Launch Technique ???

[skribe]

Seen this touched on a bit in the past, but wanted to ask the collective brain again.

The fastest launch technique for me is:

Trans in "S"
ASR "OFF"
Left foot firmly on brake
Right foot Revs engine to ~ 3000 RPM
Release brake, floor throttle simultaneously
Keep hands off flappy paddles and let the car do the shifting

In other words, the old "brakestand" trick.

This seems to build and maintain boost prior to and through launch... Very much faster, nearly a second to sixty faster than launching without using brakes...

Seems to me that this, with a foot of roll-out, is how you get a stock RS6 to hit 60 in the 4's...

The big question is how horrible is this for the trans/TC?

This is definitely not how I would typically launch the car as it makes me mildly uncomfortable -- I've never actually owned an auto trans performance car before this one. I had a friend with a Buick GNX who did this all the time, it was the only way he could spool up boost.

Is it OK once in a while when some tool in a G37 rolls up next to you at a light? :brag:

[ben916]

If I remember correctly (clawing through the fog), you can't roll like that...

I have read that you can "power brake" upto like 2000rpm's to spool up a bit...
you might search for the user 10secRS6 or something very close to that for early posts..

[DHall1]

Search for the member (Copper) and his launch tech.

Just know that for each fraction of a second your foot is on the brake and foot is on the accel....your trans fluid temp is shooting thru the roof.

How long the trans lasts can be literally factored down to tenths of a second your in the above condition.

.02c

Other than a quick flash of the TC....I have never held the brake pedal down and attempted to floor the gas pedal.

A TC flash attempts to transition the brake pedal with the gas so that the two pass like ships in the night. Releasing the brake as your rolling in the throttle.

Try it

[V8weight]

The most important part of launching the beast is not brake boosting, but a smooth application of the throttle. If you'd like you can try to brake boost the car, it will only rev to about 2200-2500rpm. Instead of mashing the throttle, slowly release the brake and in a smooth flowing motion ease into the throttle as if launching a manual car. If you just goose the throttle you actually overwhelm the intake with a rush of air and bog the car. I've made quite a few runs with my car at the strip and have a best of 13.04, in which i wasn't brake boosting. Basically on the second yellow with my left foot on the brake, I slowly step on the gas and easily let off the brake. So I'm giving the throttle a head start, but not technically boosting.

[skribe]

The most important part of launching the beast is not brake boosting, but a smooth application of the throttle. If you'd like you can try to brake boost the car, it will only rev to about 2200-2500rpm. Instead of mashing the throttle, slowly release the brake and in a smooth flowing motion ease into the throttle as if launching a manual car. If you just goose the throttle you actually overwhelm the intake with a rush of air and bog the car. I've made quite a few runs with my car at the strip and have a best of 13.04, in which i wasn't brake boosting. Basically on the second yellow with my left foot on the brake, I slowly step on the gas and easily let off the brake. So I'm giving the throttle a head start, but not technically boosting.

This is what I was looking for... I did search those older threads, but it felt inconclusive... and like I said, brake boosting makes me uncomfortable for the reasons Dave cited.

Really interesting about not just flooring the accelerator but treating it with a smooth, flowing motion... I haven't quantified it with VAG-COM yet but my car FEELS faster if I treat the throttle pedal this way vs. just stamping it down to WOT.

Also, my car has first-generation MTM ECU and TCU chips (wow, that guy paid a lot for them when they came out) and it DOES rev to nearly 3k when brake boosting IF the Trans is in "S" mode. Scary. I probably shouldn't do that... It's faster than greased goose poop to launch that way but probably just as durable.

Thanks for the replies!

[DHall1]

And this is chop liver?






Other than a quick flash of the TC....I have never held the brake pedal down and attempted to floor the gas pedal.

A TC flash attempts to transition the brake pedal with the gas so that the two pass like ships in the night. Releasing the brake as your rolling in the throttle.

Try it

[skribe]

And this is chop liver?

Depends on what kind of chopped liver... Foie gras is illegal in Chicago :hihi:

I appreciate your more refined technique vs. my two-footed cro-magnon launch. I will definitely work on it.

[V8weight]

And this is chop liver?
Sometimes it just takes someone to dumb down, I mean clarify your posts a bit:)

[DHall1]

Too funny. I was laughing because its basically the exact same technique that Pat listed. Pat did take more time to splain each specific step.

RS6 launching for dummies.....

two ships passing in the night.

or

take your little pinky, put it on the shifter, take your left little toe and put it on the brake pedal, take your right little toe and put it on the back of your head. Now, on the count of 5,456 floor it!

[DHall1]

But Dave, I can get my right foot over head. How does that work again???

http://i950.photobucket.com/albums/ad348/03RSTT/RS6pics/duck-feet.jpg?t=1265654815

[RS6-4dr911]

Someone help me out here. Without disputing which method is fastest, the "power brake" method doesn't seem that harmful if only done for a second or two.

The link between the engine and transmission is the torque converter, which is nothing more than two discs spinning very close to each other in a viscous fluid. The transmission has internal clutches that lock the gears to the desired ratio and use fluid pressure to keep them engaged. Seems once the pressure is applied, the clutches will not be slipping (assuming a healthy trans.) while power braking, only the discs inside the TC. The locking mechanism doesn't activate until the TC tells it to based on vehicle speed, gear, etc. Yes, this will raise the temp of the fluid, which is not good, but in 1 or 2 seconds can it really get that high?

This method seems nowhere near like slipping the clutch on a manual transmission for launching.


Discuss.

[skribe]

I guess I am dumb. 'Cause dhall and v8weight just lost me there.

[V8weight]

But Dave, I can get my right foot over head. How does that work again???

http://i950.photobucket.com/albums/ad348/03RSTT/RS6pics/duck-feet.jpg?t=1265654815
Awesome! Master of the heel toe braking.

[MaxRS6]

0-60 in 4.2 sec and 1/4 mile in 12.6 sec from a stand still, 93 oct gas. In S mode, ESP off, a/c off. Did this yesterday.

Edit for Brazil launch: brake up to 2K rpm and go. I roll into the throttle as stated above and do not shove it into WOT. IPT personnel stated that the tranny should be able to handle it easily.


http://i827.photobucket.com/albums/zz195/MaxRS6/MaxwellAccel20100207.gif?t=1265655404

[Brazil]

0-60 in 4.2 sec and 1/4 mile in 12.6 sec from a stand still, 93 oct gas. In S mode, ESP off, a/c off. Did this yesterday.


And what was your launch technique?

(yes, I am finally posting here, but I hate vB)

[skribe]

0-60 in 4.2 sec and 1/4 mile in 12.6 sec from a stand still, 93 oct gas. In S mode, ESP off, a/c off. Did this yesterday.

Well that's impressive... is that with the dave/pat duck-foot hamster pedal tickle or whatever the fuck?

How did you modulate brake and throttle at launch?

[cornishmoocher]

My method.

Left foot firmly on the brake.

gently rev to 1000, then 2000, then on the third or fourth rev at 3000ish plant your right foot and lift off on the brake- timing is every thing- especially at the lights!

0-60 3.6 seconds or less.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxkkZtVHMzc

[skribe]

My method.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxkkZtVHMzc

Thanks Mooch. I love the pitch-black two way pass... your beast definitely got a holeshot there...

what's the logic of the three-stage rev? wouldn't it do same just to powerbrake once and launch?

vid needs an edit, though, my favorite part comes at 3:57, almost didn't hang around for it!

[MaxRS6]

My method.

0-60 3.6 seconds or less.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxkkZtVHMzc


^^ Smokin!!!

[DHall1]

If you watch the vid....you will see that mooch is performing the TC flash method.

He is just not sitting there and powerbraking the trans to death. He is getting a flash point to the TC and some pre spool to the turbos...you can hear it. He just likes to do it in 3 steps. on off on off....kinda like his women.

So the two ships method or duck foot is the same as Pat's 1,2,3,4,5 method is the same a mooch's three step get yer ass out of my fucking way method.

Your mileage may vary.

Too funny


My method.

Left foot firmly on the brake.

gently rev to 1000, then 2000, then on the third or fourth rev at 3000ish plant your right foot and lift off on the brake- timing is every thing- especially at the lights!

0-60 3.6 seconds or less.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxkkZtVHMzc

[V8weight]

If you watch the vid....you will see that mooch is performing the TC flash method.

He is just not sitting there and powerbraking the trans to death. He is getting a flash point to the TC and some pre spool to the turbos...you can hear it. He just likes to do it in 3 steps. on off on off....kinda like his women.

So the two ships method or duck foot is the same as Pat's 1,2,3,4,5 method is the same a mooch's three step get yer ass out of my fucking way method.

Your mileage may vary.

Too funny
Was mine only 5 steps? I could have sworn there were at least 7:vhmmm: I must have omitted something. Did I include the step where you reach over and open and close the glove box while spinning the navigation knob? It would be nice to keep duck-foot-rat in the center console just to help engage the launch sequence when needed. Somebody pulls up next to you at a red light and gives you the look...... To which you respond, "hold on, I have to get duck-foot-rat to activate launch control".

[mmaturo]

eeehhh well as the stop light king here i am sure i concur on the methods described, i do MaxRS6 version with a little Mooch. In S, (i leave ASR on as often i just forget when the opportunity rolls up next to me and i don't want to look tooooooo obvious...besides if the throttle application is right it makes no difference) I brake, then tap the revs a little as mooch says then hold to 2K and roll off the brake and into the throttle easy and all the way in the throttle once rolling to skip any wheel spin. G37s don't stand a chance. Or most things. Ummmm not sure how to address the life of the tranny, got 45K out of the last one, first two were still born.

[DHall1]

"I told you people not to forget that duck-foot-rat!" Now how the hell are we going to get out of here and beat that GT-R.

http://i950.photobucket.com/albums/ad348/03RSTT/RS6pics/duckfootwing1.jpg?t=1265677632

[V8weight]

"I told you people not to forget that duck-foot-rat!" Now how the hell are we going to get out of here and beat that GT-R.

http://i950.photobucket.com/albums/ad348/03RSTT/RS6pics/duckfootwing1.jpg?t=1265677632
$100 say's the hairy guy ate Duck-foot-rat. Big mistake, only Duck-foot-rat knew the real lunch control sequence.:stick:

[650RS]

There is a software modification that allows a "proper" stalling up of our car but as stated it isnt kind to the transmission.

Having put the disclaimer aside I have this software on my car and build 1.0bar on the line, the ECU shut's the throttle to prevent "abuse" you will also notice the ECU does this when driving with the accelerator pressed and you tap the brakes.

[Born2be]

LOL on the commentary at the end, Mooch :incar:

W>

[SAF]

I love that video.

[JRS-RS6]

There is a software modification that allows a "proper" stalling up of our car but as stated it isnt kind to the transmission.

Having put the disclaimer aside I have this software on my car and build 1.0bar on the line, the ECU shut's the throttle to prevent "abuse" you will also notice the ECU does this when driving with the accelerator pressed and you tap the brakes.

I had this from a previous post:

http://rds.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0geu99l23BLJfsAU9JXNyoA;_ylu=X3oDMTEzMWFpdmF vBHNlYwNzcgRwb3MDMQRjb2xvA2FjMgR2dGlkA0Y4NjBfMTA5/SIG=12u9rk1hv/EXP=1265773797/**http%3a//www.rs6.com/forum/attachment.php%3fattachmentid=5978%26d=1199400329

[DHall1]

After flash.

Clearly no powerbraking is needed.

Roll on throttle and the car just about climbs out of its shell.

[V8weight]

After flash.

Clearly no powerbraking is needed.

Roll on throttle and the car just about climbs out of its shell.
So that slight "huff" or hesitation is gone off the initial launch? Or maybe that is just specific to my car.

[MaxRS6]

Let's have some times to see the numbers! Congrats on the power boost!


After flash.

Clearly no powerbraking is needed.

Roll on throttle and the car just about climbs out of its shell.

[DHall1]

Huff and puff and blow your car down.

[MaxRS6]

^ Not when lil sis is riding with me..

[V8weight]

^ Not when lil sis is riding with me..
Depends on whether you're going down hill or not.

[DHall1]

Lil sis needs to move these threads along and keep digging