Hot news! First pics in the World of the new Audi RS4 B7

[Amar3lio]

I agree with everything you say with the exception of maybe the quality item...

Regarding your M3 sorry that you´ve experienced that kind of problems, I´ve never had any problem what so ever with the bimmer.... but there are always ups and downs i can tell you that a big friend stoped in it´s S4 on the middle of nowhere because of the electrics of the audi that just died....

I also mention a big thumb´s up for the audi´s engine, interiors, etc.. in my post just read it till the end.

What i mean is not to bring the RS4 down is just a kind of frustation of waiting for the ultimate audi and it never arrives or arrives late, very late

m3 is 6 years old at least and only 6 years later you have a audi that matches it...

The new rs6 is yet to appear and bmw will have a club version of the m5 and latter a csl version.... so you can have your new model rs6+ and still don´t have a matche.....

get what i intend? it´s a criticism but a good one..... but as i told before, i love audi´s but wouldn´t trade the csl for the rs4

[M&M]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by tailpipe
[B]

Originally posted by Amar3lio

In terms of future everday saloon car performance, Audi will totally eclipse BMW with the new B8 platform.

And you know this how? Hasn't the 3-series been the benchmark in driving dynamics for the past 10 years? Haven't Audi & MErc been saying they will surpass the 3-series every time they release a new model. Haven't they failed every time. I'm not talking about who's got better cupholders here.

[McBurn4ever]

Originally posted by Amar3lio
I don´t believe that the RS4 will...

I'm not saying that you are wrong, but for me it is not all about performance....it is the total experience of owning a car..
And when you look at it in that way there is no way that BMW plays in the same league as Audi...no way what so ever..

There is a reason why the Audi A6 recently won the title ”World Car of the Year” and why the readers of german "auto motor & sport" think that Audi A3, A4, A6 and A8 all are better than the competition...


If I was looking for a car with the features you talk about I would go for the Porsche 996 GT3RS...without hesitation..


And one more thing.
Right now on www.auto-motor-und-sport.de there is a poll
On Was ist für Sie die aufregendste Werkstuning-Serie?
(What is the most exciting carmodell for you?)

Guess what!
Yes! Audi is in the lead...

Audi RS: 40%
BMW M: 35%
Ford ST: 3%
MB AMG: 14%
Opel OPC: 9%

[7:53 RS6]

Originally posted by quattro
It's on Pirelli P Zero. The only standard car I know with r-compound is the M3 CSL.

I rememerd it as Pirelli P Zero Corsa r-t, my misstake.

[Ebx]

Originally posted by Amar3lio
The new rs6 is yet to appear

And so has the new M5, at least to end users. The "old" RS6 beat the "old" M5.

[Erik]

Originally posted by Ebx
The "old" RS6 beat the "old" M5.

True. But they are close.

I can't beleive the number of people who can't read the facts.
Here's the link, don't shut your eyes. Click and read and tell me what you see!

http://www.track-challenge.com/main_...r1=53%26Car2=3

My good old friend even passed the M5 Ring Taxi in his stock RS6 Avant.
The "only" modification was r-tires. But still that's a professional race
driver (Sabine was not driving) vs. a normal driver with perhaps 60 laps behind him.
Did they have more fun and "feeling" driving the M5? Perhaps.
Was the M5 slower than a station wagon with automatic? Yes.


And then there's the RS6 Plus

[rks838]

The RS6 is not better than the M5 by any means, nor is it quicker, neither in the wet it will take advantage...

Let's compare the 2003 RS6 to the 2003 M5, because both the new versions are still in development. RS6 goes 0-60mph in 4.3 (Automobile, Motor Trend), 0-100mph in 10.4 (Automobile) or 10.7 (Motor Trend), and around the Ring in 8:20 (track-challenge.com). I don't know the sources, but the fastest M5 times I've seen were 4.6, 11.1, and 8:28 (track-challenge.com), respectively. Both go around the skidpad at .90g, and the RS6 goes through the slalom at 68.7, compared with the best M5 speed of 67.x (I forget the sources - I'm sure others can verify these). The RS6 even got better fun-to-drive ratings than the M5 in Road and Track and Car and Driver, the most important "figure" to many people.

In the wet, the RS6 definitely holds an advantage over the M5 - I don't think I need to explain this in detail. The RS6 can reach its full potential in virtually any condition, while the M5 can only reach its full potential in dry weather. At any given location on any given day in the world, there is a 1/3 chance it will rain. 120 days a year is a lot for $75,000 machine not to do what it's supposed to be able to do...

Besides, the RS6's interior, features, and yes, cupholders are better than the M5's. In addition, I'm 6'4 and for a midsize sedan that is 191 inches long, the M5 has zero space inside, especially the back seat. My knees hit the back of front-passenger seat and my head was hitting the roof. The RS6 literally has room to spare in both of those compartments...

I believe the quttro domination was due to the superior suspension of those cars, & everyone wrongly gave quattro the as the reason for their domination.

This sounds like a desperate attempt to prove BMW is better than Audi. Do you really think you know more than the engineers, drivers, analysts, writers, etc. who spend their lives working with and evaluating cars? "I believe the rest of the world is wrong and it's actually the suspension..."

i can tell you that a big friend stoped in it´s S4 on the middle of nowhere because of the electrics of the audi that just died....

