2009 S4 to lose V8 in favor of 335 hp V6 TT?

[Hy Octane]

Thats what we are hearing. Actually going to make it less powerful??

[AndyBG]

Less hps, but more torque, and probably better performance figures then the outgoing B7 S4, so... no problem if you asking me. :)

[RXBG]

it'll lose the near 2K USD GG tax, lose weight, have better weight distribution too.

all these things combined will make it faster in every way than the outgoing model. while costing less to run and to own.

if the block is as robust as the B5's it'll be a menace when modded too.

[Cargo8]

we should really confine this to the, oh, two or three friends in RSx. I'm getting so confused as which ones I posted in.

Leadie "predicts" V6 Supercharged. also, i said 333, and leadie said good guess...

[RXBG]

either turbo or super.

i am banking on turbo as that is audi's area of expertise.

with a bunch of turbo engines all over the lineup one supercharger would be silly. benz is also backing out of superchargers and going to turbos.

those superchargers whine too much ;p

[Leadfoot]

we should really confine this to the, oh, two or three friends in RSx. I'm getting so confused as which ones I posted in.

Leadie "predicts" V6 Supercharged. also, i said 333, and leadie said good guess...

Yeah, supercharger is what I was told, as for the actual figures it will product is a guess based on the output of the S5, Audi are meant to be positioning the A5 slightly higher in status than the A4 so it's understandable to think the same will apply to the outputs of the top models (S & RS).

P.S.

I too have said for months now that it would be a bi-turbo as that is Audi's way, so tp speak but the most recent info I recieved from my mate was he believes it will be a supercharger. Don't know why the change of thinking but there you are, if I'm wrong, I'm wrong.

[AndyBG]

I must say that if Audi makes new V6 supercharged it come as a big surprise to me. But, as lately Audi is having to many surprises, nothing isn't possible...


Anyhow, future S4 will be great car...

BMW has 335 i that will be shut off by B8 S4, I wonder how Merc' will respond... C 450 or C 500, maybe... ? :vhmmm:

[Z07]

They'd have to be stupid to give it a supercharger. Superchargers are a waste of power and fuel relative to turbos. Even Mercedes have given up on them.

[tvrfan]

They'd have to be stupid to give it a supercharger. Superchargers are a waste of power and fuel relative to turbos. Even Mercedes have given up on them.

+1

i hope it never will happend

[Leadfoot]

They'd have to be stupid to give it a supercharger. Superchargers are a waste of power and fuel relative to turbos. Even Mercedes have given up on them.

I understand and agree with you but if my source is correct in saying it's a supercharged unit will it really be that bad, on the plus sides it will have NO LAG at all and it's power and torque will be almost identical to a N/A engine only higher. :p

May be it's me, but I am a little more open minded as to the idea of a supercharged S4. :burnout:

[tvrfan]

how would be the tuning of a Supercharged B8 S4? i dont know but can the audi tuners put out so much hp from the supercharger as from a turbocharger? (bigger SC, i dont know)

[crespo]

Again, stop worrying. If Audi did decide to go the supercharger route, they must have their reasons and know what they're doing.

[AndyBG]

how would be the tuning of a Supercharged B8 S4? i dont know but can the audi tuners put out so much hp from the supercharger as from a turbocharger? (bigger SC, i dont know)

MTM actually puts supercharger on their highly tuned Audis...

[Leadfoot]

MTM actually puts supercharger on their highly tuned Audis...

Correct and the MTM RS4 isn't exactly that slow now is it. I reckon we need to drive this S4 before making judgement.

[AndyBG]

I really don't have any problem with supercharger, specilay when Audi is implementing in its car at this time of Audis fantastic moves in all fields. Honestly, several months ago, I wasn't thinking to much about B8 S4, now, I can't wait to see what is Audi ''cocked'' for us. :D

[Z07]

If you use a supercharger to gain 100bhp, the supercharger will use a further 25-35bhp to drive itself. A turbocharger by contrast will do the same task for a parasitic loss of only 5bhp.

A centrifugal supercharger would be a complete loss because boost is proportional to speed, so peak boost and torque is only delivered right at the top of the rev range. Roots chargers give good low-down and mid-range but suffer up top. A twin screw is the best option but still inferior to turbochargers. With modern variable nozzle geometry turbines, I don't see the need to go the supercharger root.

[Cargo8]

MTM RS4 Clubsport [Supercharged]. Game over.

[Leadfoot]

Listen, wait until we know for sure what the S4 is running and then start to dicuss the merits or failing of superchargers if that is indeed what it is getting.

If Audi have gone down that route I reckon they clearly know what they are doing, don't you.

[Z07]

MTM RS4 Clubsport [Supercharged]. Game over.
Aftermarket supercharging of a normally aspirated car makes far more sense, as it's a lot simpler than turbocharging. Supercharging from the factory makes little sense at all unless you're trying to avoid traction issues. With Quattro, there are no such issues.

[PetrolDave]

Supercharging from the factory makes little sense at all unless you're trying to avoid traction issues.
Don't follow your logic there ...

[Z07]

Don't follow your logic there ...
Turbos can give a rapid rise/spike in torque leading to wheelspin in 2WD cars.

[Leadfoot]

Guys this discussion is going no where unless we know for sure that it's supercharged. Like I said I have been told that this is the case but until the truth breaks cover we may be discussing all of this for nothing.

[Leadfoot]

Just to keep you all informed I ask the question once for as to whether it's going to be supercharged and the answer came back YES 100%.

So it looks like the discussions should start as to whether it's was right to chose supercharging instead of turbo.

Z07, please mate you start the ball rolling.

[AndyBG]

Just to keep you all informed I ask the question once for as to whether it's going to be supercharged and the answer came back YES 100%.

So it looks like the discussions should start as to whether it's was right to chose supercharging instead of turbo.

Z07, please mate you start the ball rolling.

Interestingly, last thing I heard was bi-turbo, but I will rely on your source, becouse this time I can't ''stand up'' for my source. Anyhow, I don't expect us to be dissapointed.

Sorry for stilling first post. :cheers:

[The Pretender]

There is noting wrong with a modern Supercharger, look at the Chevrolet V8.
It even look very clean design wise.
The only problem i have with a Supercharger is the whine it make's, i prefer the wisle of turbo's.

http://www.autoweek.nl/images/800/4/2a1341d99979ca0ae3410b61a7c63e74.jpg

Jarod.

[Z07]

There is noting wrong with a modern Supercharger, look at the Chevrolet V8.
It even look very clean design wise.
The only problem i have with a Supercharger is the whine it make's, i prefer the wisle of turbo's.
Jarod.

As I said above, supercharging from the factory makes little sense at all unless you're trying to avoid traction issues.

The ZR-1 will have a huge power and torque-to-weight ratio. The last thing it needs is a rapid rise in torque as the engine comes on boost. Should be a great car though.

[The Pretender]

As I said above, supercharging from the factory makes little sense at all unless you're trying to avoid traction issues.
Now i think longer about it a supercharged S4 make a lot of sense.
If audi will start te use the new longitudinal 7-speed DSG/S-Tronic gearbox (max 400-450 Nm of torque ?) in the new S4, your quote make a lot of sense.
Audi can go the supercharger way to protect the DSG/S-Tronic gearbox from sudden torque boost.
With a lineair power development the DSG get no power/torque hikes to handle with.
The future autobox S5 and RS4/5 will have the Quattro Tip-Tronic gearbox anyway.
A 3.0 litre V6 supercharged engine will have 300-350 hp and 360-400 Nm of torque.

Jarod.

[Z07]

Now i think longer about it a supercharged S4 make a lot of sense.
If audi will start te use the new longitudinal 7-speed DSG/S-Tronic gearbox in the new S4, your quote make a lot of sense.
Audi can go the supercharger way to protect the DSG/S-Tronic gearbox from sudden torque boost.
With a lineair power development the DSG get no power/torque hikes to handle with.
The future autobox S5 and RS4/5 will have the Quattro Tip-Tronic gearbox anyway.

Jarod.
Ah, now this is a good point. I heard the DSG was having trouble with the torque characteristics of the 2.0L turbodiesel (204bhp/295lbft) planned for the TT. However, the same article mentioned that they were developing a DSG capable of handling a similarly-generated 369lbft.

I guess the supercharger is a good workaround for the gearbox issues but in general, a turbocharger is a more efficient power adder.

[Leadfoot]

Ah, now this is a good point. I heard the DSG was having trouble with the torque characteristics of the 2.0L turbodiesel (204bhp/295lbft) planned for the TT. However, the same article mentioned that they were developing a DSG capable of handling a similarly-generated 369lbft.

I guess the supercharger is a good workaround for the gearbox issues but in general, a turbocharger is a more efficient power adder.

Can anyone convert 369ft/lbs in to new money (Nm) for me.;)

Now check out what I said regarding the RS5's torque estimates. :deal:

And now do you think 'the Pretender' is still right in assuming the S5 and RS5 will not get DSG.:hihi:

[The Pretender]

Can anyone convert 369ft/lbs in to new money (Nm) for me.;)

Now check out what I said regarding the RS5's torque estimates. :deal:

And now do you think 'the Pretender' is still right in assuming the S5 and RS5 will not get DSG.:hihi:
Use 1.3559891 for that.
btw, The S5 Tip-Tronic Quattro is already confirmed.

jarod.

[Leadfoot]

Use 1.36 for that.
btw, The S5 Tip-Tronic Quattro is already confirmed.

jarod.

I was only highlighting that there is no reason other than Audi wants it to have an auto, the DSG is coming and the first to receive it will be the Q5, of this I am certain.

P.S.

369ft/lbs = 476Nm and though I haven't checked I think I said something around 480~500Nm. ;)

[chewym]

The new S4 should at least have as much torque as the S5. 325 lb-ft or 440 nm. Othewise there is no point in going with the turbo as it at best will have the same horsepower.

[Leadfoot]

I was only highlighting that there is no reason other than Audi wants it to have an auto, the DSG is coming and the first to receive it will be the Q5, of this I am certain.

P.S.

369ft/lbs = 476Nm and though I haven't checked I think I said something around 480~500Nm. ;)

Sorry, 501Nm.:doh: