E85 is amazing :)

[p3u]

That is all muahhahahahaha

[JSRS6]

OK, now you HAVE to explain your self, sir ;-)

[Aronis]

?E85? Won't that kill a non-E85 spec engine????

Mike

[JSRS6]

Im thinking maybe a mixture of E85 and 93octane? Do tell...

[V8weight]

?E85? Won't that kill a non-E85 spec engine????

Mike
He would have to be running an e85 specific tune to increase fueling 20%. I would assume this would require a larger fuel pump and regulator?

[V8weight]

Oh, and P3U, leave e85 alone. The consumption of E85 raises the prices of liquor, which is something that I value more than a fast car;)

[AudiRS4ever]

He would have to be running an e85 specific tune to increase fueling 20%. I would assume this would require a larger fuel pump and regulator?

He was asking a couple of months ago about the 5 bar fpr and the larger fuel pump. I did think you had to change things like the pistons too though. I'll be very interested to see where this goes. And to see if the car is still running a year from now. I have a friend that changed his STI to E85 and the motor blew in 1 month. Granted, it had a bad tune, but I still got scared away after that. Good luck P3U. I'm excited to hear about it.

[ttboost]

He was asking a couple of months ago about the 5 bar fpr and the larger fuel pump. I did think you had to change things like the pistons too though. I'll be very interested to see where this goes. And to see if the car is still running a year from now. I have a friend that changed his STI to E85 and the motor blew in 1 month. Granted, it had a bad tune, but I still got scared away after that. Good luck P3U. I'm excited to hear about it.

Once you have all the right hard parts, it's ALL in the tuning. You pretty much need double the fuel system for E85. Cheaper to run once you get there and more power...but NOT cheap to get there...

[DHall1]

I pee on E85

The government tampering in private corn markets is wasting valuable food production in this country.

Not to mention the 100s of thousands of vehicles ethanol puts in the junk yard every year. But thats the end goal right? If you want a chemical engineers view on ethanol...please call Brian from BND. Get ready for his rant and you will get a dose of the real world.

[JSRS6]

And dont forget about all the booze!!!

[V8weight]

I pee on E85

The government tampering in private corn markets is wasting valuable food production in this country.

Not to mention the 100s of thousands of vehicles ethanol puts in the junk yard every year. But thats the end goal right? If you want a chemical engineers view on ethanol...please call Brian from BND. Get ready for his rant and you will get a dose of the real world.
LOL Dave. You said exactly what I was thinking, but was too polite to say.

[GEN XER]

I knew it would be Dave.

[Benman]

I knew it would be Dave. HAHA.. Ditto! :)

[snoopra]

What's E85??!! (hahaha!!!) I'm glad we don't have that crap here!

[DHall1]

^^ Listen to engineer we have on staff.

[p3u]

wow, if everyone is just going to hate then I'm not posting anything. If you don't have anything good to say...

[TozoM8]

The good thing about E85 is that the trans will last longer :)

[AudiRS4ever]

wow, if everyone is just going to hate then I'm not posting anything. If you don't have anything good to say...

Like I said, I'm excited to hear about it. :incar:

[ttboost]

wow, if everyone is just going to hate then I'm not posting anything. If you don't have anything good to say...

You can't expect everyone to be as jazzed as you are about this. People are entitled to their opinion, whether you like it or not. I'm interested to hear your results, if you do it. I know people that have done it and results are mixed, and I'm actually quite happy with my pump/meth strategy on my NON-RS6 right now.

[DHall1]

Ok,

I dont think any hating is getting directed in your specific direction. None intended in my rants.

We get off topic from time to time and in this specific case you left the door wide open for ?? and guesses and rebuttal. All directed in good fun.

Remember, most of us are old and cranky anyways.

So tell us your story.


wow, if everyone is just going to hate then I'm not posting anything. If you don't have anything good to say...

[ttboost]

Ok,

I dont think any hating is getting directed in your specific direction. None intended in my rants.

We get off topic from time to time and in this specific case you left the door wide open for ?? and guesses and rebuttal. All directed in good fun.

Remember, most of us are old and cranky anyways.

So tell us your story.

What do you mean US?

[DHall1]

"most of us"

[ttboost]

"most of us"

clarification accepted...I'll be a spritely 44 on Wednesday...don't wanna ride the geriatric bus...

[s42ski]

The other grumpy old (50!) engineer will chime in on this one - Ethanol is distorted not only from the market perspective as Dave points out but from it's "green" aspects as well. In the US there have been several analysis that show that Ethanol from corn is at best carbon neutral. Meaning that we are actually polluting more from Ethanol. The place where it makes sense is in Brazil where they make it out of sugar cane and it is proven.

Until we perfect algae based or cellulose based Ethanol it is just a farm state vote getter.

p3u I am still interested in what you have done!

[DHall1]

I may be "older" than the spritely 44 but I also have no intentions on ever getting on that geriatric bus.

:addict:

Cheers and happy bday early. I will forget by the time Wednesday rolls around.




clarification accepted...I'll be a spritely 44 on Wednesday...don't wanna ride the geriatric bus...

[hahnmgh63]

Another Engineer/Pilot but not Grumpy, I at least don't think so. The BTU content of Alcohol as most of us know is less than gasoline and therefore the fuel economy is less. The octane value is higher than gasoline but independent tests have shown that it is not as high as suppliers first claimed (seems they were showing charts of the alcohol mixed with pump gasoline for the rating when in actuality they are mixing the alcohol with basestock gasoline without octane additives). A flex fuel vehicle can never take full advantage of the E85's octane rating, a turbocharged engine can get closer than a normally aspirated by using higher boost but won't be as taking advantage of it off boost and will have to have the boost lowered when using regular gasoline.
We could go on and on about the fuel system modifications just to make it compatible without even talking about the tuning needed. Recent articles have already been posted that even the E85 vehicles out there that have been using E85 as their primary fuel are still having more than the average amount of problems. It will take a few years for the engineers & bean counters to come into agreement on the right materials/costs. Modifying a non E-85 vehicle as expensive as the RS6 would be very difficult to get it on tune and reliable longer term. What is to be gained? More mpg...No, More power...yes (but there are many other ways to do this), less costs for fuel?...doubtful. E85 may cost less than pump gasoline in the midwest but here in the Northwest it isn't, the politicians and stupid greeners want us to feel better about ourselves when they don't understand the science of it. As s42ski mentioned, the emissions benefits are very arguable unless your the E85 guy spouting the statistics everyone wants to hear or the lobbyist selling it to stupid congressman like the guy that thought Guam might sink by moving U.S. troops from Japan to Guam. Less mileage means less miles on a gallon no matter how the car is tuned. One gallon of E85 might have less pollution (arguable) than 1 gallon of gasoline but it doesn't take you as far so you use more.
Hey P3U, I just realized that you are at over 5000' aren't you? You need less Octane as you lower pressure. Anyone know what altitude the RS6 can keep maximum boost to before it starts falling off (Turbos/wastegates at max)? That is why I think your Premium in Colorado is only 90~91 Octane isn't it? Porsche use to claim years ago that the 911 Turbo could keep it's maximum boost upto 5000' minimum (therefore rated power), not sure about the Newer Porsche's or Audi's. Any Dyno runs from the thinner air guys with stock & modified cars?
Now lets talk about all electric vehicles: What is there real range with the radio, A/C, and headlights going? The few that have been tested by the car magazines haven't even come close to the claims?
OMG, have I been drinking again?

[DHall1]

Your best reply all year.

A little tech, a little rant, a little cranky and lots of real world facts.

I dont mind it if greenes want to be stupid and run this stuff. I really dont care what the greenes want to drive, it was a free country. Let em pump this stuff in their Kia. My only problem is that the government provides the subsidy and supports this stupidity. Thus, my tax dollar is going to support this stupidity. There is no science behind the stupidity and it takes a vital food supply out of the market. The US is no longer the world leader in ag.

Now I need a beer before they take that away too.




Another Engineer/Pilot but not Grumpy, I at least don't think so. The BTU content of Alcohol as most of us know is less than gasoline and therefore the fuel economy is less. The octane value is higher than gasoline but independent tests have shown that it is not as high as suppliers first claimed (seems they were showing charts of the alcohol mixed with pump gasoline for the rating when in actuality they are mixing the alcohol with basestock gasoline without octane additives). A flex fuel vehicle can never take full advantage of the E85's octane rating, a turbocharged engine can get closer than a normally aspirated by using higher boost but won't be as taking advantage of it off boost and will have to have the boost lowered when using regular gasoline.
We could go on and on about the fuel system modifications just to make it compatible without even talking about the tuning needed. Recent articles have already been posted that even the E85 vehicles out there that have been using E85 as their primary fuel are still having more than the average amount of problems. It will take a few years for the engineers & bean counters to come into agreement on the right materials/costs. Modifying a non E-85 vehicle as expensive as the RS6 would be very difficult to get it on tune and reliable longer term. What is to be gained? More mpg...No, More power...yes (but there are many other ways to do this), less costs for fuel?...doubtful. E85 may cost less than pump gasoline in the midwest but here in the Northwest it isn't, the politicians and stupid greeners want us to feel better about ourselves when they don't understand the science of it. As s42ski mentioned, the emissions benefits are very arguable unless your the E85 guy spouting the statistics everyone wants to hear or the lobbyist selling it to stupid congressman like the guy that thought Guam might sink by moving U.S. troops from Japan to Guam. Less mileage means less miles on a gallon no matter how the car is tuned. One gallon of E85 might have less pollution (arguable) than 1 gallon of gasoline but it doesn't take you as far so you use more.
Hey P3U, I just realized that you are at over 5000' aren't you? You need less Octane as you lower pressure. Anyone know what altitude the RS6 can keep maximum boost to before it starts falling off (Turbos/wastegates at max)? That is why I think your Premium in Colorado is only 90~91 Octane isn't it? Porsche use to claim years ago that the 911 Turbo could keep it's maximum boost upto 5000' minimum (therefore rated power), not sure about the Newer Porsche's or Audi's. Any Dyno runs from the thinner air guys with stock & modified cars?
Now lets talk about all electric vehicles: What is there real range with the radio, A/C, and headlights going? The few that have been tested by the car magazines haven't even come close to the claims?
OMG, have I been drinking again?

[GEN XER]

:argue::doh: Got my popcorn ready.

[JRS-RS6]

...Now lets talk about all electric vehicles: What is there real range with the radio, A/C, and headlights going? The few that have been tested by the car magazines haven't even come close to the claims?...

