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The Pretender
March 13th, 2008, 23:22
It start to look like that the new RS5 will get the "High Rev" version 4.2 litre V8 FSI engine of the RS4/R8 with 420 hp.

Jarod.

Leadfoot
March 13th, 2008, 23:37
What makes you think that this will be the case?

I don't mind either way but considering that it's around three years newer you would expect Audi to come out with something that would be offering something with an improvement in not only handling and balance but performance as well.

It might still use a 4.2L v8 but I doubt it would be the same engine or output as the RS4.

artur777
March 14th, 2008, 02:33
Leadfoot - agree with you!
455-475 hp is my opinion - to be a little bit better than C63 AMG

The Pretender
March 14th, 2008, 06:15
Leadfoot - agree with you!
455-475 hp is my opinion - to be a little bit better than C63 AMG
You all see stars, 455-475 hp for the RS5. :doh:
It can be a litle bit more then 420 hp IMHO but not 455-475 hp.
The 420 hp M3 V8 Coupe' will still be its main rival.
Even a Aston Martin V8 vantage have only 380 hp.
With close to 500 it will be more a M6 rival, also price wise.

Jarod.

Boosted-Bora
March 14th, 2008, 06:30
if it was 100k+ and had a v10 twin turbo I would buy it immediately ::hahahehe:

chewym
March 14th, 2008, 06:32
I would rather go for a TT V8.

ZeroCool
March 14th, 2008, 12:46
You all see stars, 455-475 hp for the RS5. :doh:
It can be a litle bit more then 420 hp IMHO but not 455-475 hp.
The 420 hp M3 V8 Coupe' will still be its main rival.
Even a Aston Martin V8 vantage have only 380 hp.
With close to 500 it will be more a M6 rival, also price wise.

Jarod.

Is this a Reason?

The main rival of the RS6 is also the M5 and it has 73hp less than the RS6 ... so why won't they do that also with the RS5?

RXBG
March 14th, 2008, 14:44
it might make sense to give it a new intake and or valvelift and or special exhaust system. then lighten the car up even more than the S5. in doing so, they could keep the price point not much higher than the current RS4. if it lost 150 lbs weight, got the new quattro, and maybe 15 hp more it would be a hell of a car without costing audi an arm and a leg.

Damienr8
March 14th, 2008, 16:24
It start to look like that the new RS5 will get the "High Rev" version 4.2 litre V8 FSI engine of the RS4/R8 with 420 hp.

Jarod.

This is what i have been saying pretty much all along. If they can negate the weight on the S5 down about 80kg, new quattro, etc. They would have a winner.

Oh course i wouldnt mind a 20hp bump at all in hp but i dont see that happening.

regards,
Damien R.

The Pretender
March 14th, 2008, 16:33
Is this a Reason?

The main rival of the RS6 is also the M5 and it has 73hp less than the RS6 ... so why won't they do that also with the RS5?
The RS6 is ridiculous havy and need the ridiculous power to get close performance wise to the M5.
The RS5 don't need much more then 420 hp to perform like a M3.

jarod.

RXBG
March 14th, 2008, 16:38
in all probability they may not leave the engine 100% alone. they may update it a bit but that is all. they are trying to keep costs down and increase powertrain efficiency and fuel consumption while trying to keep complexity down.

if they added turbos the car would be too powerful and they'd have to put it in the R8 as the new base engine as well. a TT V8 will make close to 500 hp. the unreleased NA V10 will barely make 510. it is impossible.

i feel quite sure that the idea of a "carryover" RS4 engine into the RS5 is not appetizing to some but it is realistic. the focus has to come in handling- hence the weight loss. weight loss is tantamount to more power. so who cares? it'll be better for the car.

we are entering an era where other makers, like mercedes, are going to have to realize that S65s are useless. they can win a drag race. but they can't corner.

+44 Dave
March 14th, 2008, 17:11
It wasnt the engine which made the RS4 the best Audi in 10 years, it was the way the engine worked with the rest of the car, the way it felt to drive. Now the RS5 uses a completely new chasis, the MLK platform, and it would be stupid to expect the 4.2 V8 of the RS4 to go in the RS5 and drive just like the RS4. Things will need to change if they are going to use this same engine in the RS5.

Hopefully it will be as great a car as the RS4, but this definately wont be achieved by using the RS4's components.

Leadfoot
March 14th, 2008, 17:55
The RS6 is ridiculous havy and need the ridiculous power to get close performance wise to the M5.
The RS5 don't need much more then 420 hp to perform like a M3.

jarod.

I would agree with that statement only if Audi can lower the weight of the RS5 below the S5, and not by a piddly 20kgs, it would need to be in excess of 75kgs minimum. How this can be achieved while improving the weight balance over the axles is beyond me.

If they don't achieve a decent weight reduction then I feel an extra 50hp over the M3 with a decent increase in torque as well will be a necessary to stay in the running, if only the acceleration side of the race. Look beyond the out right performance I reckon the RS5 will wipe the floor with everything this side of the GTR.

jeankk
March 14th, 2008, 18:06
:incar: rs5 wih v8 420hp and DSG transmission and other upgrades.. will be very competitive

The Pretender
March 14th, 2008, 21:12
:incar: rs5 wih v8 420hp and DSG transmission and other upgrades.. will be very competitive
DSG/S-Tronic is a must for the RS5 over a Tiptronic , i prefer a manual gearbox though.

jarod.

artur777
March 14th, 2008, 22:57
460hp and DSG - my expectation
and counting increased weight and quaatro this is the only way to be as fast as M3 and C63

Leadfoot
March 14th, 2008, 23:11
I am expecting the weight to be slightly less than the S5 (20Kgs), all of which will come from the front and it to definitely include DSG. I wish I know for sure the engine choice but I know that less than a year ago Audi were looking to run a N/A engine producing in excess of 500Nm.

If it matches these expectations then I reckon it will be number one in this sector. But how much will it cost?

Carl Lassiter
March 15th, 2008, 01:05
:incar: rs5 wih v8 420hp and DSG transmission and other upgrades.. will be very competitive

I agree. :cheers:

NA V8 from the RS4 is plenty and such a great engine deserve its place. Revving to 8k was a huge boon :revs: and it sounds great while pulling far stronger than the underwhelming 350bhp unit in the S5.

Agree that if they can shed 50kg or so then it'll be a rocketship with DSG. Perfect for British backroads and even the odd trip across the water to the Autobahn. :incar:

pampas
March 15th, 2008, 02:40
I will get the RS5 if it's better then current RS4. Since S5 is more like a cruiser, I am afraid the RS5 will maintain that style and will be a little soft on the suspension settings, etc. Audi will have to do a lot of work on the car if they want a real performer, I personally don't care if it's 420hp or a little more .. as long as the whole setup is better. I need a DSG trans, adjustable suspension and the new quattro and I will get the car no matter the price.

When I say better I mean faster on the straight AND faster on the track too. Interior style already is better (except rear seats&rear space).

pampas
March 15th, 2008, 02:47
It start to look like that the new RS5 will get the "High Rev" version 4.2 litre V8 FSI engine of the RS4/R8 with 420 hp.

Jarod.

Do you KNOW that for sure, from some credible sources(at least for you), or u just typing stuff on the forum ?

:)

The Pretender
March 15th, 2008, 13:21
When Audi put in the R8/RS4 4.2 litre V8 FSI high Rev engine in the RS5, i see no reason why it have to weigh more then a S5.
In fact it can weigh less IMHO, based on the light weigh engine parts.
Further i think a DSG/S-Tronic gearbox have not to weigh more then a Tiptronic/manual gearbox IMHO.
An if audi put on alumium front fenders, engine hood, doors, suspension parts and put in the RS4 style Recaro's they can save even more weight.
The RS5 "key word" is "weight" not power, the car need less weight not more power.
If Audi can make a RS5 with a weight south of 1600 Kg it will be a awesome car to drive and it will perform great.

Jarod.

The Pretender
March 15th, 2008, 13:31
Do you KNOW that for sure, from some credible sources(at least for you), or u just typing stuff on the forum ?

:)
Nothing is 100% sure till it's introduced on the market.
But based on credible info it look like there will be a R8/RS4 engine in the up-coming RS5.
And IMHO it will be the best solution anyway, every thing like Turbo's, Compressor, intercoolers, 10 cylinders will add weight to the car.
The R8/RS4 engine will probably get "Valve-Lift" to save fuel by the same power output or with a litle bit more hp.

Jarod.

pampas
March 15th, 2008, 17:25
When Audi put in the R8/RS4 4.2 litre V8 FSI high Rev engine in the RS5, i see no reason why it have to weigh more then a S5.
In fact it can weigh less IMHO, based on the light weigh engine parts.
Further i think a DSG/S-Tronic gearbox have not to weigh more then a Tiptronic/manual gearbox IMHO.
An if audi put on alumium front fenders, engine hood, doors, suspension parts and put in the RS4 style Recaro's they can save even more weight.
The RS5 "key word" is "weight" not power, the car need less weight not more power.
If Audi can make a RS5 with a weight south of 1600 Kg it will be a awesome car to drive and it will perform great.

Jarod.

please ask your sources if they know which way will Audi go with the RS5 .. make it lighter or make it a fast 420hp cruiser.

I hope for the DSG and less overall weight plus a better balance, but maybe your contacts know more about it, without just speculating on our hopes/dreams :)

chewym
March 16th, 2008, 21:11
it might make sense to give it a new intake and or valvelift and or special exhaust system. then lighten the car up even more than the S5. in doing so, they could keep the price point not much higher than the current RS4. if it lost 150 lbs weight, got the new quattro, and maybe 15 hp more it would be a hell of a car without costing audi an arm and a leg.

it's cheaper to drop in a twin turbo V8 (especially if a similar version will be a mainstream engine) than to lose weight without sacraficing luxury.

QuattroFun
March 16th, 2008, 21:35
Re-worked NA 4.2L V8 engine and diet with agility and precision tuning is my hope, as I expect to replace my RS4 with the RS5.

But to my understanding the valvelift cannot currently handle more than 7200 rpm so it may not appear in the (hopefully high-revving NA) RS5.

If Audi puts the same specific output spin on the RS4 engine as the new Lambo LP560 engine, then they should be able to pump out 448PS. This is enough in my books if they also work on weight and its distribution.

Ellden
March 17th, 2008, 12:26
I will get the RS5 if it's better then current RS4. Since S5 is more like a cruiser, I am afraid the RS5 will maintain that style and will be a little soft on the suspension settings, etc. Audi will have to do a lot of work on the car if they want a real performer, I personally don't care if it's 420hp or a little more .. as long as the whole setup is better. I need a DSG trans, adjustable suspension and the new quattro and I will get the car no matter the price.

When I say better I mean faster on the straight AND faster on the track too. Interior style already is better (except rear seats&rear space).

Just look @ what they made of the S6, if it's possible to come up with an RS6 out of that dull S6 then it shouln'd be that hard to create the RS5 which is just as good.

Rage
March 17th, 2008, 19:42
The RS5 "key word" is "weight" not power, the car need less weight not more power.
If Audi can make a RS5 with a weight south of 1600 Kg it will be a awesome car to drive and it will perform great.

Jarod.

Completely agree.

I was at the Geneva motor show and came across this complete gem of a car...

http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii269/941st_Rage/DSC01932.jpg
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii269/941st_Rage/DSC01926.jpg
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii269/941st_Rage/artega_gt.jpg
http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/ii269/941st_Rage/DSC01930.jpg


1100kg, 300HP engine, DSG, BHP/tonne ratio 272 (M3 262, R8 265, RS4 251, Lotus Exige 260, Corvette 272)

I will be seriously considering this (dont need 4 seats at the moment), different class to the RS5....but by god is it beautiful with the performance to boot. Estimated 0-62mph 4.5 seconds. Top speed 167mph.

Leadfoot
March 17th, 2008, 20:19
I agree, it looks beautiful from every angle but (there's always a but) will it sell second-hand. To me I just see another TVR type brand, which while offering excitement by the bucket, I also see something with a very limited customer market.

Rage, remember to take your brave pills before taking the plunge. :thumb:

The Pretender
March 17th, 2008, 20:29
Completely agree.

I was at the Geneva motor show and came across this complete gem of a car...

1100kg, 300HP engine, DSG, BHP/tonne ratio 272 (M3 262, R8 265, RS4 251, Lotus Exige 260, Corvette 272)

I will be seriously considering this (dont need 4 seats at the moment), different class to the RS5....but by god is it beautiful with the performance to boot. Estimated 0-62mph 4.5 seconds. Top speed 167mph.
More info here: http://www.artega.de (http://www.artega.de/)
And if you think it's to slow you can allway put on a turbo or two by HGP.

Jarod.

Rage
March 17th, 2008, 20:35
I agree, it looks beautiful from every angle but (there's always a but) will it sell second-hand. To me I just see another TVR type brand, which while offering excitement by the bucket, I also see something with a very limited customer market.

Rage, remember to take your brave pills before taking the plunge. :thumb:

TVR it is not:D

The car features a 3.6 V6 (From VW...cayenne engine I think) as well as DSG transmission from VW and systems from Paragon (Aviation cockpit systems). Spoke to the Head of Research and Develpoment and they will release Roadster next year. They intend to build 500 cars per year to start with and then expand the model line up.

RHD versions will almost certainly appear next year and will probably be sold under VW/Audi dealerships who will also carry out services/repairs etc.

Considering this is the brainchild of Ex Aston Martin and Porsche designers/engineers ...im excited and....looking forward to deciding between this and an RS5.:burnout:

Carl Lassiter
March 17th, 2008, 21:38
I agree, it looks beautiful from every angle but (there's always a but) will it sell second-hand. To me I just see another TVR type brand, which while offering excitement by the bucket, I also see something with a very limited customer market.

Rage, remember to take your brave pills before taking the plunge. :thumb:

Agreed.

Looks like a fiberglass coffin to me.

Charles DLF
March 18th, 2008, 14:35
the problem with these small production cars is emergency maintenance. Yes it may be a VW engine, and a VW gearbox (therefore reliable), but it is most likely the day you have a poblem pulling into a VW garage won't help much, people will look at you and "yeah it's VW parts... but it's not a VW car, i can't do much..."

But yeah, it does look great, wonder how it drives...

The Pretender
March 20th, 2008, 00:26
Re-worked NA 4.2L V8 engine and diet with agility and precision tuning is my hope, as I expect to replace my RS4 with the RS5.

But to my understanding the valvelift cannot currently handle more than 7200 rpm so it may not appear in the (hopefully high-revving NA) RS5.

If Audi puts the same specific output spin on the RS4 engine as the new Lambo LP560 engine, then they should be able to pump out 448PS. This is enough in my books if they also work on weight and its distribution.
I'm not sure 448 hp will be enough for the up-coming RS5 if you compare it with a 480 hp Nissan GT-R.

Jarod.

Rage
March 20th, 2008, 01:38
I'm not sure 448 hp will be enough for the up-coming RS5 if you compare it with a 480 hp Nissan GT-R.

Jarod.

Why compare it to the GTR??

The GTR is making 480hp at the wheels.

In my opinion they are different class of car........sharing the same pricepoint.

Carl Lassiter
March 20th, 2008, 17:27
Why compare it to the GTR??

The GTR is making 480hp at the wheels.
.

Dyno shot or BS

The Pretender
March 20th, 2008, 20:15
The GTR is making 480hp at the wheels.
Not @ the wheels but @ the hubs.


http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Features/articleId=125172?tid=edmunds.il.home.photopanel..1 .*

Jarod.

Leadfoot
March 21st, 2008, 00:14
Are we back on that old 'dyno says this figure' debate again.:doh:

Wheels or hub who give a f#'k, though the two cars may occupy the same price bracket they will on the most part not attract the same customers. The GTR will out perform the RS5, even Audi will agree with that one but then again the RS5 isn't going to try and compete with it, it's rivals are from Germany in the form of the M3 and C63. On this the RS5 only has to be a little better than both of them to sell by the bucket load, if Audi so desire.

The real question is not whether the RS5 needs 480+hp to compete with the GTR but how much it requires to compete and beat these two Germans, I'm guessing that 8~10% more than the M3 should do the trick.

You do the maths. ;)

P.S.

An bets on what kind of suspension will be offered with the RS5, after all we are pretty sure that 7sp S-Tronic will be there as an option and Quattro3 will be standard.

Link_to_poll (http://www.rs6.com/forum/showthread.php?t=14954)

The Pretender
March 23rd, 2008, 16:40
I would rather go for a TT V8.
Yes the old RS6+ 480 hp V8 bi-turbo engine would be a nice starting point for a Bi-TFSI version.


http://www.motor-talk.de/forum/aktion/Attachment.html?attachmentId=475258&ajax=true

Jarod.

The Pretender
March 23rd, 2008, 17:02
And you can give it a Sportec upgrade up to 600 hp.

http://rs246.de/forenpics/rs_Sportec_RS550_6.jpg

Jarod.