This too. Amar3lio, this sounds like it was made up in five seconds. "Yea man, the car just died in the middle of nowhere. The electronics just died and left my poor helpless friend in the middle of nowhere." Right...

Remember to think a little before you write...and "read the facts."

[M&M]

I have to agree with the guys here. The RS6 is definitely quicker than the E39 M5 in a straight line. On a track I'm not so sure about, but I guess it will be close. I recall the M5 being quicker around Hockenheim, but depending on the type of track it could go either way.

Now, onto the next generations. Seeing as the RS4 is normally aspirated, I see that this is the trend Audi's RS division is taking. In the RS4 press release they mention FSi & the high rev concept as being the way forward.

So I assume they will take a V10, but on Fsi, & tune it. But just lik the new RS4 vs old, I doubt the new RS6 will be much faster than the car it replaces. But the E60 M5 is SIGNIFICANTLY faster than the E39. Over 4 seconds faster to 200km/h. 107 hp more with less weight & 7 gears.

I hope for the sake of competition & evolution of the species that I am wrong, but I don't see Audi being able to dominate the E60 M5.

[7:53 RS6]

Originally posted by Erik
True. But they are close.

I can't beleive the number of people who can't read the facts.
Here's the link, don't shut your eyes. Click and read and tell me what you see!

http://www.track-challenge.com/main_...r1=53%26Car2=3

My good old friend even passed the M5 Ring Taxi in his stock RS6 Avant.
The "only" modification was r-tires. But still that's a professional race
driver (Sabine was not driving) vs. a normal driver with perhaps 60 laps behind him.
Did they have more fun and "feeling" driving the M5? Perhaps.
Was the M5 slower than a station wagon with automatic? Yes.


And then there's the RS6 Plus

That would be me and the girl ring taxidriver was Claudia Hurtgen and that girl is no rookie in motorsport.(do a googel and see)

Erik whats whit the Normal driver

[Erik]

Originally posted by M&M
On a track I'm not so sure about, but I guess it will be close. I recall the M5 being quicker around Hockenheim, but depending on the type of track it could go either way.

Correct, it is very much depending on what track you are on.

To dominate the new M5 you need a supersportscar.

I guess Audi's reply will be an RS6 with some kind of V10 Gallardo engine in it. There's already talks about an upgraded Gallardo engine, so as usual creating hp is not the problem.

[Benman]

Originally posted by M&M
I am not a hater, If you read my posts you will see that I am just disappointed that Audi didn't use this opportunity to gain a significant advantage that no upcoming competitors will supercede in a years time.

I find this slightly ammusing. OK, let's make the RS 4 SO FAR AHEAD that it would take the competition YEARS to catch up. Hmm..., the only vehicle that has come even close to doing that sort of thing is, you guessed it, the Mac F1. It was a vehicle that FROM THE START was created to be the kind of vehicle that would take YEARS for the competition to catch up (and to this day some are still waiting ).

The simple fact that technology will progess makes it easier and easier for TODAY'S cars to beat those of the past. The only way to make a car SO GOOD that the competition is hopelessly behind would be to put a TON of research into making and building it (i.e. Mac F1). But then you have a REAL problem, $$$. Any RS 4 that would be so good that it would take ANY BMW (M5, M3, whatever) to catch up to it even after 5-10 years had gone by would cost so much money that you'd have people (i.e. M&M) saying, "Oh my goodness, can you believe how much Audi is trying to charge for that thing!?!"

Then the response would be, "Yes but look at it's performance, it's simply INCREDIBLE!"

And then the reply would be "But not for that kinda $$$".

My point is ALL manufactures (except Mac) build cars that they KNOW will be eclipsed by the competition after "only" a few years. That's why they freaking call it COMPETITION. And BESIDES that, if Audi made the RS 4 THAT good then it would have to worry about IT'S future models being able to "best" it's performance (something the Mac F1 DIDN'T have to worry about!!!).

Let's admit, that for HERE AND NOW, the RS 4 will be sweet and eclipse the PRESENT competition. We'll worry about the "new" M3 when it comes out!

Ben

[5000S old skool]

Originally posted by M&M
[B] [Seeing as the RS4 is normally aspirated, I see that this is the trend Audi's RS division is taking./B]

No, if i remember correctly, this is the only RS that Audi plans on being N/A. This was to prove that Audi, too can produce a high specific out put N/A engine.

[rks838]

Yes, it does depend on what type of track you're on. The only reason I use the Nurburgring is because it seems to have elements of every track in it - straightaways, tight turns, long sweepers, etc. The Nurburgring is the closest I can come to evaluating a car's total performance, but there have got to be billions of other ways, including other tracks...for what it's worth, the M5 went around Hockenheim in 1:18.5, the RS6 in 1:17.6 (track-challenge.com). But I remember seeing the M5 beat the RS6 on some track...

[7:53 RS6]

I enjoy that its so much talk about tracks and grip and moore on this forum nowdays Keep it up.

