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tvrfan
October 22nd, 2007, 22:07
If BMW launches really a X5 M or a HighPerformance X5 with 500hp+ how would audi react??? would they build maybe a Q7 S or something same powerful??? i hope so !!! dont leave BMW alone on this segment !.

PS: i dont think the Q7 V12 TDI is a competitor to this, because diesel.

ZeroCool
October 22nd, 2007, 22:27
why is the V12 TDI no competitor?

In Le Mans it's also a competitor... i think AUDI have nothing more to do then bring the V12 TDI... :D

tvrfan
October 22nd, 2007, 22:34
they need a gasoline competitor not diesel with that hp.

itisme
October 22nd, 2007, 23:41
they need a gasoline competitor not diesel with that hp.

gess that wouldn't be any huge problem... W12 is waiting gasoline :)


just look at VW Toureg W12 (a few were sold)

Arslanoff
October 23rd, 2007, 10:06
What do you think about Q7 in S-line in Sprint Blue? Has anyone saw it or has photos in that color? Tried to find in web ut could not.

RussianM3_dude
October 23rd, 2007, 11:43
Q7 looks like a mini-van on stilts. The Q5 should be a better candidate for the go-fast treatement.

Leadfoot
October 23rd, 2007, 15:38
M3_dude,

I agree that the Q5 will be a much better choice for being sportier, the same applies to the X3 and when the smaller Merc is launched. It's that weight thing and shorter wheelbases make for cars which can change direction quicker.

Benman
October 23rd, 2007, 17:56
If BMW launches really a X5 M or a HighPerformance X5 with 500hp+ how would audi react???

PS: i dont think the Q7 V12 TDI is a competitor to this, because diesel.

I think you may have answered your own question.

You are correct, the TDI would not be a direct competitor to a high strung BMW motor, but I think that might be part of the appeal. The RS 6 with twin turbos is not as high strung as the M cars, but is still a very desirable alternative.

As for diesel, I think it is even better. You're not really buying a big SUV for the high pitched engine sounds. Me, I'd rather have a big rumbly engine to go with the size. What better than a huge V12TT TDI? Realworld performance would be about the same, but fuel economy (and therefore range) would be much better.

Ben:addict:

Leadfoot
October 23rd, 2007, 18:26
Ben,

You are correct, the diesel option is a far better in something like an SUV of this size, sure the likes of the Cayenne Turbo work great too but a high revving N/A engine like to one in the M5 wouldn't work as well or be as enjoyable in my opinion.

The thing is, it's torque that you crave when in a SUV, if you have ever sampled both the Cayenne S vs the Turbo you will know what I mean, the N/A Cayenne S is good but beside the extra torque of the Turbo you really can't compare the experience. I reckon the Q7v12TDi will have to desired pulling power to keep any power hungry person happy but doubt it's handling will match that performance if it's engine weight is to be believed.

RussianM3_dude
October 23rd, 2007, 20:05
I would still take an ML63 over them all.

gjg
October 23rd, 2007, 23:20
Ben,...................
I reckon the Q7v12TDi will have to desired pulling power to keep any power hungry person happy but doubt it's handling will match that performance if it's engine weight is to be believed.

Leadie, with all due respect, the X5 high performace "extender" can breath exhaust pipes of Q7v8TDi, let alone the v12 .. at least under normal driving conditions in Germany and regular size balls - and I would not even remotely discuss any other country like those with more speed traps and cameras than licensed drivers .... :doh:

Leadfoot
October 23rd, 2007, 23:34
gjg,

I know how quick the v8TDi Q7 feels, remember I did drive one a few months back and based on how much quicker it felt to the v8FSi I doubt anything other than a Cayenne Turbo or ML63 would be quicker.

My concerns to the handling are based on rumours that the v12TDi weighs more than half as much again as the v8TDi, itself no light weight.

