A6 Fuel Rollover Valve Recall [Archive] - RS6.com

Chung

September 29th, 2010, 01:37

Hi All,
I am in the process of purchasing a RS6 right now. It has been a dream car of mine ever since they came out so I am pretty excited.

One of the problems on the car I am purchasing is that if you fill the car full of fuel there is a smell of gas (a leak probably). The previous owner suspects it has to do with the same recall he had on his a6. I called Audi to see if having the RS6 not on the list was an oversight but they claim that we must have a different fuel system.

Checking the NHTSA there is one complaint from an RS6 owner on this issue. So my first question for this forum is, has anyone else experienced this? My second question is do we have the same fuel tank as the All Road and A6?

Anyway, I am super excited to be joining the RS6 ranks and I am sure I will have more questions in the future.

Here are more details about this recall:

<TABLE style="border-bottom-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); border-bottom-width: 1px; border-bottom-style: solid;" border="0" cellSpacing="0" cellPadding="0" width="100%">

<TBODY><TR bgColor="#e4e4e4">
<TD class="drilldowns">
1. NHTSA Campaign ID Number:
08V157000
</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD class="drilldowns">Recall
Date:
2008-04-08

Summary:
VOLKSWAGEN IS
RECALLING 68,240 MY 2001-2004 AUDI A6 QUATTRO VEHICLES EQUIPPED WITH 2.7L, 2.8L,
OR 3.0L ENGINES AND MY 2001-2005 ALLROAD QUATTRO VEHICLES EQUIPPED WITH 2.7L OR
4.2L ENGINES. THE AGING OF THE PLASTIC MATERIAL IN THE FUEL TANK ROLLOVER VALVE
COMBINED WITH BENDING STRESS FROM THE ALUMINUM VENTILATION LINE TO THE ROLLOVER
VALVE NIPPLE MAY LEAD TO CRACKING OF THE NIPPLE. IF THIS HAPPENS, A FUEL LEAK
MAY RESULT.

Consequences:
A FUEL LEAK IN THE PRESENCE
OF AN IGNITION SOURCE COULD LEAD TO A VEHICLE
FIRE.

Remedy:
DEALERS WILL REINFORCE THE NIPPLE ON
THE ROLLOVER VALVE TO PREVENT LEAKAGE OR REPAIR THE CRACKING AT THE NIPPLE. THE
RECALL BEGAN ON JUNE 27, 2008. OWNERS MAY CONTACT AUDI AT
1-800-822-2834.

Component Affected:
FUEL SYSTEM,
GASOLINE:STORAGE:TANK ASSEMBLY

Potential Cars
Affected:
68,240

Notes:
VOLKSWAGEN OF
AMERICA, INC
</TD></TR></TBODY>
</TABLE>

JSRS6

September 29th, 2010, 01:40

Congrats on the upcoming purchase! Hurry up and change your location in your profile before "they" get ya! J/K

Chung

September 29th, 2010, 01:42

Done. I was hoping "they" wouldn't find me.

JSRS6

September 29th, 2010, 01:47

Phewww! Well I think I remember smelling a hint of fuel once or twice in the time I've had mine, granted not that long, but hey, gotta start somewhere. You should fill it up, then go straight to a lift and get up under her and see if you can pinpoint any leaks. Be sure and wear eye protection though, that shit stings! Lol.

Chung

September 29th, 2010, 01:56

I plan to do some investigation when I get the car (hopefully it will ship next week). Once I made the buy decision my mind just wants to think about the car and nothing else so I have been thinking about thing to do to the car, places to drive etc. I thought I might try to tackle this problem while waiting. AoA wasn't very helpful basically telling me that the recall was carefully cordinated and that the car was not impacted by the recall.

Chung

September 29th, 2010, 02:07

It looks like I made my first faux pas too
http://www.rs6.com/showthread.php/18174-Gas-tank-leak.?highlight=fuel+smell

MaxRS6

September 29th, 2010, 02:15

I am having this exact issue right now. This will be my fourth gas tank. They have ordered the tank and fuel lines. It is an issue with the roll over valve and has been every time.

Ooooof

Chung

September 29th, 2010, 02:50

Shouldn't we get this on the recall list. According to NHTSA there is only one complaint of this on the RS6. With a few more plus the direct relation to the C5 platform we should be able to get these recalled. (I haven't been jaded yet by the RS6 since I brand new here :) ) I am prepared to replace the tank but I not going down without a little bit of a fight.

hahnmgh63

September 29th, 2010, 02:55

MaxRS6, have you complained about this to NHSTSA? Audi of course will try to say the RS6 is a different car but if it is having the same problems it should be fixed. Of course the RS6 will have few complaints as they, in general, aren't driven as much, and there isn't as many RS6's around to get the same kind of freqency of issues.

MaxRS6

September 29th, 2010, 02:57

I plan on contacting AoA tomorrow with my historical records. I then plan on adding my issues to the NHTSA site. It is a very dangerous situation with the gas leaking out around the hot exhaust.

Chung

September 29th, 2010, 03:06

Now I wish I wrote down who I talked to when I called AoA. The did redirect me to a different division. When I get the car I will be filing a complaint with the NHTSA and probably trying to track down Lawrence Hershman who was the principle investigator for the Passat recall. His phone number is listed so I will try to give him a ring tomorrow.

This is the letter that NHTSA sent to Audi when they started investigating. I wonder if Audi actually looked into the RS6 and sent the RS6 documents to them?
http://nhthqnwws112.odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/acms/docservlet/Artemis/Public/Pursuits/2008/PE/INIM-PE08008-27890P.pdf
"
Subject vehicles: All model year 2002 and 2003 Volkswagen Passat 4Motion automobiles manufactured for sale or lease in the United States. In addition include all other similar Volkswagen or Audi models, such as the Quattro all-wheel drive Audi A6, which used the same or similar subject component"

MaxRS6

September 29th, 2010, 03:11

Thanks for the additional info Chung. Hopefully, Audi will step up to the plate and take care of this issue. I don't think I'll hold my breath though...00

DHall1

September 29th, 2010, 03:15

Tell me about it. E55 has leaked from the tank 3 times in 2 years over the span of 15,000 miles. Level sensor assemblies two times and gaskets once.

MB had a recall campaign in the spring/summer of 2008 and from that point on forward MB has denied all claims to fix the leak again. Even when its the same component leaking.

MB is setting themselves up for a huge spankin. I have called MB USA and started a claim and I have called the NHTSA and reported my complaint. Not holding my breath on those folks actually doing anything.

Ben sent me the link of a late model MB S class on fire last week. Just driving down the 405 in So Cal and it lit up in flames. From the story its hard to tell where the fire started but the gas tank was lit and fire was under the car back by the rear wheels. Not in the interior. Just a matter of time before the S hits the fan.

I plan on contacting AoA tomorrow with my historical records. I then plan on adding my issues to the NHTSA site. It is a very dangerous situation with the gas leaking out around the hot exhaust.

Chung

September 29th, 2010, 03:19

Well I pay taxes so that I don't have to pay for Fuel Tank replacements. Thats how the system is supposed to work, right?

DHall1

September 29th, 2010, 03:34

Chung,

You're going to fit right in here. If and when I thread jack your threads in the future please accept my apology in advance.

We pay taxes to feed the monster. The monster gets fat and needs more food. We pay more taxes.

Chung

September 29th, 2010, 04:41

Could this be related to the amount of ethanol in the gas?

DHall1

September 29th, 2010, 04:49

I dont think so. The ethanol just dries out the gasoline and burns up pumps and injectors. Not to mention takes food off our tables and pushes out other food products. Subsidy plans have a way of doing that.

AUDI5000CSTQ

September 29th, 2010, 08:43

OMG, DHALL, where is your classic line... search is your friend. Try "gas tank leak"I was through this a year ago. http://www.rs6.com/showthread.php/18174-Gas-tank-leak./page5
Heavily documented with photos. AOA stated the fuel tank is a different PN so not in recall. I also have an Allroad.
CA has law that fuel system is covered 7 years. so was replaced N/C
good luck, They have to drop the whole rear of the car.
I was lucky, the CEL for the TC came on about the same time and the whole top of the car was removed and EVERY fluid and gas replaced.
good luck and welcome to your new home.

Chung

September 29th, 2010, 15:40

Yeah I did forget to search... My bad.

Audi5000CSTQ did you file a complaint with the NHTSA? If not woudl you be willing to?

AUDI5000CSTQ

September 29th, 2010, 16:08

Sure, I could do that. Is there a web site that eveyone is going to?
Let me know.
Also check and see if your state covers fuel systems for 7 years like CA.
You are just at the end.

Chung

September 29th, 2010, 16:15

Awesome. Thanks.
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/index.cfm

MaxRS6

September 29th, 2010, 16:18

Update- I just spoke with AoA and am sending them my historical information showing this is my 4th tank. My friends- keeps your noses out for a leak. The leak can easily potentially spill onto the hot exhausts and- well you know the rest of the story.

ben916

September 29th, 2010, 18:23

ben916

September 29th, 2010, 18:26

The leak can easily potentially spill onto the hot exhausts and- well you know the rest of the story.

I don't want a "Concorde-isque" my RS6 into a ditch with my kids on fire...

MaxRS6

September 29th, 2010, 18:29

Yeah I did forget to search... My bad...

Not to interject facts, but Chung did catch it himself in post #6 before the

http://www.wtcc.sa.gov.au/webdata/resources/images/whistleblower5.png

Secont (arkie talk)- If we stop posting any new threads on old topics, there goes 70% of the neighborhood....Just saying....LOL

MaxRS6

September 29th, 2010, 18:33

I don't want a "Concorde-isque" my RS6 into a ditch with my kids on fire...

I heard that and keep them there extinguishers handy. Maybe a fire suppressant system mod linked to the IC spray misters. Can't wait for the DIY pics...00

DHall1

September 29th, 2010, 18:55

I'm trying to be more selective about the topics. If its not a topic that we generally cover 5000 times then I leave it alone. Actually, I have not used the term in months. Too busy watching my tax burden and hiding my money.

BTW, I like Chung already. He has a political sense of humor and he writes proper thread subject titles.

OMG, DHALL, where is your classic line... search is your friend. Try "gas tank leak"I was through this a year ago. http://www.rs6.com/showthread.php/18174-Gas-tank-leak./page5
Heavily documented with photos. AOA stated the fuel tank is a different PN so not in recall. I also have an Allroad.
CA has law that fuel system is covered 7 years. so was replaced N/C
good luck, They have to drop the whole rear of the car.
I was lucky, the CEL for the TC came on about the same time and the whole top of the car was removed and EVERY fluid and gas replaced.
good luck and welcome to your new home.

MaxRS6

September 29th, 2010, 19:03

...Too busy watching my tax burden and hiding my money.

BTW, I like Chung already. He has a political sense of humor and he writes proper thread subject titles.

+1 both counts- I have a box in the backyard if you need to diversify your hidings...00

ben916

September 29th, 2010, 19:45

+1 both counts- I have a box in the backyard if you need to diversify your hidings...00

I know of a country about 15 miles south of me that will hide your money for you, for a small fee or in trade for coyoting or body cavity smuggling...

O/T - I would not be happy about this fuel tank nightmare on the RS6 and then on the MERC's.

Chung

September 29th, 2010, 21:30

Thanks for the warm welcome.

I sent an email this morning to the investigator on the A6/Passat case. If I don't get a response I will try calling him tomorrow. I am sure he has either moved on or is in a different division given how long ago it was but maybe I can dig up someone who will be able to help.

MaxRS6

September 29th, 2010, 22:21

I sent an email this morning to the investigator on the A6/Passat case. If I don't get a response I will try calling him tomorrow.

I was provided the following number for the RS6 advocacy group. You might try giving them a ring.

1.866.892.2834

Chung

September 30th, 2010, 05:19

Thanks for the number. That is the number audi transfered me to and told me that is our (RS6) help number. They didn't help me other than to say the DRC recall hasn't been done on the car yet (which I knew). How far did you get?

DHall1

September 30th, 2010, 06:07

Dont take any fuel smell without a full inspection.

Here is your friendly reliable 80,000 dollar MB up in flames. Just driving down the freeway. Oh yeah, the gas tanks are located under the car just ahead of the rear wheels. Clearly a gas fire and the gas tank is lit.

http://ireport.cnn.com/docs/DOC-495679?hpt=Sbin#

DHall1

September 30th, 2010, 06:31

Another late model Sclass fire in SoCal. I wonder when and if these folks are going to start putting two and two together.

Again, the evidence is not totally clear on where the fire started. Its lit under the car just ahead of the rear tires (gas tank location) and under the hood.

This is BS

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k5GlSRZJ4G8

V8weight

October 2nd, 2010, 01:22

Well F*&% me running! Topped up the car this morning, and now that it's home in the garage, it's leaking fuel. It's running down the drivers side of the tank. Add another one to the list.

MaxRS6

October 2nd, 2010, 01:27

Pat:

Ooooof- That stinks to high heaven like some skunk I know. Call AoA and email to document the issue further. Maybe we can all lead them to find a resolution of this issue. Keep your extinguisher handy! Or get this guy to follow you around.

http://www.geekologie.com/2008/01/04/jet-extinguisher.jpg

Chung

October 2nd, 2010, 01:43

Also be sure to file a report with the NHTSA. The investigator was on vacation last week but I plan to call him again on Monday when he is back in the office.

V8weight

October 2nd, 2010, 02:07

Also be sure to file a report with the NHTSA. The investigator was on vacation last week but I plan to call him again on Monday when he is back in the office.
Sure will, I'll file the complaint after the dealer confirms the check valve failure. Then, to light a fire (haha) under AOA.

DHall1

October 2nd, 2010, 02:40

Welcome to the club boys.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VtknX95emMQ

ben916

October 2nd, 2010, 06:35

Sure will, I'll file the complaint after the dealer confirms the check valve failure. Then, to light a fire (haha) under AOA.

I know of a certain Merc that need jjjuuuuussssttt a little help in that department...

AUDI5000CSTQ

October 2nd, 2010, 07:14

Maybe we need this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILYWJ0O__C0

This should take out any fire problems.

JRS-RS6

October 2nd, 2010, 09:00

Well F*&% me running! Topped up the car this morning, and now that it's home in the garage, it's leaking fuel. It's running down the drivers side of the tank. Add another one to the list.

Does this mean we can't smoke in your garage any more?

JSRS6

October 2nd, 2010, 14:02

Sure will, I'll file the complaint after the dealer confirms the check valve failure. Then, to light a fire (haha) under AOA.

Does this mean no dyno today? :-(

V8weight

October 2nd, 2010, 20:02

Does this mean no dyno today? :-(Nope, dyno is done!

skribe

October 3rd, 2010, 03:25

That is the worst tease since jr prom.

Post, Pat, post!

JSRS6

October 3rd, 2010, 03:52

Booooo! Not fair, man!

V8weight

October 3rd, 2010, 04:28

Sorry, I'm in the process of pouring through about 6000 frames of data logs between mine and Kyle's car (thanks for coming down Kyle, it was a huge attribute to have your stock beast on hand), and awaiting the dyno charts before I start posting numbers. One thing I will elude to is there was a discrepancy between my current numbers and my Eurocharged numbers (in case you didn't wonder on your own how my car could possibly be making 528 ft/lbs, I know I did). It would appear the last time I dyno'd my car at the same shop, they were running in shootout mode. More to come.

DHall1

October 3rd, 2010, 05:21

I got your shootout mode right here.

Got my own little secret go juice data logs of my own.

Thanks Kyle for logging your stock setup and putting down the dyno again.

Gave a certain ex RS6 owner a ride in my car today and we ran some data logs.

All I can say is

LOOK OUT IDJUITS

MaxRS6

October 3rd, 2010, 16:44

We be watchin & waitin

http://www.calvintang.com/albums/Philippines/lg/big%20eyes4s.jpg

Chung

October 4th, 2010, 23:23

Here is the response I got. Does anyone know for sure that the part are the same as the A6 or are they just similar? Hopefully the investigation well progress since we have a few here that are experiencing the issue right now.

Dear Rian,<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
<o:p> </o:p>
Thank you for writing about your 2003 RS6. I read through the blogs on the rs6.com web site and cannot be sure at this point if the RS6 tank, and therefore the problem, is the same as what we found on the A6 models. I also checked our data bases and found no complaints on RS6 or S6 models. I will refer your inquiry to our groups that monitor recalls and search for emerging defect trends. <o:p></o:p>
<o:p> </o:p>
One additional thing you could do would be to submit an official complaint on our web site: http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/ (http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/) - that at least will get your complaint into our complaint data base. If you decide to submit a complaint, it would be helpful to have handy your current mileage and the mileage when the problem first appeared, plus your vehicle identification number (VIN). I can’t promise we will expand the recall to include your vehicle, but I’ll at least have other people here review it and be aware of it. <o:p></o:p>
<o:p> </o:p>
Of course, whether or not your car is recalled, please take precautions whenever you have an issue of leaking gas: Park outdoors away from ignition sources. As you may have gleaned from some of the blogs, you can try filling the fuel tank no more than ¾ full until you have it repaired. <o:p></o:p>
<o:p> </o:p>
Good luck and thank you for bringing this to our attention.<o:p></o:p>
<o:p> </o:p>
Larry Hershman<o:p></o:p>
Office of Defects Investigation, NVS-212<o:p></o:p>
Office of Vehicle Safety - Enforcement<o:p></o:p>
National Highway Traffic Safety Administration<o:p></o:p>
U.S. Department of Transportation <o:p></o:p>
Washington, DC 20590 <o:p></o:p>

MaxRS6

October 4th, 2010, 23:33

... I also checked our data bases and found no complaints on RS6 or S6 models. I will refer your inquiry to our groups that monitor recalls and search for emerging defect trends.

I wonder why he did not see the report that is posted on the NHTSA site? Albeit only one report thus far, it is there.

