DRC update!! See here!!

[Hy Octane]

http://forums.audiworld.com/rs6/msgs/44439.phtml

C'mon folks.. Time to get even!

[DHall1]

Got it! It seems too good to be true but my info has been sent over. And I replied to your post on AW.

Burn DRC burn!



http://forums.audiworld.com/rs6/msgs/44439.phtml

C'mon folks.. Time to get even!

[RS6richard]

I have been in contact with Audi UK about the dreaded DRC failures. They are Teflon - nothing sticks, if you're out of warranty (I am by two weeks) then cough up a lot of cash.
Audi UK will not admit an issue, and won't comment on lawsuits in North America - even citing the cars are from different factories and may well have different components!!!???!!!!
It would be great to get all the UK owners to email their DRC issues to produce solid evidence to force Audi UK to admit liability.
My email is richardepatterson@gmail.com.
My car is a 2005 RS6 Avant, 40K miles, FASH. Just having first pair of shocks replaced along with new DRC valve - £1,700 in total. I have only owned the car 2 months so less than happy :-(

[snoopra]

I have been in contact with Audi UK about the dreaded DRC failures. They are Teflon - nothing sticks, if you're out of warranty (I am by two weeks) then cough up a lot of cash.
Audi UK will not admit an issue, and won't comment on lawsuits in North America - even citing the cars are from different factories and may well have different components!!!???!!!!
It would be great to get all the UK owners to email their DRC issues to produce solid evidence to force Audi UK to admit liability.
My email is richardepatterson@gmail.com.
My car is a 2005 RS6 Avant, 40K miles, FASH. Just having first pair of shocks replaced along with new DRC valve - £1,700 in total. I have only owned the car 2 months so less than happy :-(
Why didn't you just go aftermarket? Would have been cheaper and MUCH MORE reliable.

[aussie rs6]

http://forums.audiworld.com/rs6/msgs/44439.phtml

C'mon folks.. Time to get even!

If this were to happen, and i will believe it when I see it, there would be much wailing and gnashing of teeth at H&R, Bilstein, KW, Stasis as contemplate lost sales to DRC trouble ridden RS6 owners.

What I am interested in is the opinion from fellow posters:

"is a coilover system better than a fully functioning DRC" - I know, lets just imagine there is such a thing as a fully functioning DRC

I notice that the AMG black SL 65 has gone for a quality adjustable coilover system. Adjustable from the drivers seat we don't need- follow the KISS principle.

see section on suspension www.mercedes-amg.com/SL65BlackSeries/

john

:rs6kiss: :rs6kiss: :rs6kiss:

[DHall1]

I must say that a fully working DRC is a very good ride. Comfort with handling. My RS6 has 28k, fully intact DRC and added Hotchkis sway bars. As DWD can attest, when we drove another RS6 and then mine back to back last fall....there was a hands down winner in all phases. I have also driven a coilover RS6. Granted it was not setup properly but that car drove like shit. Lumber wagon is my only comment. I will take my DRC/Hotchkis any day of the week.

Dont even get me going on the AMG Black series. Those things are flat out race cars with leather. I looked over a CLK Black up at the dealer last time I was up there. Wow. My wife will shoot me if I even open my mouth about another car. I mean her E55 is like greased lightning when its unleashed in a straight line but the corners and twisties is where the AMG loses. I dont know about the Black but I have a feeling that is fixed.

Oh well, give them 3 more years and I may buy one.





If this were to happen, and i will believe it when I see it, there would be much wailing and gnashing of teeth at H&R, Bilstein, KW, Stasis as contemplate lost sales to DRC trouble ridden RS6 owners.

What I am interested in is the opinion from fellow posters:

"is a coilover system better than a fully functioning DRC" - I know, lets just imagine there is such a thing as a fully functioning DRC

I notice that the AMG black SL 65 has gone for a quality adjustable coilover system. Adjustable from the drivers seat we don't need- follow the KISS principle.

see section on suspension www.mercedes-amg.com/SL65BlackSeries/ (http://www.mercedes-amg.com/SL65BlackSeries/)

john

:rs6kiss: :rs6kiss: :rs6kiss:

[Yellow RS6]

Well it's Friday and no update from blooscloos since the initial post on 1/20. I feel a big disappointment coming on..........

[DHall1]

:idea: Sit back and relax. This will take months. Just the fact that Rob has an Audi USA VP even talking to him is proof that Audi knows about this problem and all of us RS6 owners screaming at the top of our lungs does indeed make some sort of difference.

Esp since Audi is spending 6 million dollars on a ad spot in the Superbowl and the added fact that Audi Germany has pinpointed the USA as a huge potenital to gain marketshare in new business. Audi had record sales in Dec 08. Nearly 30% gain over year to year.

:w:



Well it's Friday and no update from blooscloos since the initial post on 1/20. I feel a big disappointment coming on..........

[DuckWingDuck]

shrug, i saw my aftermarket parts as a sunk cost, i doubt anything will come of this.

[Qisha]

Dear Friends,

all US spec RS6 (~1.200 Units) will be DRC fixed. This will include new upgraded Shocks (connecting rod etc.). The special tools needed are already ordered, as well as the parts. Techs are (again) trained on how to successfully fulfil this procedure.

Everything will start off ~march/april. All known owners will be contacted.

A extended warranty on this procedure is also included.

Qisha

[formula1man]

Perhaps an "stumm" question but how do we inform Audi of a registered owner just to be safe? Many thanks, Aaron.

[DHall1]

Everyone,

There are far too many arrows pointing in this direction.

Wow!!!! Its about time.





Dear Friends,

all US spec RS6 (~1.200 Units) will be DRC fixed. This will include new upgraded Shocks (connecting rod etc.). The special tools needed are already ordered, as well as the parts. Techs are (again) trained on how to successfully fulfil this procedure.

Everything will start off ~march/april. All known owners will be contacted.

A extended warranty on this procedure is also included.

Qisha

[p3u]

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by Qisha http://www.rs6.com/forum/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.rs6.com/forum/showthread.php?p=151292#post151292)
Dear Friends,

all US spec RS6 (~1.200 Units) will be DRC fixed. This will include new upgraded Shocks (connecting rod etc.). The special tools needed are already ordered, as well as the parts. Techs are (again) trained on how to successfully fulfil this procedure.

Everything will start off ~march/april. All known owners will be contacted.

A extended warranty on this procedure is also included.

Qisha

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>


What if we don't get contacted, as I just bought my RS6 in December. Can I simply go to a dealership and have them replace it? Are there any costs involved or 100% covered by audi?

Thanks!

[SAF]

Techs are (again) trained on how to successfully fulfil this procedure.

Qisha

LOL, again?? They weren't trained the first time. I had to educate my RS6 tech on how a pulled shock meant new everything.

[aussie rs6]

Dear Friends,

all US spec RS6 (~1.200 Units) will be DRC fixed. This will include new upgraded Shocks (connecting rod etc.). The special tools needed are already ordered, as well as the parts. Techs are (again) trained on how to successfully fulfil this procedure.

Everything will start off ~march/april. All known owners will be contacted.

A extended warranty on this procedure is also included.

Qisha

Qisha, thank you for the post.

This is very positive news for US owners.:wo:

Appreciate any information as to whether logically this 'offer' applies to all RS6's world wide as my DRC is dying a slow death. :vgrumpy:

Or do non US owners have to launch an action as well to achieve this. I cannot believe that Audi would not do the 'fix' world wide.

:rs6kiss: :rs6kiss::rs6kiss:

[DHall1]

Like I have been saying for months and months. Audi has an eye on the US market. And we RS6 owners and RS4 owners have been making lots and lots of noise about this faulty system.

Its a quick pill to swallow for Audi and just fix these DRC systems once and for all. Then all of us RS6 owners will shut up. We may even buy another Audi. Myself included. When Audi is stepping up for a 60 second commercial in the Superbowl (Go Cards) you know the Germans have a plan. 6 million for that 60 seconds. Wow, that will fix alot of DRCs. Hahah

The Germans want US market share. We have a big bullseye on our backs and US car makers going down the tubes. Audi wants in. 23% increase in sales during Dec 08. Hans is counting his money and remember that guy I told all of you to send your direct emails to??? I wonder if that got them going?

Either way. Audi does see value in the US market and we :addict: owners carry some heavy bad news baggage for the homeland. Haha, I like it!!!!

As for the "downunders", it may take some time. Lets get a few cars fixed and on the roads. Your time may come.



Qisha, thank you for the post.

This is very positive news for US owners.:wo:

Appreciate any information as to whether logically this 'offer' applies to all RS6's world wide as my DRC is dying a slow death. :vgrumpy:

Or do non US owners have to launch an action as well to achieve this. I cannot believe that Audi would not do the 'fix' world wide.

:rs6kiss: :rs6kiss::rs6kiss:

[DHall1]

Maybe this worked!

http://www.rs6.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17125

[Qisha]

Dear Friends,

to everyones bad it took time to analyze, redesign, and get the cooperating shock manufacturer to get the part building process going.

I understand you have a lot of questions on how to proceed. At the moment preparations are in progress, affected VIN´s, origin- deliverin dealerships, getting the needed parts over, inform the dealerships etc.

As all of the US RS6 will be done, there will be a guidance on how to get your car done- if you are not contacted.

All OE parts (in detail: shocks) in german stock have been returned to the manufacturer for the redesigned exchange. So no further DRC repair procedures will be covered with anxious if- or not there will be a deja vu.

At this time i can only tell about the US spec RS6. It is more than likely this procedure will be extendend on other markets, may it be by "revaluation campaign" or by specific fault claim.

This information is a step before official release, so please admit some time to get everything going.

PS: Mr. Eric Felber is one of Audi´s company spokesman. Everything that got to him was forwarded.

Qisha

[DHall1]

That last line is PRICELESS!

:rs6kiss:



Dear Friends,

to everyones bad it took time to analyze, redesign, and get the cooperating shock manufacturer to get the part building process going.

I understand you have a lot of questions on how to proceed. At the moment preparations are in progress, affected VIN´s, origin- deliverin dealerships, getting the needed parts over, inform the dealerships etc.

As all of the US RS6 will be done, there will be a guidance on how to get your car done- if you are not contacted.

All OE parts (in detail: shocks) in german stock have been returned to the manufacturer for the redesigned exchange. So no further DRC repair procedures will be covered with anxious if- or not there will be a deja vu.

At this time i can only tell about the US spec RS6. It is more than likely this procedure will be extendend on other markets, may it be by "revaluation campaign" or by specific fault claim.

This information is a step before official release, so please admit some time to get everything going.

PS: Mr. Eric Felber is one of Audi´s company spokesman. Everything that got to him was forwarded.

Qisha

[sallyh]

Hi all

Well this is absolutely brilliant! Good on you everyone in the USA who kept on at Audi about this issue. I also hope that "the fix" will come to Australia, and elsewhere. The RS6 is just too good a car to be constantly shadowed by this DRC thing.

[Yellow RS6]

Sorry, I'm still pretty new here, but does Qisha work for Audi (or at Quattro gmbh)?

[Marv]

Qisha

This is very interesting news - any more information about whether this will be the case in Europe would be much appreciated.

I had mine done under warranty 2.5 years ago, the car is now out of warranty and the 'clunk-in-the-trunk' is coming back - I'm not looking forward to the service in March....

Marv

[cornishmoocher]

This will be the "fix" that they introduced in the UK i reckon...... A rubber gator over the piston to stop the ingress of shit into the seals..... or to stop you from seeing the oil leaking from the shocker. The system then needs to be re-pressurised to 16 bar. There is only 1 of these units in the UK at the moment. Once this is done the problem will be cured! Mine lasted 2 months. Wankers. Sorry, but how long do Audi think they can keep pulling the wool over our eyes for? I got sopisssed off at my car never having a working suspension system in 12 months, despite 4 sets of DRC, that the crap had to come out. Its not just the expense, its the inconvienience and time, which are irreplacable.

[hahnmgh63]

I do have a new set of KW's waiting in my shop for install but I may hold off just to see if this comes through. If they do it for all RS6's in the US and warranty it, and it fails miserably on warranty again for all cars, I will laugh my ass off at Audi and the expense they will have just outlayed. I'll probably even drive my car harder just to put more stress on the suspension.

[Yellow RS6]

Well that's a great attitude, why don't you just put the KWs on and not waste Audi's time (and parts!) then? Time and parts that could be going into another RS6 of someone who appreciates Audi finally stepping up.

[DHall1]

Then your stuck with the KWs.

There is some word that aftermarket parts may be refunded.

I am interested in the new design. I know we give Audi a hard time but is Chevorlet making an R8? I didnt think so.





I do have a new set of KW's waiting in my shop for install but I may hold off just to see if this comes through. If they do it for all RS6's in the US and warranty it, and it fails miserably on warranty again for all cars, I will laugh my ass off at Audi and the expense they will have just outlayed. I'll probably even drive my car harder just to put more stress on the suspension.

[cornishmoocher]

Well that's a great attitude, why don't you just put the KWs on and not waste Audi's time (and parts!) then? Time and parts that could be going into another RS6 of someone who appreciates Audi finally stepping up.NOt wishing to butt in on someone elses comment, But........... Audi have had a blatent disregard for both us in the UK and you guy's in the states, they may have fitted 4 sets of DRc o my car in 12 months, FOC, but that does not compensate for the time wasted, hassle and down right misery of having a car that does not work properly- and Audi KNOW it does not work properly mores to the point!
So why not play them......(if you can be arsed) The fix wont work anyway! (if its the same fix as here, which they are using on the B7 as well just for your information- so reckon it will be), id much rather have a system that worked now, tomorrow and always, rather than "oh shit, theres thjat wallowy clunk again, and only one month after that lot was changed.....AGAIN"!!!!
All imho- of course :D

[Hy Octane]

Quisha..
Could you please (in any way that you are able) inform the people in charge of this that the single biggest problem that needs to be addressed is the lack of USA tech knowledge of how an RS6 should feel with a properly functioning DRC. Most people had their cars fail before any techs actually made note of how the car ran new from the factory, so when they repaired it improperly, they didnt have anything to compare it to so they have no idea how to know when they have done the job properly. It would be a waste of time to just send a kit over with some instructions. Audi needs to have some one from GMBH present to show these American dealers/techs where the line is drawn between functional and non functional repairs. Otherwise, if the techs dont know how firm the ride is supposed to be when fixed properly, they will do what they have been doing which is to give your car back with new parts but with old repair technique and if the owner complains its not right, they simply say 'well, its up to specs' which we all know dont exist. So, please, if you can, make them understand that all this is for naught unless they can have an expert there to oversee each repair. Also, we are hoping that Audi dont opt for an 'Americanized" version of the dampers and soften up the ride. My DRC when new, was extremely firm. Like zero rebound and you could put all your weight on one fender and it wouldnt budge. This is RS ... what they have done since is BS..They dont seem to be able to bleed all the air out of the lines so there is always bounce and lean even when they say its perfect.
If they think that by softening up the damping it will extend the life of the components, then we will be back where we are now with spongy rides and unhappy customers. Gmbh needs to understand that we Americans who bought this car expected the same performance the Germans enjoy and do not want smoother shifting or softer suspensions.. we are car enthusiasts not grandmothers and we hope they will treat us as such..
If there is any way you can pass this message along it will be most appreciated and these are the main concerns we owners have with this fix,; We have waited over 5 years now and it needs to be right this time..
Thanks old friend.. You know how long I have been fighting for this and your help has been fantastic..

[Qisha]

Dear Hy Octane,

i totally understand your worries. To make it short, the latest repair procedure -that will come to use- is not only saving about 25% of time in total per car, it also unmistakeably cleares that the central valve has to be pressurized @16 bar, not more- not less. In the past some of this pre-pressure went out by finalizing the repair procedure, most likely by mishandling. Less pre-pressure=softer ride. To rule this out, the valves are "self closing" after pressurizing the system, no way to loose pressure-, otherwise the tool will point out "start over".

The proceeded longrun tests with the re-engineered shocks do not show any unnormal wear or leakage.

Again, i apologize and do admit for a little more time until everything starts running.

PS: as there are questions about my intentions or personal relationship to Audi-, as you call the RS6 a Beast, maybe i am a "Beastmaster", who is trying to help...

Qisha

[DHall1]

All in all, I am very pleased with the words from our friend in Germany.

I can tell everyone that can barely remember what a working DRC feels like that when the system was working, it was flawless. My DRC has never been opened up and works wonderfully along with the added Hotchkis sway bars. Ask DWD/Greg how firm and steady my RS6 was when we drove it last fall back to back with a "unknown" stock RS6.

It was the deal maker when I bought my RS and yes, HyOctane my fender does not budge when you put your weight on each corner. Firm, firm, firm. Its a pleasure to drive.

I have high hopes for the new system and repair process. And yes, all those calls/emails/reports to DOT and finally Rob with the class action did indeed get the ball rolling along. Its only fair, this is the top of the heap and was 90k over 5yrs ago.



Dear Hy Octane,

i totally understand your worries. To make it short, the latest repair procedure -that will come to use- is not only saving about 25% of time in total per car, it also unmistakeably cleares that the central valve has to be pressurized @16 bar, not more- not less. In the past some of this pre-pressure went out by finalizing the repair procedure, most likely by mishandling. Less pre-pressure=softer ride. To rule this out, the valves are "self closing" after pressurizing the system, no way to loose pressure-, otherwise the tool will point out "start over".

The proceeded longrun tests with the re-engineered shocks do not show any unnormal wear or leakage.

Again, i apologize and do admit for a little more time until everything starts running.

PS: as there are questions about my intentions or personal relationship to Audi-, as you call the RS6 a Beast, maybe i am a "Beastmaster", who is trying to help...

Qisha

[Bigglezworth]

Without getting sidetracked on the DRC repair matter that looks like it's coming to fruition, let's not forget there are a 100 or so cars in Canada as well..... 90 2004 models and 10'ish (estimate) that have been imported since July 07 when the Gov't of Canada revised Bumper Standard regulations. I'm hopeful that this is an Audi Cars of North America effort and that the models in Canada will also receive the retrofit.

Tim

[snoopra]

Yeah, totally forgot about our Canadian brothers.

[vangelis]

Here is the right place to post this question,, guys,, i was wondering if this will cover only owners from USA or going to apply all RS6 owners around the world :)

[sallyh]

Hi all

Sorry to mention the "nemisis at the traffic lights", but, when our current (now sold) M5's transmission failed completely at a roundabout (the "red cog of death"), BMW replaced it without a stomp of the foot, a yell, a complaint or anything. All from a regional BMW dealership. That's what I call a great car company. The Audi RS6 is a great car but Audi has a lot to learn. The M5 is not for me, but the RS6 is, but I really wish Audi would get its act together and realize that to be a great car company is more than Super Bowl Ads, sponsering ocean going yachts etc. Once again, I thank everyone who got Audi to get to and do something about this DRC issue.

[DHall1]

Your observations are true. BMW is far ahead on the service after the sale component. Its also no accident that BMW is ahead on sales in the USA and has a much better reputation.

BMW takes care of its "M series" car buyers. Period.

BMW knows these M series buyers make up the core group of people with the passion and money to buy thier cars for years to come. That is key to long term goals and repeat sales in this niche of the car world.





Hi all

Sorry to mention the "nemisis at the traffic lights", but, when our current (now sold) M5's transmission failed completely at a roundabout (the "red cog of death"), BMW replaced it without a stomp of the foot, a yell, a complaint or anything. All from a regional BMW dealership. That's what I call a great car company. The Audi RS6 is a great car but Audi has a lot to learn. The M5 is not for me, but the RS6 is, but I really wish Audi would get its act together and realize that to be a great car company is more than Super Bowl Ads, sponsering ocean going yachts etc. Once again, I thank everyone who got Audi to get to and do something about this DRC issue.

[Benman]

Qihsa,

Excellent news, thank you!

Ben:addict:

[DuckWingDuck]

Not to appear even more Doom and Gloom but wouldn't this repair be an admission of guilt? Can't I on the basis of this recall file a suit claiming negligence on the part of Audi?

[DHall1]

As for admission of guilt or not. I tend to side with Qisha and the statement of how Audi has been working on this and had knowledge of the problems. Again, making parts that can be recharged and parts that interchange while holding all pressure. ect.

You can file anything you wish. Your only going to collect damages and how much will your legal costs be? Now you did incur some damages but was it the fault of the DRC? Can you make that case after the fact, years down the road? Didnt you submit your damages to insurance? How much was really out of pocket? And what are the damages now? Zero. How much will it cost to try and do you have a 100% chance at winning? If you lose, your out everything and didnt get the settlement that was offered.

Now, if the CEO of Boeing was killed in a crash due to a failed DRC. We have another story.

??

:doh: :argue:



Not to appear even more Doom and Gloom but wouldn't this repair be an admission of guilt? Can't I on the basis of this recall file a suit claiming negligence on the part of Audi?

[SAF]

I'd be surprised if this is coming as an official "recall". More likely a service bulletin that flags when an RS is in for anything suspension related, if the car hasn't had the fix (whatever it may be).

[DuckWingDuck]

Heh@Dave, was just playing devil's advocate painting out a potential outcome of a "recall"; the pronoun I was meant generalistically (hmm, not sure if that's a word or not...)

[Hy Octane]

Dear Hy Octane,

i totally understand your worries. To make it short, the latest repair procedure -that will come to use- is not only saving about 25% of time in total per car, it also unmistakeably cleares that the central valve has to be pressurized @16 bar, not more- not less. In the past some of this pre-pressure went out by finalizing the repair procedure, most likely by mishandling. Less pre-pressure=softer ride. To rule this out, the valves are "self closing" after pressurizing the system, no way to loose pressure-, otherwise the tool will point out "start over".



Qisha

Quisha..
So, are you saying that the central valves will still come pre-pressurized to 16 bar from the factory or will the dealer/techs now be able to do this in house?
Actually, from what I have been able to learn from those I have spoken to, the area that seems to cause most repairs to be improper is the lack of understanding about the proper procedure for evacuating the lines and shocks themselves before filling. It appears that many repairs are faulty due to their not getting negative pressure in all lines and shocks before refilling them causing there to be air in the lines when the CV is connected. Thus, we get up to 3-4 rebounds just from pushing on the fender when it shouldnt really move at all. One shouldnt be able to compress hydraulic fluid but one can compress air if its in the lines..
Please if you can, pass on to your people that this area needs to be looked at when the new parts/procedures are sent to the USA. With just a little communication, we will be able to avoid the same problems we went thru before.. Remember, most of the RS6 trained techs from 5 years ago have moved on now and considering that they were never trained in DRC repairs in the first place, it is imperative that Audi makes a foolproof DRC training this time for the current USA techs.
As usual, Quisha, thanks for your help in these matters.
BTW, last time in for service, my tech was replacing a transmission in another RS6..He said it was the common problem of the Torque converter that had failed. I asked him if Audi had made any improvements to the tranny as a result of all the failures we have seen and he said that they had strengthened the internal parts that had been causing the problems.. Do you have any more info as to what and when they did this?
My tranny slips between 2200 and 2800 rpm in any gear except 1st if you let off the accelerator and then get on it again.. every time.. and I am trying to get Audi to admit its wrong. They say its normal wear.. I know better.

Thanks Quisha..

HY O.. :cheers:

[Qisha]

Dear Hy Octane,

the service revision provides that the central valves can be re-pressurized to factory spec of 16 bar. The revised version of the procedure combined with the special designed toolkit makes it impossible to fail in evacuating the system properly leading to a "success only" state. Otherwise the tookit will point out to start over with the procedure. A mishandling is ruled out.

I would assume that the outcome will be to the utmost satisfaction.


Transmission:

the base ZF 5HP24A is able to transfer 420NM. For use in the RS6 application it has been strengthened to cope with 560NM. This is initially and the strengthened 5HP24A has been used since production start.

To me it sounds like a faulty multi-plate clutch. To diagnose this impression i would recommend to change the transmission oil as well as the fine mesh filter withing the oilsump. The darker the replaced oil is, the more wear of the multi-plate clutch is what you can expect- the lighter the oil is, the better. By removing the oilsump you can also see how processed the wear is. The transmission is filled with ~11l of oil, make sure to rinse the transmission by re-filling and clearing the transmission about three times. This is recommended since you only remove a third- to half of the oil with each procedure. After this you should be good- if the oil shows no advanced particle appearance and/or visual wear. If so, you will be in need to do either a transmission revision or get it replaced.

Qisha

[vangelis]

Dear Hy Octane,

the service revision provides that the central valves can be re-pressurized to factory spec of 16 bar. The revised version of the procedure combined with the special designed toolkit makes it impossible to fail in evacuating the system properly leading to a "success only" state. Otherwise the tookit will point out to start over with the procedure. A mishandling is ruled out.

I would assume that the outcome will be to the utmost satisfaction.


Transmission:

the base ZF 5HP24A is able to transfer 420NM. For use in the RS6 application it has been strengthened to cope with 560NM. This is initially and the strengthened 5HP24A has been used since production start.

To me it sounds like a faulty multi-plate clutch. To diagnose this impression i would recommend to change the transmission oil as well as the fine mesh filter withing the oilsump. The darker the replaced oil is, the more wear of the multi-plate clutch is what you can expect- the lighter the oil is, the better. By removing the oilsump you can also see how processed the wear is. The transmission is filled with ~11l of oil, make sure to rinse the transmission by re-filling and clearing the transmission about three times. This is recommended since you only remove a third- to half of the oil with each procedure. After this you should be good- if the oil shows no advanced particle appearance and/or visual wear. If so, you will be in need to do either a transmission revision or get it replaced.

Qisha

Thanks a lott Qisha for all your efforts and support in this issue. I have a question please, I have 2004 Audi RS6 got it from Ali & Sons which is the Audi dealer for Abu Dhabi - UAE. My question is, Are we going to get the revised version of DRC once it is done for US? Do we need to contact Audi Middle East here about this? Is there any step we have to do at the moment from our side here?

[Dutch RS6]

Same question for the Netherlands (Europe).

[Hy Octane]

Thank you Qisha. If only our techs here knew as much as you!
We will be waiting anxiously for the new fixes..
Still owe you that beer.. and give that dog a hug for me too ..<S>

HY

[coco]

Thank you for your effort Qisha for DRC issue.
I have the same DRC replacement question for Japan.
I've already replaced center pressure valve at a local dealer and the second time will be soon, I think.

I've contacted AUDI Japan (not a dealer) yesterday and they do not recognize anything about it nor nothing has come from AUDI of Germany.
Is there anything I can do in Japan? to solve this issue like you guys have in the U.S.?

Actually we have another issue regarding DRC in Japan.
We have pretty tight vehicle inspection here in Japan.
And if I put an aftermarket coilover system on any of RS6, it won't be approved to drive on the public road here in Japan. That means, I have to replace aftermarket coilover kit back to original equipment before inspection.

What would be the better solution here?

[DHall1]

you just need to hang on. we dont even have the repair parts here in the usa yet. keep your car going the best you can and wait till we actually have some cars fixed here.

i hate to say this but we are first most likely becuase we made the most noise and had class action threat in the works.

also audi wants more usa marketshare. not good pr when you have top rs6 owners screaming and yelling to threat the class action.





Thank you for your effort Qisha for DRC issue.
I have the same DRC replacement question for Japan.
I've already replaced center pressure valve at a local dealer and the second time will be soon, I think.

I've contacted AUDI Japan (not a dealer) yesterday and they do not recognize anything about it nor nothing has come from AUDI of Germany.
Is there anything I can do in Japan? to solve this issue like you guys have in the U.S.?

Actually we have another issue regarding DRC in Japan.
We have pretty tight vehicle inspection here in Japan.
And if I put an aftermarket coilover system on any of RS6, it won't be approved to drive on the public road here in Japan. That means, I have to replace aftermarket coilover kit back to original equipment before inspection.

What would be the better solution here?

[DHall1]

The reality here is that Audi USA is starting to turn the tide of response to DRC.

http://forums.audiworld.com/rs6/msgs/44900.phtml

Interesting to read this owners account of RS6 performance. I too agree with those statements as we currently own a AMG with more hp and tq that the RS6 but I would not trade the RS for anything. DRC or not.

Just happy to see Audi start to step up.

Rob has also had his car repaired with the "new" updated kit.

[coco]

Thank you DHall1 for letting me know update about the DRC issue.
It's a great news for you guys living in the US.

I talked to one of Audi dealers in Japan and they said order of recall job by Audi is AoA and Audi of Japan!!

Hope, it's the case for this time, too.

[Qisha]

Dear Friends,

update:

all certified US Dealers will receive the updated DRC Repair Toolkit: VAS 6544.

All global certified Dealers are able to order either the updated Toolkit VAS 6544- or upgrade from prior version VAS 6209 to VAS 6209/4. (upgraded Version is equal to VAS 6544).

Further all certified Dealers can access and download a new Training Video as well as tech notes and written material through their Online Servicenetwork. This should be available anytime soon after CW 09/09.

Qisha

[SAF]

Sept '09 for the toolkit and Training Video, or is that just for the download? Does that mean the "new" parts will not be delivered until after that? Thanks for the update!

[Qisha]

Dear Friends,

for clarification:

CW (calendar week) 09/09 is starting at Feb 23rd 09. Download and parts will be available anytime soon after this week.

Qisha

[DHall1]

Thats a long time to go before any docs get printed. There is word of a car or cars having been fixed already. What exactly is the story here?

Rob gets his car fixed with a authorized Audi/Germany service rep and we are left holding the bag.

There are no specifics on what was "changed" and several members have made the comment and noted that the part numbers have not even changed.

If anyone has a car right now with leaking shocks. You better go out and order your KW struts. You could kill yourself between now and Sept 09.

I hope the CEO of Boeing doesnt kill himself between now and Sept 09.

I must admit, not impressed by the situation at all.

Edit because of the post above:

I still have reservations due to part numbers that are being listed on the repair. It seems the part numbers are the same as before. We have questioned what exactly is different with no answers. Is it the service kit thats different? Moving forward, how will the "new" system be serviced when a shock fails? Replace 1 shock or 2 or all 4 with central valves?

I think we all deserve to see these service bulletins given the run around we have all had over the years. Someone has to read and understand how to properly fix these cars. And our necks are on the line every day.


Sept '09 for the toolkit and Training Video, or is that just for the download? Does that mean the "new" parts will not be delivered until after that? Thanks for the update!

[GEN XER]

I think or at least I hope Qisha is talking Julian date when she says calender week 0909 which is 23 Feb and not Sept 2009. I have an issue with my DRC and I prefer to have it fixed by Audi. I hear the clunking when I hit bumps, I went WOT once and hit a man-whole-cover and nearly lost my RS6 before I really had her, so I'm really familiar with the problems of the DRC. I can also tell that if it worked it would be a really nice system, because on smooth corners the car is really flat and handles like nothing I have felt before. Since I just got the car I'm a lot more patient than some of you who have been going through this for years and years, but I feel your pain. Just ask me how I feel about Chrysler and the SRT8 and you will get an entirely different answer. LOL.

[vangelis]

I have a question here please. Is there any official documentation from Audi we can print and give it to Audi dealers to prove this! as they won't take the posts at the forum here as an official documents. Another question, Is that going to be free or we are going to pay for repair fees? Is it going to repair the faulty ones or a brand new 4 coilovers?

[GEN XER]

I have a question here please. Is there any official documentation from Audi we can print and give it to Audi dealers to prove this! as they won't take the posts at the forum here as an official documents. Another question, Is that going to be free or we are going to pay for repair fees? Is it going to repair the faulty ones or a brand new 4 coilovers?

IAW this link of instructions http://forums.audiworld.com/rs6/msgs/44439.phtml
they are replacing the whole system. The dealers dont know about it yet. There is no TSB yet. There is only one car that has been fitted with the new system as of now, I guess for testing and we are still in the que/ wait mode. It will be fixed for free.

[DuckWingDuck]

As I have said many times both in person and on the boards, I'll believe it when I see it and honestly, unless Audi has been working behind the scenes to redesign the DRC, how do you patch fix something that is fundamentally unsound?

[hahnmgh63]

I agree as I'm in a bit of a dilema. I have a new set of KW V3's in my shop as well as all new suspension arms/bushings etc... to go in. If Audi is only recharging the system a better way than before, and replacing a few more parts than before (instead of trying to do the minimum, cheap route), it will fail again, maybe not as soon as many have been failing due to the new procedures but it will fail. If it is not a redesigned system with redesigned parts, I would rather have the cash, and I would install my KW's and sign a waiver than I will not bother them again about the suspension. Otherwise, if it is the same old crap, with a new & improved re-install procedure, we should go ahead with a class action suit against Audi.

[GEN XER]

Well I hope for Audi's sake they do the right thing. They really cant afford the negative press of a class action that alleges an unsafe Driving system when they have tried so hard to become the standard of AWD. I mean they still use this system after all, and if you want to be considered in the same class as BMW then it goes w/o saying that you make this right in your RS cars. This would have already been fixed had it been in an M car from BMW, they would never let those owners tell potential buyers to buy something else because of an unsafe/ unreliable suspension system. The one thing BMW has right is that if you complain about there cars to many time for the same reason you get another car in most cases, I have seen it happen on several occasions.

[DHall1]

I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head.

The only problem here is this.

The one and only guy willing to go ahead with a class action suit just got his car fixed. Do you think this was by accident?

We pretty much got hosed and wasted even more time. Should have listened to Grizz. He said weeks ago to bag the whole friggin thing and the "new" fix was a just a crap full of the old stuff.

Put the KWs on. Screw the DRC.




I agree as I'm in a bit of a dilema. I have a new set of KW V3's in my shop as well as all new suspension arms/bushings etc... to go in. If Audi is only recharging the system a better way than before, and replacing a few more parts than before (instead of trying to do the minimum, cheap route), it will fail again, maybe not as soon as many have been failing due to the new procedures but it will fail. If it is not a redesigned system with redesigned parts, I would rather have the cash, and I would install my KW's and sign a waiver than I will not bother them again about the suspension. Otherwise, if it is the same old crap, with a new & improved re-install procedure, we should go ahead with a class action suit against Audi.

[GEN XER]

I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head.

The only problem here is this.

The one and only guy willing to go ahead with a class action suit just got his car fixed. Do you think this was by accident?

We pretty much got hosed and wasted even more time. Should have listened to Grizz. He said weeks ago to bag the whole friggin thing and the "new" fix was a just a crap full of the old stuff.

Put the KWs on. Screw the DRC.

Now thats some funny stuff there. I dont care who you are, thats some funny stuff there. So what you are saying is Audi has shutup the one person they needed to shutup and the rest of us are just SOL. LOL. :lovl: I think you are right because I cant get any responses over on the Audiworld Forum about this. I dont like KW's who else makes replacements?

[DHall1]

Glad I can offer some enjoyment to all. :deal:

I am sure Audi has something in the works but yes, they shut up the one person that had the means and broken car to cause some real pain in Audi's behind.

Then when we see the part numbers and they are the same old shit. We ask questions. Then we get the silence.

Hey, if it walk like a duck, talks like a duck and smells like a duck. We all got quacked.

I donno. All this government bailout stuff has me all fired up. The poor suckers that go to work every day and make house payments on time, every time are getting the big shaft. Everyone else that got in over thier heads and are upside down in homes or cant make payments at 15% interest get bailed out and principal lowered. :vgrumpy::noshake::argue:

I mean really. WTF


Now thats some funny stuff there. I dont care who you are, thats some funny stuff there. So what you are saying is Audi has shutup the one person they needed to shutup and the rest of us are just SOL. LOL. :lovl: I think you are right because I cant get any responses over on the Audiworld Forum about this. I dont like KW's who else makes replacements?

[GEN XER]

Glad I can offer some enjoyment to all. :deal:

I am sure Audi has something in the works but yes, they shut up the one person that had the means and broken car to cause some real pain in Audi's behind.

Then when we see the part numbers and they are the same old shit. We ask questions. Then we get the silence.

Hey, if it walk like a duck, talks like a duck and smells like a duck. We all got quacked.

I donno. All this government bailout stuff has me all fired up. The poor suckers that go to work every day and make house payments on time, every time are getting the big shaft. Everyone else that got in over thier heads and are upside down in homes or cant make payments at 15% interest get bailed out and principal lowered. :vgrumpy::noshake::argue:

I mean really. WTF

Oh do get me started on this big load of BS!! They messed up my whole business. I cant flip a house right now to save my life, I mean I could but who the hell am I going to sell it to. I saw this coming and sold off all my real estate before it hit and moved into one of my rental properties. Now I have to wait for the market to recover, when I don't see that happening for at least 2 more years, why, because it was 2005 when we stopped the ARM interest only loan programs to get folks who would not ordinarily qualify for a home into home and these loans don't balloon until 2010, when we will see more folks file for bankruptcy and go into foreclosure, unless the government does something to stop it. I cant stand to see these folks get over but most of them were hustled by fast talking snake oil salesmen who got rich off them and cant be found now. The answer is not to stand around for the next two years and wait for more folks to default and go bankrupt, we have to head this one off somehow, so i can go back to making money.

[DHall1]

Well you made a very wise move to sell out before the shit hit the fan.

We also cleared out of our largest property investment in Oregon just before loans were dried up. 750k property. That was too close to call. We also pulled out 90% of all stocks when the crooks started getting picked off.

"They messed up my..." They is a wide valley. IMHO its the lack of oversight and the whole banking industry that turned into quasi "investment banks" who then packaged up securitized mortgages/CDOs to poor suckers on Wall Street. Those CDOs are now worthless and the "banks" are under water. City and B/A were the worst and if we get into those books you will see Trillions of losses. City and B/A need to go under now.

I hope it clears up in 2 years. It could be 10 in some areas. CA,NV,AZ


Oh do get me started on this big load of BS!! They messed up my whole business. I cant flip a house right now to save my life, I mean I could but who the hell am I going to sell it to. I saw this coming and sold off all my real estate before it hit and moved into one of my rental properties. Now I have to wait for the market to recover, when I don't see that happening for at least 2 more years, why, because it was 2005 when we stopped the ARM interest only loan programs to get folks who would not ordinarily qualify for a home into home and these loans don't balloon until 2010, when we will see more folks file for bankruptcy and go into foreclosure, unless the government does something to stop it. I cant stand to see these folks get over but most of them were hustled by fast talking snake oil salesmen who got rich off them and cant be found now. The answer is not to stand around for the next two years and wait for more folks to default and go bankrupt, we have to head this one off somehow, so i can go back to making money.

[Hy Octane]

Geez guys.. Lets be a bit patient here.. They did say march/april.. so lets not go worshiping the golden idol.. If Qisha says its happening, it is..

[Qisha]

Dear Friends,

the VAS 6209 toolkit consists of:

Vehicle adapter with charge valve
Connection hose
Venturi with breather hose
Valve
Pressure limiter
Pressure gauge with valves and charge hose
Suction hose
Waste oil container
New oil container

VAS 6209/4 Upgrade Kit:

Adapter for front shock absorbers
Adapter for rear shock absorbers
Filler lines with quick-release couplings
Pump unit

VAS 6544

Adapter for front shock absorbers
Adapter for rear shock absorbers
Filler lines with quick-release couplings
Pump unit with integrated pressure gauge and oil containers
connection hoses

Attached you will find pics of each Kit.

Hope this will help to show the differences.

Qisha

[Hy Octane]

Qisha. Thanks for those pics.. One question..

Do you know why the original shocks were failing and what they have done to fix them so they wont leak anymore?

[Qisha]

Dear Hy Octane,

in short terms:

Kayaba has changed the sealing ring attached on the piston rod. The piston rod itself got a new surface structure.

When a damper leak emerges there a different stages of damage. If noticed soon, there is no hardware damage- solely a oil leakage. Depending on driving style- a hardware damage on the dampers is most likely to happen due to:

less pressure -> piston rod is able to plunge deeper -> more oil is suppresed by the rods capacity -> damper inner pressure rises -> sealing ring blurts and/or piston rod twists itself (->nut of damping rod falls off)

It is not for certain that each stage happens as listed. I would only like to show best to worst stages- in case of a DRC problem.

The whole story caused a lot of headaches, since Kayaba assured to have delivered the parts by blueprint layout and the opposite was hard to proof by lab experiments. Finally the all new damper is the result of a long term argument. Since Kayaba owns the production rights on the DRC, no other supplier could have been involved...

Qisha

[vangelis]

Qisha, THANKS A LOT for all your efforts in this.

I have a question plz, Is that new /upgraded kit going to be with the dealers once it is released? is it MUST for every dealer to buy /get it? How can we get our DRC fixed for free thourgh the dealers here? Is there any official notice to dealers going to be sent from Audi mentioning that? or we going to pay for that fix?

[GEN XER]

Well you made a very wise move to sell out before the shit hit the fan.

We also cleared out of our largest property investment in Oregon just before loans were dried up. 750k property. That was too close to call. We also pulled out 90% of all stocks when the crooks started getting picked off.

"They messed up my..." They is a wide valley. IMHO its the lack of oversight and the whole banking industry that turned into quasi "investment banks" who then packaged up securitized mortgages/CDOs to poor suckers on Wall Street. Those CDOs are now worthless and the "banks" are under water. City and B/A were the worst and if we get into those books you will see Trillions of losses. City and B/A need to go under now.

I hope it clears up in 2 years. It could be 10 in some areas. CA,NV,AZ

Man you sure you were not at the Christmas party I just attended. We just had this very conversation. One of my friends said it would take 10 years to clear up this mess and most folks agreed, but one Real Estate Investor was not trying to hear that, but you are right we are in for a long, slow recovery that is going to take us back to disciplined investment.

[GEN XER]

Dear Hy Octane,

in short terms:

Kayaba has changed the sealing ring attached on the piston rod. The piston rod itself got a new surface structure.

When a damper leak emerges there a different stages of damage. If noticed soon, there is no hardware damage- solely a oil leakage. Depending on driving style- a hardware damage on the dampers is most likely to happen due to:

less pressure -> piston rod is able to plunge deeper -> more oil is suppresed by the rods capacity -> damper inner pressure rises -> sealing ring blurts and/or piston rod twists itself (->nut of damping rod falls off)

It is not for certain that each stage happens as listed. I would only like to show best to worst stages- in case of a DRC problem.

The whole story caused a lot of headaches, since Kayaba assured to have delivered the parts by blueprint layout and the opposite was hard to proof by lab experiments. Finally the all new damper is the result of a long term argument. Since Kayaba owns the production rights on the DRC, no other supplier could have been involved...

Qisha

Well it certainly sounds like somebody knows what is wrong and is working on our behalf to make things right, so Ill give Audi the benefit of the doubt. I cant help but be sarcastic though. I mean from what Qisha said it looks likea lot of back and forth on who was responsible or who was going to foot the bill and Audi could not just scrap KYB because of legal/ contract issues. They probably tried though.

[DHall1]

I did say above that...."Audi has something in the works"

I can only hope that....

1. Dealer staff know how to use this stuff.
2. How can we assure that we are getting the new components/shocks when the part numbers are the same?

Qisha-thank you

Dave


Dear Hy Octane,

in short terms:

Kayaba has changed the sealing ring attached on the piston rod. The piston rod itself got a new surface structure.

When a damper leak emerges there a different stages of damage. If noticed soon, there is no hardware damage- solely a oil leakage. Depending on driving style- a hardware damage on the dampers is most likely to happen due to:

less pressure -> piston rod is able to plunge deeper -> more oil is suppresed by the rods capacity -> damper inner pressure rises -> sealing ring blurts and/or piston rod twists itself (->nut of damping rod falls off)

It is not for certain that each stage happens as listed. I would only like to show best to worst stages- in case of a DRC problem.

The whole story caused a lot of headaches, since Kayaba assured to have delivered the parts by blueprint layout and the opposite was hard to proof by lab experiments. Finally the all new damper is the result of a long term argument. Since Kayaba owns the production rights on the DRC, no other supplier could have been involved...

Qisha

[SAF]

Qisha, thank you for your posts.
Reading that description and looking at those pictures, I certainly hope Audi plans to have a trained tech do this install and training. Hopefully they will identify the dealers that have an RS6 customer in need of this overhaul and then send in someone to make sure it is done right - the first time. I pray they don't count on a downloaded video to be sufficiant for every service department in the country to do these installs without some hands-on experience! If that's the case, I will petition Webster's to add "DRC" to the definitions listed under Clusterf@ck, because that is exactly what it will be.

If that happens, we will be right back where we were long ago, i.e. trying to explain to the techs the proper procedures for replacing the DRC components. (and that sad situation was not the fault of the techs, it was the fault of Audi for not providing accurate training and service information when the failures began to pop up years ago.)

I hope this replacement project falls smoothly into place in my lifetime, but I have my doubts.

[Hy Octane]

Ya know, the one thing I get now is that Audi (or Gmbh) were not just sticking their heads in the sand about this.. rather, it now appears that once they figured out there was a big problem with the DRC system, they have been trying to convince Kayaba (the manufacturer) that there was a problem.. looks like Kayaba disagreed. ..I guess they finally relented since changs have been made..but it obviously was being worked on while we thought they werent listening..
Perhaps some kind of input from Audi might have relieved some pressure from the whole thing, but as we know, they are super reluctant to admit a fault and thus opening themselves up to media and public scrutiny of the brand again.. Maybe next time..
I really feel for all the owners here that turned their Beasts in over this issue but I also have some frustration over having to spend my last 4 years of a new sports car dealing with this as well as not being able to enjoy the machine the way it was intended.... and lastly, the subsequent premature extreme devaluation of them as a result.
Looking forward to finally enjoying my car again the way it was new.

[DHall1]

I agree. This should have been handled by Audi in a different manner.

Many owners left Audi. The cars value and stock is in the toilet. Current owners are disgruntled.

Well said.


Ya know, the one thing I get now is that Audi (or Gmbh) were not just sticking their heads in the sand about this.. rather, it now appears that once they figured out there was a big problem with the DRC system, they have been trying to convince Kayaba (the manufacturer) that there was a problem.. looks like Kayaba disagreed. ..I guess they finally relented since changs have been made..but it obviously was being worked on while we thought they werent listening..
Perhaps some kind of input from Audi might have relieved some pressure from the whole thing, but as we know, they are super reluctant to admit a fault and thus opening themselves up to media and public scrutiny of the brand again.. Maybe next time..
I really feel for all the owners here that turned their Beasts in over this issue but I also have some frustration over having to spend my last 4 years of a new sports car dealing with this as well as not being able to enjoy the machine the way it was intended.... and lastly, the subsequent premature extreme devaluation of them as a result.
Looking forward to finally enjoying my car again the way it was new.

[DuckWingDuck]

So, what about those owners who took out the DRC due to a lack of warranty coverage and safety concerns for something else?

[DHall1]

SOL :argue:

At least your car is safe to drive on the road.

Audi....meet Greg and Greg's 357 Magnum. :vgrumpy:

You can fill in the rest.







So, what about those owners who took out the DRC due to a lack of warranty coverage and safety concerns for something else?

[SAF]

<img src="http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3278/3289151370_38e9c435df_o.gif">

[DHall1]

LOL

:mech:

His 357 Magnum is in his pocket. Come on over AOA. (Did everyone catch the little AOA on the letter?)

Priceless






http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3278/3289151370_38e9c435df_o.gif

[GEN XER]

Anything new on this front?

[coco]

Hi everybody,

Unfortunately my DRC went bad and I have to replace all four suspensions and a couple of central valve for DRC.

A dealer that I deal with told me that one cntral valve costs 241,500yen which is more than $2,500 a piece!!
Don't you guys think that is absurd?

Does anybody know the price of central valve in any country?
Is there any place that I can get those parts?

FYI, factory suspension was about $700 a piece.

Please let me know.

Coco

[DHall1]

You better bail out of that system asap. The chances of getting a proper fix is about 2%. Look, we cant get these things fixed in the US and they sold a 1000 of them here.

Install KW struts and forget about it.

IMHO


Hi everybody,

Unfortunately my DRC went bad and I have to replace all four suspensions and a couple of central valve for DRC.

A dealer that I deal with told me that one cntral valve costs 241,500yen which is more than $2,500 a piece!!
Don't you guys think that is absurd?

Does anybody know the price of central valve in any country?
Is there any place that I can get those parts?

FYI, factory suspension was about $700 a piece.

Please let me know.

Coco

[Benman]

Late to the party but got my notice in the mail... looking like August for repairs.

Ben:addict:

[MikeL01]

Interesting,
I had taken my letter to my Audi service manager and he was pissed to say the least. Not at me but at Audi for making them tow the company line that there no issues with the DRC. Lets see, when I had a shock replaced I was told that the other 3 had "stage 2 seepage" and could not be addressed until they were at "stage 4". Now I'm not a Mechanical Engineer (just a Civil Engineer) BUT leaking is leaking. Good work fellow RS6 owners. There is strength in numbers.

[DHall1]

Thats a new one for me. They "stage" the leaking?

Give me a break. Its a 90,000 dollar car not a Kia Rio. Come on Audi....get your shit together.

Lets at least get a PSI reading for each side of the X DRC and make sure the PSI is within spec. Because if you have a leak that was dried up...all thats left is some old remains but the X line is low. That is a danger to drive on the road. Thats the bigger problem.

There will be a big time accident caused by this suspension some day.




Interesting,
I had taken my letter to my Audi service manager and he was pissed to say the least. Not at me but at Audi for making them tow the company line that there no issues with the DRC. Lets see, when I had a shock replaced I was told that the other 3 had "stage 2 seepage" and could not be addressed until they were at "stage 4". Now I'm not a Mechanical Engineer (just a Civil Engineer) BUT leaking is leaking. Good work fellow RS6 owners. There is strength in numbers.

[Spidercat]

I guess it depends on where you take your car. My dealer/mechanic/SA told me the first time my DRC went that one shock was "leaking a lot," and two were "seeping." He told the warranty company that all three were leaking. He told me he had to use their language to get them to cover it, and that "seeping" is a subset of "leaking" in his mind. I guess he's a lumper rather than a splitter. I hadn't heard of the "grading" of leaking before. Seems like it should be a binary issue, like pregnancy!

[coco]

Hi, everybody,

My car came back from DRC repair last night. The repair done by AUDI MEGURO in Tokyo included changing four suspensions.
The dealer said air was mixed in the central valve and hard to take the air out of the valve. But finally they said they take all the air out.
When my car finally came back from almost three weeks repair trip to the dealer, I noticed the height of the car went up. I mean there is more than two inches of space between the top of the tire and the fender.

While I drove the car, kind of expecting nice ride, on a highway, I noticed the suspension is pretty stiff, picking up little bumps so much. Simply stiff, not sturdy.
When I went over large bump, I noticed the car became bumpy and takes two or three vertical movements before settles down.

Does anybody know what is going on?
If the hydro pressure is to high, the hight of the car changes?
If the air is still in the DRC system, does it also make the car bumpy and tall?

Please let me know, please.

[GEN XER]

I'm convinced. I'm just going to keep riding mine like it is. I am not ready to let the dealer touch it and fub it up more than it already is, new parts or not. On second thought I might have to go for an aftermarket setup afterall. I mean damn.

[DHall1]

Sorry for the problems. I have several questions....can you post answers?

Please clarify ride height right now. Which size tire do you have on the car? And front and rear fender gap. For example, my car has stock tire size and approx 1" fender gap on front and 1.5" gap on rear. This is the distance from the top of the tire to the top lip of the fender.

Next, exactly what components were replaced? 4 struts only?

From the answers above...I have the next steps for you.

Dave


Hi, everybody,

My car came back from DRC repair last night. The repair done by AUDI MEGURO in Tokyo included changing four suspensions.
The dealer said air was mixed in the central valve and hard to take the air out of the valve. But finally they said they take all the air out.
When my car finally came back from almost three weeks repair trip to the dealer, I noticed the height of the car went up. I mean there is more than two inches of space between the top of the tire and the fender.

While I drove the car, kind of expecting nice ride, on a highway, I noticed the suspension is pretty stiff, picking up little bumps so much. Simply stiff, not sturdy.
When I went over large bump, I noticed the car became bumpy and takes two or three vertical movements before settles down.

Does anybody know what is going on?
If the hydro pressure is to high, the hight of the car changes?
If the air is still in the DRC system, does it also make the car bumpy and tall?

Please let me know, please.

[DHall1]

Hang in there.

Audi will get this right. The new tool kit if operated properly will pressurize the system properly. And, your getting all new components....struts and central valves.

If Audi does not get my car right. I will make the Fidelity policy buy KW struts. Period.




I'm convinced. I'm just going to keep riding mine like it is. I am not ready to let the dealer touch it and fub it up more than it already is, new parts or not. On second thought I might have to go for an aftermarket setup afterall. I mean damn.

[SAF]

The dealer said air was mixed in the central valve and hard to take the air out of the valve. But finally they said they take all the air out.
When my car finally came back from almost three weeks repair trip to the dealer, I noticed the height of the car went up. I mean there is more than two inches of space between the top of the tire and the fender.

While I drove the car, kind of expecting nice ride, on a highway, I noticed the suspension is pretty stiff, picking up little bumps so much. Simply stiff, not sturdy.
When I went over large bump, I noticed the car became bumpy and takes two or three vertical movements before settles down.



That scenario makes my head hurt.

[DHall1]

Coco,

I hate to say I told you so but "I TOLD YOU SO"

With all the known problems with DRC and the Japan market with almost no knowledge or experts on this design....you can fill in the blank from there.

I can only hope that you did not pay any money out of pocket for these repairs. Please tell us that Audi covered these repairs.

And yes, SAF.....my head hurts too. This is just the plain truth come to smack us in the face again. I dont know if they can fix these things anywhere.




You better bail out of that system asap. The chances of getting a proper fix is about 2%. Look, we cant get these things fixed in the US and they sold a 1000 of them here.

Install KW struts and forget about it.

IMHO

[GEN XER]

This is the same nightmare I was going through with Chrysler. Shit I thought I was coming to a better experience. I wont let it get my BP up just yet though, but if after Aug I see you guys still having problems with the DRC with all new components there wont be any reasons for me to trust in the fix or the dealer techs to get it right. Im going to get with my lawyer to see if I have a case to get Audi/KYB somebody to pay for me some shocks. Ill have to call the media to get them involved as well though because Audi wont move on just one complaint, they will just stall me out. Come to think of it I think we are SOL on this one. LOL! WTF!!! How much are these shocks again? Who else makes them? I like Billstien.

[DHall1]

Willie,

I would call Fidelity and Audi customer care and present your case.

1. Your DRC is blown up today.
2. Your car is somewhat dangerous to drive if a emergency situation happened on the hwy.
3. A "fix" 6 months down the road is unacceptable
4. What are you going to do for me today. You=Audi/Fidelity

Pretty straight forward and reasonable.

Possible solutions.

1. Send all the updated parts to your dealer asap along with the proper special tool.
2. Install H/R or KW coilover struts.

I have seen and driven in the Bistein coilover kits. I didnt like them.

Dave


This is the same nightmare I was going through with Chrysler. Shit I thought I was coming to a better experience. I wont let it get my BP up just yet though, but if after Aug I see you guys still having problems with the DRC with all new components there wont be any reasons for me to trust in the fix or the dealer techs to get it right. Im going to get with my lawyer to see if I have a case to get Audi/KYB somebody to pay for me some shocks. Ill have to call the media to get them involved as well though because Audi wont move on just one complaint, they will just stall me out. Come to think of it I think we are SOL on this one. LOL! WTF!!! How much are these shocks again? Who else makes them? I like Billstien.

[V8weight]

I got my letter from AOA about three weeks ago and spent a lot of time racking my brain trying to figure out what to do about it. I finally crumpled it up and threw it away. I'm sooooo happy with my Kw's. I can't stand the thought of converting back to DRC only have it fail again and spend any more time in a rental car while they bumble f%$& around trying to fix it. Right now my car sits just right (all four tires tucked about 1/2" into the fender well) and there's no way I would want this thing going back to the factory ride height. It just handles so much better now. For anyone on the fence, I'd say just swallow your pride and go aftermarket. Its well worth it to remove that ever looming doubt from the back of your mind as to when its going to fail and to be able to just enjoy the car.

[DHall1]

There are quite a few that say just this. Grizz is one of them.

There is also some weight to having Fidelity or Audi pay for the KWs as well. We may get some traction with this angle.


I got my letter from AOA about three weeks ago and spent a lot of time racking my brain trying to figure out what to do about it. I finally crumpled it up and threw it away. I'm sooooo happy with my Kw's. I can't stand the thought of converting back to DRC only have it fail again and spend any more time in a rental car while they bumble f%$& around trying to fix it. Right now my car sits just right (all four tires tucked about 1/2" into the fender well) and there's no way I would want this thing going back to the factory ride height. It just handles so much better now. For anyone on the fence, I'd say just swallow your pride and go aftermarket. Its well worth it to remove that ever looming doubt from the back of your mind as to when its going to fail and to be able to just enjoy the car.

[DuckWingDuck]

I don't know if Fidelity will sign off on an aftermarket system.... But it's well worth a try!

[DHall1]

Willie has them bent over right now. He has a car with blown DRC. Audi cant fix it for 6 months.

"Fix my car now with a new DRC or suitable replacement" Just so happens the suitable replacement is 1/2 the cost of the DRC. Fidelity could bite and take the offer.

KWs, HRs are known quality replacements. DRC has no track record of long term usage.

Remember Fidelity.....ARE YOU WILLING TO TELL A CUSTOMER TO DRIVE A DANGEROUS VEHICLE FOR 6 MONTHS. YOU BETTER GIVE ME THAT IN WRITING AND OH, YOU SURE YOU DONT WANT TO CLEAR THAT WITH LEGAL FIRST?"


Go ahead, make my day.

I don't know if Fidelity will sign off on an aftermarket system.... But it's well worth a try!

[coco]

Hi, DHall1

I know that you told me so.
But at that time, the dealer had already ordered new suspensions and told me that they wanted to try to fix them.
So, I told them that they could go ahead and try, but I won't pay anything if they couldn't perform repair appropriately.
I also told them that I want to go ahead and select one of aftermarket coilovers if they couldn't fix the problem at this time.

So, fortunately, I haven't paid a penny (a yen, I sould say)at this moment.

Anyway, I think I would go for KW or H&R, both of which I can't buy in Japan. Only available option in Japan for C5 RS6 is Bilstein, which, as I read many threds here, is nobody's choice.

I will keep you posted the update.

Thank you guys:dig:.

I feel like I have many supporters here!!



Coco,

I hate to say I told you so but "I TOLD YOU SO"

With all the known problems with DRC and the Japan market with almost no knowledge or experts on this design....you can fill in the blank from there.

I can only hope that you did not pay any money out of pocket for these repairs. Please tell us that Audi covered these repairs.

And yes, SAF.....my head hurts too. This is just the plain truth come to smack us in the face again. I dont know if they can fix these things anywhere.

[V8weight]

Willie has them bent over right now. He has a car with blown DRC. Audi cant fix it for 6 months.

"Fix my car now with a new DRC or suitable replacement" Just so happens the suitable replacement is 1/2 the cost of the DRC. Fidelity could bite and take the offer.

KWs, HRs are known quality replacements. DRC has no track record of long term usage.

Remember Fidelity.....ARE YOU WILLING TO TELL A CUSTOMER TO DRIVE A DANGEROUS VEHICLE FOR 6 MONTHS. YOU BETTER GIVE ME THAT IN WRITING AND OH, YOU SURE YOU DONT WANT TO CLEAR THAT WITH LEGAL FIRST?" Go ahead, make my day.
I tried to no avail to get a set of H&R's shipped from Germany, but it just isn't possible. Even if someone manages to secure a set, H&R won't warranty them stateside. Just a little info from my experience.

[DHall1]

Coco,

Ok, that is good news. Maybe you could confirm those questions I had above as to what exactly was replaced and where your ride height is right now.

Maybe Audi could call tech assist and get the proper bleeding tool.




Hi, DHall1

I know that you told me so.
But at that time, the dealer had already ordered new suspensions and told me that they wanted to try to fix them.
So, I told them that they could go ahead and try, but I won't pay anything if they couldn't perform repair appropriately.
I also told them that I want to go ahead and select one of aftermarket coilovers if they couldn't fix the problem at this time.

So, fortunately, I haven't paid a penny (a yen, I sould say)at this moment.

Anyway, I think I would go for KW or H&R, both of which I can't buy in Japan. Only available option in Japan for C5 RS6 is Bilstein, which, as I read many threds here, is nobody's choice.

I will keep you posted the update.

Thank you guys:dig:.

I feel like I have many supporters here!!

[coco]

Hi, DHall1,

Thanks for your reply:

Here are the sizes that my car has at this moment:

Tire size: 255/35R19
Front Gap: 1"(2.5cm)
Rear Gap:2.36"(6cm)

Componets replaced:
upper and lower arm bushes
four staruts
front upper arms

These are what I know at this moment.

If any updated information will come to me, I will post asap.

Thank you for your help




Sorry for the problems. I have several questions....can you post answers?

Please clarify ride height right now. Which size tire do you have on the car? And front and rear fender gap. For example, my car has stock tire size and approx 1" fender gap on front and 1.5" gap on rear. This is the distance from the top of the tire to the top lip of the fender.

Next, exactly what components were replaced? 4 struts only?

From the answers above...I have the next steps for you.

Dave

[DHall1]

Ok,

Then the problem is in the rear shocks. I seem to remember other members having this problem after a DRC repair. A few questions.

1. Why didnt the dealer replace the central valves?
2. How did the dealer recharge the central valves after opening the system up for the repair?
3. Are the fronts equal and rears equal in height? In other words, RF and LF the same. and RR and LR the same?

Have you read some of the old DRC threads and looked at this manual?

http://www.titsup-racing.com/RS6_Training_Manual.pdf




Hi, DHall1,

Thanks for your reply:

Here are the sizes that my car has at this moment:

Tire size: 255/35R19
Front Gap: 1"(2.5cm)
Rear Gap:2.36"(6cm)

Componets replaced:
upper and lower arm bushes
four staruts
front upper arms

These are what I know at this moment.

If any updated information will come to me, I will post asap.

Thank you for your help

[coco]

Hi DHall1,

Thank you for your time,

The dealer didn't replaced the cdentral valve because they didn't mention about replacing central valves in the written estimate before I left the car to the dealer. I guess, they thought they can save some money not replacing the central valve.

I have no idea how they re-charge the central valve.
I know they said there was some air in the system so that they need to replace the central valves. But, later they said they did repair the system without replacing the central valve. I don't know how, though.

I measure the height in both side:
Here are numbers:
RF: 30mm(1.18")
LR: 60mm(2.36")

LF: 24mm(0.94")
RR: 50mm(1.97"):eye:

I guess, something is wrong, right?

Yes, I have read some of old DRC threds and remember someone said that the ride became pretty stiff after changing struts and central valves and went through the procedures twice.

I will check the training manual.

Thanks again, HDall.
This is a great help for me, since nobody know (even AUDI Japan) for sure about the DRC in Japan.

[DHall1]

Ok,

If your central valves were not replaced. The whole system is junk once again.

The entire system needed to be brought up to pressure before you drive it. How much pressure. 13-15bar pressure. How can you get that much pressure in the system? You either replace the central valves with the new shocks or have the special Audi tool to recharge the central valves to 15bar. Thats 15bar. You do the math.

When the old shocks leaked....your old central valves lost all pressure. Just replacing 4 shocks did nothing to restore 15bar pressure.

Please read the "new" US recall on this matter
http://rs6.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17890

You are driving on no pressure.

Your ride height is all wrong.

Your car is dangerous to drive on the streets.

I dont mean to be blunt but this whole Audi thing really has some of us quite upset.

Please install KW coilover struts and be finished with it. There is no chance Audi can fix this in Japan. NONE...ZERO.

http://rs6.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8798&highlight=drc+repair

This problem has been going on for years.

Dave


Hi DHall1,

Thank you for your time,

The dealer didn't replaced the cdentral valve because they didn't mention about replacing central valves in the written estimate before I left the car to the dealer. I guess, they thought they can save some money not replacing the central valve.

I have no idea how they re-charge the central valve.
I know they said there was some air in the system so that they need to replace the central valves. But, later they said they did repair the system without replacing the central valve. I don't know how, though.

I measure the height in both side:
Here are numbers:
RF: 30mm(1.18")
LR: 60mm(2.36")

LF: 24mm(0.94")
RR: 50mm(1.97"):eye:

I guess, something is wrong, right?

Yes, I have read some of old DRC threds and remember someone said that the ride became pretty stiff after changing struts and central valves and went through the procedures twice.

I will check the training manual.

Thanks again, HDall.
This is a great help for me, since nobody know (even AUDI Japan) for sure about the DRC in Japan.

[DHall1]

Ok,

This next thread is a classic example of what to expect from your Audi dealer. Enjoy

http://rs6.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9161&highlight=drc+repair

Air in the system.

Kinda like my old 69 Chevy with air shock in the rear. We jacked that thing up so high and put on those L60s with the Cragar chrome wheels! We needed the air shocks because the rear tires had to clear the fenders. They stuck out 8 inches past the fender.

:thumb:

Alittle joke. Humor if you have it.

Actually, I built a 67 Chevelle SS396 Pro Street back in the day. It had 14/32 rear tires tucked under the rear quarters. Also had a L88 427 Big Block that would melt those 14/32s at the drop of the clutch in almost any gear. Ohhhhh, I took a mint Marina Blue SS396/350hp car and tubbed it with a 4 link rear. What an idiot....but it was sure fun. Licence plates on that car.....are you ready? U LOSE And yes, it got me into all kinds of trouble.




Hi DHall1,

Thank you for your time,

The dealer didn't replaced the cdentral valve because they didn't mention about replacing central valves in the written estimate before I left the car to the dealer. I guess, they thought they can save some money not replacing the central valve.

I have no idea how they re-charge the central valve.
I know they said there was some air in the system so that they need to replace the central valves. But, later they said they did repair the system without replacing the central valve. I don't know how, though.

I measure the height in both side:
Here are numbers:
RF: 30mm(1.18")
LR: 60mm(2.36")

LF: 24mm(0.94")
RR: 50mm(1.97"):eye:

I guess, something is wrong, right?

Yes, I have read some of old DRC threds and remember someone said that the ride became pretty stiff after changing struts and central valves and went through the procedures twice.

I will check the training manual.

Thanks again, HDall.
This is a great help for me, since nobody know (even AUDI Japan) for sure about the DRC in Japan.

[coco]

Hi DHall1,

I don't want to be a loser on this matter nor paying parts and labor for this DRC and suspension repair. No, never.
I talked to Audi Japan and filed official complaint.
The Audi Japan told the dealer that did the repair and that a guy (that would be me, fyi) is pretty upset about the repair they did.
The dealer contacted the shop that I've been dealing with on this isuue and asked what the dealer can do. And I have the shop tell the dealer that I will go for an after market coilover kits rather than continue dealing with factory setting. And I think the dealer understood and they will cover the parts and labor!!

About the KW variant 3, I found several online parts shops in U.K. which sell KW for around ￡1050-1100 pound, which is about $1,500-1,600!! based on the current exhange rate and since I don't have to pay VAT.

Sound too good to me?
The price of KW price in Japan is around $3,800-$4,700!!
So, I kind of hesitate to order it from them.

Since I'm feeling that either TC or transmission or both is going to need a fix pretty soon, it helps me a lot to save some money on parts for sure.

The places that I found were:
http://www.awesome-gti.co.uk/product.php?xProd=11353&xSec=1037
and
http://www.europerformance.co.uk/pages/products/category_results.mhtml?category=kwvariant3coilover s;car=audirs6;manufacturer=kw;sub_category=1

There are some others, too.

Have anyone dealet with them before?
Are they good or not.
Does anybody know?

Please let me know.

Thank you.









:thumb:

Alittle joke. Humor if you have it.

Actually, I built a 67 Chevelle SS396 Pro Street back in the day. It had 14/32 rear tires tucked under the rear quarters. Also had a L88 427 Big Block that would melt those 14/32s at the drop of the clutch in almost any gear. Ohhhhh, I took a mint Marina Blue SS396/350hp car and tubbed it with a 4 link rear. What an idiot....but it was sure fun. Licence plates on that car.....are you ready? U LOSE And yes, it got me into all kinds of trouble.[/quote]

[DHall1]

OK, so you are installing coilover kit. right?

If your going to order from the UK. Please order from Grizz (Unit20)

You can get the KWs or H/R coilovers. Both good, if your driving habits are more relaxed...you may want the H/R kits.

Contact "Grizz" from this forum. That is the only person from the UK that I would order parts from.

Do a search or give Grizz a PM.

Good luck


Hi DHall1,

I don't want to be a loser on this matter nor paying parts and labor for this DRC and suspension repair. No, never.
I talked to Audi Japan and filed official complaint.
The Audi Japan told the dealer that did the repair and that a guy (that would be me, fyi) is pretty upset about the repair they did.
The dealer contacted the shop that I've been dealing with on this isuue and asked what the dealer can do. And I have the shop tell the dealer that I will go for an after market coilover kits rather than continue dealing with factory setting. And I think the dealer understood and they will cover the parts and labor!!

About the KW variant 3, I found several online parts shops in U.K. which sell KW for around ￡1050-1100 pound, which is about $1,500-1,600!! based on the current exhange rate and since I don't have to pay VAT.

Sound too good to me?
The price of KW price in Japan is around $3,800-$4,700!!
So, I kind of hesitate to order it from them.

Since I'm feeling that either TC or transmission or both is going to need a fix pretty soon, it helps me a lot to save some money on parts for sure.

The places that I found were:
http://www.awesome-gti.co.uk/product.php?xProd=11353&xSec=1037
and
http://www.europerformance.co.uk/pages/products/category_results.mhtml?category=kwvariant3coilover s;car=audirs6;manufacturer=kw;sub_category=1

There are some others, too.

Have anyone dealet with them before?
Are they good or not.
Does anybody know?

Please let me know.

Thank you.









:thumb:

Alittle joke. Humor if you have it.

Actually, I built a 67 Chevelle SS396 Pro Street back in the day. It had 14/32 rear tires tucked under the rear quarters. Also had a L88 427 Big Block that would melt those 14/32s at the drop of the clutch in almost any gear. Ohhhhh, I took a mint Marina Blue SS396/350hp car and tubbed it with a 4 link rear. What an idiot....but it was sure fun. Licence plates on that car.....are you ready? U LOSE And yes, it got me into all kinds of trouble.[/quote]

[DuckWingDuck]

Ya, I would echo dave's sentiments re: grizz. I honestly felt like I should've gone with the h&r, but just couldn't find a set in the us when I needed to pull out the drc!!

[Teutonic_Tamer]

Qisha

This is very interesting news - any more information about whether this will be the case in Europe would be much appreciated.

I had mine done under warranty 2.5 years ago, the car is now out of warranty and the 'clunk-in-the-trunk' is coming back - I'm not looking forward to the service in March....

Marv

In the UK, Audi now offer a free extended warranty for five years for the DRC components - so if the stealer presents you with a big bill, hand it back to them and speak to Audi Customer Services.

[DuckWingDuck]

hey, can anybody fax/scan me a copy of the reimbursement form? I can't seem to find mine! greg @ twilightstar . net

Many thanks in advance.

[KfabR8]

hey, can anybody fax/scan me a copy of the reimbursement form? I can't seem to find mine! greg @ twilightstar . net

Many thanks in advance.You have e-mail (not you've got mail - that would be incorrect - "you have got e-mail" - uh, nope. Sorry, but that contraction drives me insane and I digress.)

I'm going to call the number and see just what they'll tell me. I figure that four months after getting the letter will be enough time for the influx of everyone w/DRC issues to have died down a tad and hopefully be enough time for Audi to get a clue.

Piss on the DRC and getting it repaired. I love my KW setup!

[DHall1]

Look! :harass:

That guy is pissing on a set of shocks over there.

:rolleyes:



You have e-mail (not you've got mail - that would be incorrect - "you have got e-mail" - uh, nope. Sorry, but that contraction drives me insane and I digress.)

I'm going to call the number and see just what they'll tell me. I figure that four months after getting the letter will be enough time for the influx of everyone w/DRC issues to have died down a tad and hopefully be enough time for Audi to get a clue.

Piss on the DRC and getting it repaired. I love my KW setup!

[Marv]

In the UK, Audi now offer a free extended warranty for five years for the DRC components - so if the stealer presents you with a big bill, hand it back to them and speak to Audi Customer Services.

I'd heard that the extended 5 year warranty was just for the RS4...

Still it's all academic anyway - I've sold the RS6 and am now the happy owner of a new S4, soon to be a much happier owner when the MTM upgrade hits the UK (~400hp :dig: according to Mr Balsen)

Marv

[DuckWingDuck]

You have e-mail (not you've got mail - that would be incorrect - "you have got e-mail" - uh, nope. Sorry, but that contraction drives me insane and I digress.)

I'm going to call the number and see just what they'll tell me. I figure that four months after getting the letter will be enough time for the influx of everyone w/DRC issues to have died down a tad and hopefully be enough time for Audi to get a clue.

Piss on the DRC and getting it repaired. I love my KW setup!

Got it! Thanks so much.

[albertracing]

Can anyone mail me a scan copy form AoA abour DRC ? albertracing @ gmail dot com