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Leadfoot
April 3rd, 2007, 16:17
Some of you might already know this but the weight balance of the new A5 is 55%/45% front to rear which is actually for the A5 fwd model and not the quattro S5, this is a huge improvement over the out-going A4 which was 61%/39%.

As yet there is no official figures for the S5, but basing the same improvements that the RS4 had on the standard model, the S5 and RS5 will have a weight balance in the range of 53~52% at the front axle and 47~48% at the rear. These figures are as good if not better than the current M5 which because of the engine can't meet BMW's holy grail of 50/50. So if you combine this with the fact that the steering system is much better than that of the RS4 and the controlled power that is Quattro one can expect the new S5 to be something very special indeed, not only to us Audi nuts but just might be able to pull the BMW guys out of their beloved Ms and sample something new.

Ruergard
April 3rd, 2007, 16:25
Interesting, that's really nice. Looking good for the handling! :D

Damienr8
April 3rd, 2007, 17:14
Yea I cant wait for a writeup discussing the handling differences between the RS4 and the S5. I would like to understand how significant these improvements are.

- Damien

chewym
April 3rd, 2007, 22:24
I think the S5 won't be any better than the regular A5. Sure it has quattro but it also has a longer and slightly heavier engine. Probably about the same, maybe 1 percentage point better. BTW, the Q7 V8 FSI has a perfect 50/50 weight destribution.

Leadfoot
April 3rd, 2007, 22:51
I think the S5 won't be any better than the regular A5. Sure it has quattro but it also has a longer and slightly heavier engine. Probably about the same, maybe 1 percentage point better. BTW, the Q7 V8 FSI has a perfect 50/50 weight destribution.

Actually the Q7 has a 47/53 weight balance.

http://www.autobild.de/test/neuwagen/artikel.php?artikel_id=13656&artikel_seite=0

Damienr8
April 3rd, 2007, 23:55
53 front 47 rear would be significantly nice. I don't think that in the A5's case, having a perfect 50/50 weight distribution would prove useful since the torque split is rear biased. I do think 53/47 front/rear weight distribution is great enough for sblime handling characteristics and will complement the steering improvements very nicely.

I envison the A5 to be a drivers car, where the communication between the driver and the car happens with alacrity and precision.

Leadfoot
April 4th, 2007, 00:14
I personally hope that Audi give it is little more steering feel if only to satisfy the motoring press that seem to demand such things but not to the extremes that Porsche provide, great on the great and smooth roads but not so much on a bumped back road where the present Audi system works amazingly well.

You are quite right, 50/50 weight balance is not ideal when the car is awd with the engine up front, I think anything around the 55%~52% front bias is just about prefect especially when the awd system is rear bias. I think we will all be surprised how well the S5 will going around the ring but also the short circuits that seem to favour the rwd cars.

chewym
April 4th, 2007, 00:27
Well, the figure I quoted for the Q7 was from actual Car and Driver measurements for the Q7 V8 FSI. So that is for the American version. But still it shows that the Q7 has excellent weight destirbution. The A5 MLP platform was quoted to be similar to the layout in the Q7, so it should be pretty good. (as the A5 already shows, it isn't bad)

SuperstarDriver
April 12th, 2007, 11:54
S5 will be a very good handling car, MLP platform will definitively beat the crap BMW handling as saying by stupid people around the world, that feeling in a bmw is better than an audi...bla bla...when pigs will fly:)) you shall see how fast will grow audi range of S/RS models to become the world most performant premium cars!sweet...:D

PeterJohn
April 14th, 2007, 20:12
S5 will be a very good handling car, MLP platform will definitively beat the crap BMW handling as saying by stupid people around the world, that feeling in a bmw is better than an audi...bla bla...when pigs will fly:)) you shall see how fast will grow audi range of S/RS models to become the world most performant premium cars!sweet...:D

I looked for an Audi first, when I was in desperate need for a new car. But I couldn't find a Quattro with the specs I wanted, and I didn't want another FWD. The BMW was available on short notice, with all the specs I was looking for, and a great price, so I bought it. I'm a general car enthusiast, so I appreciate the engineering no matter the badge. And the "crap BMW handling" suits me just fine, so I guess I'm stupid.

I think you work for BMW, SuperstarDriver. I think you are an undercover marketing agent who has been put behind a computer to discredit the Audi community, by making them look like a bunch of pompous asses.

That, or Audis offensive has attracted the same kind of annoying snobs that you often find behind the wheel of a BMW. Too bad. Audi can expect a backlash pretty soon. Some people, I know, wouldn't want to be caught dead in a bimmer. Audi is heading the same way, and I can only hope the brand is strong enough. There is a BMW already, so what will Audis hook be? If BMW starts looking like the underdog, Audi will loose a lot of its "at least it's not a BMW" sales.

If two dogs fight over a bone, the third one walks away with it. The new C-Class from Mercedes-Benz will start to look very attractive to people who don't want to get involved in the battle between the Audi snobs, and the Bimmer snobs.

And to get back on topic, the A5 chassis is fantastic, and if it lives up to it's promise, it will kick BMWs ass all the way to the next solar system.

:cheers:

SuperstarDriver
April 14th, 2007, 20:53
man don't you understand that a performance car must have an 4WD system to put all the power down for effiecieny? Audi is all the way leader of the sports segment because of the quattro and super high rev engines like RS4 for example!You are just making me nuts when saying Audi snobs!Where?I saw every single day BMW snobs but Audi snobs?!No...Audi drivers are driving their cars but BMW are making show with RWD oversteering at every start and in the curves...so what is bmw?!better than audi?more efficient and good driver feelings?!no way man!A CAR MUST BE EFFICIENT TO BE A PROPER SPORTS CAR!INEFFICIENY DOESN'T HAVE PLACE IN A RACE CAR OR NORMAL PERFORMANCE CAR!WHY IS AUDI KILLING ALL THE OPONENTS AT LE MANS IN ALMOST 6 YEARS IN A ROW?WHY?WHY IS LE MANS THE BEST RACE IN THE WORLD WHERE AUDI IS THE LEADER?!AHHH...YOU HAVE MORE WORDS IN YOUR MOUTH ABOUT AUDI ENGINEERINGS?I THINK YOU DON'T...

Leadfoot
April 14th, 2007, 21:31
superstardriver,

I am sorry but we have as many snobs driving Audis as any other brand, you seriously have to get off this BMW witch hunt, sure I like a lot here don't like BMW cars but at least give a constructive reason for this.

I see PeterJohn as the most level-headed of all people on this site and someone who I believe will in the near future be driving an Audi in some form or another.

SuperstarDriver
April 15th, 2007, 05:22
why i hate bmw?
-3 friends of mine died in 2 years in a row in different cars, the new 3 series, 5 series from 2002 and and 7 series from 2005
-bmw cars doesn't give confidence in driving when pushing to the limit and accelerating hard in the last moment of the curve you crossed, and when you want more power you can't get it even with ESP on your tires are burning all along every time you push the accelaration and you see that your car isn't moving as fast as you do this because it spinning tires a little bit more before the car actually put more power down and that's not ok with me
-the design of the exterior is not my style at all, doesn't fit with my optics about how it want to look a car, and the interiors of ALL BMW are so bad constructed even with the turometer and speedmeter is making me an impression that it was made for a low cost car and the designer used to design the cockpit by using old bmw's without changing the things on it to be more present and more satisfied when you look at it, cause when i'm entering in a bmw i don't have that feeling of wanting to do something good with that car, it's not a feeling car for me
-the technology is not the best in the industry
-i only hate bmw, i also like Mercedes Benz, Lexus, VW, Porsche, Lamborghini, Aston Martin, Honda, Infiniti, etc ...but i really really don't like BMW at all...it doesn't fit my style because i'm a desperate driver who needs speed and passion when driving without careing about the weather even when is raining or snowing or icey roads Audi keeps me on the road safely at high speeds!
-bmw is for everyone else in my country the perfect car but not for me, not for me...Bring Me Women, is not for me the style of making spectacular drifts to impress, not for me by having a car like everybody does, etc

When my car will arrive i will get to know you all when we gonna meet the S/RS drivers in europe and talk with you a lot more of this kind of things!I hope for now is allright my opinion!

Leadfoot
April 15th, 2007, 08:33
Sorry for your lose and in a way your dislike is understandable, but maybe your friend were driving beyond their capabilities and the capabilities of the cars.

SuperstarDriver
April 15th, 2007, 11:29
when you drive an BMW to his limits a single bad manouver will kill you fast and painfully, but when you drive an Audi Quattro you simply don't realise that the car is melting on the road to stay put and be with the driver,so that he can't loose control!That's why Audi is better than anything else on this world, especially BMW!I drived a lot of cars in my life Mercedes, Porsche, VW but no car was so oversteering at any speed like BMW!BMW was loosing power all along even with ESP on, and that's not ok with me! I'm obsessed by perfection, by stability, by efficieny to the race track but simply BMW could not offer this at all!I don't know BMW are made by for me BMW is a dead brand in which you invest in tires and when you want to go further you can be dead if any mistake you have and the other thing i really don't know how BMW put back differentials on BMW cause are so unefficieny that even Jeremy Clarkson said in a test between M6, 911 and Aston V8 that on paper M6 was much faster than both but at the end he was finishing the last place....and then Clarkson said...where is going that kind of power?!He also answered to this by saying..."IS LOOSING ON THE ROAD THAT KIND OF POWER" so in conclusion for him M6 couldn't put more than 450HP to ground (it's too much power on the ground i think more than 400HP exactly can't put it), a dyno test will show that i'm right!

Informer
April 15th, 2007, 23:43
Wow, looks like BMW's are pretty dangerous. They should stop selling them. Is it the RWD killing the people in BMW's? I'm sure there are other cars that are RWD and maybe even more powerful. Why don't they die on the way to work eveeryday? Maybe BMW are just useless and can't build a safe car. I think that's the answer. After all, I'm sure no-one dies in Audi's, or Merc's or Hyundai's.

SuperstarDriver
April 16th, 2007, 00:02
the probability of dieing in a bmw is 90% more than in audi or mercedes!tell me that a porsche and aston martin and jaguar and ferrari is not more stable than bmw?!!!bmw has RWD but real bad RWD and unefficiency...and that's why so many people die in bmw's around the world!Unfortunetely my country Romania is no.1 in europe's badest accidents with casualties and a lot of deaths...anually we are no.1 on accidents!why?ask the people who drives bmw cause are so many in my country that if all romanian people would have a lot of money all the stock from bmw will be exausted in 1 month! in my country bmw is the "ultimate machine", "better than porsche, audi, mercedes, lamborghini", for them living on scratching their tires for show off are one of their oqupations and then all bmw drivers in romania believe in one think..."Bring Me Women"...so stupid people, a lot of them are driving at very very low speeds for showing off in front of girls, others make an "impressive star on the green colour in the city" by burning tires, they think are cool and they think bmw is the fastest car on the planet:))
You can't ask more from a stupid man who drives an BMW...is like you would ask an Alzheimer when he was married and with whom:))))BMW is the only car maker in the world who actually is not capable of putting power down at all...

Informer
April 16th, 2007, 00:09
)BMW is the only car maker in the world who actually is not capable of putting power down at all...

YEah you right. I mean look at the CLK63. It has so much more power & torque, & no LSD, but it still puts the power down better. I heard M3's wheelspin into 6th gear even on a prepped track. This one time I was following an M5 & it just oversteered on the highway for no reason. Just flew off the road in a straight line. Then I looked in the mirror & all the BMW's were just flying into the barriers. I think the Government should get involved & ban these cars or something. People could get hurt.

Leadfoot
April 16th, 2007, 00:38
Informer,

I hope you know that SuperstarDriver doesn't speak for all of us here, we are all a little bit more subjective than that.

As for spinning the wheels in 6th, now I have never had a car do that but I did have a 3/4 race Escort which if the road was greasy would spin the wheels up to 100mph. Scary as f#ck but lots of fun .................. well I was only seventeen at the time and didn't know any better and fear wasn't part of my vocabulary back then.

rqiu
April 16th, 2007, 01:07
why i hate bmw?
-i only hate bmw, i also like Mercedes Benz, Lexus, VW, Porsche, Lamborghini, Aston Martin, Honda, Infiniti, etc ...but i really really don't like BMW at all...it doesn't fit my style because i'm a desperate driver who needs speed and passion when driving without careing about the weather even when is raining or snowing or icey roads Audi keeps me on the road safely at high speeds!


SuperstarDriver, I don't understand you. You hate BMW but like Lexus? You think Lexus is a driver's car but BMW is not? I would prefer a BMW to a Lexus.
I like Audi, but I don't hate BMW. I had the new 3 series, and I liked it. I don't think it is unsafe.

Yahh
April 16th, 2007, 03:29
I think SuperstarDriver should calm down a bit too. I also like Audi better than BMW...But seriously! :)

Leadfoot
April 16th, 2007, 09:05
I am not going to jump on the bandwagen and dump on the poor guy, his heart is in the right place and in time he will calm down, heck if you check out his first few posts to his most recent you will see it's already starting.

I reckon by 2020 he will be as laid back as Ben.:hihi:

SuperstarDriver
April 16th, 2007, 09:11
as i was saying why Mercedes, Porsche, Ferrari, Aston Martin, Jaguar and many more are so confident and deosn't spin the wheeels like bmw does even in the straight line?!For me BMW is only a car for shows nothing more...very very unsafe and very nasty to drive, for example look at the test in the past from S4 vs M3 where M3 was so oversteering that when he tryed to get on the right line of the curve who couldn't and S4 was like a super fast and safe TGV on curves!So bmw as i said again sucks with their ineficient RWD!

Leadfoot
April 16th, 2007, 11:23
as i was saying why Mercedes, Porsche, Ferrari, Aston Martin, Jaguar and many more are so confident and deosn't spin the wheeels like bmw does even in the straight line?!For me BMW is only a car for shows nothing more...very very unsafe and very nasty to drive, for example look at the test in the past from S4 vs M3 where M3 was so oversteering that when he tryed to get on the right line of the curve who couldn't and S4 was like a super fast and safe TGV on curves!So bmw as i said again sucks with their ineficient RWD!

Sorry guys,

I stand corrected.:doh:

Damienr8
April 16th, 2007, 17:11
Sorry guys,

I stand corrected.:doh:

Leadie, your reply cracked me up LOLOL :trash: Yes, superstar may be a bit on the crazy side and while his opinions seem very aggressive against BMW (and most of the time I do not agree with his comments), there needs to be someone like this in the forums. I do not know how to explain it but superstar's passion for audi and his aggression towards BMW in his posts (along with the responses from other forum members) make me laugh. :trash:

quattro Gmbh
April 16th, 2007, 20:11
does a5 have recently mentioned torque vectoring quattro system?

SuperstarDriver
April 16th, 2007, 21:05
as i heard yes and it works super ok but we have to wait the test to see with our eyes!

Leadfoot
April 16th, 2007, 21:28
does a5 have recently mentioned torque vectoring quattro system?

I don't know and I have had no luck from any of my sources so I would say no. The logical thing for Audi to do if they had add this expensive technology is to bum and blow about it's ability, but the fact that this hasn't happened lead me to believe it isn't there.

Leadfoot
April 16th, 2007, 21:32
Leadie, your reply cracked me up LOLOL :trash: Yes, superstar may be a bit on the crazy side and while his opinions seem very aggressive against BMW (and most of the time I do not agree with his comments), there needs to be someone like this in the forums. I do not know how to explain it but superstar's passion for audi and his aggression towards BMW in his posts (along with the responses from other forum members) make me laugh. :trash:

I know what you mean, I too laugh at some of the posts and the fact that no matter how many ridicule him he doesn't seem to get to bouldered.

Our SuperstarDriver is one of a kind and we can thank the lord for that one.:thumb:

rqiu
April 16th, 2007, 21:36
Or maybe Audi doesn't want to make a big deal out of it from a marketing perspective because other models don't have it yet, especially A6 which competes with Acura RL today. I know the chance is too little, but surely hope so.

SuperstarDriver
April 16th, 2007, 21:38
my id name it was not choosed by my head but by my abilities to drive...i always scary a lot of people when driving right to me cause i'm very very crazy driver, i do things that some of people things are imposible or to risky but i always had my passion for supercars and performance cars and i can't imagine me driving an TDI 140HP or more (i do not count Q7 V12 TDI)...i always need power power and power to drive "normally"...for me 35miles/h is a very very slow speed and i'm not capable of driving at this kind of speed...i was getting in a lot of sutpid stuffs with police but never ever had an accident...so...i must say that if you all apreciate my style i will thank you but definitively i will not change...i crazy and i will remain crazy and my opinions about audi will never gonna change!

Thrives
April 17th, 2007, 11:06
Fourtitude has a very comprehensive account on the new A5/S5

S5 info here ...

http://www.fourtitude.com/news/publish/Audi_News/article_3063.shtml?page=11

In terms of performance the S5 is said to do 0-200 at 19.1 seconds which is just about the time of a 335i right or perhaps a whee bit faster? I mean, the old S4 v8 did it in about 21, right? and I have seen accounts of the 335i doing it in 19.9. Please do correct me if I am wrong ...

In any case the articles on the S5 and A5 are well worth a look and indeed black is the true color of Audi's new beauty :incar:

Leadfoot
April 19th, 2007, 00:19
Fourtitude has a very comprehensive account on the new A5/S5

S5 info here ...

http://www.fourtitude.com/news/publish/Audi_News/article_3063.shtml?page=11

In terms of performance the S5 is said to do 0-200 at 19.1 seconds which is just about the time of a 335i right or perhaps a whee bit faster? I mean, the old S4 v8 did it in about 21, right? and I have seen accounts of the 335i doing it in 19.9. Please do correct me if I am wrong ...

In any case the articles on the S5 and A5 are well worth a look and indeed black is the true color of Audi's new beauty :incar:

How sure are you that the 335i takes 19.9s to get to 200km/h, I know that there has been tests showing it posts times of 4.8s to 60mph and 12.1s to 100mph, to take another 7.8s to cover the remaining 25mph does sound a little bit longer than I would have reckoned on. I wouldn't be surprised to see a test showing a 335i doing the 200km/h (125mph) run in the same time of the S5. And remember these figures I am quoting are for an automatic 335i not a manual.

But lets say that your figures for the 335i are correct and it's best 200km/h (125mph) run is 19.9s and the S5's is 19.1s, where would this leave the S5's time to the 160km/h (100mph) mark ?

11.8sec maybe or even less, say 11.4sec both times I personally would be very happy with.

Thrives
April 19th, 2007, 08:40
How sure are you that the 335i takes 19.9s to get to 200km/h, I know that there has been tests showing it posts times of 4.8s to 60mph and 12.1s to 100mph, to take another 7.8s to cover the remaining 25mph does sound a little bit longer than I would have reckoned on.Well, not sure at all actually :). It seems as if there a lot of numbers flying around. My statement on 19.9 seconds was actually also wrong since I apparently did not look straight when I read this test by Auto Bild (http://www.autobild.de/test/neuwagen/artikel.php?artikel_id=12065&artikel_seite=1). As such they have the 335i at 19.1 as the Audi S5 and not 19.9 like I said above :).

Having said that I also have this quote from another forum where somebody (have no idea who :)) quotes different figures, mind you with both 130 mph (208 kph) and 200 kph as the benchmark. Here it then says 20.7 for 335i:vhmmm:


In a sraight line, the M3 is still marginally quicker, from the tests I've seen. Car and Driver recorded 0-60 in 4.9, 0-130 in 21.6 for the 335i. That compares with 4.8 and 20.3 for their M3 est (with SMG). Sport Auto recorded 0-200 kph in 18.1 for the manual M3, 20.7 for the 335i coupe.

At the end of the day, this only goes to show that there won't much in it between the S5 and 335i although I expect the S5 to beat it on the ring since even a S4 v8 seems to be at par with it based on the times I have seen. I agree with you that 0-160kph in about 11.5 seconds for the S5 would be very good indeed, especially since we are talking straight line accelaration.

Subzero
April 19th, 2007, 13:05
First drive of the s5, and they don not like it.
They prefere the 335i.

They think the styling is BORING, how the hell can they think that, the writer must love BMW

http://autocar.co.uk/CarReviews/FirstDrives/Audi-A5-4.2-V8-FSI-S5/225288/

Leadfoot
April 19th, 2007, 13:31
First drive of the s5, and they don not like it.
They prefere the 335i.

They think the styling is BORING, how the hell can they think that, the writer must love BMW

http://autocar.co.uk/CarReviews/FirstDrives/Audi-A5-4.2-V8-FSI-S5/225288/

Autocar has been in BMW's back pocket for years. This review means very little as to what we will feel the S5 will really be like. But one thing that is true in their statement is that the S5 will have a harder time justify it's price over that of the 335i, especially in the UK as the S5 is £3.5K more expensive even when the two cars are specced the same.

It all comes down to personal choice, Audi or BMW, awd or rwd, V8 or 6 Bi-turbo.

But you do have to keep in mind that this is only a first drive and a short one at that, wait to see how the car compares when it reviewed in a full test in familiar roads. This might change their first impressions.

rqiu
April 19th, 2007, 20:09
Well, 335xi may cost you about the same or a little bit less. I also doubt they actiually drove it. They don't even have a real picture of the car that they drove and the review has no real content except "we like 335i better".

Benman
April 19th, 2007, 21:41
I reckon by 2020 he will be as laid back as Ben.:hihi::applause: :applause: ROFLMAO!!!:applause: :applause:

Somehow I doubt it.

Seriously, SuperStar, if you wish to continue "contributing" here, please refrain from the "BMW DRIVERS SUCK, BMW MUST DIIIIIIIIIIIEEEEEEEEE" comments. Please. We are asking nicely.

Ben:addict:

SuperstarDriver
April 19th, 2007, 22:24
We Are On An Audi Fan Forum With All The Members Fanatism Of Audi So Why Should I Do That?!no I Will Not Do That!if Someone Will Look At The Bmw Forums You'll See There They Think They Are "the Boss, The Meanest, The Most Powerfull, The Most Sexier And God Of The Roads With Bmw Cars"...i Hate When Someone Is Saying That! I Just Wait My Rs4 To Come And Destroy All Bmw S......r In My Country At Least...if Any Driver With Bmw Will Challenge Me After Destroying All M3 M3 Csl M5 And M6 I Will Humiliate Him In Front Of Everyone...i Will Supercarche My Future Rs4 (summer Order Arrival) To About 580hp And Let's See Then Who's The B....h Here...bmw Better, Faster, Beautiful And Meanest Than Audi?!sweet Dreams Bmw...

IulianUM
April 19th, 2007, 23:37
Just a silly question ,:blush: how much weight a S5 ?
The future RS5 might be tempting me yet .:trash: I think that Audi should pay Leadfoot a commission for promoting Quattro Gmbh .:thumb:

Leadfoot
April 19th, 2007, 23:53
Just a silly question ,:blush: how much weight a S5 ?
The future RS5 might be tempting me yet .:trash: I think that Audi should pay Leadfoot a commission for promoting Quattro Gmbh .:thumb:

The weight of the S5 is 1630Kgs compared to 1600Kgs for a 335i Coupe, not bad when you consider the Audi has a V8 and quattro drive. Talk is that the RS5 might appear sometime next year but if the RS6 is only due in spring '08 I think you will have to wait until sometime in '09.

As for the commission, how sure are you I am not getting paid. :hahahehe:

Audiphile
April 23rd, 2007, 04:22
I may not agree with SuperstarDriver on the way he puts down his words, but I admire and love his passion for Audi.:thumb: It is way cool. :dig: Though his comments towards wannabe BMW owners is not politically correct, he does make point in regards to BMW owners' overall Napolean complex regarding their cars. Incidently, if you examine many of the comparisions in the Tier 1 automotive sector over the last three years in much of the world's main automotive journals (not to mention the awards from the industry), and quality and reliabitliy data, Audi has won a majority of those comparisons easily besting BMW. So, SuperstarDriver does have a point somewhere in his run-on sentences. It will be very interesting to see what the next decade will bring between the world's "Big Three". All indicators point to a very dominate Audi. The RS6 is just one example where BMW will have a difficulty coming up with an answer. The S6 has been seen as much better, and it lacks a good 70 + bhp on the M5!:bigeyes: The R8 has already left BMW befuddled in terms of a response. And in terms of a long view of the two businesses (even the three busineses), Audi has the best business model and synergies for long-term research and development (not to mention cash, considering Audi has already surpassed BMW in terms of net capital return on investment this year), and overall future global strength. With Audi, Porsche, and the VW Automotive Group (throw in Piech for his shear presence and cunning) aligned against BMW, let just say I wouldn't want to be on the receiving end of that stick. Though the US continues to be somewhat of an achille's heel for Audi, I do not forsee this to continue too long into the future. It is about proper profitablity and not about how many units are moved. There is a reason why BMW leases are generally 60% cheaper than that of Mercedes-Benz and Audi, and why the A8 continues to command a higher price point than any 7-Series (8 or 12 cylinder).

So BMW fanboys need to get a dose of reality that their little cars are not necessarily the best any longer.:bye: But I guess this is hard to do as long as the BMW CEO continues to make "highly intelligent comments" :vhmmm: that Audi is not a threat. As they say, reality lags behind perception. :doh:

SuperstarDriver
April 23rd, 2007, 08:15
Thank you Audiphile, you are the one who understand my passion and why i say that Audi is way better than BMW at every category!By the way guys every magazine of this planet is comparing any car maker with Audi...for example "the materials are not like from Audi", "the design not like from Audi", etc...everything in this moment and in the future is connected to Audi brand...Company of the year:AUDI, The most beautiful car of the year:TT, Performance car of the year:RS4, SUV car of the year by Autobild, AMS:Q7, Best Supercompact car:S3, etc etc etc...Audi rocks and even people from BMW knows that but they can't do nothing stopping this hugely brand upper power of Audi A.G...

Tanner
April 24th, 2007, 14:42
Well there are car/Audi enthusiasts but IMO, true car enthusiasts don't go knocking other brands saying that brand xyz sucks. But that's just my opinion. I know guys with BMWs and frankly they're just as crazy about their cars but they don't go dissing the Audi brand either.

SuperstarDriver
April 24th, 2007, 14:46
i dislike scartttttt scarrrtttt like BMW does ALLL THE TIME IN ALL GEAR IT'S CALL INEFICIENT TRACTION...AND INEFICIENCY = BAD TIMES ON RACETRACK!!!

Tanner
April 24th, 2007, 16:38
Whatever turns your crank.

Benman
April 24th, 2007, 17:01
i dislike scartttttt scarrrtttt like BMW does ALLL THE TIME IN ALL GEAR IT'S CALL INEFICIENT TRACTION...AND INEFICIENCY = BAD TIMES ON RACETRACK!!!


SuperStar,

You obviously do not watch racing...

Please, we know you dislike BMWs, it's no secret. Just skip the "BMWS SUCK!!!" lingo, we all get the point. Try to contribute in a positive way. Many people who are members here do in fact own Audis and BMWs. They do not like their cars being disrespected. Just becasue they own BMWs does not in fact make them stupid.

And yes, in the past you pointed out (correctly) that there are BMW forums that disrespect Audis... Well, we are NOT one of those kinds of forums, we are better than that! And that is why so many seem to want to join rs6.com. Please, let us keep it that way. And yes, we ALL love Audis.:cheers:

Ben:addict:

SuperstarDriver
April 24th, 2007, 17:49
ok i understand man...by the way my country is NO.1 IN THE WORLD WITH THE MOST AGRESSIVE AND DEATHLY ACCIDENTS IN THE WORLD and yes this is the country where BMW still is no 1 in accidents and 80% of the accidents is with BMW cars, so....

Benman
April 24th, 2007, 18:03
ok i understand man...

Thanks Super, that is all I ask.:cheers:

Ben:addict:

RXBG
April 24th, 2007, 19:36
ok i understand man...by the way my country is NO.1 IN THE WORLD WITH THE MOST AGRESSIVE AND DEATHLY ACCIDENTS IN THE WORLD and yes this is the country where BMW still is no 1 in accidents and 80% of the accidents is with BMW cars, so....

could that be not because of the cars but because of the idiots who drive them? or because of poor traffic laws? etc..?

for sure i think we are plagued by bad drivers here in the US and especially in FL.

so we do have our share here too, superstar.

BTW- i am not a bimmer fan either, prob. more so because of the kinds of people i associate with them that buy them and not so much because of the machines themselves.... but yeah, agree with ben. we gotta be nice to them. at least out of sympathy :trash:

rqiu
April 24th, 2007, 20:37
In general, Audi is safer - A4, A6, A8 are all rated higher than BMW in collision tests. BMW is not unsafe, however an agressive driver can make bigger mistakes and get into trouble easilier with RWD, than with AWD or even FWD. They often overestimate their own capabilities.

QuattroFun
April 29th, 2007, 18:34
We will soon learn the S5's true weight distribution, but deliberate chassis tuning is the main reason for why some reviews claim that it feels numb and understeery. And this can be fixed if desired - maybe in the upcoming RS5.

The one-dimensional focus on weight balance is misplaced. Sure, it - along with weight - affects how prone the car is to understeer and what the starting point is - but chassis tuning and accessories are generally more important until we reach very giddy levels where the power to overcome simply runs out. But that is high indeed and generally relevant only for dedicated track cars. Moreover, the advocated 50%-50% is not dynamically the ideal weight distribution even for track cars.

Especially in daily driving, dynamics and the feeling of nimbleness is reasonably proxied by slalom rather than track times where power-to-weight and power understeer and other (designed) limit behaviour etc. come into play.

Exhibit 1: The R8: on fat 19" PZeros and with MRC, it posts slalom 69.2km/h - very well done, non-GT 911 roll over. With Corsas and ceramics, it will probably be a draw with the mighthy GT3 RS which posted 73.2km/h with PCCB and Pilot Sport Cups. R8: 1632kg, 44.0% up front. GT3 RS 1424kg, 39.0% up front.

Exhibit 2: The RS4: on 19" Corsas, SS+ and Ceramics, it clocks 68.9km/h. Weight 1728kg, 59.5% up front. This is Porsche 911 territory with mirror image weight distribution.

Exhibit 3: The TT 2.0TFSI FWD: on 18" 245 PZeros and MRC, it posts 68.2km/h. Weight 1310kg, 60.3% up front. This is nearly same as the R8 on same, albeit smaller, tyres and FWD - think about it.

Exhibit 4: MTM S3: 69.4km/h on 19" 235 Pilots. Weight 1522kg and 60.0% up front. By the way, Hockenheim - while not the scope for this comparison - is 1.16.7min as compared with 1.16.3min for the M3, which has only 50kg more weight but also 24PS more. How about this as proof of overcoming weight balance issues?

Sources: R8 AMS 10/2007, rest Sport Auto results.

chiphead
April 29th, 2007, 23:27
Quattro the feeling of nimbleness is proportional to the weight over the front wheels and it's ability to change directions with the least momentum. This is called moment of inertia. Think of the car as balance on a needle. If the distance between the tires is equidistant, there is less energy needed to rotate the car's mass. No amount of techno-wizardry can fix a flawed chassis balance. Sure you can mask it so the driver doesn't feel it, but it's still physically there.

Leadfoot
April 29th, 2007, 23:59
Quattro the feeling of nimbleness is proportional to the weight over the front wheels and it's ability to change directions with the least momentum. This is called moment of inertia. Think of the car as balance on a needle. If the distance between the tires is equidistant, there is less energy needed to rotate the car's mass. No amount of techno-wizardry can fix a flawed chassis balance. Sure you can mask it so the driver doesn't feel it, but it's still physically there.

I personally think weight balance should ideal be 55% front biased for any car that is either fwd or awd with the engine at the front. BMW believe 50/50 for rwd but there is a lot of other rwd companies who disagree with that.

Entertainment is something totally different from ability and when they talk about the Audi car's understeering I wish they would talk about the speed at when this happens compared to it's rivals, I know that the 335i understeers at a lot less speed than the S5 and it's this ability that makes the S5 ultimately the quicker car.

Trust me, the S5 will post a higher slalom speed than the RS4.

QuattroFun
April 30th, 2007, 05:35
Sure you can mask it so the driver doesn't feel it, but it's still physically there.

Well, my point exactly - in road cars, you can indeed mask it a long way so the driver doesn't feel it and numbers do not show it - if the manufacturer so desires - even though it obviously still is there. Ultimately, you obviously cannot turn a RS4 into a M3 CSL killer in terms of track ability when the mutual modification race is on and all gloves are off as the laws of physics come in the way - but this is not was this post is about is it? Low hanging dynamic fruit and so on...

That said, let us just wait for the S5 test numbers - but needless to say, in standard guise it will come nowhere near the times posted by the RS4 with the above mentioned specs. However, it can almost surely eventually be turned into a dynamically better car - aka RS5 with SS+, Corsas and Ceramics - than the RS4 with its wider track and at minimum 3%-points better weight distribution...