Where I live it gets hot in the summer and cold in the winter. Really Hot! and Really Cold! Do EV tests take into account using the AC or especially the Heater (it takes a lot of Watts to make Heat when there is no "free" heat available from the engine) or do greens expect us to show up for work sweating to death and soaked from head to toe or with our fingers frozen to the bone.

[DHall1]

Its not about the planet, its not about green, its not about saving resources. There is no science behind the curtain. Just control. That said, we are so lucky to have these cars in the driveway. In Germany literally only CEOs drive this caliber of vehicle. The worker bees all drive Pelosi tin cans because its all they can afford.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAqPMJFaEdY

<object height="385" width="480">


<embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/rAqPMJFaEdY&hl=en_US&fs=1&rel=0" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" height="385" width="480"></object>


Where I live it gets hot in the summer and cold in the winter. Really Hot! and Really Cold! Do EV tests take into account using the AC or especially the Heater (it takes a lot of Watts to make Heat when there is no "free" heat available from the engine) or do greens expect us to show up for work sweating to death and soaked from head to toe or with our fingers frozen to the bone.

[AudiRS4ever]

I haven't laughed that hard in a long time. Thanks Dave!

[DHall1]

Just here to help.

They say the best comedy has its roots in truth and reality.

Seinfeld made millions from that fact.

[Benman]

wow, if everyone is just going to hate then I'm not posting anything. If you don't have anything good to say...

Sometimes Dave reminds me of this guy:

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/06/08/video-what-happens-in-an-internet-car-forum/

(from Greg ;) ).

[Benman]

Another Engineer/Pilot but not Grumpy, I at least don't think so. The BTU content of Alcohol as most of us know is less than gasoline and therefore the fuel economy is less.

So by that reasoning diesel also contains way more power per volume than petrol, so we should all switch to that?

[DHall1]

Dude,

Not even close.

How about this.

Jerky1 comes on the forum with promises of some new fangled gizmo that does something? Leaves it at that.

Jerky2 has no idea what 1 is hiding and wants more info

Jerky3 is tired of waiting and starts down the road guessing what gizmo 1 was hiding.

Jerky4 is also tired of waiting and takes yet another guess at Jerky1s gizmo.

Jerky5 blames it on the government.

Jerky6 agrees and wants the government out of his business.

Jerky1 comes back and points the finger at everyone and no longer wants to talk about the gizmo.

Jerky5 goes on about the government and starts a war about corn.

Jerky6 wants his booze left alone.

Does that about cover it.




Sometimes Dave reminds me of this guy:

http://www.autoblog.com/2010/06/08/video-what-happens-in-an-internet-car-forum/

(from Greg ;) ).

[Benman]

Jerky 1 wants a thread that does NOT involve politics. For Jerky Dave, that simply is not possible... ;)

As for Jerky 1 teasing us with someone... hell we all do that:

http://www.rs6.com/showthread.php/10010-The-Riddle?highlight=THE+RIDDLE

[DHall1]

For the most part we remain good natured. I even spell it out.

As for politics or government. Not very often do I get to ranting and even on this thread there were others that simply talked about the stupid decisions some greeners and policy of subsidy programs take corn off the food table.

No personal attacks, no heavy handed political speak.

Yet some call the teacher and want total PC on the forum.

Whatever. I pee on PC.

If anyone wants to enjoy a real thread with tons of information and data.....I am going back over here.

http://www.rs6.com/showthread.php/21076-Dyno-Day


Jerky 1 wants a thread that does NOT involve politics. For Jerky Dave, that simply is not possible... ;)

As for Jerky 1 teasing us with someone... hell we all do that:

http://www.rs6.com/showthread.php/10010-The-Riddle?highlight=THE+RIDDLE

[Benman]

Whatever. I pee on PC.

It is not PC, it is manners. This is Erik's property.


He said no politics. Do you respect property rights or not? It is quite simple.

:cheers:

Ben

PS: for what it is worth, I have even asked him to allow it, but no go. So... we respect his wishes.

[ben916]

http://www.rs6.com/showthread.php/10010-The-Riddle?highlight=THE+RIDDLE

O/T:
I like this one better
http://www.rs6.com/showthread.php/10030-The-Answer (http://www.rs6.com/../10030-The-Answer)

[p3u]

wow, this thread got way ot. I'll start a new one with some info.

Just some clarification, I'm NOT on E85, yet..., but I know someone who is :) the results are very impressive. Stay tuned.

[DHall1]

Not really what I was talking about.

I pee on PC and follow the rules here on this forum for 99.5% of the time. I respect the politics rule and on the rare situation throw some humor at a topic that relates to the thread at hand. ie the Ethanol in this thread. "Do you respect property rights or not? It is quite simple." This is alittle extreme for the nature of this thread but hey. Like you said. its that simple.

Whatever


The heavy hand of justice can come down in many ways on the forum. Some better than others. That is all I will say on this matter.


It is not PC, it is manners. This is Erik's property.


He said no politics. Do you respect property rights or not? It is quite simple.

:cheers:

Ben

PS: for what it is worth, I have even asked him to allow it, but no go. So... we respect his wishes.

[JRS-RS6]

wow, this thread got way ot. I'll start a new one with some info.

Just some clarification, I'm NOT on E85, yet..., but I know someone who is :) the results are very impressive. Stay tuned.

Thanks p3u you have my interest in the form of curiousity. Going up to Estes from Fort Collins this weekend to go horseback riding with my wife. I am sure the greenies love the Yukon Avis gave me.

[sallyh]

Hi all

This stuff is coming to Australia, and it will be sold at Caltex petrol stations. Apparently they are going to be making it out of "rubbish" (not corn). The V8 Supercars (Holden versus Ford, Australia's very own) racing series will be using it to improve their "green" image. Ethanol got a very bad name here a few years back as wrecking engines, it will be interesting to see how the latest version goes. Gosh, I find it hard enough to avoid the diesel bowser already - too many choices! Anyway, lift the petrol cap and it says that the V10 RS6 runs on 91 octane, or 95.

[Benman]

wow, this thread got way ot. I'll start a new one with some info.

Just some clarification, I'm NOT on E85, yet..., but I know someone who is :) the results are very impressive. Stay tuned.

Sorry I helped derail it. ;)

I would be hesitant to try it, but I'm very interested in the results. :cheers:

Ben

[dmross]

E85 will net results comparable to C16, but it's pretty corrosive so even with more capacity (pump, injectors, etc) you will also need to consider your fuel lines, rails, etc. if you want to "do it right" in terms of reliability/longevity.

[DHall1]

Never mind the piston rings and cylinder walls. But hey, minor details.

Sallyh-ethanol still ruins engines. Dont run it without AcesIV.

.03c and no PC


E85 will net results comparable to C16, but it's pretty corrosive so even with more capacity (pump, injectors, etc) you will also need to consider your fuel lines, rails, etc. if you want to "do it right" in terms of reliability/longevity.

[p3u]

Never mind the piston rings and cylinder walls. But hey, minor details.

Sallyh-ethanol still ruins engines. Dont run it without AcesIV.

.03c and no PC

Just curious, what are you basing this off of? I know plenty of people with E85 evo's with tens of thousands of miles and no problems. The biggest problem comes from the fueling, but most modern vehicles can run it as long as they have the supporting hardware. Injectors don't need to be special, just larger for flow purposes, and the fuel lines is questionable at whether they need to be replaced, most can run it no problem. Fuel tank is the other item in question, but again, most vehicles post 1985 should be good.

[skribe]

Sorry, I'm calling it out. Why are we pimping BND products like "ACES IV" in the forum... hit the BND site and there's information such as this:

"ACES IV Gasoline Formula chemically changes 87 octane fuel up to a 96 octane effect, 89 to up to 98 and 93 is improved up to a 102 Motor (112 Research) octane effect... ACES IV also has 5 times the synthetic lead byproduct that produces a copious upper cylinder lubricant that reduces cylinder/bore wear by 600% and valve recession by 360%"

A bottle of magic can turn 93 into 102 and reduce friction by 600%. Uh huh. Heard that one before.

:vhmmm:

[DHall1]

Because we know better
Because we have used it and have seen the difference
Because we know what is in todays gas
Because we want to save the fuel system and drivelines of our vehicles

But hey, dont take it from me. Talk to the 8 engineers on our forum that use the products.


Sorry, I'm calling it out. Why are we pimping BND products like "ACES IV" in the forum... hit the BND site and there's information such as this:

"ACES IV Gasoline Formula chemically changes 87 octane fuel up to a 96 octane effect, 89 to up to 98 and 93 is improved up to a 102 Motor (112 Research) octane effect... ACES IV also has 5 times the synthetic lead byproduct that produces a copious upper cylinder lubricant that reduces cylinder/bore wear by 600% and valve recession by 360%"

A bottle of magic can turn 93 into 102 and reduce friction by 600%. Uh huh. Heard that one before.

:vhmmm:

[skribe]

Post some data that shows how to turn 93 octane into 102 and reduce cylinder wear by 600% with a fuel additive and I'll FedEx you a chicken dinner.

[DHall1]

If I send you 3oz to treat a tank and you notice the difference. Will you send me that same chicken dinner?

I dont have the time to prove the theory or setup the tests to show 200 to 600% increases. I talked to Brian at BND for over an hour and we went over the chemical makup of not only his product but whats in most products out in the market today. I did agree with his direction and product descriptions so I tried a gallon of the AcesIV and Aces for diesel for the motorhome. So then I tried it and noticed the difference right away. Again, guys smarter than me and with engineering degrees all agree and run the product. I dont need to invent the widget but I am smart enough to know a good widget if it smacks me in the face.


Post some data that shows how to turn 93 octane into 102 and reduce cylinder wear by 600% with a fuel additive and I'll FedEx you a chicken dinner.

[p3u]

interesting article

http://www.europeancarweb.com/tech/0503ec_octane_boosters_tested/index.html

[p3u]

A bottle of magic can turn 93 into 102 and reduce friction by 600%. Uh huh. Heard that one before.

:vhmmm:

When I hear about octane boosters only one thing comes to mind. "One born every minute..."

[4everRS]

Ok, I have tried to restrain myself from this thread but I am having a momentary lapse of self-control.

With regards to octane. Any expierenced engine builder will tell you, the lower the engine can run good on, the better. Higher octane doesn't mean higher quality. Higher octane burns better at higher temps. A hotter combustion chamber will burn higher octane fuel as fast as a cooler combustion chamber will burn lower octane fuel. A engine builder will want the fastest, most efficient burn possible. This is also why fuel atomization is so important. Also, car companies today that recommend 87 in the tank will say to not use 91, why - slower burn in the combustion chamber when the chamber is designed to burn lower octane fuel(lower compressionr ratio). Fast burn = better. Higher compression ratio's usually equal more power. Our cars have such a hot chamber that Audi(cosworth) felt the need to use sodium filled exhaust valves to disipate heat better.