As far as my thinking of RS cars vs M cars. And not talking cupholders or space here. Or rain even i know it rains a lot. Maybee thats unfair but its only my thinking. For what its worth.

(Not thinking of M5 E60 and the new RS4 cuse that i have no experiense of yet.)


Up to now my impression is that M cars always have deliver moore drivingfun than RS cars. Also i think the interaction between motor and gearbox has been superior in the M cars. As well as steering and the sportier handling in total. No news.

Exampel I mean when i drove my old RS4 at the ring or other track. And then direktly changed to drive my friends M3 E46 or all other M cars i had you can not say the S4/RS4/RS6 feels sporty or exact if compared.

M3(M cars) is to now anyway so much moore communicating and fun.Sorry but thats my feel and i also had S4/S6/RS4/RS6/ . But for sure the S/RS cars are better at much, but in above text i said i leave that out.

And im still impressed of how good grip the RWD M3 have even moore the CSL. Now im not saying the old RS4 is not a fast car, it is. But thats not all that matters im my mind.

Well i hope this belong to the past, and obvusly this was not news for Audi. Considering they now are loading the gun whit new thinking.

I hope The new RS4 deliver pure driving joy, the old sure did not, but still it was very fast!

New RS4 is not a competitor to CSL that someone said even they are nearly same weight/hp. The CSL is so much moore, onley the carbonfiber roof do magic to its handeling and there are moore.

As other here mentioned the aim is moore to M5 E60.

[rks838]

As far as my thinking of RS cars vs M cars. And not talking cupholders or space here. Or rain even i know it rains a lot. Maybee thats unfair but its only my thinking. For what its worth.

But those qualities are some of the biggest attributes of RS cars. Not the little things, but overall practicality. RS cars have a major practical advantage that includes weather, space, and even cupholders . I've seen a 3-series slide down a hill in the snow, and a 545i almost crash in the rain entering a traffic circle because his wheels spun, and however unsafe these events are, something about them is satisfying...knowing that you spent all that money on a car that can get you somewhere safely (the most basic reason for any form of transportation) on any day of the week. Then again, if one were actually being practical, he wouldn't spend %70,000-$90,000 on a car that does the same thing as a $20,000 Subaru...and in good weather, a $9,000 Kia...or, if you measure practicality in terms of money and not time, a $3000 moped...or a $200 bicycle...or even a healthy pair of legs...

As for fun-to-drive, the magazines widely favored the RS6 over the M5 (at least in America) and went 50:50 for the S4 versus the M3. In America, most M drivers croon about hteir cars' performance and fun-to-drive qualities, but many (really, the majority) have never even heard of RS, moreover driven one. That makes sense, because only 1000 or so have ever been in the US. But in Germany, where everybody knows about both divisions, they are favoring RS according to that online magazine poll that somebody mentioned - but it's close, 40% RS to 35% M, with the other votes being for other performance divisions. I think RS is on the rise, for fun-to-drive, performance, recognition, and maybe overall superiority. BMW is rising too, but I don't think it has the speed or especially the momentum of the RS division, considering the customers it has lost with its styling. But it's all about opinion...

[SpinEcho]

This is the type of debate repeated on many car enthusiast forums, and I just I don't get it. If so many of you are track day junkies, what the hell are you doing trying to debate the finer points of racing around in 3-4,000 lb. tanks? If you're serious about tracking, why don't you buy a nice, light track machine? I mean, it's not like anyone here is short on funds if they can afford to abuse an RS or M car on a circuit!

[Bauer]

[i]

So I assume they will take a V10, but on Fsi, & tune it. But just lik the new RS4 vs old, I doubt the new RS6 will be much faster than the car it replaces. But the E60 M5 is SIGNIFICANTLY faster than the E39. Over 4 seconds faster to 200km/h. 107 hp more with less weight & 7 gears.

I hope for the sake of competition & evolution of the species that I am wrong, but I don't see Audi being able to dominate the E60 M5. [/B]

Don't be so sure about this...look at the weight reduction in the RS4....remember it is about more then power. Also, if they get the DSG in the next RS6 that will reduce times as well, more so then SMG (not huge but there) which I have to believe they will.

An RS6 with less weight, quicker gear box and 50 or so more hp will be faster. Not to metion the chassis will be stiffer and the 60/40 power split. I also would not be suprised to see a LSD as well. Add to that better weight dist. The next RS6 should be a monster that I think the E60 will have a hard time with.

As for the comment quattro is not an advantage and that it is suspension only.....you have got to be kidding. This comment shows your lack of knowlagde about quattro or maybe you are just blinded by RWD.

[RS4Ever]

Originally posted by Tanner
Nice video thanks for putting it up. Hope you can post a longer one in the future.

Unfortunately I hear that this is again going to be a no show for Canada... not enough interested in spending large amounts of cash on a car like this. It's too bad. They didn't keep Canada in mind in developing the car and especially meeting the stricter crash tests here.

Tanner My friend...

you and your canadian friends were not forgotten....

"Both the USA and Canada will be graced with the presence of the RS4, though pricing has yet to be confirmed."


Click me - Full Article


i bet you went from this to this.. :bigeyes: