BMW should be very concerned of what the RS4 is doing to their beloved fans...

[Vorsprung]

For those of you who read the www.m5board.com forum, you'll know that there is a bit of a divide on that forum between E60 M5 owners and E39 M5 owners. E39 M5 owners saying that the E60 M5 with all its SMG/gearbox glitches, VANOS oil leaks, Bangled design looks etc etc was the reason they never replaced their E39 M5's to the E60.

Well if anything it seems there's a good couple of these guys now shifting over to the 4-rings academy buying RS4's to replace their M5's...:rs4addict :dig: :rs4addict

A very interesting link to read from the M5board. http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=82407

Its just a matter of time before they all get converted I tell you!:applause:


Edited to add:
You know when BMW fans are saying things like this that the RS4 is one awesome machine:
"If I wanted a new E39 M5 right now that was more nimble, with quicker starts, with a full factory warranty, and I could settle for it being a little smaller than the E39 to get the nimbleness, well, this would be the car!"

"The Ferrari V12 used to be my favorite sound but not anymore. The exhaust note of the RS4 is the Ferrari's equal, but then add in the supercharger-like whine (straight-cut gears for the high-pressure fuel pumps for the SFI) and the car has no equal."

"The RS4 is a great car. I love mine. In many ways, I find it more fun to drive than my M5. And dare I say that the sounds this Audi's screaming V8 makes from idle all the way to redline is even more impressive than the music the V10 lump makes in the bimmer. No joke."

"I assure you, the RS4 is worth the drive! Ihave driven one on two occassions and the handling is what I can't get out of my mind - stuck like glue on the corners. If I had to get rid of my E39 M5 right now the RS4 would be my #1 choice (I can't afford more than one car for myself and I need something similar to the E39 - 4 doors, 6 speed, etc)."

[Gustav]

Too bad it is so slow at high speeds ;)

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=81728

[Vorsprung]

Too bad it is so slow at high speeds ;)

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=81728

Dont get me wrong Gustav. I think the E39 M5 was one of the best M cars BMW ever made. One of the last purist driving M cars if you ask me. No IDrive/SMG nonsense, bangle designs etc etc.

What I'm really getting at (in a very cheeky way of course :360: ) is the if I were an E39 M5 owner and was starting to look for another alternative, as many are simply because their cars are now at a stage where mileage is getting high and warranties are becoming void, what do you go for considering E60 M5 is not the answer for many? RS4's seem to be make a lot of sense for these guys and understandibly so.

As for performance, fortunately we live in a world where performance is FAR more than just high speed straight line acceleration. It also consists of standing starts, average roads which are not all surfaced like a race track, all forms of weather from sun to rain to snow, poor traction conditions, corners etc etc, where as an overall package the RS4's capabilities in all these conditions are way beyond what the M5 can produce.

Lets hope BMW dont make the same mistakes as they have made with the E60 M5 in their new M3. Hopefully they'll have learnt the lessons and will keep the M3 to what makes ///M cars as great as they've always been in the past.

For now though, its the RS4 which is generating a lot of interest, and you cant blame BMW fans for shifting brands if you look at what BMW has to offer them at the moment.

[Speedou]

I have to agree your points. I love M-cars way more than RS-cars. I don't have that choosing "problem", but really understand it. The new M5 with SMG just isn't for everyone. Now they have make 6-speed, but you can't even get it in europ or switch the DSC off...argh! To me the e39 was the true beast, the E60 just isn't.

I LOVE the e46 M3, have to hope the BMW makes good job for the next one. Z4M seems to be a true M-car what is promising for the next M3.

[Klint]

///M power all the way, shame i can't say the same about the m5board lol


























j/k!

[Benman]

Vorsprung,

Your quotes from the first post are priceless.

And Gustav, if the New Gen M5's only saving grace is it's higher top speed (both are electronically limited) then the M5 is screwed!:lovl:

The M5 is a very nice vehicle but certainly ugly and the tranny is certainly not for everyone (myself included).

Ben:addict:

[Leadfoot]

Maybe Gustav will disagree with me on this, but BMW has forgot what the M stands for with the M5 and M6, that is pure driving pleasure. The old M5 and M3 were very entertaining mainly because as a whole package it jelled so well, no part of the finished product better than any other, but in producing this mighty V10 they have an engine which is beyond the capabilities of the chassis and the brakes and in doing so have produced a one trick pony, hellish quick in acceleration and when delimited, hellish top speed.

Couple this with all of the transmission and engine problems and you have very unhappy customers who rightly are looking else where for their kicks. Another example of this is the M-Roaster and M-Coupe, two cars that work well on the track and can produce really good times but put them on the road and they are frankly dangerous to drive fast, what with their over-fast steering and very stiff suspension. Two cars which for a first from BMW should come with no off switch on the ESP or as BMW say it "DSC".

On present form I doubt the new M3 will equal let alone beat the current RS4, such is the state of the current M products. No, sorry but BMW has lost the plot with their M cars, for a great driving BMW look no further than the 335i Coupe and Z4 Coupe 3.0Sport or like a lot of former customers, look to the new kid on the bloke, the RS4.:dig:

[Benman]

...for a great driving BMW look no further than the 335i Coupe...


Heck yeah! My uncle just picked up a brand new 335i sedan w/ sport pkg. Fantastic car.

Ben:addict:

[BBGT2]

Vorsprung,

Your quotes from the first post are priceless.

And Gustav, if the New Gen M5's only saving grace is it's higher top speed (both are electronically limited) then the M5 is screwed!:lovl:

The M5 is a very nice vehicle but certainly ugly and the tranny is certainly not for everyone (myself included).

Ben:addict:

Every person I have talked to that owns the new M5/M6 has complained about the tranny and how crappy it is, thank goodness the bimmer fokkers decided to bring the 6 speed back. The SMG in auto mode is harsh to say the least, the only alternative is to always drive in manual mode. BUT, with so many problems with the unit always having to go and get "reflashed" at the dealer its more of a nuisance than a great driving experience.

If I had to chose between the older M5 and the new M5 the old one would win for sure, it looks and feels like its got a soul, the Bangledesh design is still sore to look at. Showing that the loyalists to the Bimmer gang are saying no to the new M5 and getting RS4's is a sign that there is hope for humanity after all, :wo: .


Bajo

[sarends]

Too bad it is so slow at high speeds ;)

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=81728

Note: Gustav is one of those fortunate individuals who has the opportunity to enjoy cars at higher speeds! I have heard repeatedly how incredible the E39 M5 is at triple digits - even though I own an E39 M5 I have had it up to 145MPH once and it was UNBELIEVABLY stable and intoxicating. However, I don't get to do this often enough (once in two years) for it to weigh heavily in any A/B comparo between how I would decide upn two cars. The fact that the RS4 does not have the top speed ability of the E39 M5 just wouldn't be much of a factor (to me). If I could afford to switch from my E39 M5 to and RS4 right now I would do it. #1 reason - the street performance and handling - I would enjoy and experience this EVERY DAY. The thing I would probably miss the most moving away from the E39 would be the size and comfort of the cabin - I am a big guy and I have 5 kids. Anyway, I simply LOVE my E39 M5 - it is the best car I have ever owned, ALL things considered. And, it pleases me to know that there is another car out there (the RS4) that would be a worthy replacment if I were making a decision to trade for a new car today.

[Gustav]

I would say the new M5 is much more sportier than the E39 M5 and also the 7-sped gearbox does not suit everyone. Yes, there have been some problems mostly related to the SMGIII gearbox but overall the car is a success. Already over 20 000 units of the engine produced its a total success and with performance better than any competitor. Here is a good sumamry of the two generations I saw today:

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=918657#post918657




Maybe Gustav will disagree with me on this, but BMW has forgot what the M stands for with the M5 and M6, that is pure driving pleasure. The old M5 and M3 were very entertaining mainly because as a whole package it jelled so well, no part of the finished product better than any other, but in producing this mighty V10 they have an engine which is beyond the capabilities of the chassis and the brakes and in doing so have produced a one trick pony, hellish quick in acceleration and when delimited, hellish top speed.

Couple this with all of the transmission and engine problems and you have very unhappy customers who rightly are looking else where for their kicks. Another example of this is the M-Roaster and M-Coupe, two cars that work well on the track and can produce really good times but put them on the road and they are frankly dangerous to drive fast, what with their over-fast steering and very stiff suspension. Two cars which for a first from BMW should come with no off switch on the ESP or as BMW say it "DSC".

On present form I doubt the new M3 will equal let alone beat the current RS4, such is the state of the current M products. No, sorry but BMW has lost the plot with their M cars, for a great driving BMW look no further than the 335i Coupe and Z4 Coupe 3.0Sport or like a lot of former customers, look to the new kid on the bloke, the RS4.:dig:

[Leadfoot]

Gustav,

Thanks for your reply but I am not sure why you singled out my comments without really replying to them. I checked out the comments from m5board.com and it is very much what I expected to see, glory be the M5/6 v10. Not one comments on transmission failure apart them the E39 M5 which looks like it was plagued with the problem too. I stick with my opinion that the engine is way beyond the chassis and brakes, something that should be addressed, especially the brakes.

Out of interest, what do you think of the M-Roadster and Coupe, good cars period or good cars let down by final set-up?

If your opinion is the former than this explains the gulf of difference between an Audi driver and a BMW M driver. The Audi driver thinks of what makes a great everyday driving car 90% of the time and the BMW driver thinks of what makes a great driving car the 10% of the time it's brilliant on a track.

By the way, I think the 335i and the Z4 Coupe 3.0Sport are working by the Audi philosophy.

[buyalemon]

And still ...RS4 is faster around the Ring :incar: