purchasing. Some of the other options did not include the gasket and seals option. That option helped me get some work covered under warranty.

[DonS]

At the time the contract was written, this part was covered - correct? That's what yo signed and paid for, so that's what you should get. Maybe Audi can order this old part number and not list the retrofit part...

[Ben74]

Thanks for posting the link again Max. I had missed the part in your thread linking to the instructions for changing the oil cooler without removing the engine. I'll try to work with the service department to see if they would be willing to try the procedure without removing the engine. I expect push back on that, but I might as well at least try. I'm willing to try anything I can to keep my costs to a minimum.

Originally the service advisor said it was a very minor leak, maybe 2 to 3 drops showing in the garage each day. Once the warranty came into play, they were more than happy to do the work. Now that I have to pay for it, they seem to still be pushing for the work to be done. I'm wondering if it wouldn't hurt to just monitor it for the next 3 to 6 months to see how much engine oil I lose and how noticeable the leak is. My hope is that something else would go wrong that the warranty would cover. Any thoughts on this approach?

Ben

[DHall1]

OK

1. Engine block is covered right? Are these seals touching the engine block?

2. Walk away if its not covered. Go home and clean the area off and monitor the amount and location.

3. If not covered, call the Penske dealer you purchased this car and warranty from and express your displeasure over the whole situation. May or may not help but it cant hurt.




Thanks for posting the link again Max. I had missed the part in your thread linking to the instructions for changing the oil cooler without removing the engine. I'll try to work with the service department to see if they would be willing to try the procedure without removing the engine. I expect push back on that, but I might as well at least try. I'm willing to try anything I can to keep my costs to a minimum.

Originally the service advisor said it was a very minor leak, maybe 2 to 3 drops showing in the garage each day. Once the warranty came into play, they were more than happy to do the work. Now that I have to pay for it, they seem to still be pushing for the work to be done. I'm wondering if it wouldn't hurt to just monitor it for the next 3 to 6 months to see how much engine oil I lose and how noticeable the leak is. My hope is that something else would go wrong that the warranty would cover. Any thoughts on this approach?

Ben

[Ben74]

I contacted the BMW dealership I bought the car from and spoke with the salesperson who sold me the car. He initially said there's nothing they can do. I pressed him on it and asked why they wouldn't stand behind a product they sell. He said he'd get back to me. I've heard nothing from him, which is what I expected. However, the service advisor at Carousel Audi has a contact at the BMW dealership and is going to contact them. The service advisor has been excellent to work with. He's been trying everything possible with the warranty company to get it covered.

Also, the service department says they cannot replace the oil cooler without removing the engine because of the turbos. I sent them the link with the instructions. They reviewed it and say it is physically impossible to do following those instructions because of the turbos.

My last resort is going to just drive the car as is and monitor the coolant level regularly, while hoping that something else major fails that would require the engine to be pulled.

Thanks again to everyone here who has helped and offered their advice!!!

Ben

[SteveKen]

Invest in the Bufkin Engineering coolant pipe, too if you end up replacing it.

[Ben74]

The service advisor at Carousel Audi contacted someone he knows at the BMW dealership where I bought the car. The person at the BMW dealership called me yesterday and said she understands the problem and she will do what she can to get the warranty company to cover the oil cooler repair. She called me back this afternoon and said she went to the top of her organization and they were able to get the warranty company to approve and pay for the repair! Needless to say, I'm very excited about this and can't begin to express how great the service advisor at Carousel has been to work with! Thanks once more to everyone here!

[MaxRS6]

^^ Woo hoo ^^ A win for the good guys and congrats!

[V8weight]

The service advisor at Carousel Audi contacted someone he knows at the BMW dealership where I bought the car. The person at the BMW dealership called me yesterday and said she understands the problem and she will do what she can to get the warranty company to cover the oil cooler repair. She called me back this afternoon and said she went to the top of her organization and they were able to get the warranty company to approve and pay for the repair! Needless to say, I'm very excited about this and can't begin to express how great the service advisor at Carousel has been to work with! Thanks once more to everyone here!
So your car is at Carousel in Minneapolis? Aren't you out in North Dakota? Who are you dealing with at Carousel?

[Ben74]

I'm in the La Crosse, WI area. It's about a 2.5 hour drive one way, so 5 hours total. We had it worked on in mid January to fix a front axle seal leak. A few days after getting it back, it seemed to be leaking again. We brought it back and they paid for a rental car for us to take back home while they looked into the problem again. When they found what was causing the continued leaking from the axle seal, they called and notified me about the oil cooler leak. I've had the rental car now since Jan. 28th while they were working on the axle seal leak and fighting with the warranty company about the oil cooler, all at no charge to me. Hopefully I'll be picking up the RS6 on Tuesday next week. The service advisor is Joel Anderson. I would highly recommend contacting him if you are anywhere close to Minneapolis, MN, even if it is a couple hours of driving.

[nistah]

Nice glad everything worked out for you!;)

[vodeftones]

Shit could have brought that thing out here to Hudson, I've done that oil cooler a few times in the car. It's tight but can be done