WE ARE MISSING THE POINT of the Aces IV. The real benefit is its upper cylinder lubricating properties. Octane enhancement, - ok fine, but not as important as the valve lubrication. Air flows better if it has a smoother path, and has less carbon in the way, as well as landing on the valve seat better.

As far as ethanol goes. I did my graduate thesis in economics on "The effect of ethanol production on the price of corn" in 2006. After much regression analisys, I did not find the my hypothesis to be true, that the higher production of ethanol increased the bushel price of corn. At the time there were not enough data points in ethanol production (relatively new industry in the US). In my research I did find that the ethanol production in the US was unsustainable without the government incentive (at the time .31 cents per gallon produced). In Brazil, it is sustainable as they use sugar cane (mentioned earlier)in which they can get almost twice as much ethanol per acre.

[DHall1]

So now we are suckers?

Call me in 5 years and we shall see who still owns a RS6 and how its running.


When I hear about octane boosters only one thing comes to mind. "One born every minute..."

[DHall1]

My new hero.

And here I thought it was the turbo encapulator all the time.




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjxfAjAyp5k
Ok, I have tried to restrain myself from this thread but I am having a momentary lapse of self-control.

With regards to octane. Any expierenced engine builder will tell you, the lower the engine can run good on, the better. Higher octane doesn't mean higher quality. Higher octane burns better at higher temps. A hotter combustion chamber will burn higher octane fuel as fast as a cooler combustion chamber will burn lower octane fuel. A engine builder will want the fastest, most efficient burn possible. This is also why fuel atomization is so important. Also, car companies today that recommend 87 in the tank will say to not use 91, why - slower burn in the combustion chamber when the chamber is designed to burn lower octane fuel(lower compressionr ratio). Fast burn = better. Higher compression ratio's usually equal more power. Our cars have such a hot chamber that Audi(cosworth) felt the need to use sodium filled exhaust valves to disipate heat better.

WE ARE MISSING THE POINT of the Aces IV. The real benefit is its upper cylinder lubricating properties. Octane enhancement, - ok fine, but not as important as the valve lubrication. Air flows better if it has a smoother path, and has less carbon in the way, as well as landing on the valve seat better.

As far as ethanol goes. I did my graduate thesis in economics on "The effect of ethanol production on the price of corn" in 2006. After much regression analisys, I did not find the my hypothesis to be true, that the higher production of ethanol increased the bushel price of corn. At the time there were not enough data points in ethanol production (relatively new industry in the US). In my research I did find that the ethanol production in the US was unsustainable without the government incentive (at the time .31 cents per gallon produced). In Brazil, it is sustainable as they use sugar cane (mentioned earlier)in which they can get almost twice as much ethanol per acre.

[p3u]

So now we are suckers?

Call me in 5 years and we shall see who still owns a RS6 and how its running.

Go dyno your car before and after with the treatment and let me know the results. No way 3oz can treat 24 gallons and bump it 10+ points. Would make race gas obsolete, don't you think?

[V8weight]

Go dyno your car before and after with the treatment and let me know the results. No way 3oz can treat 24 gallons and bump it 10+ points. Would make race gas obsolete, don't you think?
You're missing the point. I run Aces IV not for the octane boost but for the improved upper end lubrication. The lubricity of petroleum fuel has gotten bad enough, but when you start talking about ethanol, were talking no lubricity whatsoever. In fact, despite ethanol's two positive traits, the worst is the fact that it actually washes the cylinder walls of lubrication. And as for the octane boost, I obviously cannot measure it, but I can say that I have data logs that show an increase in timing advance.....If you are uncomfortable with the thought of running Aces IV in your car, then your best bet is not to buy it. I'm more than pleased with my results.

[GEN XER]

WOW!!! Its hot in here. You cant knock a product until youve tried it. Everyone lay off the man, he has the right to be sceptical, most of you were before you actually tried it. It never fails to amaze me how folks pass judgement on one product based on other products, but they do. most of you are the same. I sale Acrylic Werks polish but most folks would say its just like any other polish, but those who have used it know its not. I am in ATL and I just did my Granms truck, the paint was oxidized but its not anymore. Sceptics for the sake of argument and science call Brian and have a talk with him then let me know how you feel about his products then. Its only a call. You may be suprised at waht you find out. 440-821-9040.

[DHall1]

One thing to be skeptial. Another to call others suckers for using a product. Especially when the name calling has no basis in fact or evidence whatsoever. None. Zero. Nada. Other than "it just cant do that".

.02c

[p3u]

WOW!!! Its hot in here. You cant knock a product until youve tried it. Everyone lay off the man, he has the right to be sceptical, most of you were before you actually tried it.

I appreciate you understanding my skepticism. Every test published I have seen over the years by major auto magazines has come up with the same answer. Octane booster is worthless. I'll call Brian and see what he says.

[p3u]

You're missing the point. I run Aces IV not for the octane boost but for the improved upper end lubrication. The lubricity of petroleum fuel has gotten bad enough, but when you start talking about ethanol, were talking no lubricity whatsoever. In fact, despite ethanol's two positive traits, the worst is the fact that it actually washes the cylinder walls of lubrication. And as for the octane boost, I obviously cannot measure it, but I can say that I have data logs that show an increase in timing advance.....If you are uncomfortable with the thought of running Aces IV in your car, then your best bet is not to buy it. I'm more than pleased with my results.
So I'll bite on the added lubrication, but if it is really as simple as throwing in 3oz in a 24 gallon tank for 102oct then why doesn't everyone use this stuff? Race gas at $7+ a gallon would be considerably more expensive, so why is this not used?

[V8weight]

I appreciate you understanding my skepticism. Every test published I have seen over the years by major auto magazines has come up with the same answer. Octane booster is worthless. I'll call Brian and see what he says.
I'm glad to hear that you'll be giving Brian a call. I myself was skeptical of some of BND's claims, but he was able to explain every claim, and answer any question that I could muster. Comparing this to off the shelf octane boosters is ridiculous. Every octane booster you can buy is simply Toluene in one form or another, and the Aces most certainly is not. I'll leave it at that.

[V8weight]

So I'll bite on the added lubrication, but if it is really as simple as throwing in 3oz in a 24 gallon tank for 102oct then why doesn't everyone use this stuff? Race gas at $7+ a gallon would be considerably more expensive, so why is this not used?
Because race gas is leaded. And you'll be surprised to find out who is actually using this stuff. Do you remember Waltrip's crew cheif getting fired in 2006 over a mysterious coating in the intake of their Toyota? By the way, the ratio is 1oz to 6 gallons.

[p3u]

Because race gas is leaded. And you'll be surprised to find out who is actually using this stuff. Do you remember Waltrip's crew cheif getting fired in 2006 over a mysterious coating in the intake of their Toyota? By the way, the ratio is 1oz to 6 gallons.

You can get unleaded race gas up to 104 octane. Thanks for correcting me on the amount needed, so 4oz for 24 gallons :)

[GEN XER]

Brian does have racing teams using ACES, he is the little guy so the major sponsers get their names all over the car for advertisement and Brian's products are in the cars. He has even had meetings with NASCAR to help them reduce emmisions during races. The issue in NASCAR is after 500 miles of running around in a circle they leave a large cloud of exhaust over the track and with new standards they have to reduce this carbon foot print.

[GEN XER]

Because race gas is leaded. And you'll be surprised to find out who is actually using this stuff. Do you remember Waltrip's crew cheif getting fired in 2006 over a mysterious coating in the intake of their Toyota? By the way, the ratio is 1oz to 6 gallons.

YUP! the coating is the result of the ACES burning in the cylinder. In the end he was fired for using a non authorized fuel additive. Brian did it! ACES is not a Octane Booster its a Fuel Catylist.

Watch this Video it will help clear things up.
http://acesworldwide.com/products_movie.html

[skribe]

I dropped this turd in here, so I guess I own it...

www.bndautomotive.com. A home-made website with unsubstantiated "facts", old school hard-sell copy, no third-party testing, but plenty of wild claims.

The pop-can video... what is that supposed to prove? I thought I was watching a shamwow demo at the state fair. At the end, the dude said, "and it has micro-organisms!" Tell me what octane-boosting, super-lubricity-creating petrochemical additive could possibly sustain a carbon-based life form in suspension.

Then I did a "whois" on the domain owner of acesworldwide.com out of curiosity... and this guy shows up:

http://www.jasonboreyko.com/JasonBoreykoBiography.html

A career multi-level marketer who "...grew into a $220 Million Dollar a year business with over one million distributors, created 40 Millionaires and generated over $350,000,000 in commissions for its members..."

So tell me honestly. Who in this forum is a distributor of this magic elixer. I thought I smelled multi-level marketing, and now the smell stinks like a dead mouse in the wall.

You guys are the best, I've learned a ton in here, but when the community sells out it's objective, collective wisdom to make a buck off each other... well, that sucks.

[DHall1]

Keep digging.

I may not know a good widget when it smacks me in the face?

I will still run my Aces till proven to be honey. Then I will put it on my oatmeal in the morning.

Serious for a second. I dont think anyone here is a dealer. I am not on any take.

Here is a forum link

http://speedtalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=16984


I dropped this turd in here, so I guess I own it...

www.bndautomotive.com (http://www.bndautomotive.com). A home-made website with unsubstantiated "facts", old school hard-sell copy, no third-party testing, but plenty of wild claims.

The pop-can video... what is that supposed to prove? I thought I was watching a shamwow demo at the state fair. At the end, the dude said, "and it has micro-organisms!" Tell me what octane-boosting, super-lubricity-creating petrochemical additive could possibly sustain a carbon-based life form in suspension.

Then I did a "whois" on the domain owner of acesworldwide.com out of curiosity... and this guy shows up:

http://www.jasonboreyko.com/JasonBoreykoBiography.html

A career multi-level marketer who "...grew into a $220 Million Dollar a year business with over one million distributors, created 40 Millionaires and generated over $350,000,000 in commissions for its members..."

So tell me honestly. Who in this forum is a distributor of this magic elixer. I thought I smelled multi-level marketing, and now the smell stinks like a dead mouse in the wall.

You guys are the best, I've learned a ton in here, but when the community sells out it's objective, collective wisdom to make a buck off each other... well, that sucks.

[DHall1]

I got an idea. We need to call in Obama to kick some RS6 a$$


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yghFBt-fXmw

[DHall1]

Kick some a$$ over here too

http://www.epa.gov/etv/pubs/600etv07056.pdf

[DHall1]

next hit the bricks over here. A 64 page thread of a$$ kicking to get thru. Oh $hit, these people are all happy.

http://www.chargerforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=101392&highlight=power+gasoline

[DHall1]

We're going to need to kick alot of a$$

http://tomerdevelopment.com/ACESfuelcatalyst.htm

[p3u]

I dropped this turd in here, so I guess I own it...

www.bndautomotive.com. A home-made website with unsubstantiated "facts", old school hard-sell copy, no third-party testing, but plenty of wild claims.

The pop-can video... what is that supposed to prove? I thought I was watching a shamwow demo at the state fair. At the end, the dude said, "and it has micro-organisms!" Tell me what octane-boosting, super-lubricity-creating petrochemical additive could possibly sustain a carbon-based life form in suspension.

Then I did a "whois" on the domain owner of acesworldwide.com out of curiosity... and this guy shows up:

http://www.jasonboreyko.com/JasonBoreykoBiography.html

A career multi-level marketer who "...grew into a $220 Million Dollar a year business with over one million distributors, created 40 Millionaires and generated over $350,000,000 in commissions for its members..."

So tell me honestly. Who in this forum is a distributor of this magic elixer. I thought I smelled multi-level marketing, and now the smell stinks like a dead mouse in the wall.

You guys are the best, I've learned a ton in here, but when the community sells out it's objective, collective wisdom to make a buck off each other... well, that sucks.

Thats some serious dough!

[4everRS]

I think Dave is right that there aren't any distributors on this forum for ACES. GENXER is a distributor for Acrylic works as far as I understand, but not ACES - right?

Some choose to defend a product they use and promote it to others, because that's how they are, and they have had excellent expirence with the product. I manage money for a living and get referrals because I do well for my client's money. This is also going on with the Eurocharged tune right now as well. I know for a fact that those who got the tune, had to pay for it and are not getting some kind of compensation for talking about it. It is being "promoted" because it is arguably the best tune on the market for the money.

A far as this Jason guy goes, good for him. Aces is likely not the only product he helps market. And that amount of money sounds like a lot to me a you, but, for a company, it's not. Lucas oil generates close to 200 million in revenue per year. That is just fluids, no other type of business involved. 1 million distributors? This Jason dude must be helping a lot of other business' with marketing.

Moral of the story - use it if you want, I don't think anyone will give a sh** if you don't. We're all big boys here.

Disclosure: I use BND trans fluid. I have never tried their other products, or ACES.



I dropped this turd in here, so I guess I own it...

www.bndautomotive.com (http://www.bndautomotive.com). A home-made website with unsubstantiated "facts", old school hard-sell copy, no third-party testing, but plenty of wild claims.

The pop-can video... what is that supposed to prove? I thought I was watching a shamwow demo at the state fair. At the end, the dude said, "and it has micro-organisms!" Tell me what octane-boosting, super-lubricity-creating petrochemical additive could possibly sustain a carbon-based life form in suspension.

Then I did a "whois" on the domain owner of acesworldwide.com out of curiosity... and this guy shows up:

http://www.jasonboreyko.com/JasonBoreykoBiography.html

A career multi-level marketer who "...grew into a $220 Million Dollar a year business with over one million distributors, created 40 Millionaires and generated over $350,000,000 in commissions for its members..."

So tell me honestly. Who in this forum is a distributor of this magic elixer. I thought I smelled multi-level marketing, and now the smell stinks like a dead mouse in the wall.

You guys are the best, I've learned a ton in here, but when the community sells out it's objective, collective wisdom to make a buck off each other... well, that sucks.

[JRS-RS6]

A couple more:

https://www.fordmuscle.com/forums/all-ford-techboard/484599-aces-iv-fuel-catalyst.html
http://www.hitechfuel.com/products/ACES_IV.asp

Will be dynoing car and monitoring A/F when I get home and have the time and plan to be running Aces for the event. Beyond that I have other theories concerning GIAC data noted elsewhere including that the car dyno graph referenced could very well have had a vacuum leak or other problems. We all know that some cars are inherently stonger than others even from the factory and there are many variables that can drive that including and especially the holding force on the waste gates at high RPM.

[DHall1]

IMHO the chance of having a RS6 with "weak wastegates" and causing the symptoms described including the dyno graphs listed is almost zero. Less than .01%

IMHO the chance of having a lean operating RS6 with fully operational wastegates causing the symptoms described including the dyno graphs listed is almost certain. 99.99%

IMHO can any vacuum hose cause the above condition without a trigger to the check engine light? Nope

"weak wastegate" springs would do just the opposite of what is happening in these cases. In other words, boost would be fine at low rpm and then as rpm rose the boost would taper off due to the inability of the springs to keep the door closed.


A couple more:

https://www.fordmuscle.com/forums/all-ford-techboard/484599-aces-iv-fuel-catalyst.html
http://www.hitechfuel.com/products/ACES_IV.asp

Will be dynoing car and monitoring A/F when I get home and have the time and plan to be running Aces for the event. Beyond that I have other theories concerning GIAC data noted elsewhere including that the car dyno graph referenced could very well have had a vacuum leak or other problems. We all know that some cars are inherently stonger than others even from the factory and there are many variables that can drive that including and especially the holding force on the waste gates at high RPM.

[GEN XER]

I think Dave is right that there aren't any distributors on this forum for ACES. GENXER is a distributor for Acrylic works as far as I understand, but not ACES - right?

Some choose to defend a product they use and promote it to others, because that's how they are, and they have had excellent expirence with the product. I manage money for a living and get referrals because I do well for my client's money. This is also going on with the Eurocharged tune right now as well. I know for a fact that those who got the tune, had to pay for it and are not getting some kind of compensation for talking about it. It is being "promoted" because it is arguably the best tune on the market for the money.

A far as this Jason guy goes, good for him. Aces is likely not the only product he helps market. And that amount of money sounds like a lot to me a you, but, for a company, it's not. Lucas oil generates close to 200 million in revenue per year. That is just fluids, no other type of business involved. 1 million distributors? This Jason dude must be helping a lot of other business' with marketing.

Moral of the story - use it if you want, I don't think anyone will give a sh** if you don't. We're all big boys here.

Disclosure: I use BND trans fluid. I have never tried their other products, or ACES.

Man I wish I could get paid for this. I don't even get a discounted price. I don't even know if Brian has distributors at all. His plant is in Ohio and as far as I know he does not have a distribution network. He ships directly to you from his plant. He uses FEDEX. I would use UPS but FEDEX is cheaper for him so he uses them.

[p3u]

A couple more:

https://www.fordmuscle.com/forums/all-ford-techboard/484599-aces-iv-fuel-catalyst.html
http://www.hitechfuel.com/products/ACES_IV.asp

Will be dynoing car and monitoring A/F when I get home and have the time and plan to be running Aces for the event. Beyond that I have other theories concerning GIAC data noted elsewhere including that the car dyno graph referenced could very well have had a vacuum leak or other problems. We all know that some cars are inherently stonger than others even from the factory and there are many variables that can drive that including and especially the holding force on the waste gates at high RPM.

Agree, I've talked to several people with "big number" RS6's and the limiting factor was the wastegate not holding closed. They can simply be adjusted, well, when off the car anyways. If I ever pull the motor it will be on the list of things to do.

[DHall1]

No surprises here...this thread did nothing to educate the blind.

http://www.rs6.com/showthread.php/21076-Dyno-Day

[DHall1]

I hope we can all learn something from the monkeys.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWvxq6MRSdA

[p3u]

I hope we can all learn something from the monkeys.


Yeah, they make the forums reek of flung poo and cigarette smoke. :hahahehe:

[skribe]

Ok. It seems sketchy to me, but I will cop to being a highly skeptical person.

I'm glad it makes you guys feel good. Me, a couple few cold Coronas on the patio are my favorite octane/lubricity additive. :hahahehe:

Shutting up now. I can't afford to piss y'all off, no doubt I'll need your help on one thing or another soon enough. :hihi:

[V8weight]

Ok. It seems sketchy to me, but I will cop to being a highly skeptical person.

I'm glad it makes you guys feel good. Me, a couple few cold Coronas on the patio are my favorite octane/lubricity additive. :hahahehe:.

Shutting up now. I can't afford to piss y'all off, no doubt I'll need your help on one thing or another soon enough. :hihi:
No harm done here. Like I said, I'm not concerned with what others are running in their cars. I myself had no intention of ever putting this voodoo koolaide in my car, but knowing how skeptical Dave is (he won't even take a restaurant recommendation with out three sources of data) seeing his satisfaction with the product led me to give it a shot. I didn't just dump it in either, I data logged to see if I would see an increase in timing advance which would be indicative of a corresponding increase in octane, and I did. I also saw the alleged lubricating film left behind as a result of the combustion process when I pulled my plugs (they were actually lightly coated in it). Anyhow, I can relate to your skepticism, and I won't push the issue any further.

[V8weight]

I hope we can all learn something from the monkeys.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWvxq6MRSdA
Dave is definitely the monkey at 2:05 hissing at people passing by.

[GEN XER]

Dave is definitely the monkey at 2:05 hissing at people passing by.

Definetly..Definetly Dave at 2:05. Definetly Dave (Rainman Voice)

[DHall1]

Actually, if it were just an opinion backed by evidence. I would respect it.

However, when the "opinion" is only backed by a personal attack and no evidence. I have no respect for the poster. None.

"When I hear about octane boosters only one thing comes to mind. "One born every minute..." "

[p3u]

Actually, if it were just an opinion backed by evidence. I would respect it.

However, when the "opinion" is only backed by a personal attack and no evidence. I have no respect for the poster. None.

"When I hear about octane boosters only one thing comes to mind. "One born every minute..." "

Oh please, it wasn't a personal attack, unlike your new signiture that prompted mine...

[AudiRS4ever]

Thought I would chime in that while I think the subject of this thread was about E-85, and I kind of think that now it's more of a why you should use Aces IV, I did try to call Brian today to talk to him and probably order some to see what my thoughts were. However, I've tried twice and his voice mail box is full. Is he usually hard to get ahold of, or maybe I should just wait until the Monday rush is over with? Just thought I'd throw that out there and see where it lands.

[Benman]

Thought I would chime in that while I think the subject of this thread was about E-85, and I kind of think that now it's more of a why you should use Aces IV...

It would actually be good to get back to that. ;)

[GEN XER]

http://www.chargerforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=131159

Brian is 370 Hemi here and he answered a question about Ethanol.