Thinking of H&R springs...

[Avus-RS6]

to help shorten the life of my "new and improved" DRC. It still sits a tad higher than before and frankly it bugs the shit out of me.

Has anyone actually experienced a H&R lowered RS6? I got 55K miles out of my factory original DRC and it had not failed when replaced under recall. I'm thinking the new DRC can handle 1/2 that with lowering springs... ;-) that will give me a year of a nicely lowered RS6 while I decide which coilover to install (KW likely). Sounds like a good plan, right?!? ;-)

Seriously though, I just might do it. Wisdom says it will shorten DRC life... we'll see!

J

[hahnmgh63]

I think it will be difficult but not impossible to change the springs on the shocks with the DRC connections still hooked up? I don't know if they can be disconnected and re-connected without charging but there are some checkvalves in the system. Tru-line in Seattle quoted my $600 to install the H&R's at one time but they may not have really known about the RS6's DRC. Yes, I actually purchased a set of H&R's at one time but never installed them, sold them later on EBay for 1/2 price. It is decisions like that will help keep me poor, buy high, sell low.

[AudiRS4ever]

I was thinking about doing the same thing, but most likely will just put KW's on the car next Spring if I still have it. If you do put H&R's on yours please take pictures and let us know your thoughts. I am still not sure I wouldn't rather just do that for now. Thanks!

[hahnmgh63]

I should keep my mouth shut since I'm not even a DRC owner anymore (thanks to KW) but since MTM doesn't list the lowering perches on their site has anyone contacted them to see if they are still available? What about Euro Audi as the RS6+ was advertised to sit I think 10mm lower?

[Avus-RS6]

MTM perches are $800+ through Hoppen, I called them a couple weeks ago. Cost/Benefit is poor for this product.

[AudiRS4ever]

I should keep my mouth shut since I'm not even a DRC owner anymore (thanks to KW) but since MTM doesn't list the lowering perches on their site has anyone contacted them to see if they are still available? What about Euro Audi as the RS6+ was advertised to sit I think 10mm lower?

I did try and contact MTM, but they never answer the phone, nor do they return phone calls when leaving a message. I'm done trying. Quite frankly I'm sick of always having to beg people to take my money, ie; Hoppin Motorsports, Stassis, Koni and many many other companies I have done business with in the past. That's one of the reason's I really enjoy Bilstein so much. They are always extremely nice and answer the phone. The jackass' like Stassis and Hoppin are probably wondering why they are having trouble with their business's and all they have to do is look at themselves and how they are operating. Sorry for the rant I just got a little pissed off as I thought about the 3 phone calls I put into Hoppin last week and never heard back once. :doh:

[Avus-RS6]

I got in touch with MTM after 2 tries. Stasis has been great to deal with, Jason, Jared(now gone) all very helpful and willing to take my money. I do understand your point however. Try Achtuning (they're local to me) or Stratmosphere. Both are very good to deal with and have many products for our cars.

[Avus-RS6]

Well... my local Audi dealer will install the springs, but they want 18 hours at $120 an hour to do so. I'm better off with KW's at that point. I guess I'll be sticking with DRC unless I can get a deal. :-/

[hahnmgh63]

If you decide to do the KW' Jason let me know. This winter or late fall you can bring your car to my place and we can easily get them done in a day. It wil all be easier the second time around now that I've done mine. We need to meet up sometime so you can see how my car sits.
P.S. I do have a lift in my shop which makes life much easier.

[Shoppinit]

The incorrect ride height isn't a spring issue. If you change just the springs (which won't fit anyway) then it'll be the same or worse. The DRC is over-pressurized so the shocks are jacking up your car.

Bilstein PSS9's for me.

[AudiRS4ever]

I got in touch with MTM after 2 tries. Stasis has been great to deal with, Jason, Jared(now gone) all very helpful and willing to take my money. I do understand your point however. Try Achtuning (they're local to me) or Stratmosphere. Both are very good to deal with and have many products for our cars.

I actually have used Stratmosphere and really do like them. They have always been great. Stassis however, I'd argue with you. 4 months to get an Alcon kit?!?!?!? And when I ordered it I told them please do not send track pads with it. After having to call them numerous times to track where the brake kit was I finally got it and put it on. Within 10 miles I knew something was wrong. Pulled the pads and cross referenced them to find out that they were indeed track pads. Called Stassis and asked exactly which Alcon caliper I had so I could order different pads and guess what, they didn't even know what caliper it was. Called Alcon USA and was referred to Hare "sp" racing. They were able to figure out which pads I had and actually cut a set of Hawk HPS' for me. Car is quiet as a mouse now. And I will never bother to call Stassis again. Sorry again for the rant, but thought I would chime in about how great Stassis is. You're definitely right about Achtuning and Stratmosphere though.

[TylerRS6]

When I had my DRC replaced last month, I had Carousel Audi (Golden Valley, MN) install H&R springs. I purchased the springs from them for about $200. Labor was free since they were replacing the suspension system anyways. I just had to pay for an alignment...and the springs. Very happy with the results. I'll post pics, if anybody is interested.

[Brav]

When I had my DRC replaced last month, I had Carousel Audi (Golden Valley, MN) install H&R springs. I purchased the springs from them for about $200. Labor was free since they were replacing the suspension system anyways. I just had to pay for an alignment...and the springs. Very happy with the results. I'll post pics, if anybody is interested.

Yes please post, Im scheduling my DRC soon.

[Spidercat]

When I had my DRC replaced last month, I had Carousel Audi (Golden Valley, MN) install H&R springs. I purchased the springs from them for about $200. Labor was free since they were replacing the suspension system anyways. I just had to pay for an alignment...and the springs. Very happy with the results. I'll post pics, if anybody is interested.

Any updates on loading the pix? How about the ride after a few months with the H&Rs?
I'm considering doing this. I can't deal with the looks of my RS6/Allroad hybrid. :harass:


My SA spoke with the tech, who did the correct procedure for suspension setup that we've beat to death in other threads. He said that while it's not strictly a requirement to load the car, then torque everything down, who would do otherwise? (I like this guy!) He said maybe if someone were in a rush or something...

He also suggested letting it settle a bit more (2K miles), and if it didn't settle down, we could talk about it. I'm going to do that since it did settle a little just on the ride home, but hasn't really budged since.

These springs seem like a cost effective way to get my car to pre-DRC "fix" stock height again. I'm waiting to get an estimate just to replace the springs. I can't see how on earth it could be 18hrs labor. If it's only 4-6 hrs maybe I'll do it to tide me over until I get KWs.

Anyway,
Audi/KYB MUST have known that the new DRC raises the ride height of the car by a lot. I'm sure they put a lot of work into engineering a fix. It does ride better (stiffer and more "planted"). But why, oh why, would they raise the height? :vhmmm:
Just tell me, Audi! I'm reasonable, I can handle it. Just need a reason...

[hahnmgh63]

Spidercat, it almost scares me that your tech thinks that because it doesn't say to load up the suspension before tightening that it is Ok. Any mechanic knows that any car with rubber bushings in the suspension needs the car loaded before tightening. It even says so in the Bentley for the A6/S6/RS6 and for my tt. And my Porsche's manuals, both 944 Turbo and 911. Unless the suspension is all Monoball and/or spherical joints that is what needs to be done. It sounds like these dealer "techs" are all pathetic paper reading knowledgless idiots nowadays, definitely not mechanics. I guess if the manual doesn't have say common sense is needed then they don't use it.

[Spidercat]

No, he doesn't think that it would be ok to do that. He actually seemed a little insulted that I thought he might have done that. He's a good mechanic. I guess he was more reponding to what some around here have been spouting about the new DRC ride height problem being simply the result of torqueing everything down on a unloaded car. Obviously that's not the case.

The ride height is higher. Why? It's not a mechanic's oversight.

Has anyone's RS6 been returned to them at the same height as when they dropped it off???

[Hy Octane]

Avus.. How is the ride different compared to pre fix and post fix?

[Avus-RS6]

I never measured, but I think it's about 1cm higher all around after.

[Hy Octane]

No, I mean as far as ride quality. Is it the same, firmer, less firm..??

[uncfrk]

I'm new here. My suspension was done by Carousel MPLS. Measurements are 14.125 front & 14.55 rear, with nearly a full tank of fuel. Drove it for the first time since I first test drove it 3 weeks ago. The ride is definitely stiffer than my test drive before purchase & suspension fix. Now it's perfect. After a 100 mile road trip, ---- An awesome Beast!!!!

[AudiRS4ever]

Is anyone ever going to take pictures and post them with the H&R springs on? And it would be nice to also hear how the car rides with them on. Just wondering.............:looking:

[DHall1]

Welcome to the new America.

Service and knowledge are gone with the wind.

:w:


I did try and contact MTM, but they never answer the phone, nor do they return phone calls when leaving a message. I'm done trying. Quite frankly I'm sick of always having to beg people to take my money, ie; Hoppin Motorsports, Stassis, Koni and many many other companies I have done business with in the past. That's one of the reason's I really enjoy Bilstein so much. They are always extremely nice and answer the phone. The jackass' like Stassis and Hoppin are probably wondering why they are having trouble with their business's and all they have to do is look at themselves and how they are operating. Sorry for the rant I just got a little pissed off as I thought about the 3 phone calls I put into Hoppin last week and never heard back once. :doh:

[DHall1]

Look 2 threads up by the member from Sweden.

Looks very good.


Is anyone ever going to take pictures and post them with the H&R springs on? And it would be nice to also hear how the car rides with them on. Just wondering.............:looking:

[DHall1]

Your car is spot on.

Enjoy the beast


I'm new here. My suspension was done by Carousel MPLS. Measurements are 14.125 front & 14.55 rear, with nearly a full tank of fuel. Drove it for the first time since I first test drove it 3 weeks ago. The ride is definitely stiffer than my test drive before purchase & suspension fix. Now it's perfect. After a 100 mile road trip, ---- An awesome Beast!!!!

[DHall1]

18hrs.

Pleeze.....give me a break.




Well... my local Audi dealer will install the springs, but they want 18 hours at $120 an hour to do so. I'm better off with KW's at that point. I guess I'll be sticking with DRC unless I can get a deal. :-/

[DHall1]

What took you so long.

Please post pics!

Carousel sounds like a good place.


When I had my DRC replaced last month, I had Carousel Audi (Golden Valley, MN) install H&R springs. I purchased the springs from them for about $200. Labor was free since they were replacing the suspension system anyways. I just had to pay for an alignment...and the springs. Very happy with the results. I'll post pics, if anybody is interested.

[DHall1]

Mine is the same pre/post

I can only add that pre was not totally shot. Mine had just started to seep.




No, he doesn't think that it would be ok to do that. He actually seemed a little insulted that I thought he might have done that. He's a good mechanic. I guess he was more reponding to what some around here have been spouting about the new DRC ride height problem being simply the result of torqueing everything down on a unloaded car. Obviously that's not the case.

The ride height is higher. Why? It's not a mechanic's oversight.

Has anyone's RS6 been returned to them at the same height as when they dropped it off???

[V8weight]

What took you so long.

Please post pics!

Carousel sounds like a good place.
Carousel Audi is phenomenal, it's a shame they'll never have a chance to do the DRC on my car:hihi:

[TylerRS6]

Yes please post, Im scheduling my DRC soon.


Sorry for the delay. Here are some recent pics...

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f183/Tyler2000S4/DSC_0014-6.jpg

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f183/Tyler2000S4/DSC_0013-4.jpg

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f183/Tyler2000S4/DSC_0017-1.jpg

[AudiRS4ever]

Thanks for the pics. How does it ride? Bouncy, or pretty much stock?

[Spidercat]

Nice, TylerRS6! Thanks for the pix.
That to me looks pretty good. Can you fit a finger between the front tire and the top of the wheel well?
I might go with this if the ride is stiff and not bouncy.

[DHall1]

Man that looks good.

I would also like the feedback on ride quality. bouncy or firm.

Also, can you measure from center wheel hub to top lip of fender on the front and rear.

That will give us an idea on how low the drop is.

[Spidercat]

Oh, and did the dealer give you any BS about maybe they wouldn't cover the DRC fix if it went bad since they used aftermarket springs to lower the ride height? Sorta like voiding the warranty?
That has been hinted at downtown here when I inquired about a re-do w/the H&Rs, or even having somebody else do the H&Rs.

[Spidercat]

Just ordered the H&Rs from ECS @ $275 delivered 2nd day air! Can't beat that with a stick!
They are on sale for $202 right now. Site says they lower the F 1.4 inches/R 1 inch, and are stiffer than stock.

[TylerRS6]

New DRC with H&R springs ride quality is great. Not bouncy at all...just more aggressive. I am so happy with this "upgrade". The handling is very much improved. Night/Day difference. No issues from the dealership at all. In fact, they sold me the springs. It will not effect the DRC warranty.

I cannot get a finger in-between the front tire and fender, or a piece of paper :-0 ...
I can get a finger in-between the rear tire and fender though. Occasionally, I have some rubbing in the front when turning over a bump or steep driveway. I haven't had the time to figure out where the rubbing is coming from, but will post results when I do. I'll also measure and post the drop.

-Tyler

[hahnmgh63]

Tyler, check that rubbing in the front, with the H&R's I am lowered to 13 1/8" front & 13 1/4" rear with KW's and I don't have any rubbing problems. I imagine your higher than this so I'm not sure where the problem is. These measurments are take from the center of the hubs to the bottom of the fender flare openings.

[V8weight]

New DRC with H&R springs ride quality is great. Not bouncy at all...just more aggressive. I am so happy with this "upgrade". The handling is very much improved. Night/Day difference. No issues from the dealership at all. In fact, they sold me the springs. It will not effect the DRC warranty.

I cannot get a finger in-between the front tire and fender, or a piece of paper :-0 ...
I can get a finger in-between the rear tire and fender though. Occasionally, I have some rubbing in the front when turning over a bump or steep driveway. I haven't had the time to figure out where the rubbing is coming from, but will post results when I do. I'll also measure and post the drop.

-Tyler
You're running spacers though right?

[DHall1]

I will venture to guess that he is lower than 13 1/8 on the front. Thus the rubbing.

There is no finger clearance between tire and front fender.

I guess 12 7/8 on the front.




Tyler, check that rubbing in the front, with the H&R's I am lowered to 13 1/8" front & 13 1/4" rear with KW's and I don't have any rubbing problems. I imagine your higher than this so I'm not sure where the problem is. These measurments are take from the center of the hubs to the bottom of the fender flare openings.

[DuckWingDuck]

ya, if there's no finger clearance, you're def going to have rubbing issues. my left front had to be jacked up because I was rubbing going into turns. Of course, I am also running an unhealthy 20 :P

[TylerRS6]

You're running spacers though right?

Just running 10s in the rear. Nothing in the front. I'll measure today and post the results.

Thanks guys!

[TylerRS6]

Alright. Just measured from the center of the hub to the the fender.

Front = 13"

Rear = 13 3/4"

Going to make an appt with the dealer to get this fixed...

[Spidercat]

Going to make an appt with the dealer to get this fixed...

You mean the rubbing?

[TylerRS6]

You mean the rubbing?

Yep. It has gotten worse now that it's freezing cold here now :-(

[Spidercat]

Lemme know the results if you don't mind before I throw them on my car. I still have a ton of room left to go down, though.

[V8weight]

Alright. Just measured from the center of the hub to the the fender.

Front = 13"

Rear = 13 3/4"

Going to make an appt with the dealer to get this fixed...
I'm at 12 3/4 in the front and 12 7/8 in the rear, and I've never had my tires rub even with 4 adults in the car. Maybe the Kw's don't offer as much suspension travel? I remember seeing your car in person and thinking to myself that the tires seemed abnormally wide. They obviously have a larger section width than the PS2's that I'm running.

[Spidercat]

Questions:
1. Is anyone SURE that the DRC doesn't have to be opened just to replace the springs? Someone had written "no need to open the DRC," but my mech friend couldn't see how. I really want to avoid the dealer due to the logistics/timing/price. He's willing to do it, but understandably doesn't want to open the system.

2. Does anyone have any input re:stiffer (H&R) springs on the rear only? I would intuitively think that it would make the car tend to OVERsteer more (which is fine with me), much like a stiffer rear sway bar. The front height doesn't bother me that much. I would also avoid any potential rubbing problems if I did the rears only. The ride height is about an inch higher in the rear now, and the H&R drop the rear 1 inch, so I would think I'd be just about even.

Any thoughts?

[hahnmgh63]

I replaced my complete DRC system in order to install my KW's and as I did it I thought about the H&R's as I had originally purchased them but later decided not to bother with the DRC. If a mechanic was very careful the springs could be installed without opening the system. I think two people would help very much. One to hold all of the lines steady and one to operate the spring compressor tool and remove the springs. The springs on my "New Fix" DRC weren't under much compression and they could probably be replaced without need for a spring compressor tool.

[Avus-RS6]

So if I get the H&R's will you help me put them in?

[Shoppinit]

The connection to the DRC is at the bottom of the strut, so you should be able to change the springs without disconnecting. You might have to twist yourself into unholy positions, but you should be ok.

You can see the eye hole for the banjo bolt at the bottom of the strut, just before the shaft.

http://img200.imageshack.us/img200/2429/dscn1639c.jpg

I can't help thinking that you should be getting rid of the DRC altogether...

[Spidercat]

Thanks, guys!
I wholly agree this is a band-aid until I get a real suspension setup. The new drc "feels" a lot better, but my car no longer looks like it did before the fix. Just trying to get it to look "right" again.

[AudiRS4ever]

Thanks, guys!
I wholly agree this is a band-aid until I get a real suspension setup. The new drc "feels" a lot better, but my car no longer looks like it did before the fix. Just trying to get it to look "right" again.


I would agree with your statement. If you end up just doing the rear springs, and not the front I would think you would have a car that no longer handles correctly though. I don't know the weight of either the stock springs, or the H&R's. As long as they are both linear you probably won't have that much of a problem, but if the H&R's are progressive and the stocks are linear you will get some very sporadic handling from the rear of the car. If you go this route I'd like to see pictures and get your input. I'm just like you as far as I don't think the front looks bad, just the rear. Let us know. Thanks! :incar:

[DHall1]

^^

+1

NEVER mix and match spring rates without fully understanding what your taking off and what your putting on.

:nono:




I would agree with your statement. If you end up just doing the rear springs, and not the front I would think you would have a car that no longer handles correctly though. I don't know the weight of either the stock springs, or the H&R's. As long as they are both linear you probably won't have that much of a problem, but if the H&R's are progressive and the stocks are linear you will get some very sporadic handling from the rear of the car. If you go this route I'd like to see pictures and get your input. I'm just like you as far as I don't think the front looks bad, just the rear. Let us know. Thanks! :incar:

[Spidercat]

I would agree with your statement. If you end up just doing the rear springs, and not the front I would think you would have a car that no longer handles correctly though. I don't know the weight of either the stock springs, or the H&R's. As long as they are both linear you probably won't have that much of a problem, but if the H&R's are progressive and the stocks are linear you will get some very sporadic handling from the rear of the car. If you go this route I'd like to see pictures and get your input. I'm just like you as far as I don't think the front looks bad, just the rear. Let us know. Thanks! :incar:

Thanks. You make some good points. The H&R's are progressive (don't know about the stocks). They are stiffer than stock, but I don't know the load rating difference. I'll look into it. I think that putting on both F/R would lower the car even MORE (proportionately) in front (1.4 inches) compared to the rear (1 inch), so it would "look" even worse than it does now. That can't be good for handling either.
Either way, since these are the only springs available, I can always add the fronts later, or switch the rears back to stock if the minor variation in how it handles (if it's even apparent) is somehow worse than having to look at the drc mullet (business in the front, :trash: in the back). I will definitely post pictures whichever I do.

Most understeer-prone track/race cars have stiffer rear spring rates to help compensate, no? I really don't think my car is going to flip over in a corner just because I stiffen the rear springs (I'm willing to take that gamble), or even lose a couple seconds/lap at the local track. I should be so lucky as to have a local track.

[4ng crcs]

Most understeer-prone track/race cars have stiffer rear spring rates to help compensate, no? I really don't think my car is going to flip over in a corner just because I stiffen the rear springs (I'm willing to take that gamble), or even lose a couple seconds/lap at the local track. I should be so lucky as to have a local track.

Isn't H2 your local track? :)

[Spidercat]

Isn't H2 your local track? :)

Hah! Touche!
I really wanted to buy on that side of the island when we came back here just for the drive to/from work. Not kidding.
Nothing even remotely new in over there in our price range, though. I couldn't deal with a fixer-upper, not at those asking prices!

[4ng crcs]

I was visiting an old army friend who lives in Ewa a couple of weeks ago and we had a reunion at the home of one of the guys who lives mauka side of Mililani. I was amazed at how comfortable it was up there compared to Ewa... must have been 10 degrees cooler.

[Spidercat]

Yeah, I live Mauka. Much cooler, but rains frequently. But hey, that's what quattro's for, right?