V8weight

October 4th, 2010, 23:40

Well, I'll post my complaint as soon as I can. I really need my car this week and can't afford to have it tied up at the dealership.

MaxRS6

October 5th, 2010, 20:15

Some pics

The crack is at the plastic valve
http://i827.photobucket.com/albums/zz195/MaxRS6/2010%20Coolant%20Repair/DSC03957.jpg?t=1286306048
New tank- Valve doesn't seem changed or reinforced so I assume the problem will occur again
http://i827.photobucket.com/albums/zz195/MaxRS6/2010%20Coolant%20Repair/DSC03960.jpg?t=1286306181
http://i827.photobucket.com/albums/zz195/MaxRS6/2010%20Coolant%20Repair/DSC03959.jpg?t=1286306237

DHall1

October 5th, 2010, 20:44

Nice detailed pics.

So you cant change the plastic assembly without swapping the entire tank?

I need to buy a Kia Rio.

The old hanging brake line trick.

SteveKen

October 5th, 2010, 20:47

I'm guessing that would be an even bigger PITA if you didn't have those V3's

MaxRS6

October 5th, 2010, 21:00

..So you cant change the plastic assembly without swapping the entire tank?

That wasn't on my multiple choice option. However; I prefer they replace it- with my luck it would spring a leak elsewhere. At least it'll be covered by warranty for a short while. With good Karma- maybe Audi will develop a long term solution for all of us. It appears to my eyes that the plastic valve is prone to eventually crack/break

I also asked for the fuel lines to be replaced while they were in the area. The shop separately received 3 fuel lines before actually receiving a fourth one that wasn't "kinked" along the path. Finally received a good one this morning that wasn't kinked, and the repair goes on.

MaxRS6

October 5th, 2010, 21:05

I'm guessing that would be an even bigger PITA if you didn't have those V3's

I'll ask the tech for a discount....;0 Actually- I'm glad to have a qualified tech that puts up with my rants and does a quality job.

DHall1

October 5th, 2010, 21:13

Can you circle and arrow the exact part leaking? I think I see it....its actually part of the new tank. Not the best design idea Guido ever came up with.

I ask because it will determine what if anything ever gets the recall.

That wasn't on my multiple choice option. However; I prefer they replace it- with my luck it would spring a leak elsewhere. At least it'll be covered by warranty for a short while. With good Karma- maybe Audi will develop a long term solution for all of us. It appears to my eyes that the plastic valve is prone to eventually crack/break. The shop separately received 3 fuel lines before actually receiving a fourth one that wasn't "kinked" along the path. Finally received a good one this morning that wasn't kinked, and the repair goes on.

MaxRS6

October 5th, 2010, 21:23

Can you circle and arrow the exact part leaking?...

The actual spot is where the black rubber fuel line connects to the white valve circled. As you can see on the new tank, there are several of these on the tank.

http://i827.photobucket.com/albums/zz195/MaxRS6/2010%20Coolant%20Repair/DSC03957-1.jpg?t=1286310353

Chung

October 5th, 2010, 22:51

I don't suppose you can have the shop reenforce the failure points like the recall spells out before you put the tank back. (I have no idea what they do to "reenforce" the plastic)

DHall1

October 5th, 2010, 23:00

Does anyone have a copy of that recall? If the nipple on the plastic insert is cracking due to vibration or stress then yes, I would think you could fashion a rubber grommet to slide over the nipple and support it.

I don't suppose you can have the shop reenforce the failure points like the recall spells out before you put the tank back. (I have no idea what they do to "reenforce" the plastic)

Chung

October 6th, 2010, 00:21

I tried to copy paste but it didn't work here
http://nhthqnwws112.odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/acms/docservlet/Artemis/Public/Pursuits/2008/PE/INCLA-PE08008-29127.pdf

"Audi will repair all subject vehicles by reinforcing the fuel tank rollover valve
with an epoxy adhesive. This investigation is closed."

MaxRS6

October 6th, 2010, 01:17

Good ideas to try support it- but too late as the tank is back in..ooof! Well- in a couple of years when it happens again...LOL

Chung

October 6th, 2010, 01:32

May I ask how much this replacement was?

MaxRS6

October 6th, 2010, 11:17

May I ask how much this replacement was?

Retail for the tank, fuel lines (about $600) that I wanted done while they were in the area, and labor retail would be approx $2,900. However; my shop is providing a significant discount and I'm getting a couple other things taken care of while they have it apart at no cost. On my previous tank warranty repairs, the tank was shown at approx $900. However; the current repair the tank is estimated at $1,200 which is also part of the ongoing discussion/final tally. They estimated 9 hours of labor for the repair. An alignment is also being done as part of the process.