R8 successor.

[RXBG]

according to my memory the current R8 is supposed to run through MY 2014.

can anyone speculate (Qisha) on goings on in the quattro gmbh skunkworks dept? i assume they'd want to move on this because such a project is easier to protect in light of porsche's takeover the further along it is once they have the influence to modify or cancel it....

[Bodhii]

Well it looks much more likely that VW will be owning Porsche in the very very near future. That being said,.. , with Porsche in control, the biggest question for the R8 will be what will replace the current Porsche 997 rear engine model. It has been heavily rumored that Porsche will (MUST?) go with a mid-engine platform flag ship car to stay competitive in racing. If Porsche maintains its control over VW/Audi, then the R8's future may be in jeopardy.

But Porsche will NOT maintain control of VW/Audi. And if the current Audi R8 GT3/LMS can rake up some significant race victories, the R8 will remain a new landmark long into the future.


Volkswagen eyes move on Porsche

By Daniel Schäfer in Frankfurt

Published: April 22 2009 23:33 | Last updated: April 22 2009 23:33

Volkswagen is considering an audacious bid for Porsche’s automotive business, in another extraordinary twist in the corporate saga surrounding Germany’s most famous car dynasty.

Several people close to the situation said VW’s management was weighing the option of buying Porsche AG, in a move that would bring relief to the highly indebted parent Porsche SE holding company.
EDITOR’S CHOICE
VW’s Piëch steers towards Porsche deal - Apr-22
VW profits fall 74% in spite of truck sale - Apr-22
John Gapper: Porsche travels east and gets longer - Apr-22
VW hedges give Porsche €6.8bn windfall - Mar-31
Porsche to cut costs amid drop in sales - Jan-30

This would turn upside down Porsche’s audacious takeover of VW, which started three and a half years ago. VW is Europe’s largest car company whose turnover is roughly 15 times as great as Porsche’s.

“The tail would finally stop wagging the dog,” said a person familiar with the thinking of VW’s management.

Wendelin Wiedeking, Porsche’s chief executive, has in the past repeatedly locked horns with VW’s management and works council.

The plan emerged as shareholders were set to convene at VW’s annual meeting on Thursday.

The move would allow Ferdinand Piëch, grandson of Ferdinand Porsche, the founder who designed the VW Beetle, to integrate the sports carmaker into VW as its 10th marque and thus finalise his task of reuniting his family heritage.

The Porsche and Piëch families jointly own Porsche SE, the holding company as well as 50.76 per cent of VW’s shares. The holding company would keep keep the VW stake after such a deal.

The price, which is facing many obstacles and could still be dropped in favour of another solution, came after Porsche had revealed it had net debt of €9bn.

Analysts and bankers have argued that Porsche could run into difficulties servicing its debt.

A Porsche spokesman, who said he was unaware of the takeover plans, said the €280m it was about to receive in VW dividends and its operating profit would be enough to make its interest payments this year.

Porsche has reaped huge profits in the past years from controversial VW option trades. It made €6.8bn, more than double its revenue, from its VW takeover in the past six months alone. However, analysts said most of these profits were paper gains and could not be easily converted into cash.

Arndt Ellinghorst, analyst at Credit Suisse, said it would be the most logical solution to use VW’s €10.7bn net cash from its automotive division to buy the sports car business.

People close to the situation warned the plan was still facing many obstacles, such as the question of Porsche’s valuation. Estimates vary from €6bn to €9bn.

Another question is if the regional state of Lower Saxony, which owns about 20 per cent of VW, would support such a move.

[RXBG]

come one guys. someone must care????

[tvrfan]

iam really interested in an R8 successor. so far i know, theres a law that porsche CANT stop develpment of cars from audi or canceling project from audi. i read it a time ago in the german Auto motor sport. so a R8 successor will be awesome. and i hope that audi will give this thing the power it really needs.

[roadrunner]

My glass bowl can only look into the future till 2012 - j/k

It is too far ahead and a too sensible matter that anyone will be willing to give you a decent answer :vhmmm:

[Erik]

I don't think the 911 will go the mid engine route, not for a while at least.
The car is still competetive, and sells, don't you think?

The best way to find out what the next step will be for the next R8 will be to look into future concepts, but mainly to see where what steps the Gallardo will take.

[The Pretender]

Another problem with a mid-engined 911 is that you can't have 4WD in combination with a flat six.
There is no room for a axle, the flat six obstructs either way.

btw, I highly doubt there will be a next gen R8.

Jarod.

[G@Fourtitude]

I asked Michael Dick about this recently and a replacement sounded like a done deal. I have more details (not about R8 specifically, but about some corporate strategies not mentioning any Porsche models specifically) and am working on an upcoming article on the subject. I know I'm being vague and I apologize about that, but hope to have much more posted on my site soon.

[Bodhii]

a replacement sounded like a done deal.... hope to have much more posted on my site soon.

LOL.. What a hook to your site!!! :D
That's like promising to reveal the true identity of GOD or something! :dance:

[RXBG]

my opinion on the matter is that it will likely be an evolution of the current car (like the new and old TT's) with the major difference being that audi will likely go with front/rear sport diff rather than the current viscous coupling differential. it will remain the corporate halo car but will probably be designed to allow force induced engines in the rear mid engined position. and will definitely offer a DSG gearbox.

why do i care about this? well, some business plans MAY delay my acquisition of a V10 R8 by a year and if this is the case and i don't expect to see the car till CY 2011 by then i may only be a year from seeing test mules. don't get me wrong- but if things move faster than i think i'll be driving a V10 in less than a year anyway.

[The Pretender]

It's already confirmed by the development team that the next Gen Audi mid-engined car will be designed to allow force induction engines to be installed.
N/A engine are dying animals anyway IMHO.

[RXBG]

twincharged 4.5L V8 with 550 hp and 450 of torque and 24 MPG combined. in a 3200 lb 2 seater rear mid engined car.

hey audi. can you do it?

[The Pretender]

twincharged 4.5L V8 with 550 hp and 450 of torque and 24 MPG combined. in a 3200 lb 2 seater rear mid engined car.

hey audi. can you do it?
No, more likely will be a 4.0TFSI V8 Supercharged engine, less heat development then a bi-turbo.

[RXBG]

No, more likely will be a 4.0TFSI V8 Supercharged engine, less heat development then a bi-turbo.


we'll see in sept. i expect the new audi V8 will be shown then in the D4 A8.

[emve]

we'll see in sept. i expect the new audi V8 will be shown then in the D4 A8.

The new A8 will have 4,2FSI (372hp) and 4,2TDI (340hp) from start. 4,0TFSI might replace 4,2FSI in 2011 here.

My guess is twin-turbo.

[Audiphile]

Well it looks much more likely that VW will be owning Porsche in the very very near future. That being said,.. , with Porsche in control, the biggest question for the R8 will be what will replace the current Porsche 997 rear engine model. It has been heavily rumored that Porsche will (MUST?) go with a mid-engine platform flag ship car to stay competitive in racing. If Porsche maintains its control over VW/Audi, then the R8's future may be in jeopardy.

But Porsche will NOT maintain control of VW/Audi. And if the current Audi R8 GT3/LMS can rake up some significant race victories, the R8 will remain a new landmark long into the future.

I think this has been the plan along. I read at least a year ago tha VW-Audi will do reverse merger and take over Porsche. Porsche has accumulated very serious debt to grab shares of VAG which it cannot service. If VW-Audi swallow Porsche (I think his is very likely and the news is only now trickling out of Germany), then Piech will be the most powerful car czar since the dawn of the automobile. Say what you will about him, but he is genius and has a very strong love for Audi. Who knows he may push Audi to be the main power over VAG.

[Bodhii]

Porsche AG labour leader rejects sale to (Audi)/VW

FRANKFURT, May 6 (Reuters) - The senior labour leader at Porsche AG, the sports car business entirely owned by heavily indebted Porsche Automobil Holding SE (PSHG_p.DE), rejected any sale to VW and called on the owners to raise fresh capital.

The Porsche and Piech clans that control the SE and indirectly Volkswagen with its majority voting stake are meeting in their home town of Salzburg on Wednesday in the hopes of finding a solution to its high-risk takeover plans for Volkswagen (VOWG.DE) that have backfired.

A decision could fundamentally shift the balance of power in favour of VW's crafty chairman and part owner of Porsche, Ferdinand Piech.

"I would like to emphasize this once more: it is time for the Porsche and Piech families increase the capital in order to redeem the debt," Porsche AG works council boss Uwe Hueck told German news channel n-tv.

Porsche is expected to make a statement later in the day, although some analysts and bankers are sceptical any key decisions could be reached, since VW's powerful unions could voice opposition while VW large shareholder Lower Saxony can veto any deal.

Until recently, Porsche SE appeared to be on course to building its voting stake in VW to 75 percent this year as planned, taking majority control in January.

Starting in March the first cracks appeared, as Porsche clinched an 11th-hour deal to rollover 10 billion euros ($13.32 billion) in bank debt only to report days later that it had amassed 9 billion in net debt as of Jan. 31, when its fiscal first half ended.

Since then, speculation mounted over how Porsche could continue with its plans, in particular since owning 75 percent would still not give it access to raid the 10.7 billion euros in automotive net cash at Volkswagen.

Reports appeared that said Porsche Chief Executive Wendelin Wiedeking and finance chief Holger Haerter had lost the backing of the two clans, as Porsche Chairman Wolfgang Porsche and cousin Ferdinand Piech battle over whether to merge the two companies into one or sell Porsche AG to VW to raise funds.

Hueck reaffirmed Sunday's comments from his chairman in the Frankfurter Allgemeine Sonntagszeitung, who ruled out a disposal.

"I can ensure you, Porsche will not be sold," Hueck said.

Piech, the 72 year-old Austrian chairman of Volkswagen has dominated events in Wolfsburg since his ascension as CEO in 1993 and is looking to cement his place in history next to grandfather Ferdinand Porsche, the creator of the VW Beetle.

A brilliant tactician and engineer, Piech aims to tighten his control by pushing Volkswagen -- led by chief ally Martin Winterkorn -- to buy Porsche's sports car business.

Speculation of a planned capital increase at Porsche SE has surfaced and the sheikh of Qatar has gone on the record with his interest in buying some sort of stake in Porsche.

Talk has also grown that family members might have to sell one of the crown jewels: Porsche Holding GmbH, Europe's largest car dealership that has a monopoly on VW sales in Eastern Europe. (Reporting by Christiaan Hetzner, Edward Taylor and Philipp Halstrick; Editing by Jon Loades-Carter and Andrew Macdonald) ($1=.7467 Euro)