Speedou
October 26th, 2007, 18:08
There was some X5 with big engine at the ring. It sounded very deep so think there was a big V8 inside. Also can be very wrong :)

artur777
October 26th, 2007, 18:13
Surely, it could be X5 with V8 TT - 408 hp

Leadfoot
October 26th, 2007, 18:27
Turbos usually dull the sound of the engine, if Speedou reckons the engine sounded impressive then it's more than likely N/A and big. The X5M is meant to be running a V12 6.0L which would sound very impressive if it's rev limit was in the high sevens.

Speedou
October 26th, 2007, 19:25
Leadfood, sound was quite low and deep. So TT is very possible.

Sanjuro
October 27th, 2007, 01:51
If Audi come with the concept V12 Q7 with the lemans engine it will be able to handle just about anything. That engine was emissions equipped in race from and it was able to destroy everything in a racing series. You put something like that in anything and it will go well. About 1000+ Nm? Basic Q7 is great at high speed too, and given it would be "relatively" efficient I think it will be more than a match.

Plus making something exactly the same as BMW is stupid - why compete just to compete - differentiation is the only thing that makes any business sense

Leadfoot
October 27th, 2007, 22:42
I see WCF are running a story that Ferrari might enter the SUV market with a 600hp and 600Nm machine capable of 0-100km/h in under 5 seconds and a top speed of 300km/h. The gauntlet has been laid down to Porsche and the others.

Fab
October 28th, 2007, 13:27
Forget all that guys this is THE ONE :D

http://www2.rs6.com/forum/showthread.php?t=13307&page=2

AndyBG
October 31st, 2007, 01:37
Fab, are there any interior pic's on the way ?

One question, is this ''AMG optik'' package, that your ML has ? That is something like Audis ''S-line" and BMWs ''M packet'', correct ?

Fab
October 31st, 2007, 07:59
This is the AMG body style i.e. the same look as the ML 63 AMG excepted that I do not have the quad exhaust pipes and the side chromed foot board. The 20" AMG rims with 295/40/20 rubber are part of the package.

I will add the beautifull quad exhaust in a year or so (for the look and the sound) but I don't really like the foot board.

I will post some interior pics for you.

Ciao

Mori
November 11th, 2007, 00:33
Hate the look of the ML - we had the previous one (ML430) and it sucked so much. It broke down 400 metres after picking it up brand new from the dealer - failed gearbox. Last Mercedes in our family. The only SUV I would consider is a Q7 4.2TDI or Cayenne GTS - I mean who really needs all that HP in a SUV? :)


PS. Which MBs can have ESP switched off atm?

Fab
November 11th, 2007, 11:07
Understand your point : The previous ML was just a joke. You should have been crazy to buy one...

The W164 is just perfect and the 5.5L V8 388cv is great. I am still in the break in period but starting to push a bit :revs: and it delivers far behond my expectations. It is so powerfull and sounds very good.

Styling wise you can like it or not fine for me. But comparing it to the previous version is like comparing apples and bananas.

Concerning the power on an SUV I can tell you that I have been wondering a lot as well about which engine to go for. I am fully satisfied with my choice for various reasons : I like sports cars and I am so used to drive quickly and faster than the usual road users that I can't leave without this grunt and power feeling and nice sound. And my ML just provide me all the above greatly :thumb:

The 2 models you mentionned also have 300-400hp so what is your logic of your question about power ? The GTS is very much sports and power driven.

Then in terms of look every body is free to have his own opinion no doubt ;)

Leadfoot
November 11th, 2007, 11:41
I know this is off topic a bit but Fab can you explain why when you go and get a Merc ML, members not blink an eyelid but when I decide to go for an M3 it's shock horror.

P.S.

The ML sounds like an animal, I know the new 5.5L engine has some serious punch in an E class but it looks like the same is true in even the heavy big ML as well. How are you finding the cornering of the thing, I am more than impressed with the Q7 apart from the overall performance but that is to be expected from a 3.0Tdi after all.

Fab
November 11th, 2007, 12:12
Well my wife and I were both on the call :cheers: since this will be more the family car. We both like the ML it is nice looking especially with the AMG body kit which gives him a nice sporty look while keeping the benz luxury atttitude...

I don't really like the X5, The Q7 is too big and I don't really like it (also wanted to change from Audi). Then I liked the Cayenne but my wife was afraid about carjacking :( Also the 3 year full free package is an added value for the ML since Porsche services are very expensive. But shurely the Cayenne was the closest call. I also looked very closely to the Range Sport Supercharged but the interior looked a bit cheap to me. Also the performances and consumption figures were not as good as the ML.

But THE decision to go for the ML is simply that we both find the ML beautifull :heart:

Then the 5.5L is a monster and the 7 speed auto box is great. My ML is fully optionned and this is great. The Sat Nav has a great definition and is so rapid. Far better than the Audi (the one in my RS4).

The power is great as I said. Cornering with normal suspension setting is good but you feel that to do better you have to switch into sport mode. Then the car is very well planted a bit like the RS4 : not harsh but firm. And if you add the tremendous 20" wheels in 295/40/20 you really feel an impressive grip. You can really drive fast on a twisty road. This is more than enough to have fun with the animal since it is indeed a sporty and powerfull SUV but it also remains an SUV and not a GT or an RS4. What I want to say is that this package allows great fun and nice acceleration feeling which add to the overall car safety and allows you to overtake cars easily on a long trip BUT the first usage is more cruising, relaxing in a luxury environment but with enough power and handling capacities if needed as my biggest concern for SUV is to drive a big fat turtle with no power and grunt.

Consumption wise I am below 15L/100km which is fine.

Audi is just a great car manufacturer and I love it. It would have not been immaginable for me to change from Audi 1-2 years ago. This doesn't mean I will not go back to it for shure (I still have the RS4 :love: ) but I want to explore some new horizons also to compare, feel, judge, etc... As said many times my next one will most probably be a Porsche 911. I also like the M3 very much and the RS5 will be a great pretender.

Maybe the fact to change brand will make me come back to Audi quicker and prove that this is the best brand for me which fits all my car needs and expectations. :confused:

Fab
November 11th, 2007, 12:26
I know this is off topic a bit but Fab can you explain why when you go and get a Merc ML, members not blink an eyelid but when I decide to go for an M3 it's shock horror. Leafoot you are probably a reference for many community members which will feel like lost babies when you will be gone for the M3 :D

Maybe the difference is that is still have the RS4 while getting my new ML...

P.S. most probably the main reason is that the M models are the main and closest competitor to the Rs models so getting an M3 is like selling you soul to the devil :king:

Leadfoot
November 11th, 2007, 16:09
Leafoot you are probably a reference for many community members which will feel like lost babies when you will be gone for the M3 :D

Maybe the difference is that is still have the RS4 while getting my new ML...

P.S. most probably the main reason is that the M models are the main and closest competitor to the Rs models so getting an M3 is like selling you soul to the devil :king:

I will still be here and the wife has decided on the A3 Sportback instead of the VW mini SUV so there will still be an Audi in the family, plus the M3 will only be with me until the RS5 arrives and if my timing hadn't been off I would have had the RS4 instead but alas the RS4 was going out of production.

As for being a voice for the group, well thanks for that I never thought of myself like that, I am passionate to the brand though. :thumb:

Lately as I don't have the M3 yet I am feeling the heat from you know who. :king:

AndyBG
November 11th, 2007, 17:33
...Then the 5.5L is a monster and the 7 speed auto box is great...

...Consumption wise I am below 15L/100km which is fine.

That is MORE then fine for that kind of car, my Grand Cherokee V8 was in the high twenties and that was when it had a good day. :D


...As for being a voice for the group, well thanks for that I never thought of myself like that, I am passionate to the brand though...

You were allways very critical when there was anything discused about BMW, that's the reason of my confusion, nevertheless, I think that you are going to enjoy in with that M3, and I wish you to use it in good health... :cheers:

Leadfoot
November 11th, 2007, 19:23
You were allways very critical when there was anything discused about BMW, that's the reason of my confusion, nevertheless, I think that you are going to enjoy in with that M3, and I wish you to use it in good health... :cheers:

Not critical but if someone placed the BMW ahead of Audi on ground that were not true then your dam right I would speak my mind and in fact I still do. :w:

http://www.rs6.com/forum/showpost.php?p=113060&postcount=22

http://www.rs6.com/forum/showpost.php?p=112466&postcount=26

Two example of me still being hyper critical of someone saying something against Audi. :thumb:

AndyBG
November 11th, 2007, 19:51
...Two example of me still being hyper critical of someone saying something against Audi. :thumb:

Some things are never changed... :D

Benman
November 12th, 2007, 19:17
I know this is off topic a bit but Fab can you explain why when you go and get a Merc ML, members not blink an eyelid but when I decide to go for an M3 it's shock horror.


Leadie,

You know I was certainly not one of those who questioned your Audi Manhood when you announced the "conversion" to the M3 so I can only guess as to the reasons... prehaps since you were one of the most outspoken heralds of the glory of Audi as to where Fab was more low key.:cheers:

And no worries, remember I got mucho flak when the Q7 fell through and I got the wifey a Denali. :D

Ben:addict:

Leadfoot
November 13th, 2007, 00:09
Leadie,

You know I was certainly not one of those who questioned your Audi Manhood when you announced the "conversion" to the M3 so I can only guess as to the reasons... prehaps since you were one of the most outspoken heralds of the glory of Audi as to where Fab was more low key.:cheers:

And no worries, remember I got mucho flak when the Q7 fell through and I got the wifey a Denali. :D

Ben:addict:

Ben, I didn't notice you getting lots of flak about the Denali ..... lots of out loud laugther maybe. :lovl::lovl::lovl::lovl::lovl: On that subject, has anything fallen off it yet. ;)

RussianM3_dude
November 13th, 2007, 09:44
Well my wife and I were both on the call :cheers: since this will be more the family car. We both like the ML it is nice looking especially with the AMG body kit which gives him a nice sporty look while keeping the benz luxury atttitude...

I don't really like the X5, The Q7 is too big and I don't really like it (also wanted to change from Audi). Then I liked the Cayenne but my wife was afraid about carjacking :( Also the 3 year full free package is an added value for the ML since Porsche services are very expensive. But shurely the Cayenne was the closest call. I also looked very closely to the Range Sport Supercharged but the interior looked a bit cheap to me. Also the performances and consumption figures were not as good as the ML.

But THE decision to go for the ML is simply that we both find the ML beautifull :heart:

Then the 5.5L is a monster and the 7 speed auto box is great. My ML is fully optionned and this is great. The Sat Nav has a great definition and is so rapid. Far better than the Audi (the one in my RS4).

The power is great as I said. Cornering with normal suspension setting is good but you feel that to do better you have to switch into sport mode. Then the car is very well planted a bit like the RS4 : not harsh but firm. And if you add the tremendous 20" wheels in 295/40/20 you really feel an impressive grip. You can really drive fast on a twisty road. This is more than enough to have fun with the animal since it is indeed a sporty and powerfull SUV but it also remains an SUV and not a GT or an RS4. What I want to say is that this package allows great fun and nice acceleration feeling which add to the overall car safety and allows you to overtake cars easily on a long trip BUT the first usage is more cruising, relaxing in a luxury environment but with enough power and handling capacities if needed as my biggest concern for SUV is to drive a big fat turtle with no power and grunt.

Consumption wise I am below 15L/100km which is fine.

Audi is just a great car manufacturer and I love it. It would have not been immaginable for me to change from Audi 1-2 years ago. This doesn't mean I will not go back to it for shure (I still have the RS4 :love: ) but I want to explore some new horizons also to compare, feel, judge, etc... As said many times my next one will most probably be a Porsche 911. I also like the M3 very much and the RS5 will be a great pretender.

Maybe the fact to change brand will make me come back to Audi quicker and prove that this is the best brand for me which fits all my car needs and expectations. :confused:

Carjacking? In Geneva? Are you also afraid of being struck by a falling moon rock????

AndyBG
November 13th, 2007, 12:13
Carjacking? In Geneva? Are you also afraid of being struck by a falling moon rock????

:hihi: Why do you think that is impossible ?

gjg
November 13th, 2007, 12:24
Carjacking? In Geneva? Are you also afraid of being struck by a falling moon rock????

comrades moving to Geneva? :applause: Could not resist that one.... :doh:

Fab
November 13th, 2007, 14:03
Dude :doh: Could you once follow up on the subject rather than focusing on uninteresting thinks ?

Your reaction simply proves you do not leave in Geneva. There are A LOT of carjacking down there : Cayenne, M5, RS4 etc... Cayenne being by far the most exposed vehicule and guys do not care wther it is a man or a woman they just hit you :(

I know many people victim of it. Geneva is well known for money and luxury cars and this is the unfortunate result.

Let me give a recommendation if you ever stay in Geneva at night : watch around you before to step in your car.

Mori
November 13th, 2007, 14:04
Understand your point : The previous ML was just a joke. You should have been crazy to buy one...

The W164 is just perfect and the 5.5L V8 388cv is great. I am still in the break in period but starting to push a bit :revs: and it delivers far behond my expectations. It is so powerfull and sounds very good.

Styling wise you can like it or not fine for me. But comparing it to the previous version is like comparing apples and bananas.

Concerning the power on an SUV I can tell you that I have been wondering a lot as well about which engine to go for. I am fully satisfied with my choice for various reasons : I like sports cars and I am so used to drive quickly and faster than the usual road users that I can't leave without this grunt and power feeling and nice sound. And my ML just provide me all the above greatly :thumb:

The 2 models you mentionned also have 300-400hp so what is your logic of your question about power ? The GTS is very much sports and power driven.

Then in terms of look every body is free to have his own opinion no doubt ;)

Hmm I seem to have misread your post - thought you had the ML63 AMG.

I test drove the ML a year or so ago, and quite frankly it was a bit too soft for me (even on sport suspension settings). Didn't feel as well planted as the X5.

My reference to the Q7 4.2TDI and GTS was in regard to having an AMG - I wouldn't need the Q7 V12 or Cayenne Turbo/TurboS (when/if it comes), but since you have the 5.5 then its a moot point. ;)

Actually you can't compare the current ML to the previous version - its like comparing a comfortable SUV to a bus. Still the 4.3l engine was decent in those days, and with the Brabus tuning we had it up to about 300HP if I recall. And the 20" Brabus wheels made it look much better. :) Hate the car now though - almost got me killed once (wheel almost fell off at 160km/h+).

Have fun with your MB. ;)

Fab
November 13th, 2007, 15:59
Have fun with your MB. ;) I am having a lot fun actually :cool2: Fully satisfied with it. A great complement to the RS4 Especially on winter time :snow:

Leadfoot
November 13th, 2007, 16:24
Dude :doh: Could you once follow up on the subject rather than focusing on uninteresting thinks ?

Your reaction simply proves you do not leave in Geneva. There are A LOT of carjacking down there : Cayenne, M5, RS4 etc... Cayenne being by far the most exposed vehicule and guys do not care wther it is a man or a woman they just hit you :(

I know many people victim of it. Geneva is well known for money and luxury cars and this is the unfortunate result.

Let me give a recommendation if you ever stay in Geneva at night : watch around you before to step in your car.

Fab,

Check it out I think you will like. :thumb:

Crossword (http://www.rs6.com/forum/showpost.php?p=113338&postcount=6)

Benman
November 13th, 2007, 17:19
On that subject, has anything fallen off it yet. ;)

The car has exceeded all of my expectations. Coming from an RS 6, that is saying something. And on that topic, wifey took it in first first 6K maintenance... how much do you think it cost her?

Drum roll...


$40.00USD...

Seriously, rides as nice as the Q7, and just as quiet. It is that good. If I bought a Land Rover, I would be much more fearfull of parts falling off. ;) :D

Back on topic, I am looking forward to seeing when the 4.2TDI will come Stateside and how well it will be received.:cheers:

Ben

Fab
November 13th, 2007, 20:50
Fab,

Check it out I think you will like. :thumb:

Crossword (http://www.rs6.com/forum/showpost.php?p=113338&postcount=6) Thats a nice one :applause: :applause: :applause:

The "funny" think is that we almost get used to have him on board :vhmmm: