I'm confused with Audi's line up...

[FSI_ooomph]

Back in early 2000s, the S4 was competing with the M3. Now, they moved it to compete with the 335i. Does that mean the current S6 is competing against the 550i/E500?

I'm gonna replace my aging E500 and I'm really looking at the S6. Here in Manila, the V8 A6 is no longer available. The line up is the A6 3.0T, 3.0 TDI and then the S6. No offense but the V8 in the current A6 seems underpowered compared to the competition?

Are the "S" cars competing with the top of the range models of MB and BMW? For example:
S4 = 335i/C350, S6 = 550i/E500 and S8 = 760/S600

Please clarify the Audi line up for me... :vhmmm:

[Skaala]

I'd say you have it about right, but I would say that the A8L W12 is the competitor against 760 and S600.
Generally Audi RS cars compete with BMW M-Models and Mercedes AMG Models. and the Audi S cars (not S-line) compete against top of normal lineup.

[Casey]

That is my understanding of it now as well. Especially in the smaller cars, comparison tests even put the S4 up against the 335i. But things seem to get strange, at least in the US, with the S6, which has a V10 and technically should compete with the M5.

[DHall1]

Clearly the Audi focus in the US is volume, market share and profit.

Volume of A4's, A3's and Q5's.

From a market perspective the cheap and easy to pump vehicles. Volume and profits.

Hey, I get it but Mercedes and BMW offer the full line in the US including the high end and performance driven vehicles.

I wonder about the long term retention of the performance driven market? Is Audi going to lose that market? It looks like it. They have made the trade off for volume and profit. I can think back over the years and back to when I first purchased the Toyota brand in the late 80s. Performance car driven Toyota and the Supra turbos were the hot car. Then Lexus combined luxury performance and reliability in some nice packages. Both Toyota and Lexus made the change to volume and profits without the attention to the performance market and look where they are. All the cars look the same and drive like crap. I drive right past the Toyota and Lexus dealer to stop in and drive the CLK Black series.

So I sit back and watch Audi to see if the performance will return. It would be nice to add a sports avant to my garage and park it next to the RS6. Bring them over to the US please.

[SAF]

Cue Supertramp "Dreamer".

[skribe]

As somebody who knows a thing or two about marketing... :hahahehe:

Audi NA (and in many ancillary markets) has largely put the "halo" cars (RS cars) on the back burner. They are comfortable with the idea that the R8 is their big aspirational halo car that will draw up-and-comers into the franchise and the dealership for S-line cars, S cars, and yeah, even Q5s. They are pursuing a "value" and volume strategy -- look at the aggressive pricing on the S4. The S6 is not a halo car, it's a business man's power cruiser... the average shmo doesn't know it from an A6. It does little to stoke desire on the street.

But then look at the A5 S-line 2.0t... all bark and no bite, a lot more show than go. Will pull the poseurs in to sign leases and no-money-down loans. I ran into some tool in an S-line A5 the other day who thought his car was fast, and clearly didn't know what was in the next lane. LMAO 5 seconds later.

Audi NA doesn't think they need to take on the expense and hassle of bringing stuff like the C6 RS6 to NA... they wouldn't make money on it with the low volumes and added support expense, it would be here only to halo the brand and stoke the enthusiast core, but they don't consider that a necessary or worthwhile investment.

WRONG! This strategy will do exactly what is happening in this forum -- alienate the hardcore guys who would actually buy these cars and put them on the street, drive them like they're meant to be driven, talk them up at the burger stand and in the enthusiast forums. They are losing these important "influencers," and long-term that is a bad thing for performance cred and health of the brand

Interesting to note they made the decision to bring the RS5 to NA. They have a better shot at making money bringing that car here, it's a little easer to support (no turbos) and A5s are selling like twinkies outside a weight watcher's convention right now.

But it is a hopeful sign that they're waking up a bit and know that they can't let the RS legend dwindle (outside of germany anyway) forever.

[ben916]

...But then look at the A5 S-line 2.0t... all bark and no bite, a lot more show than go. Will pull the poseurs in to sign leases and no-money-down loans. I ran into some tool in an S-line A5 the other day who thought his car was fast, and clearly didn't know what was in the next lane. LMAO 5 seconds later...

Same thing with the S5...

Slightly off topic but relates:
Getting the car washed last weekend at a local shop and some 20yo-something young exec pulls up in his new S5 with local dealer plasto-plates on.
I ask him how he likes the S5 (indirectly priming him). He said "LOVE IT! Nearly 400hp and I dumped the E500 I had for this.. All wheel drive.." etc.. blah blah blah
Then he asks what I am driving.. "Audi over there.." "Which one?" "RS6" "RS what?"
I could instantly see the look on his face of 'I never heard of that one' and 'wtf??'
He had no idea what I was talking about...
At that point, his ego was bruised and I let him slink off to save face.

I wasn't more than 20' from that conversation and was nearly tackled by someone else that knew EXACTLY what an RS6 was...

(No offense was implied, intended, directed to any and all S5 owners at the time of this post was written or in the future or past)

[DHall1]

You sound like me. I guess we are above the average shmo that thinks a 2.0t A5 is king turd.

R8 is cool but out there for many folks. RS6 sedans and avants can serve dual duties in the house. Ditto for the nice S4 avant or RS4 avant. TTRS is a just a go cart on roids. I can swing any of these in the stable where the R8 just draws too much attention. I dont like that.

And I agree again. If this is the master plan behind Audi's market in the USA then my wife may end up with a souped up Subaru wagon instead of the S4 avant like we want.


As somebody who knows a thing or two about marketing... :hahahehe:

Audi NA (and in many ancillary markets) has largely put the "halo" cars (RS cars) on the back burner. They are comfortable with the idea that the R8 is their big aspirational halo car that will draw up-and-comers into the franchise and the dealership for S-line cars, S cars, and yeah, even Q5s. They are pursuing a "value" and volume strategy -- look at the aggressive pricing on the S4. The S6 is not a halo car, it's a business man's power cruiser... the average shmo doesn't know it from an A6. It does little to stoke desire on the street.

But then look at the A5 S-line 2.0t... all bark and no bite, a lot more show than go. Will pull the poseurs in to sign leases and no-money-down loans. I ran into some tool in an S-line A5 the other day who thought his car was fast, and clearly didn't know what was in the next lane. LMAO 5 seconds later.

Audi NA doesn't think they need to take on the expense and hassle of bringing stuff like the C6 RS6 to NA... they wouldn't make money on it with the low volumes and added support expense, it would be here only to halo the brand and stoke the enthusiast core, but they don't consider that a necessary or worthwhile investment.

WRONG! This strategy will do exactly what is happening in this forum -- alienate the hardcore guys who would actually buy these cars and put them on the street, drive them like they're meant to be driven, talk them up at the burger stand and in the enthusiast forums. They are losing these important "influencers," and long-term that is a bad thing for performance cred and health of the brand

Interesting to note they made the decision to bring the RS5 to NA. They have a better shot at making money bringing that car here, it's a little easer to support (no turbos) and A5s are selling like twinkies outside a weight watcher's convention right now.

But it is a hopeful sign that they're waking up a bit and know that they can't let the RS legend dwindle (outside of germany anyway) forever.

[Benman]

Both Toyota and Lexus made the change to volume and profits without the attention to the performance market and look where they are. All the cars look the same and drive like crap.

Correction, "handle" like crap. They "drive" quite nice. ;)

[DHall1]

S5 is nearly 400hp?

ha


Same thing with the S5...

Slightly off topic but relates:
Getting the car washed last weekend at a local shop and some 20yo-something young exec pulls up in his new S5 with local dealer plasto-plates on.
I ask him how he likes the S5 (indirectly priming him). He said "LOVE IT! Nearly 400hp and I dumped the E500 I had for this.. All wheel drive.." etc.. blah blah blah
Then he asks what I am driving.. "Audi over there.." "Which one?" "RS6" "RS what?"
I could instantly see the look on his face of 'I never heard of that one' and 'wtf??'
He had no idea what I was talking about...
At that point, his ego was bruised and I let him slink off to save face.

I wasn't more than 20' from that conversation and was nearly tackled by someone else that knew EXACTLY what an RS6 was...

(No offense was implied, intended, directed to any and all S5 owners at the time of this post was written or in the future or past)

[ben916]

S5 is nearly 400hp?

ha
yeah, I didn't have the heart to tell him the sticker read 340hp-ish...

[DHall1]

To me they drive like crap. The new ones that is.

Now a 92SC400(we had one) was a sweet car. Stiff ride and firm.
Ditto for the 94LS400(had one), 98LS400(had one) then they started getting soft and cozy.

I dont like soft and cozy.

All the ES, Venza, IS stuff is crapola with paint on top.




Correction, "handle" like crap. They "drive" quite nice. ;)

[skribe]

And I agree again. If this is the master plan behind Audi's market in the USA then my wife may end up with a souped up Subaru wagon instead of the S4 avant like we want.

In Japan, New Zealand, and Australia I've seen something pretty cool on the streets -- the forester WRX.

http://www.zerotohundred.com/newforums/attachments/cars-for-sale/138510-fs-subaru-forester-xt-auto-2002-jdm-full-spec-frostie1.jpg

I seriously thought about making one of my own two years ago when the back seat of the M3 became too small for my kids. You can source the subie parts bin and build one out of a US turbo forester, then the endless amounts of monstrous subie tuning upgrades are wide open to you... have to admit I love the kind of broken sound of a tuned flat four, reminds me of my dad's myers manx with a header and dual webers we used to bomb the sand dunes of texas in when i was a kid in the '70s...

Of course, the downside to such a ride is the parade of tuner dipshits with penciled-in beards and fred durst hats who would inevitably follow you everywhere you went.

[4everRS]

Of course, the downside to such a ride is the parade of tuner dipshits with penciled-in beards and fred durst hats who would inevitably follow you everywhere you went.

hahahah lmfao

[DHall1]

Can you imagine what those pencil beard folk thought about this? I was all the hit. Not.

pic coming

http://i950.photobucket.com/albums/ad348/03RSTT/IMG_0404.jpg

A buddy of mine built of one of these. Took a 05 Forester XT and installed a complete STI bolt on package. Turbo, scoop, suspension, wheels...ect. Flash tuned and dyno tuned and the output was right up to STI standards with a flash. Nice ride.

And no, I dont fit in with the pencil anybody so the Sube tuner crowd didnt have much to do with me.


In Japan, New Zealand, and Australia I've seen something pretty cool on the streets -- the forester WRX.

http://www.zerotohundred.com/newforums/attachments/cars-for-sale/138510-fs-subaru-forester-xt-auto-2002-jdm-full-spec-frostie1.jpg

I seriously thought about making one of my own two years ago when the back seat of the M3 became too small for my kids. You can source the subie parts bin and build one out of a US turbo forester, then the endless amounts of monstrous subie tuning upgrades are wide open to you... have to admit I love the kind of broken sound of a tuned flat four, reminds me of my dad's myers manx with a header and dual webers we used to bomb the sand dunes of texas in when i was a kid in the '70s...

Of course, the downside to such a ride is the parade of tuner dipshits with penciled-in beards and fred durst hats who would inevitably follow you everywhere you went.

[4everRS]

Reminds me .

Came up to a new M3 on the highway and gently tried to entice him to have a little run. I don't think he even took to cruise off. Not much later a newer looking Impreza WRX came up to me and made a go of it. About 55 to 100 mph and obviously the beast was the victor. He gave me a little honk and waive with respect.

[s42ski]

I agree that Audi is making some marketing mistakes with the core, but how many of us are out there - perhaps they think that a cross between Lexus and BMW will work in the states? I think that having an RS6 type car is a marketing tool in the same way a R8 is to a different group of people. I still get people asking me what I drive, I tell them an Audi and then I tell them it is an RS6 and the reaction is "Oh wow".

A friend of mine traded in his RS6 ( my test drive in his was when I bought mine!) for an R8 and he mentioned that the RS6 impressed more people than the R8.

I hate to say this but the next BMW M5 with twin turbo's has caught my fancy since Audi is not willing to give me a 4 dr sedan with a back seat for adults AND that has the performance of the RS6

[ben916]

I hope that Audi isn't headed down the slippery slope of being every car for every body like Merc or BMW (joy!).

[DHall1]

At least merc and BMW bring the hot rods in addition to the cars for the masses.

Audi is not bringing the hot rods. Big mistake.


I hope that Audi isn't headed down the slippery slope of being every car for every body like Merc or BMW (joy!).

[ben916]

At least merc and BMW bring the hot rods in addition to the cars for the masses.

Audi is not bringing the hot rods. Big mistake.

perhaps it is time for Qisha to "spill the beans" on this big surprise that he keeps alluding to...
Maybe it is a big marketing ploy on Audi's part on us... the natives are getting restless.....

[PatriotRSX]

What's with all the negativity in here tonight?

Anyone who buys an A4/A5/A6/A8 and thinks it's fast is clueless. Their opinion doesn't carry any weight. Just ignore them.

The S4 obviously can't compete with the M3...81hp and $8k USD are big enough number differences to skew the results of that comparo. I think Qisha's big surprise is a ridiculous new RS4. Somehow they make it super-lightweight so that even without a V8 it crushes the M3 and C63. BMW feels this coming, so they're hard at work on the new M3 GTS, but Audi will undercut that $170k USD price tag handily. Note, too, that the new A4/S4 are pretty much the same size as the C5 RS6. So while you might not see the same badge, I think it will for all practical purposes be an updated version of the C5. Think differences between the previous V8 S4 and the current S4. Similar power, better fuel economy, better all-around driving experience, less money.

I understand that we're RS6 fans here and we're unhappy with not getting the C6, but I don't feel like that's justification for slamming Audi's whole line. Both R8s are masterpieces. Nothing screams "uber-luxo-barge" like the new A8. The S4 has won every magazine comparo I've seen (versus 335i and Evo MR, if not others). The TT might still be more a design exercise than a performance exercise, but there still isn't anything else like it on the road. The A5 and S5 are gorgeous, no two ways about it, and they really are selling like crazy.

The Audi brand is in a golden age right now. We should enjoy it.

[skribe]

Note, too, that the new A4/S4 are pretty much the same size as the C5 RS6.

Umm, no. I looked at the B8 S4 among other new cars before I bought the RS6. Nice ride, but not at all comparable to a C5 RS6 for a million reasons... just feels like a totally different car, lighter, drives more like a TT. Not necessarily bad, but very different. But the real deal-breaker was I have a 13-year-old son with size 10 feet and the back seat is too small for him.

Drove the C6 S6 next, nice car, big interior, but that engine just doesn't do it for me... doesn't have that low/mid torque the kicks you in the gut. Dare I say... boring? A boring V-10?

Looked at E63 next. AWESOME motor, but today's mercedes is just not my thing. So flashy and blingy, feel like a miami coke dealer or a wanna-be baller, so much unwanted attention. No AWD is a drag for those of us in snow belt.

Panamera: Surprised how much I liked it. But the four-place seating = deal breaker for me, need room for five.

So I rewind the clock and buy a seven-year-old car, and I love it... but it's still a seven-year-old car. The first used car I've ever bought in my life. The last new car I bought cost 90k -- so I'm willing to pay a shitload for a car if it can meet both my rational and irrational needs. Yes that is hard but such a car does exist.

I guess the frustration comes from the fact that there IS the perfect car for guys like me and Dave, the C6 RS6. I would buy the avant, even. But Audi NA is more concerned with volume in the US than giving us their very best car, the C6 RS6. Frustrating. Annoying. To your point, they are doing well in the US. They could afford to give us this car if they chose to. And they choose not to. Which some of us can't help but take as an insult.

Not ripping the line of cars, but the marketing strategy beneath the line of cars that denies us, in this market, their very best. I think a forum called RS6.com is the appropriate venue for venting this frustration.

[DHall1]

Dude,

Are you my long lost twin brother. I could not have said it any better. +1000%

I dont think we are bashing Audi but more venting our frustration. The RS6 owner is a picky creature that understands performance and needs their vehicle to perform very specific duties. Its frustrating to see a lot full of A4s, A5s and Q5s at the local Audi dealer. Will Audi become the one trick pony as Lexus did in the US? Take a drive over to the Lexus lot and you will see a lot full of RX330s and ES whatever their called these days. After the boom of Lexus in the late 90s and early 00s.....how have Lexus sales been doing? hmmm? Toilet. The A6, A3, A8 do nothing for me. nada, zero.

The R8 is nice eye candy but thats it. Audi has the vehicles I want but makes the decision not to bring them in the US. S4 Avant, RSTT, RS6 Avant. If Audi made these three vehicles available....I would buy 2 cars next week. As it stands, Audi delivers the RS6 avant to Mexico. WTF is up with that? Do I need to bust over the border and buy one?

Thus our frustration.


Umm, no. I looked at the B8 S4 among other new cars before I bought the RS6. Nice ride, but not at all comparable to a C5 RS6 for a million reasons... just feels like a totally different car, lighter, drives more like a TT. Not necessarily bad, but very different. But the real deal-breaker was I have a 13-year-old son with size 10 feet and the back seat is too small for him.

Drove the C6 S6 next, nice car, big interior, but that engine just doesn't do it for me... doesn't have that low/mid torque the kicks you in the gut. Dare I say... boring? A boring V-10?

Looked at E63 next. AWESOME motor, but today's mercedes is just not my thing. So flashy and blingy, feel like a miami coke dealer or a wanna-be baller, so much unwanted attention. No AWD is a drag for those of us in snow belt.

Panamera: Surprised how much I liked it. But the four-place seating = deal breaker for me, need room for five.

So I rewind the clock and buy a seven-year-old car, and I love it... but it's still a seven-year-old car. The first used car I've ever bought in my life. The last new car I bought cost 90k -- so I'm willing to pay a shitload for a car if it can meet both my rational and irrational needs. Yes that is hard but such a car does exist.

I guess the frustration comes from the fact that there IS the perfect car for guys like me and Dave, the C6 RS6. I would buy the avant, even. But Audi NA is more concerned with volume in the US than giving us their very best car, the C6 RS6. Frustrating. Annoying. To your point, they are doing well in the US. They could afford to give us this car if they chose to. And they choose not to. Which some of us can't help but take as an insult.

Not ripping the line of cars, but the marketing strategy beneath the line of cars that denies us, in this market, their very best. I think a forum called RS6.com is the appropriate venue for venting this frustration.

[DHall1]

Case in point.

Look at these two threads in response to this imported RS4 Avant. One thread is from 6speedonline.com which is a high end Porsche and exotic car forum. The other is Audizine. Just read what the owners of GT-R's, 911TT's, AMG's and BMWs have to say about the RS4 Avant. My god people where do you get your marketing?

I am sorry but the bone head move not to import some of these hot rods and avants into the US is just plain STUPID. STUPIDO. SPRECHEN ZE STUPIDO.



http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/audi/210801-b7-rs4-avant-miami.html

http://www.audizine.com/forum/showthread.php?356182-B7-RS4-quot-AVANT-quot-in-Miami-Novitech-Tuning

[skribe]

And in the mean time, the good ol' general is going to have a CTS-V wagon for sale in the US for 2011.

http://www.carblog.co.za/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/2011-Cadillac-CTS-V-wagon-1.jpg

I wonder how it would look de-blinged...

[Aronis]

Test Post....

Testing.....


I posted three responses to this thread and they are gone!?!?!?

Oh well....

Mike

[ben916]

And in the mean time, the good ol' general is going to have a CTS-V wagon for sale in the US for 2011.

http://www.carblog.co.za/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/2011-Cadillac-CTS-V-wagon-1.jpg

I wonder how it would look de-blinged...

Still missing that AWD and turbo thing....

[DHall1]

The point is that Caddy is making it. We can argue performance and quattro till we are purple in the face but we still cant buy any performance driven Audi avant.

I will never buy another GM just from a personal stance against bailouts and throwing shareholders under the bus. My best friend even owns a Caddy dealership. That said, we are still back to square one. No performance avant from the four rings.




Still missing that AWD and turbo thing....

[Benman]

The RS6 owner is a picky creature that understands performance and needs their vehicle to perform very specific duties.

The point is that Caddy is making it.


I'd have to agree on this.

I love Audis, but have to admit my disappoinment that they don't bring all the big guns over here...

Ben :addict:

[Amulet-S6]

FWIW, I traded emails with the head of AoA (Johan De Nysschen) a couple weeks ago on the topic of Audi abandoning the higher performance mid-size sedan market. I mentioned the soon to arrive BMW 550xi (twin turbo-v8 w/ all wheel drive) and the lack of the C6-RS6 in North America. He pointed out the RS5 as an option, then fell on the old song of not wanting to talk about coming Audi debuts in Europe.

Could a C6-RS6 be brought into Mexico then driven across the boarder? Anyone know the " rules " on this type stuff?

[I'm also interested in bringing in a Euro spec M3 for a dedicated track car. Strictly legal angles options seem prohibitive, any other suggestions?]

Jim

[ben916]

... Could a C6-RS6 be brought into Mexico then driven across the boarder? Anyone know the " rules " on this type stuff?

Since I am very close to the southern border of the USA in California, I see the following plates on a daily basis:
BAJA
SONORA
JUAREZ
I am sure there are more but I am busy listening to lovely German 4.2 notes....

There are many that are north of border that will not see these plates or notice.
(How the hell the Border Patrol determines where to put the check points is like rolling a dice 6 times and hoping for the same number)

I-5 about 60+ miles N of border
I-15 about 60+ miles N of border
SR -94 about 8+ miles from border
I-8 near Pine Valley

There are several things I don't understand about how these (the cars that are not properly maintained as exhibited below) passenger vehicles (not NAFTA) are even allowed/permitted into the US/CA/AZ/TX/NM with:
1. the amount of or lack of US DOT safety equipment, (a majority but not all have broken tail lights, windshields, bald or near bald tires, missing headlights or burned out headlights, the list goes on and on.)
2. the lack of proper emissions, CARB, EPA, etc. (kinda like second hand smoke stays in one area)

One would think that if you, a US citizen, had a place in the US and MX, well you could drive your C6 here...

[skribe]

I mentioned the soon to arrive BMW 550xi (twin turbo-v8 w/ all wheel drive)...

Yep, waiting to see that one. The E60 5-series was far too fugly to sit in my driveway.
But the F10 5 looks a bit better (the godawful gran turdismo notwithstanding).

Friend of mine just took delivery of a 750i xdrive. Haven't got a ride yet but it is a nice, nice piece. That powertrain in the 5 body will be extremely comparable to our C5 RS6's...

[Benman]

One would think that if you, a US citizen, had a place in the US and MX, well you could drive your C6 here...

Correct. If you have a place (address) in Baja, then you are good to go. Just leave it registered there and drive it here. However, don't think for one minute that bringing it over and then trying to register it here will work. That route is extremely frustrating.

Final food for thought is all parts would need to be purchased down in Baja. :cheers:

[ben916]

Final food for thought is all parts would need to be purchased down in Baja. :cheers:

AND serviced... scary....

on a side note... there was a thread about a B8 RS4 Avant that DHall1 pointed to on Audizine and it was in Miami... so how the hell are these onezies, twozies finding there way into the US?!?!?

[Amulet-S6]

AND serviced... scary....

on a side note... there was a thread about a B8 RS4 Avant that DHall1 pointed to on Audizine and it was in Miami... so how the hell are these onezies, twozies finding there way into the US?!?!?

I spoke with an international shipper/importer about my options of coming straight into the US:
a) For street use, at LEAST... repeat... The VERY LEAST, $10K to federalize. And of course the warranty doesn't follow the car.
b) There is a "show car" designation that must be applied for, and approved by the DOT, but limits to a very small number of miles/yr.
c) Track cars have to be registered track cars prior to arriving in the US. She mentioned they have connections if I want to pursue this option.

All a mute point if the market doesn't turn around. That's all I know, Jim

[Amulet-S6]

Correct. If you have a place (address) in Baja, then you are good to go. Just leave it registered there and drive it here. However, don't think for one minute that bringing it over and then trying to register it here will work. That route is extremely frustrating.

Final food for thought is all parts would need to be purchased down in Baja. :cheers:



I'd just like to bring a Euro spec M3 into the country for track use. Parts aren't an issue. And it would never see a license tag...
Hmmm... I have a couple pals with houses in Mexico... {devious wheels turning}

[Benman]

I'd just like to bring a Euro spec M3 into the country for track use. Parts aren't an issue. And it would never see a license tag...
Hmmm... I have a couple pals with houses in Mexico... {devious wheels turning}

Sounds like a plan. ;) :thumb:

Ben

[DHall1]

Jim,

Go the show car route. Buy two instrument clusters for the car. Drive the hell out of the car with the second cluster. Put the first cluster back in for inspections.

Done.

Dont worry about the market. It will be fine.


I spoke with an international shipper/importer about my options of coming straight into the US:
a) For street use, at LEAST... repeat... The VERY LEAST, $10K to federalize. And of course the warranty doesn't follow the car.
b) There is a "show car" designation that must be applied for, and approved by the DOT, but limits to a very small number of miles/yr.
c) Track cars have to be registered track cars prior to arriving in the US. She mentioned they have connections if I want to pursue this option.

All a mute point if the market doesn't turn around. That's all I know, Jim

[DHall1]

I just dont think these guys get it. (De Nysschen)

That new BMW is looking very good. Agreed Skribe

Oh Jim....if we need to fill a container and bring over 2 or 3 "show" cars. Count me in.

C5 RS6 avant for me.


FWIW, I traded emails with the head of AoA (Johan De Nysschen) a couple weeks ago on the topic of Audi abandoning the higher performance mid-size sedan market. I mentioned the soon to arrive BMW 550xi (twin turbo-v8 w/ all wheel drive) and the lack of the C6-RS6 in North America. He pointed out the RS5 as an option, then fell on the old song of not wanting to talk about coming Audi debuts in Europe.

Could a C6-RS6 be brought into Mexico then driven across the boarder? Anyone know the " rules " on this type stuff?

[I'm also interested in bringing in a Euro spec M3 for a dedicated track car. Strictly legal angles options seem prohibitive, any other suggestions?]

Jim

[Amulet-S6]

Dave, That's exactly what I'm going to pitch to my neighbor as I float around the lake this weekend. He's CEO of a big international container shipping Co. We slap some "dental material" labels on some boxes and wallah, New toys for the summer!?! Could you get 3 cars in a container? All the news articles say our customs is a joke... Hmmm? Now there's a quandary.

Maybe we could talk Greg Norman (the golfer) to put a couple extra cars in the belly of his 747? Oh wait, that damn ash cloud is still mucking up flights.

The market: Buying Gold, Silver and Lead <there's a joke in there someplace>

Enough silly babble Everyone have a great Memorial Day weekend and take a moment to remember the reason for the Holiday. Jim

[SIKAudi]

Have to agree with 99.9% of whats being posted here. The RS4 Almost Spot on. But, should have been an S (317 ftlbs) and if not turbo'd, then a supercharger for the RS4 and limited in numbers not just years. However, the new RS5 in my opinion is GARBAGE. A watered down version of an S (not nearly as agressive looking as RS lines previous) and not worthy of the RS Badge same reasons as the RS4. And its heavier (450hp ok but 317 ftlbs "are you serious") same motor as the RS4 (it only barely squeaks out in the 10ths of numbers, better times due to gearing). Although, the S6 V10 did showed promise (power wise), heavier yet, nothing special and not nearly limited enough. I have been in one at the dealer but the new Audis seem incredibly cheap inside (a lot if plastic). This coming from the 09' loaner A6 S-Line the dealer gave me during a service visit. Looked nice but made me want to purge. I did get to test drive a customers modified R8 and although impressive the mark up on these is huge and if I was going to pay over 100K for mid engined sportscar then i'd buy the Porsche TT not a sub 500 hp/400ftlb N/A V8. I am thoroughly disgusted and disheartened as to where the brand seems to be headed.

[DHall1]

As a note to Audi,

Check any golf magazine lately and you will see Cadillac ads for the CTS sport wagon. Some have full two page ads on the inside cover.

Sure its a GM but guess what? They are making the CTS-V sport wagon with over 550hp with the V8 supercharged Corvette engine.

Stupid move Audi.





Have to agree with 99.9% of whats being posted here. The RS4 Almost Spot on. But, should have been an S (317 ftlbs) and if not turbo'd, then a supercharger for the RS4 and limited in numbers not just years. However, the new RS5 in my opinion is GARBAGE. A watered down version of an S (not nearly as agressive looking as RS lines previous) and not worthy of the RS Badge same reasons as the RS4. And its heavier (450hp ok but 317 ftlbs "are you serious") same motor as the RS4 (it only barely squeaks out in the 10ths of numbers, better times due to gearing). Although, the S6 V10 did showed promise (power wise), heavier yet, nothing special and not nearly limited enough. I have been in one at the dealer but the new Audis seem incredibly cheap inside (a lot if plastic). This coming from the 09' loaner A6 S-Line the dealer gave me during a service visit. Looked nice but made me want to purge. I did get to test drive a customers modified R8 and although impressive the mark up on these is huge and if I was going to pay over 100K for mid engined sportscar then i'd buy the Porsche TT not a sub 500 hp/400ftlb N/A V8. I am thoroughly disgusted and disheartened as to where the brand seems to be headed.

[SIKAudi]

As a note to Audi,

Check any golf magazine lately and you will see Cadillac ads for the CTS sport wagon. Some have full two page ads on the inside cover.

Sure its a GM but guess what? They are making the CTS-V sport wagon with over 550hp with the V8 supercharged Corvette engine.

Stupid move Audi.

Yep, and 551ftlbs and $62,000 new you could get two or custom order yours with AWD. "Yes, Cadillac offers AWD!" (don't know about AWD with the "V" option but def on this platform).

Your right Audi is missing the point The RS is what kept Audi in business. Using the massive power, state of the art technology in a limited production to sell the Audi brand. What gives? Why abandon the philosophy? If I wanted mediocre, I could buy a VW.

[DHall1]

Not rocket science here folks.

Golf magazines cater to a certain demographic. Do ya think some of these folks might drive performance luxury vehicles??

or are these folks happy with A3s and A4s?

Hmmm? Let me see....nope, no A3s and A4s in my garage. RS6, E55, Supra turbo are just the top 3.

I give up on AoA, my best friend owns a very big Caddy dealership and he may get my business.


As a note to Audi,

Check any golf magazine lately and you will see Cadillac ads for the CTS sport wagon. Some have full two page ads on the inside cover.

Sure its a GM but guess what? They are making the CTS-V sport wagon with over 550hp with the V8 supercharged Corvette engine.

Stupid move Audi.

[SIKAudi]

Not rocket science here folks.

Golf magazines cater to a certain demographic. Do ya think some of these folks might drive performance luxury vehicles??

or are these folks happy with A3s and A4s?



Hmmm? Let me see....nope, no A3s and A4s in my garage. RS6, E55, Supra turbo are just the top 3.

I give up on AoA, my best friend owns a very big Caddy dealership and he may get my business.

In all fairness, I do drive A VW when I am not driving my RS6. But again it is limited. 04 R32 Turbo'd with a Garrett 35/82 w/ cloth inserts. So not your average VAG vehicle. 'AoA keep the Niche' Get back to the racing heritage we love! Not a request, we demand it or we will go elsewhere......

[PatriotRSX]

Dave,

http://ttrspetition.com/

Better speak up and wave that checkbook quickly.

[DHall1]

Check out the TT RS form here on RS6.com

Qisha had already released news. My form is filled out and sent to Audi already. Give me sticker price and show me where to sign on the dotted line.

That simple.


Dave,

http://ttrspetition.com/

Better speak up and wave that checkbook quickly.

[hahnmgh63]

I was also on the TTRS petition and I'm glad it's coming to the U.S. although since Audi has pissed me off so bad multiple times in the last few years I'm wondering if I should go the TTRS route or maybe the Nissan GT-R. When I say Audi, I actually mean Audi of America.

[ben916]

Yep, and 551ftlbs and $62,000 new you could get two or custom order yours with AWD. "Yes, Cadillac offers AWD!" (don't know about AWD with the "V" option but def on this platform)....

On the show "Battle of the Supercars" CTS-V versus E63 AMG - CTS-V crushed the E63.... badly...

[DHall1]

CTSV has the full line. Coupe, wagon and sedan all offered in the V series.

How will the RS5 stack up against the CTSV coupe? 450hp vs 560hp? Get ready for another smack down like the E63 had.

I just cant bring myself to hand GM any of my money. My good friend even owns two Caddy dealerships.

Like the styling of the CTS wagon or not. Caddy is making the V series in the wagon and delivering 560hp to the masses. Audi of America wont even bring us the S4 Avant.


On the show "Battle of the Supercars" CTS-V versus E63 AMG - CTS-V crushed the E63.... badly...

[hahnmgh63]

I took a look in a CTS-V and all I can say is "GM CHEAP". The quality just isn't there, although it is better than the quality of a Corvette ZR1. Check the forums on Cadillac reliability. It sucks. I've been helping out a girl at work (She's hot) with Customer service at Cadillac on her CTS and the car is a Lemon. Most CTS's have had their timing "Chains" replaced at 15K to 30K miles among other things, what kind of junk is that?

[V8weight]

I took a look in a CTS-V and all I can say is "GM CHEAP". The quality just isn't there, although it is better than the quality of a Corvette ZR1. Check the forums on Cadillac reliability. It sucks. I've been helping out a girl at work (She's hot) with Customer service at Cadillac on her CTS and the car is a Lemon. Most CTS's have had their timing "Chains" replaced at 15K to 30K miles among other things, what kind of junk is that?
I second your notion on reliability issues. Apples to oranges comparison, but my folks bought a new STS-4 in 2005(?). The factory alignment specs caused it to destroy it's first set of tires at around 5000 miles. By 15k it had eaten it's wheel bearings, and while in for it's 25k service it was determined that it needed a new power steering pump, rack, and an AC compressor. He taught them a lesson by trading it in on the spot for a new Chevy pickup :) This is the guy that frowns on my affliction with these "foreign cars".

[ben916]

I took a look in a CTS-V and all I can say is "GM CHEAP". The quality just isn't there, although it is better than the quality of a Corvette ZR1. Check the forums on Cadillac reliability. It sucks. I've been helping out a girl at work (She's hot) with Customer service at Cadillac on her CTS and the car is a Lemon. Most CTS's have had their timing "Chains" replaced at 15K to 30K miles among other things, what kind of junk is that?

That is the problem I have with American cars and now it is starting to trickle over to Toyota/Nissan... and others...
Yeah, a car with decent gas mileage is a desirable quality but so it a decent/solid/non-tinny interior.

I am not looking for a brick console or fred flintstone size buttons or everything labeled with words (symbols are fine) RTFM!!!

[DHall1]

GM cheap is very correct.

Reliable? Nope

All one has to do is look at the typical US GM assembly line. Want to talk about monkeys. doh

The costs for GM cars and trucks is upside down. You all know where I normally go with this. But, given the high overhead there is just not much left for product, quality, design and materials. There you have it. Once you have driven an Audi high line vehicle you are spoiled. Take a look at the Audi assembly line and you will never buy another GM.

Good luck telling Pat's dad this song and dance. hehe

[skribe]

I worked with GM for a few years a few years ago. I would call them operationally challenged -- at least back then. Politicking, positioning, jockeying and backstabbing amongst senior executives is not conducive to engineering excellence.

Funny story, I flew into Detroit for a meeting at the Rennaisance Center very early one morning. The admin asked me if she could get me anything... I said coffee would be great. She disappeared for a few minutes, came back, and said they had no coffee. I asked if they were brewing a pot. She said, "No, we have no COFFEE. Apparently we stopped paying the bill, so they stopped bringing it, you know, the grounds."

I did get to demo their cars. I had the new Escalade for a week, a few months before it came out, rolling on the factory dubs at that. Brand new, I was surprised how much I liked it, it reminded me of a super-sized IROC-Z Camaro. Who knows how it would hold up long-term? It was better to drive than I expected FWIW. And when I took it to the local carwash, none of the guys who worked there had seen the new one yet in the real world. And the carwash literally stopped and ground to a halt, 'cause for the guys who worked there, I had just rolled up in a dream car. There is still some passion out there for the Caddys...

[DHall1]

Yep, no coffee in the office but you better damn well pay the UAW legacy costs.

While your at it, just give the UAW ownership in the company. Oh yeah, here is another 60 billion to buy some coffee.

You cant teach stupid but you all have 1 vote.


I worked with GM for a few years a few years ago. I would call them operationally challenged -- at least back then. Politicking, positioning, jockeying and backstabbing amongst senior executives is not conducive to engineering excellence.

Funny story, I flew into Detroit for a meeting at the Rennaisance Center very early one morning. The admin asked me if she could get me anything... I said coffee would be great. She disappeared for a few minutes, came back, and said they had no coffee. I asked if they were brewing a pot. She said, "No, we have no COFFEE. Apparently we stopped paying the bill, so they stopped bringing it, you know, the grounds."

I did get to demo their cars. I had the new Escalade for a week, a few months before it came out, rolling on the factory dubs at that. Brand new, I was surprised how much I liked it, it reminded me of a super-sized IROC-Z Camaro. Who knows how it would hold up long-term? It was better to drive than I expected FWIW. And when I took it to the local carwash, none of the guys who worked there had seen the new one yet in the real world. And the carwash literally stopped and ground to a halt, 'cause for the guys who worked there, I had just rolled up in a dream car. There is still some passion out there for the Caddys...