Video: Audi RS6 C6 Avant vs. BMW M5 E60 Sedan with ECU and exhaust!

[Ruergard]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0bdApIi9cZM

The M5 is closing the gap at the end, but still... The RS6 is standard and has it beaten until then! :addict:

Once again, thanks to Gustav and gtboard.com for these videos! :race:

[kju]

its just insane

[wankeldude]

Hey! Give the RS6 an ECU and exhaust upgrade and see what happens

[Ruergard]

Hey! Give the RS6 an ECU and exhaust upgrade and see what happens

Oh, but we can't do that... That would be like cheating. :hihi:

[bastordd]

Audi RS6 is the best :) Win 2 races! M5= sucks and wait for the RS6 sedan ahaha

[florin08]

What is this M5 power figure?

[Leadfoot]

What is this M5 power figure?

Stock M5 has 507PS, but I would reckon the ECU + exhaust should add about 12~15% to that figure. That would place the M5 with the mods equal on power with the RS6.

[Kliko61]

it's all about the torque and the fast gearing of the RS6 isn't it? but what I don't understand is the fact that the M5 also has a fast gearing...??

[Erik]

The BMW is on 18" as well ;)

[Leadfoot]

it's all about the torque and the fast gearing of the RS6 isn't it? but what I don't understand is the fact that the M5 also has a fast gearing...??

If you were to listen to a lot of those BMW d1cks who rabbit on about how torque is multiplied as the revs increase and because the M engines rev higher it's gearing means it's actually producing more torque up at peak revs of both cars.

I say bullsh1t, the evidence in before you on a BMW biased event.

[Kliko61]

They're going to do a race with the M6 against the RS6 the next time, but what I've seen from the videos between M6 vs M5 (both stock) is that there isn't a huge gap at the end of the race(ok the M6 wins maybe by 3 cars length), so I think actually that the RS6 will go head tot head with the M6......It'll be a close race

[The RS6]

Gotta love BMW Fans :)

"Dude. AUDIs are just a show off cars. but at BMW they make machines!!! AUDI is just suffering from BMW . thats why created the odd R8 and this ugly Biturbo V10. just for show off. just to say " look we can do better than BMW. but in the end they are just dreaming lol. i mean they dont even own their name!!! . BMW = Pure engineering, Pure Dynamics and pure mechanism. BMW 4 Ever, to all the AUDI fans just go shit ur selves looooooooooooooooooooooooooooo ooooooooool"

(from the video comments)

[Leadfoot]

They're going to do a race with the M6 against the RS6 the next time, but what I've seen from the videos between M6 vs M5 (both stock) is that there isn't a huge gap at the end of the race(ok the M6 wins maybe by 3 cars length), so I think actually that the RS6 will go head tot head with the M6......It'll be a close race

Personally I still think the M6 will edge the RS6 to the latter half of the race. Though the thing I noticed watching both the stock M5 and this one is that during every gear change the M5s made the RS6 jumped ahead, this new automatic gearbox is the business.

If someone takes an MTM RS6R to the next event I would love to see how it's fares against some of the more modified stuff at these events.

I bet there is a hell of a lot of BMW guys there scratching their heads as to how such a big heavy estate car with power crippling Quattro has just whipped all their mighty M machines. Wonder what this guy T Bone is saying now. :lovl:

I hope the RS6 owner did Jeremy Clarkson's customary LOSER sign at the end of each race. :dig:

[Michaël Barbé]

Gotta love BMW Fans :)

"Dude. AUDIs are just a show off cars. but at BMW they make machines!!! AUDI is just suffering from BMW . thats why created the odd R8 and this ugly Biturbo V10. just for show off. just to say " look we can do better than BMW. but in the end they are just dreaming lol. i mean they dont even own their name!!! . BMW = Pure engineering, Pure Dynamics and pure mechanism. BMW 4 Ever, to all the AUDI fans just go shit ur selves looooooooooooooooooooooooooooo ooooooooool"

(from the video comments)

Those are clearly guys who don't know the first thing of cars. Ok, you can be a BMW-fan, no problem with me. BMW makes great cars, but please: when you comment on things like that make sure it does make sense. Ugly biturbo V10? How in the world can an engine be 'ugly'?

MB
:rs6kiss:

[Clio16V]

They're going to do a race with the M6 against the RS6 the next time, but what I've seen from the videos between M6 vs M5 (both stock) is that there isn't a huge gap at the end of the race(ok the M6 wins maybe by 3 cars length), so I think actually that the RS6 will go head tot head with the M6......It'll be a close race

I don't think a stock M6 can pass the RS6, maybe the tuned M6 of RussRamz can:bow:

[Rutkowsky]

I bought M6 few days ago, i'd be very interested to see how it does against the RS6.

There's a lot of guys on BWM forums, praising Audi for what they have achieved with B7 RS4, R8 and RS6, including me of course.

I think i'll never get used to the silly, immature fan boys comments, which really let the site down.. (on both sides)

My feeling after test driving the RS6 was right then. The RS6 is faster.

I'm not sure if it can out accelerate the M6. I'll let the cars do the talking..

[Rutkowsky]

Personally I still think the M6 will edge the RS6 to the latter half of the race. Though the thing I noticed watching both the stock M5 and this one is that during every gear change the M5s made the RS6 jumped ahead, this new automatic gearbox is the business.

Leadie,

Since i own M6 now, i have a better point of view as to how it may fair against the RS6.. my opinion is that the M6 will be a bit quicker.

The RS6s gearbox as i commented a while back is very quick but the jump you mention is a result of the extra torque.

[Leadfoot]

Leadie,

Since i own M6 now, i have a better point of view as to how it may fair against the RS6.. my opinion is that the M6 will be a bit quicker.

The RS6s gearbox as i commented a while back is very quick but the jump you mention is a result of the extra torque.

Hi Ruthowsky,

I thought you got an M3, where you unhappy with the car or it's performance or did this M6 fall in your lap at a price you couldn't turn down?

As for the M6 vs RS6, I reckon the M6 will be quicker but only a bit and based on the video evidence we have seen here against both M5s and how the M5 compares against the M6 I would say the M6 will be playing catch up for the first half of the race and only in the later stages will it over haul to RS6.

I think you are misunderstanding what I mean by the jump being made.

I meant that the SMG is clearly showing a lengthy delay during it's shift which the Audi's auto isn't, it's not the extra torque I was talking about but the sheer speed of the two cars shift patterns. Based on the video it looks like the M5 was completing it's shift in a lengthy 200~300ms.

P.S.
How are you finding the M6 compared to the M3, is it a better driving experience or is it all about the speed. :D

[Gustav]

I would say 25 HP max. No way 50 HP.


Stock M5 has 507PS, but I would reckon the ECU + exhaust should add about 12~15% to that figure. That would place the M5 with the mods equal on power with the RS6.

[Kliko61]

I would say 25 HP max. No way 50 HP.

ow comeee ooooooon, ECU and Exhaust will never be less than 40HP, you're not realistic in my opinion.

The ECU only gives it approx. like 10/15% jump in HP. Add the exhaust system to it and you get a minimum of 40 HP I think

[artur777]

Guys,
I know that M3 with ECU + exhaust (470hp claimed) is visually faster than M5 stock (500 hp claimed). About 2-3 car lenghts up to 1/4 mile

Having some runs with modified M3 vs modified M5 I should say that the winner is who had better start without excessive burnout...

So figures for M5 having about 540-550 hp are quite realistic.

But it depends greatly what company's tuning was it.
If it were Hamann - it's not good, their claimed figures are never realistic. It it were Evotech - than it's ok, their claimed figures are abou right...

[artur777]

I am absolutely sure than M5 with Evotech ECU tuning + exhaust will be as fast as RS6, because it's capable to claim 12.4-12.5 sec for 1/4 mile in road conditions. And the speed is about 190 km/h. So it's doing 200km/h for 13.5-13.8 secs.

[Gustav]

An M6 would most definetly kill an RS6.

BTW this M5 is running 19' wheels stock.

[artur777]

Agree!

M6 with ECU tuning is capable of doing 12.2-12.3 secs

[Leadfoot]

An M6 would most definetly kill an RS6.

BTW this M5 is running 19' wheels stock.

Don't you think Gustav that this is a slight exaggeration. To use the word kill implies many lengths ahead and we both know this won't be the case, 3 maybe 4 but no more.

Also are you serious in saying that the ECU + exhaust will only add 20~25hp. :lovl: That was a good one, I nearly died from lack of oxygen I was laughing so hard.

Any ECU will give a minimum of 8% improvement and the exhaust should yield another 10hp minimum, that gives a worst case scenario of 50hp so to think both would only give a gain of less than 5% is plain stupid.

I seriously expected more from you. :nono:

P.S.
I take it the BMW guys are finally sitting up and taking notice of Audi now. :hihi:

P.S.2
I think Erik was only making a joke about the 18" on the M5, especially as so many were using the 20" as the excuse for the M5's poor result.

[Rutkowsky]

Leadie,

ECU remaps on V10 M will not give you 40 extra bhp and i know this for a fact. An exhaust system is good for about 10 extra bhp. I'm not saying this because i own an M6.. i'm as much of an Audi fan as i am a BMW.

The most that M5 could have is an extra 30bhp..

[Rutkowsky]

Hi Ruthowsky,

I thought you got an M3, where you unhappy with the car or it's performance or did this M6 fall in your lap at a price you couldn't turn down?

As for the M6 vs RS6, I reckon the M6 will be quicker but only a bit and based on the video evidence we have seen here against both M5s and how the M5 compares against the M6 I would say the M6 will be playing catch up for the first half of the race and only in the later stages will it over haul to RS6.

I think you are misunderstanding what I mean by the jump being made.

I meant that the SMG is clearly showing a lengthy delay during it's shift which the Audi's auto isn't, it's not the extra torque I was talking about but the sheer speed of the two cars shift patterns. Based on the video it looks like the M5 was completing it's shift in a lengthy 200~300ms.

P.S.
How are you finding the M6 compared to the M3, is it a better driving experience or is it all about the speed. :D

Leadie,

Speed matters!! :jlol:

Let me put it this way.. :bow: M6

It is a different car all together and since i do more of motorway driving now, it suits me fine.

To be honest, acceleration of an M3 is good but it just doesn't compare to an M6. The M3 feels like a baby next to 6, no really! From size, power to the feeling you get behind the wheel. The M6 is just a much bigger sister..

The built quality is good. I have full leather option which makes the interior look and feel very classy. The car's very quiet with windows up which is also good. Loud is tiring! ..or am i getting too old? :hihi:

I've had the M6 since last saturday so i can't say much plus the tyres are Contis (not very good) 3mm of tread left, it's cold and wet. 500bh plus on rear axle and you have a happy rear end! I still don't know what tyres to go for, probably PS2s.. I've had many advanced driver training courses and did track days so there's no drama. I floor it in rain and stay on the road if you know what i mean but i can't go on throttle more than say 80% at the moment because it slides a bit. Still, i find that this car has a good balance..

..so far though, i'm very happy with the car and honestly, i think this is one of the best looking cars there is! :love2: Sure it's not perfect but ticks most of the boxes that suit my lifestyle.

I need more time with the car, change tyres and hopefully the weather will improve so i can do some high speed handling tests.

I'll be happy to report back! :0:

How's your S5 Leadie? I test drove it and i really really liked it! :0:

[Rutkowsky]

An M6 would most definetly kill an RS6.

BTW this M5 is running 19' wheels stock.

Gustav,

When will you do the next airfield event?

[Speedou]

Yeah, that is true. The full Kelleners,or haman set will give you about 40 to 50 more horsepower, just exhaust and ecu is nowhere there.

[TTDriver]

I think this is the first GTboard event where an Audi beats a BMW or am I wrong?
I wonder how objective these events allways are.:vhmmm:

[Rutkowsky]

Maybe they are? What other Audi is quicker than an M5 or M6? Only just now, the mighty RS6, has enough power to keep up/out accelerate the M V10.

It's so easy to hate and criticise..

I'm sure it is a lot of hassle trying to organise such big event. I for one, am happy to be able to see how i.e. Porsche 997 tt vs LP560 performs.. Sure the races have a lot of BMWs but why not? At the and of the day, Gustav runs BMW orientated site.!? ..and would you rather watch people doing silly speeds on public roads and races shot on a mobile phone?

I've yet to see a 10 people agreeing on any given one subject, you'll always have people doubting and hating and disagreeing but what annoys me most are the internet warriors who know it all and talk from experience.. oh and they've owned the fastest cars in the world.

[KK265]

i think this is one of the best looking cars there is! :love2:
:vhmmm: :nono:

[Rutkowsky]

:jlol: well, just my opinion! I am a moderator on Mtorque.co.uk and it seems most of the guys share your opinion as they constantly wind me up how ugly the M6 is!! :hihi:

I personally am in love with the car.. but i won't go trying to convince everyone that it is the fastest, sexiest etc etc machine there is (like some do and yet they've never driven the car!! It happens!) I respect other's people choices of cars!

[TTDriver]

@Rutkowsky
I really didn't want to offend anyone from GTboard. I can imagine how difficult it is to organise such an event.
Also I didn't want to criticise the idea of such an event, I think it is perfect to compare the performance of different cars.
The only thing I criticise is that sometimes they test a modded BMW against other stock cars. They may say it has an ECU remap but not how many Hp it gains.
I remember a video where Gustav tested a E46 M3 against a C5 RS6 and the RS6 didn't stand a chance. The M3 was claimed to be stock.
Sorry if you misunderstood my interpretation. I don't care at all who is winning. It is nice to see the RS6 winning but if doesn't so what, the other car performs better.

[KK265]

:jlol: well, just my opinion! I am a moderator on Mtorque.co.uk and it seems most of the guys share your opinion as they constantly wind me up how ugly the M6 is!! :hihi:

I personally am in love with the car.. but i won't go trying to convince everyone that it is the fastest, sexiest etc etc machine there is (like some do and yet they've never driven the car!! It happens!) I respect other's people choices of cars!

Ok!See also these videos (Gustav's) and tell me please if there is a logical explanation:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leFSPRvWvqI M5 E60 beats Gallardo 520PS
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpaVTdqsPLk RS6 C6 beats M5 E60
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBxdTeF_REk Gallardo 500PS beats RS6 C6!
:vhmmm:

[Rutkowsky]

@Rutkowsky
I really didn't want to offend anyone from GTboard. I can imagine how difficult it is to organise such an event.
Also I didn't want to criticise the idea of such an event, I think it is perfect to compare the performance of different cars.
The only thing I criticise is that sometimes they test a modded BMW against other stock cars. They may say it has an ECU remap but not how many Hp it gains.
I remember a video where Gustav tested a E46 M3 against a C5 RS6 and the RS6 didn't stand a chance. The M3 was claimed to be stock.
Sorry if you misunderstood my interpretation. I don't care at all who is winning. It is nice to see the RS6 winning but if doesn't so what, the other car performs better.

:thumb: sometimes the cars just don't run 100%.. i owned C5 RS6, e46 M3 and i know that the RS6 C5 is quicker 200km/h plus, i have no doubts about it! Up to 200km/h not a lot in it. (but still quicker!)

[Rutkowsky]

Ok!See also these videos (Gustav's) and tell me please if there is a logical explanation:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=leFSPRvWvqI M5 E60 beats Gallardo 520PS
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpaVTdqsPLk RS6 C6 beats M5 E60
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBxdTeF_REk Gallardo 500PS beats RS6 C6!
:vhmmm:

RS6 does beat M5 e60, what's so illogical about it?

The Gallardo race vs RS6 could be a typo/mistake as there are other videos that clearly show RS6 > Gallardo 500

e60 M5 vs Gallardo.. maybe the Lambo wasn't running 100%.? In any case, the Gallardo 520 ps is just a little bit quicker..

[cornishmoocher]

From my stock C5, dyno'd at 441bhp, with a stage 1 map and milltek with no cats I gained 70hp. So, i find it hard to believe that a gain of only 25hp was achieved. At 510hp my car is quick 190 mph+ 0-60 sub 4 secs,and do you know what, there are faster cars out there and some are BMW and some are audi, but does it really matter? they are all really great fast cars, sure its nice to beat a "rival" but there is always someone who will beat you!

[artur777]

Yeah, that is true. The full Kelleners,or haman set will give you about 40 to 50 more horsepower, just exhaust and ecu is nowhere there.

hamann is not the best solution, it's just a well-known one.
imho, evotech package adds up to 50-65 hp for M-cars
it was tested at dyno:hahahehe:

[artur777]

RS6 does beat M5 e60, what's so illogical about it?

The Gallardo race vs RS6 could be a typo/mistake as there are other videos that clearly show RS6 > Gallardo 500

e60 M5 vs Gallardo.. maybe the Lambo wasn't running 100%.? In any case, the Gallardo 520 ps is just a little bit quicker..

my congratulations on m6 purchase...
nice choice:love:
will you do tuning on it?
hamann, evotech?

[Rutkowsky]

From my stock C5, dyno'd at 441bhp, with a stage 1 map and milltek with no cats I gained 70hp. So, i find it hard to believe that a gain of only 25hp was achieved. At 510hp my car is quick 190 mph+ 0-60 sub 4 secs,and do you know what, there are faster cars out there and some are BMW and some are audi, but does it really matter? they are all really great fast cars, sure its nice to beat a "rival" but there is always someone who will beat you!

Well said :thumb:

in regard to tuning.. you don't get that sort of power gains on normally aspirated engines, impossible!

30bhp, that's a max gain on that M5.

[artur777]

From my stock C5, dyno'd at 441bhp, with a stage 1 map and milltek with no cats I gained 70hp. So, i find it hard to believe that a gain of only 25hp was achieved. At 510hp my car is quick 190 mph+ 0-60 sub 4 secs,and do you know what, there are faster cars out there and some are BMW and some are audi, but does it really matter? they are all really great fast cars, sure its nice to beat a "rival" but there is always someone who will beat you!

nice car you have!:king:
what is your average 1/4 mile time?

[Rutkowsky]

cornishmoocher, why don't you join the Gustav's airfield events? It'd be great to have C5 RS6 up against all other high performance cars!

[audi_ch]

I would say 25 HP max. No way 50 HP.

@leadfoot
Kelleners with other camshafts ecu gets a gain of about 50 hp and 60 nm
Price 12000 euros

how stupid must kelleners be if other companies just make ecu for a normal aspirated v10 witch have the same gaine then does have a Kelleners tunning with a lot more work and prices...

In fact, just with ecu on normal aspirated engine v10 be happy if the power is not less than befor.

Ecu in combination with no "vorkats" and "100 zeller renkats" and other exaust system may give you in the v10 about 20-25 horspower if done really well.

Kelleners is somehow the top in Europe but do have quit i high price.

Expect a kelleners tuned v10 to be 1 sec quicke up to 200 than stock, more is not possible, expect you go for a complet mad g-power...

Respect to the m5 boards event.

May, we run next time the rs6.com events... instead of critisize other events

[Rutkowsky]

my congratulations on m6 purchase...
nice choice:love:
will you do tuning on it?
hamann, evotech?


Thank you Artur!

I don't like to tune.. maybe if i get bored it could be Kelleners but very much doubt it. It is an awesome car, great balance at speeds and even in top end, the car's rock solid! I didn't go all out yet but the power delivery is relentless .. :hihi: Great feeling starting this car up and it gets a lot of attention (good and bad) Have you ever test driven M6?

[Rutkowsky]

Remaps on normally aspirated engines are always a trade off.. give you mid range power, take away top end..

I wouldn't go for just a remap on my M6. If i went with anything, it'd be Kelleners..

The respectable tuners will always recommend upgrading to the full exhaust system first and then remap software to take advantage of more free flowing exhaust system..

[artur777]

Thank you Artur!

I don't like to tune.. maybe if i get bored it could be Kelleners but very much doubt it. It is an awesome car, great balance at speeds and even in top end, the car's rock solid! I didn't go all out yet but the power delivery is relentless .. :hihi: Great feeling starting this car up and it gets a lot of attention (good and bad) Have you ever test driven M6?

I have tried M6.
The car is a reaL blast.
Top end is uncomparable espcially after 6000 rpm...

[Speedou]

hamann is not the best solution, it's just a well-known one.
imho, evotech package adds up to 50-65 hp for M-cars
it was tested at dyno:hahahehe:

Didn't say that, just meant that ECU doesn't give nothing for M5 or M6.

[cornishmoocher]

nice car you have!:king:
what is your average 1/4 mile time?

I have no idea! Never done it, it is bloody quick, Only official 0-60 time (mate with a stop watch :rolleyes: ) 3.8 secs, huge amounts of torque, 560ftlbs, and I am down on boost for a minute, only running 1.2b. ut am going for the stage3+ next month, 560hp?? 610ftlbs ??:hahahehe:

Maybe something to try then!

@ rutowski- i have had some good kills lately actually, but the only one's for definate were an R8, at 182 as i closed him, and i didnt look as i took him on the straight, but killed him dead, he got me in the twisty bits tho, couldn't live with him. And tthe other was an (sorry about this) an M6, it was probably stock, or poorly, but at 190ish he could do nothing.....

Gustavs forum??

[cornishmoocher]

Well said :thumb:

in regard to tuning.. you don't get that sort of power gains on normally aspirated engines, impossible!

30bhp, that's a max gain on that M5.

Yeah, you are right, i was forgetting the non turbine issue:doh: :D

[Leadfoot]

It seems everyone else was correct and I was wrong, the only way the M5 would gain 50hp is with the complete package which includes cams, so apologizes to Gustav for doubting him. I suppose I should have known better what with he's background and interest in all things BMW.

Though here is a word of doubt creeping into my mind, who is to say that this M5 which raced the RS6 didn't have the whole package. If it's from Kelleners they didn't list that you can buy anything other than the whole deal. Which if correct means the M5 in question is kicking out close to the RS6.

[Rutkowsky]

@ rutowski- i have had some good kills lately actually, but the only one's for definate were an R8, at 182 as i closed him, and i didnt look as i took him on the straight, but killed him dead, he got me in the twisty bits tho, couldn't live with him. And tthe other was an (sorry about this) an M6, it was probably stock, or poorly, but at 190ish he could do nothing.....

Gustavs forum??

:jlol: no problems! i am not the one to start convincing and argueing the results.. a lot of people do, i don't.

Since we are in the UK, would you be up for a race track? Friendly fun, not a challege :thumb:

Since i had C5 RS6 i'd be great to have some fun with the torque monster!

[cornishmoocher]

:jlol: no problems! i am not the one to start convincing and argueing the results.. a lot of people do, i don't.

Since we are in the UK, would you be up for a race track? Friendly fun, not a challege :thumb:

Since i had C5 RS6 i'd be great to have some fun with the torque monster!
Oh yeah!!!:dig:

There are a few tarck days coming up, and If you are in London, we are not to far apart!:thumb:

[Rutkowsky]

Cool, but just forget the first line of your signature when we race, will you? LOL

[Leadfoot]

Ruthowsky,

I take it your M6 is chipped or do BMW offer a delimiting package option?

[Rutkowsky]

BMW will delitmit to 305km/h mine is delimited with no software reprogrammed to give more power though. I heard so much info that a remap on n/a engines can give no benefit (a trade off, give midrange, take away top end power) i decided to leave it alone.

The money is better spent on pro driving tuition, quality tyres or track days..

[cornishmoocher]

No worries on the signature! I like to drive hard but not dangerous! :)

[Georgious86]

hey BMW fans,as these 3 races showed us Rs6 is faster then M5,i mean Rs6 avant vs M5 sedan stock,and even faster then a bit tuned M5,so next race will be Rs6 sedan vs M6 coz i give you :harass: weight odds, and still sure Rs6 will win...Leadfoot one of the active Rs6 forum user is right in saying that M5 is in another leauge.:rs6kiss:

[Leadfoot]

Georgious86,

I will be surprised if the RS6Avant will win against the M6. It will most probably be ahead up to the 220~230km/h mark but after that I would expect the M6 to get the upper hand and finish the run about 3 car lengths ahead.

No sour grapes from us Audi fans if that would be the result when you consider one is a lightened version of the M5 minus two doors and the other is a full blown Estate car weighing an extra few hundred kilos, with a proper automatic and extra driveshafts sapping the power.

Whether the saloon can regain control is another question, I think based on what we have seen the expectation will be high because I have seen the differences in acceleration times between the RS4 saloon vs Avant and the saloon is always well ahead by the 250km/h point.

If the next M5/6 comes with a bi-turbo engine then bring it on, there is plenty on room to increase the output from the RS6 engine. The gearbox, driveshaft, diffs etc are all able to cope with considerably more than they are currently getting. You might not see a RS6+ soon but it's there if the need arises.

[audi_ch]

Georgious86,

I will be surprised if the RS6Avant will win against the M6. It will most probably be ahead up to the 220~230km/h mark but after that I would expect the M6 to get the upper hand and finish the run about 3 car lengths ahead.

No sour grapes from us Audi fans if that would be the result when you consider one is a lightened version of the M5 minus two doors and the other is a full blown Estate car weighing an extra few hundred kilos, with a proper automatic and extra driveshafts sapping the power.

Whether the saloon can regain control is another question, I think based on what we have seen the expectation will be high because I have seen the differences in acceleration times between the RS4 saloon vs Avant and the saloon is always well ahead by the 250km/h point.

If the next M5/6 comes with a bi-turbo engine then bring it on, there is plenty on room to increase the output from the RS6 engine. The gearbox, driveshaft, diffs etc are all able to cope with considerably more than they are currently getting. You might not see a RS6+ soon but it's there if the need arises.


Next rs6 version will be lighter less powerfull, better/quicker gearbox and come to the us, performance will be sligthly improved, but not as mutch as c5 vs c6.

Downsizing will be the word.

Bmw will be around 550 hp with a twin turbo with about the same wight
but faster gearbox and more torque. apparently performance will be significant better than the e60/ e63 version

The battle will go one, but both engine will be downsized

[Leadfoot]

Next rs6 version will be lighter less powerfull, better/quicker gearbox and come to the us, performance will be sligthly improved, but not as mutch as c5 vs c6.

Downsizing will be the word.

Bmw will be around 550 hp with a twin turbo with about the same wight
but faster gearbox and more torque. apparently performance will be significant better than the e60/ e63 version

The battle will go one, but both engine will be downsized

I have preached this theory for sometime now.

The next M5 will probably be out (late 2010~early 2011) and will run a bi-turbo v8 of either the 4.4L or maybe the block from the current M3. If the RS6 is still on sale by then I would expect Audi to up the stakes by making a 'plus' version with 630hp but I serious doubt the RS6 will still be around by then.

[Rutkowsky]

Dry 2050kg for RS6 Avant is a lot of metal.. a 350kg more than an M6 (which is a large car in itself.) Quatrro or not, this much weight will come back to haunt to you in some ways but still, the straight forward acceleration is absolutely awesome.
(quote) Accelerating from idle, the M6 engine builds its revs more gradually than that in the Gallardo. But once you hit 6000 rpm in the M6, the revs grow as quickly as they do in the F430. (quote)
.. i so want to see this race.! The quote is spot on; flooring from 6000 rpms i get a hard push in the seat, so much power.

[audi_ch]

I have preached this theory for sometime now.

The next M5 will probably be out (late 2010~early 2011) and will run a bi-turbo v8 of either the 4.4L or maybe the block from the current M3. If the RS6 is still on sale by then I would expect Audi to up the stakes by making a 'plus' version with 630hp but I serious doubt the RS6 will still be around by then.


Agree with you, 2011 is a long time and things can chance quick. Especially will the next year really shows witch company has a good strategie for the needs of the market.
Everyone can make his rs6 easy to an rs6 plus or more. But as i said one thing is pretty clear, the next rs6 generation will have less wight but as well a smaller engine

[Rutkowsky]

I have also heard of the twin turbo with M-DCT obviously and efficient dynamics.

[Rutkowsky]

hey BMW fans,as these 3 races showed us Rs6 is faster then M5,i mean Rs6 avant vs M5 sedan stock,and even faster then a bit tuned M5,so next race will be Rs6 sedan vs M6 coz i give you :harass: weight odds, and still sure Rs6 will win...Leadfoot one of the active Rs6 forum user is right in saying that M5 is in another leauge.:rs6kiss:


:0: :thumb: :applause: :hihi: :jlol: :rs6kiss: :rs6kiss: :rs6kiss: :cheers: :dig: :thumb: :jlol: :rs6kiss: :rs6kiss: Audi rocks!

[artur777]

IMHO,
if next M5/M6 is going to be DCT equipped, and to have V8TT with 550hp it will wipe the floor with the current RS6...

M5 is a car of 2004 model year so we will see next one as a car of 2011 model year...

But for now RS6 is the king

[Michaël Barbé]

IMHO,
if next M5/M6 is going to be DCT equipped, and to have V8TT with 550hp it will wipe the floor with the current RS6...

M5 is a car of 2004 model year so we will see next one as a car of 2011 model year...

But for now RS6 is the king

Of course, that's the whole point. The RS6 was made to be quicker then the M5 and E63.
The next M5 will be quicker then the RS6 and that's what they call the horsepowerwar.

MB
:rs6kiss:

[Leadfoot]

IMHO,
if next M5/M6 is going to be DCT equipped, and to have V8TT with 550hp it will wipe the floor with the current RS6...

M5 is a car of 2004 model year so we will see next one as a car of 2011 model year...

But for now RS6 is the king

I would expect the next M5 to better the current RS6, after all it will be based on a model which will be only a year old (2010) instead of the RS6 which is based on a three year old model (2005). Take that into account and the RS6 is a much better achievement than the M5.

With Audi upping the speed at which their RS models are to be released that will mean BMW's reign will be very short lived and with it their public opinion as the best.

Mark my words, QuattroGmbH is the new M-Division for the next 10+ years.